brendangeorge

Well I am pleased and proud to report that the key board has been replaced by removing 5 screws and removing ribbon cable and replacing with like. Total time taken 4 mins.

As you can see it fgjjyoam jmkklgfleklg gfjkldbhu is working well Mike.

Very impressive - no hammers and chisels needed then? You should have made a video for Youtube - or just post the URL to the manual.

I am glad you are back on the buttons mate.

Bren

Heres the Update,

Thanks for the images my plug is in a worse condition but otherwise similar to the pictures you posted ill try and insert the image at the end of this post.

Ive had the helicoil and compression tests done, dismayed at the compression test results in PSI they are as follows:

windscreen end

190 psi 180 psi

145 psi 180 psi

155 psi 180 psi

155 psi 200 psi

As you can see all the left Cylinders look to be poor, Lexus engineer states they are in spec However the spec shows the min expected pressure to be 143 psi, and its 145 in the affected cylinder ! The fitted plugs were NGK bkr6eix-lpg 4 of em look to be in similar decent condition but the others while in tact look different.

The repair with replacement plugs and a single replacement coil was £850

the diagnosis was incorrectly fitted out of spec plugs, but having driven the car back from the dealers as soon as it switched to lpg the engine management light came on which i wasnt expecting, its going back tomorrow to get the fault code read.

how do i post the image(s) ? (Pm me an email address and ill email them if interested.)

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/824/w27g.jpg/

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/811/7k6s.jpg/

Regards

Colin

That does not look good Colin - looks like a lot of work needs to be done on the head(s) - that will cost a lot - bad luck - it may be cheaper to put in a replacement engine.

Bren

Hi Colin to post pics you need a photo bucket account - it is free. You then upload your pics to it and paste the URL in the post here in the forum.

Bren

If the price drops then see the tax go up :) I'm a sad old cynic.

Bren

The tax won't go up for the next few years & when it does it will only go up 1p per litre per year . Signed up agreement by the government as part of an eu green policy I believe. I have been using lpg for the last 7 years & the tax hasn't gone up yet.

Some petrol stations are greedy with their profit on it though if there is no near by competition.

I hope you are right Mark - remember we are at the mercy of the politicians so trust is not always rewarded.

A little quiz - Q How can you tell when a used car sales man is lying? Ans When he is speaking. Q How can you tell when a politician is lying? Ans They are breathing.

I have been using LPG for quite a while now and even if the tax did go up a little it would still be worth it.

Great numbers from your German trip - I was able to open my 430 up, on an unrestricted road, over there once - good fun but there are too many others on the road to look out for and there is always some so and so who wants to go faster than you :) I got just past 145 for a bit and at that indicated speed I had a 5 MPH error according to a GPS.

Bren

If the price drops then see the tax go up :) I'm a sad old cynic.

Bren

This thread has prompted me to check the economics of my conversion today.

Most of my driving is in town traffic, on petrol I get 20 mpg and on LPG I get 16 mpg. (Down 20% which is about right.) Equivalent to 4.396 miles/litre on petrol and 3.516 miles/litre on LPG, and my local fuel prices are 130.9 p for petrol and 60 p for LPG.

That means my fuel costs are 29.8 p per mile on petrol or 17.6 p per mile 0n LPG, making it 42% cheaper to use LPG.

I always thought the 50% savings claims were exagerated, but a 42% saving on todays petrol prices still makes a conversion worth while.

On the question of valve seat regression I had an incident with my previous LPG converted car, an S Class Merc. It had a slight judder on a light throttle which I thought may be due to the LPG conversion. The local LPG "expert" insisted I had the engine electronics checked independently at great expence. The report from the electronics "expert" was that the electronics were ok but the engine had terminal valve seat regression.

A free compression test at the local engine rebuild specialist showed there was nothing wrong with the valves and the engine was ok! In the end the problem was a worn flexible coupling on the drive shaft. But you have to ask how often valve seat regression is mis-diagnosed when a garage can't find the real fault?

John N

You have nice low fuel prices John - in South Northamptonshire the best I can get is 73.9 for LPG and 136.9 for petrol - your figures are very very good because you have a price difference of 70.9p and I can only get 63p. When I was up North a couple of weeks ago I found Morrissons was about 65p and 60p LPG was at cash only establishments. I am very jealous of your prices :)

One challenge I find is that on very long trips LPG can vary in price by 20p - still cheaper than petrol but really annoying.

I am sure most people who use this site are smart enough to find out fuel prices - here is a site I use that does not require a log in and means you will receive no spam

http://www.ukd8.com/index.php

Bren

I wasn't going to attempt it having seen the 1st one as he basically destroyed the Lap Top. but the 2nd one plus your link on HP for replacing the keyboard has given me the courage to give it a go.

If you don't hear from me again for some time you know what's happened.

Mike

Good luck Mike - it's the little ribbon cable connectors that may be tricky - you need to be gentle with the sliding clips - and give the gadget a shake before you put the Battery back in or turn it on after you have put it back together. If anything rattles you know what to do - or perhaps not. Open it up and remove the cause of the rattle :)

Bren

As I have need to replace a key board on my Lap Top I thought best place to go for instructions was good old reliable Youtube and this was the first result.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgRHh26wgJ8

You need a cup of tea and about 15mins, a strong stomach will help as well.

After that I was put off doing the job but tonight I thought that this guy couldn't be right so searched for another video and 30 secs later came up with this one.

Showing the difference between a grease monkey and a Lexus engineer.

Moral of the story never take what your first offered in life.

Brenda, you will love the engineering capabilities of the first guy.

Mike

The first guy - I Love him to bits - at the start of the video he looks like he's had a few beers :) I love the rice crispy noises when he takes things apart.

My solution - get the book and it is free from HP and easy to read http://www.hp.com/ctg/Manual/c02641795.pdf and I may add a damn sight quicker that matey boy on Youtube :)

The second guy (not ****** up) good but I would not use power tools on my laptop - Audi mechanic not a Lexus standard bod :)

Bren

Always liked the quirky add-ons found on the Celsoirs. I like the extended rear light cluster, it's so over-the-top. But at six and a half grand I'd have to be a Maharajah to even think about buying it. By the way, my mk4 doesn't have an auxilliary fan either (2000).

I did not know what a fender pole was so I investigated -

Very amusing.

Bren

Hmm I contacted the buyer.... She replied with the steering wheel had been changed...

Good answer - A sales person trained in the art of objection handling - I suppose the next question is why doesn't it look like a Lexus under the bonnet?

The dead give away is the Toyota steering wheel - nice try :)

Hi Martin

My 430 has never used a drop in 206K miles - if you had to put 6 liters in there is some thing wrong. Don't take this the wrong way but were you putting oil in the engine but checking the transmission fluid level. If so you need to get some oil out of your engine pronto over full is very very bad. If you had lost oil there would have been warnings on the dash also if you had a leak you would smell it if it got near something hot or you would see drips on the drive.

Good luck

Bren

Do they change the phone number on the listing frequently by any chance.

Don't think so but I will check

items 151057699920, 151057699986, - sorry these are both the same seller but there was a third one with a picture of blue/black one but I cant find it now

Thanks - the usual suspects :arrrggg-matey:

theres altleast 3 being broken on the auction site - have you tried them? - failing that try Dewsbury auto salvage

Which auction site Mark? I have done business with one on eBay and am about to go legal because they stuffed me.

No names yet however when the time comes...............................................................

Thanks for the heads up on Dewsbury. I am also looking at repairers - I can do it myself but cannot find the parts :(

Bren

Hi does anybody have a Nav ECU for a 430 they need to dispose of? I have a gen 1 system and it failed so bought the drive (the internal part not the complete box) from the US. However it is for a Gen 3 system (anybody want it let me know) so will not mount in my box :megaangry:. I don't care which 430 model the unit comes from if it is the box from the boot.

If anybody knows of anybody breaking a 430 I would appreciate a nod.

Cheers

Bren

em light wasnt on when purchased, someone had cleared the EM Code and it had an lpg cert, when it came back on i got the car serviced, light went out, got the car lpg serviced it came back on after 500 miles, took it back to different lpg service centre who confirmed brcs system was set up correctly for vehicle, Back to lexus dealer who said em diag suggested it was running a little lean but within tolerances for its age/mileage. did 50k with out issue now done a total of 140k which i agree is about 100k less than id expect from my other lexus 400's ive had over the years.

LESSON: is prob to have the plugs and em checked on regular basis if your running LPG, incidently it had a lexus service 2 months ago but i elected to just do a "b" service. if you put the lexus approved titanium plugs in at service interval i guess i wouldnt have had the issue.

disappointed but not devastated, it appears it may be corrected by re-threading or is this a bad idea

If its hellicoiled (re threaded) the new plug should be OK as long as no damage has been done to the valves or piston. & the cause of the overheating sorted.

cause of the overheating sorted is a good point, do you agree that this could be the lean running, id certainly want to see the condition of the other plugs, its my regular lexus dealer and id accept a guarantee on the work.

One of my pals had a 430 go bang - it was exhaust valve seat recession. The car had done 72K ish on LPG - no lights - it just started running a little rough - a compression test revealed the bad news. £5K from Lexus dealer or £2.5K from Toyoda for the head rebuild - they also recommended Flash lube :) Colin you may want to get your valves checked out before they carry out the repair - I assume they have already suggested this but........

Bren

Ive got a quote from lexes dealership for the suggested helicoil and fix a reasonable sounding £700 quid, Given the advice i recieved here I asked the following questions:

Where are the Bits that melted away, rolling about in the cylinder/Engine ?

Diagnosis of Cause ?

Condition of other plugs ?

Results of a compression test ?

and Guarantee on offer for the repair ?

No answer rolled of their tounges but they are getting back to me, let you know ...

Fantastic Colin - you asked them all the correct questions and got no answers. They need to bore-scope (put a camera down) each cylinder and check the condition of the valves etc - or take the head off (big bucks). But they need to find out what went wrong and if there is any damage - the bits went somewhere - even if they were vaporised then they are now in the exhaust - get an emission test done as part of the fix so you know your cats are OK. They probably are because any metal vapour will have condensed in the top end of the exhaust.

Keep pushing (nicely) and asking until you get sensible answers - try the service manager and then the dealership principle - point out they checked the car out and said it was OK. Always be nice and shame them into giving you good service if you have to :)

Bren

em light wasnt on when purchased, someone had cleared the EM Code and it had an lpg cert, when it came back on i got the car serviced, light went out, got the car lpg serviced it came back on after 500 miles, took it back to different lpg service centre who confirmed brcs system was set up correctly for vehicle, Back to lexus dealer who said em diag suggested it was running a little lean but within tolerances for its age/mileage. did 50k with out issue now done a total of 140k which i agree is about 100k less than id expect from my other lexus 400's ive had over the years.

LESSON: is prob to have the plugs and em checked on regular basis if your running LPG, incidently it had a lexus service 2 months ago but i elected to just do a "b" service. if you put the lexus approved titanium plugs in at service interval i guess i wouldnt have had the issue.

disappointed but not devastated, it appears it may be corrected by re-threading or is this a bad idea

If its hellicoiled (re threaded) the new plug should be OK as long as no damage has been done to the valves or piston. & the cause of the overheating sorted.

cause of the overheating sorted is a good point, do you agree that this could be the lean running, id certainly want to see the condition of the other plugs, its my regular lexus dealer and id accept a guarantee on the work.

One of my pals had a 430 go bang - it was exhaust valve seat recession. The car had done 72K ish on LPG - no lights - it just started running a little rough - a compression test revealed the bad news. £5K from Lexus dealer or £2.5K from Toyoda for the head rebuild - they also recommended Flash lube :) Colin you may want to get your valves checked out before they carry out the repair - I assume they have already suggested this but........

Bren

em light wasnt on when purchased, someone had cleared the EM Code and it had an lpg cert, when it came back on i got the car serviced, light went out, got the car lpg serviced it came back on after 500 miles, took it back to different lpg service centre who confirmed brcs system was set up correctly for vehicle, Back to lexus dealer who said em diag suggested it was running a little lean but within tolerances for its age/mileage. did 50k with out issue now done a total of 140k which i agree is about 100k less than id expect from my other lexus 400's ive had over the years.

LESSON: is prob to have the plugs and em checked on regular basis if your running LPG, incidently it had a lexus service 2 months ago but i elected to just do a "b" service. if you put the lexus approved titanium plugs in at service interval i guess i wouldnt have had the issue.

disappointed but not devastated, it appears it may be corrected by re-threading or is this a bad idea

Hi Colin

Running lean with the light on is not within accepted params in my humble opinion - I have done 206K+ in a 430 and have usually put the Lexus plugs in. I would expect if it is running lean it will run hot. The Lexus dealer in Coventry was always great even with the conversion - I usually use an indi now and occasionally go back to Lexus for a special treat.

If the Lexus dealer say they can fix it then take their advice and guarantee - and don't pay if they don't fix it.

Bren

bren, that seems a reasonable assumption in the circumstances my technical knowledge extends to opening the bonnet and filling the washer bottle thats why I buy lexus ...

You are spot on Colin - I'm an engineer so understand some of the stuff - one of the main reasons to go to Lexus is you should be able to trust them. If they inspected and serviced my car (LPG or not) said it was OK and then it blew up I would have somebodies man vegetables on a skewer or need a pretty god explanation.

Good luck with the fix mate. I see in later posts people say go to Profess - well they may be good but as somebody else pointed out they are not in every town in the Country and there are other really good people out there converting cars. I would always try and go with a recommendation for a supplier and make sure that they have successfully converted the your model in the past.

Bren

em light wasnt on when purchased, someone had cleared the EM Code and it had an lpg cert, when it came back on i got the car serviced, light went out, got the car lpg serviced it came back on after 500 miles, took it back to different lpg service centre who confirmed brcs system was set up correctly for vehicle, Back to lexus dealer who said em diag suggested it was running a little lean but within tolerances for its age/mileage. did 50k with out issue now done a total of 140k which i agree is about 100k less than id expect from my other lexus 400's ive had over the years.

LESSON: is prob to have the plugs and em checked on regular basis if your running LPG, incidently it had a lexus service 2 months ago but i elected to just do a "b" service. if you put the lexus approved titanium plugs in at service interval i guess i wouldnt have had the issue.

disappointed but not devastated, it appears it may be corrected by re-threading or is this a bad idea

Hi Colin

Running lean with the light on is not within accepted params in my humble opinion - I have done 206K+ in a 430 and have usually put the Lexus plugs in. I would expect if it is running lean it will run hot. The Lexus dealer in Coventry was always great even with the conversion - I usually use an indi now and occasionally go back to Lexus for a special treat.

If the Lexus dealer say they can fix it then take their advice and guarantee - and don't pay if they don't fix it.

Bren

I'm with Mike - the light should never be on under normal operating conditions - if the EM light is on you have a problem - read the codes from the ECU via the OBD port - you can get an interface for you laptop or tablet on eBay for a few quid. Any competent garage/mechanic will tell you this and will also be able to check the fault for you. If the Lexus designers think light on is a fault how can anybody else say differently.

Good luck passing the MoT with the light on.

Bren

its with the dealer now, they have now idea but they are going to send the Coil and melted plug to toyota/lexus for further diagnosis. i called in today to see how they were getting on and they showed me the damage. the coil is at the top and it has a plastic type seal to the engine, that had split and that may be the initial cause.

As you know the engine warning light is on following a lpg conversion, it goes off after car is serviced but back on after any decent journey, not concerend about that done ablout 50k with it converted so no prob there.

at the weekend i noticed my phone vibrating on its mount, then noticed while stopped at lights there was a mis-fire going on. at home the engine had a louder than normal tick-over but i wasnt concerned decide to drive to work nottingham to sheffield daily commute and book in for a service i just did a b service last time as funds were tight it should have had an a at 140k that would prob have replaced the plugs ...

the plug itself appears to be stuck in the coil mounting but one side of its thread right to the top has melted away, the engineers say there was a fault code from the diagnosis but didnt say what it was and it may just be the usual one from the lpg anyway.

I cant confirm it had the Correct plugs fitted this would have been down to prev owner who is a forum member and was very proud of his car justifiably so (sorry but ive broke it)

Hi Colin

I have done nearly 100K on LPG and my engine light is never on. Except of course when there is a fault. I had a pin hole in my exhaust that was very close to the Lamda sensors and was a swine to weld up but I got it done - this caused the light to come on. The short term data will be cleared from the ECU if you disconnect the Battery or clear them from the OBD port - I could do this and the light would stay out for a few days but soon came back on. If you had the car serviced at a Lexus dealer what did they say? I did not wait too long to get mine sorted out - I am interested who told you that the light being on was O.K. and what the faults where in the system that caused the light to come on.

I hope you get a good result mate - if a dealer serviced the car and said it was ok.......................

Bren

Hi Colin

Commiserations - any idea how the plug came to melt? Are you going to scrap your LS just sell it as is? How many miles did you put on it on LPG?

Bren

Top Gear presenters will always cause controversy to up the viewer numbers even though the BBC should not concern themselves with such matters. When the first of the LS's were born Quentin Willson gave them a rave review and even ran one himself as a private car for many years and may still to this day for all I know.

As for Top Gear I am not a lover of the Fri/Sat night ***** up brigade they think we all belong too but I have to praise them for some items that have appeared on their program, i.e. who cannot feel justice and a feeling of warm security each time you see a bloody great piano flatten a British Leyland Marina, just a shame they couldn't have done this at the prototype stage if they ever such a thing was made.

I always record and watch later this allows me to edit all the rubbish. As for the "Star In The Car" section I live in hope to hear one day when JC asks the audience "shall we see how he/she got on" the audience reply "No" cause I don't give a damn how they get on.

End of todays rant and I feel all the better for it. Mike

Spot on Mike - QW can be described as a proper journalist which is probably why he is no longer a Top Gear presenter.

Bren

In the past JC and Co have always disparaged the LS and have favoured the big German 3 - why would they change now?. They would probably start dropping pianos on our favourite cars. Those 3 guys do not work as serious motoring journalists they make entertainment using cars as props. It can be great fun and I usually watch - I never watch 5th Gear (that tries to be more serious) because it is a bit boring.

Ray I think you need to add when blokes have a few beers they love to behave like to Top Gear 3

Bren