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I sometimes find it difficult, as a follower and occasional contributor to the LOC, to quickly and confidently distinguish legitimate opinion-based argument from sterile forms of argumentativeness, correct information from incorrect information or (heaven forbid) wilful misinformation, and legitimate complaints from generic rants. I think, Renato, you are going to get this on any forum. The LOC is far better than many I have used in the past. The moderators are keen to try and prevent this. Some feel they are too quick to jump in. However, if posts breach T&C guidlines, then there is not excuse. We must accept that people on the forum will have different opinions, some of them entrenched. I am pleased when debate gets heated that moderators step in to defuse / end a situation developing. Here on the LOC, we are far more civilised than other car forums!

I have done 5 trips to North Norfolk and back to Gloucestershire since March this year, all roof up, 2 people, 2 dogs, boot full. Weather has been mainly fair but some rain, traffic variable but mainly good. Route M4, M25, M11, A14, A11/A134/A1065/A148 to Cromer. All at legal maximum conditions allowing. Total distance c1500 miles Average MPG 30.1 Fuel Used: Tesco Momentum 99 (mainly) & Shell V-Power. I am happy with this.

I drove 170 miles to collect this car. This Premium Pack ES was the only one in the entire Lexus Network in Mesa Red and tan leather interior when I saw it. Like hen's teeth in this spec. It arrived at the dealer who said this colour combo/spec won't hang around long. Sales talk maybe but there was some truth to it as I just couldn't pin one down. What I am getting to is this car was coming home with me unless there was some significant reason why I wouldn't want it. I've had a Premium Edition ES but the spec is well below a Premium Pack and my very first ES in 2019 was a premium pack so I knew my third ES had to be a premium pack The scuffed bumper is something I don't even think they knew anything about even when they did the second year service before I went down. My life was spent in body shops so the actual damage was an easy fix for me but I take the point that a Lexus approved car shouldn't be sold with this sort of paint defect. I agreed £150 reduction on the price as it was agreed the damage came under the heading of a Smart Repair or localised paint repair. I intend to take the bumper off again in a years time and have the bumper fully painted to bring it back to new condition but this localised repair will do till then. I'm at the stage now where I need to use some stopper paste or body putty as some people call it. It's very fine grade of filler and is good for very fine micro scratches prior to priming. Not sure the parking sensors will need to be re calibrated. I removed both bumpers on a Lexus LS460 for repainting once and the sensors worked fine when reconnected.

It's because it doesn't have an Audi/BMW/Mercedes badge. Was it Clarkson who said that if you put one of those badges on a plate of sick, they would fly out of the shop?

Nice move, Malc. Congratulations.

Very true, and in itself a highly positive contribution to Lexus’s image without the company’s involvement …“LEXUS. THE CIVILIZED PERSON’S CAR”.

Oil has brought us decades of prosperity just look at the rise of the western world in the last century. It created possibilities to travel by car boat plane is the basis for numerous products and was the driving force of many economies. The dark side is the drilling can be a pretty horrible story with human rights issues and slave labour and wars have started because of oil. The slogan Stop Oil is naive as we just cant. Looking for alternatives yes fine great idea nobody will debate this but it is not as simple as it sounds.

Agreed, it would not make sense for Lexus to directly participate in the Forum, but I do hope they are lurkers and take note of some of the discussions.

Spot on Ken, a very valid summary of good reasons to buy from a Lexus dealer. You will pay a premium for the purchase and the servicing but you will have peace of mind that you should not be landed with a huge repair bill if something goes wrong. Advice - get an insurance quote before you buy.

I wish l had a product that the law says you have to buy!

As somebody who has spent their entire career in the Printing Industry I agree that there in nothing better than a hard copy printed manual!

You are absolutely right with what you have said there about the inconsistent practices - its ridiculous. Also because of this it seems you have to question, check everything that they say and provide evidence to support your case which is so irritating. My partners 4 year old Yaris Hybrid had its service and I had told them that there was a fault with the front parking sensors in that they get triggered at very random points when driving by a leaf blowing past, exhaust vapour from a car a mile away, spec of dust drifting across (ok a bit of an exageration :)) but makes my partner edgy when the car suddenly warns of an obstruction ahead that isn't there. They are ridiculously sensitive and trigger for no reason at all. They said no fault found and all ok, I went outside with her to drive off and as soon as I started the car was warning me of proximity danger at front, I was still stationery and the object in front was the dealership building but it was at least 8m away. I went back inside they sent the service person out and he said oh yes that's not right but don't know what it could be and we haven't got any available appointments today so bring her back in future and we will keep her for a day / look at it again. When I got home I did some research myself through my work system and found that Toyota were very aware of this issue on the 2018 Yaris models and had implemented a free 'chip' change / fix completely rectified this but were not doing it as a recall and only if the customer complained about the issue and insisted it to be done. Toyota however had rectified it for 2019 models onwards. I PDF'd the information and emailed the dealer and they said they knew nothing about it at all but would order the chip and replace free of charge. Its a bit mad that its the customer who has to do the work to identify the fault to get it sorted especially with a company such as Toyota who seem to recall cars for the pretty much everything.

I’m relieved in a way that I know it’s not ‘just me’ who is witnessing this because for a while, shortly before becoming a member on here, I thought maybe I’m being too harsh with my grumps with the sales team I’ve now been dealing with for 13 months. I know I’ve been asked what dealer I use, but out of respect and decency whilst my long-standing order remains ongoing, I’ve chosen not to say for now. Given my location, that certainly limits the possibilities. All I’ll say is that my dealer has been discussed by at least one other former member in the past (after a bit of searching), but our experiences are very much ‘chalk and cheese’. Recently in another post I said that that it’s unlikely I’ll be dealing with my particular dealer again after I collect my new car (currently due in September) and would unlikely buy another Lexus after this upcoming one based on this experience alone. It would take something pretty special from them in the remaining time I have to wait (or upon collection) for me to change my mind on that. Given how woefully uncommunicative they have been for over a year since I placed my order, in my heart I think enough damage has already been done. I’ve never, ever felt this way about one particular dealer of any brand I’ve dealt with in the past and it does shock me that Lexus, in my opinion, have very much let themselves down. What I find particularly sad is that I’m quite a ‘soft’ person and I am beginning to feel as though I’ve been taken advantage of. I don’t particularly like confrontations but it’s had to get to that point over the last month or so just in order to get something...anything...to happen. I can see it all bubbling up when it comes to sorting out the finance with them/getting a trade-in value on my existing car and again on collection day.

Just seen on the Facebook LOC:

Having owned both the RX and NX, I can say….both are great cars. RX definitely has more passenger space but the boot it’s very very similar (check the technical details) The 2.5l engine in the NX feels somehow more agile and more responsive at low speeds especially in town so you might like it more. Best to do is try both and see what suits you. Both with F Sport package look and feel great to drive. Don t be scared to buy a high mileage one if it has full Lexus history. 34-36 mpg for the RX on average and 39-43 mpg for the NX in case you’re wondering. But that’s with sensible driving style and mostly in the summer.

Get an insurance quote first before considering an RX.

RHD and very different because of the steering shaft that has to run through the middle of the drivers side manifold.

Some of it I guess has to do with the motoring press as well. With pretty much all UK motoring brands being German (or European conglomerate) owned the press has to pander to those brands. There is a very popular reviewer on YouTube who reviewed cars from all the big three Germans and Lexus ES was included in that round up and according to that one reviewer .. the Lexus was the worst of them. I have personally owned Audi and BMW (Audi from brand new) and I am at least one single data point that does not agree with that outcome. The ES when I considered buying was priced in the BMW 3-series segment but had the space/comfort in the 5-series class. Compare U.K. with North America though and the situation flips (in my opinion) towards the right direction. The German cars over there are considered mostly lease-only products. If someone has disposable write-off eligible income they go and lease a German brand car. The fleet market in North America is majorly occupied by other Asian brands or budget American brands as well. I was able to rent a VW at one occasion somehow as I had a Hertz Emerald membership provided by my employer and I walked out of SFO arrivals and completely randomly this VW Jetta was the first car on the lot and I was in a rush. Every other time the rental was a Nissan or a Ford. Also, Lexus are not doing themselves a favour by marketing the ES (and pretty much all hybrids) as e-CVT. The press especially totally unfairly rags on the hybrid drive system. The ES makes less noise than the chain-rattley BMW 4-cylinder I had. Also, try to kick down a Volvo V90 (lowest powered petrol variant was the one I test drove) and it makes a proper racket... and doesn't go very fast too. The Audi A6 I had was on the awful S-Line suspension and not only the engine was droney, the tire noise was horrendous ! Lexus should simply take away that term e-CVT from their marketing materials and start using the proper term Planetary Power Split Device. But I think recently, newer Lexus products are getting favourable reviews from the press. But sadly, the newer products are quite expensive (The NX and the RX) The one reviewer I believe is quite a fair reviewer on YouTube (savagegeese) has reviewed the new products and has concluded that the ES is a far better Lexus than then new NX and RX are. --E

By all means try that as it makes perfect sense (to us mere mortals!) ... but when I renewed earlier this year I went for a higher voluntary excess and the premium went up too! Work that one out!! 🤔

Just recharged this afternoon and got the same result as the previous charge - 53.3/54.9.

A/C would make a small 2hp difference but I'm sure they turn it off. Heated seats wouldn't make a difference. I'll post it up once we go.

Lexus doesn't fit run flats on the 300e electric UX. They're only fitted on the 250h with 18" wheels. Not sure why but guess it might be something to do with the extra weight of the 300e or extra torque or the noise of runflats might be less acceptable in the electric model.

Interesting thread. I agree that the es300h represents fantastic value for money compared to German counterparts but the reality is people just don't want to buy saloons anymore. They are considered old fashioned and seriously uncool. A real shame but they suit my purpose for now but my next car wil be an suv purely from a practical point of view.

I ordered mine, price fixed, last year in September, so may have price increase since.

an unusual choice for me for sure BUT it will take me back some 20/25+ years to my first one J54DAP that I had for some 60k+ miles i think and much joy driving across some of Europe then too ...... In that time there's been much very useful comments and experiences with the Mk1 as advised on here ...... I've learnt a lot over the years and can maybe now appreciate rather more that which I had all that time ago .. hopefully ! e.g non-interference engine and no need to change the cambelt quite so often, the originals had a likely life of 150k miles ..... just odd snippits like that I'm earnestly trying to recall the pitfalls though . I'm sure there'll be a few that I've put to the back of my mind......... might help stave off dementia having some aged thought processes to recount .. let's see I was trying to simply find another Mk3 as I'm thinking the ULEZ expansion end of this month might flush a few older Ls400s out of hiding where the owners won't want to be paying the £12.50 a day charge ...... even if it's " holed up " I'm reading..... . whatever, I live in deepest darkest Kent where the pirates used to live and where Himmler Khan hasn't yet reached his money grabbing tentacles . I do know of another Mk3 with just 60k miles that belongs to the London area living brother of a buddy BUT he's never likely to sell and keeps it immaculate and it's his only car and the added ULEZ charge is just a drop in the ocean to him I understand ..... he's quite prepared to pay for his comfort and luxury and reliability that goes with his immaculate Mk3 ........ a wise man eh ! Mine's got lots of dings and dents and scrapes from some 246k miles of other people's careless driving around and into me ...... I'll be keeping her of course 🤩 Our 2006 Honda Legend is ULEZ proofed and just passed it's fresh MOT so all's well to visit friends and relations in the newly ULEZ'd outer London Boroughs ...... for now anyway I'll keep anyone interested fully posted on all this " new " car to me Malc

To be fair I was well pleased with the outcome as I phoned them on the Sunday night after rear ending someone lol! And it was all sorted and booked in for the repair on the Monday with collection arranged 3 days later, top job done. The only downside was 3 months later getting a threatening letter off the other parties insurer saying they would be taking me to court for their clients costs because my insurers hadn't settled with them 🥲 After a few long winded phone calls my insurers sorted it, even so I sent a letter of complaint over the hassle I received. Imagine my surprise when nearly 1 year later I received a nice letter of apology and an inconvenience cheque for £300.

Picked up my second fob on the 24th July - 6 months to the day after taking delivery of the car. I got a letter from Lexus asking me to book an appointment with my local dealer (Birmingham) and the appointment itself took 10-15 minutes.

got it, thanks

Yeah, I've even contributed to some of them myself but I just thought it worth copying that Facebook post because it categorically states that they are fitting them free of charge.

My car is due to be fitted with this plate tomorrow, so it will be interesting to see what it actually is and how secure it is. It would be nice to see something visible to potential thieves, letting them know before they even try that it is there.

As this gets rolled out more widely, there’s a benefit for all RX owners even if their car hasn’t had the modification. Anything that introduces uncertainty or jeopardy for the bad guys - will this car be an easy and quick theft or not - helps everybody, as hopefully they’ll start to look elsewhere and for other targets. My assumption is this modification isn’t about ultimate prevention, it’s more about delay and causing difficulty. If one car takes thirty seconds to steal but another 3 minutes then the hope is the villains will take the easiest option.

I think you’re correct in that there’s a generational factor involved. We older buyers probably regard developing a good long term relationship with a Dealer as being preferable to shopping around for small, short term gains. And the best Dealers recognise that. Younger buyers, on the other hand, for social and/or financial reasons, have little time for such niceties or the vague concept of loyalty. Equally, it may be that the new breed of salespeople are less inclined to spend time cultivating such customer relationships - especially if they’re constantly pressured to deliver to sales targets or lose their jobs. Of course, car sales has always had that image. But now that buyers can elect to avoid real salespeople completely, it must be an even more challenging way to make a living.

For those living in the London area, according to that post RX owners might be contacted without needing to complain or pursue this themselves. That’s some good news, at least for owners in the London area. Imaginably this will spread and this may then be recognised in the ridiculous insurance premiums!

Love that carbon fibre roof!

I few here already have them:

Are you not aware of hyper expensive designerfridges in black or red?? The smegs of the world. Or the american fridges big enough to host a family( well propably not an american family..) its not easy to be a dealer i know. You need to have the hyperexpensive building, the suits the staff have to sell the x number of cars or no end of year bonus. On top maintenance intervals are getting longer manufacturers want to go direct over the internet and all thats left is a maintenance hub on comissionbasis. Large dealers buy smaller ones and its cost cutting everywhere just to survive. Just not a healthy business environment. However, that does not excuse a sub par attitude as far as i am concerned. If you dont know the details of the car you are selling, if you are not interested in long term relationships. Are blatantly arrogant and full of yourself. I can go on and on. I really think dealers will disappear and the village garage and the true specialists will survive. Volvo announced to go full internet only in the UK. Ford will restructure the network and will go comission only and Tesla? Well the propably started all this

You make an excellent observation Len. I contacted my dealer regarding the 450 canbus plate saying that it's attracted a lot of chatter on this forum. Intriguingly they had no knowledge of the part and said that they will contact Lexus UK? This lack of interaction with a user forum is diametrically opposed to my Jaguar club where JLR are actively involved thereby adding brand value without expensive s****y Marketing Gurus! But that leads onto different points - what is the point of a user forum? Shouldn't the manufacturer be fronting this up? Fundamentally are they adverse to criticism? Or, are they above it all? Once the product is out of the door is that the end of their job and is now the dealers responsibility ie the middle man? And we all know where middle men are going 🤔

I hope you are correct however.... There are people on here (myself included) who have waited 12 to 18 months for delivery so it does seem quite strange that delivery has now been reduced to 4 months.

A little bit of positive news for today, folks. I've been informed that my car has now ‘completed build’ and been put on ‘a ship’. I’ve no idea which one. As usual, being what I consider to be a 'non-priority' customer, no information was given. I can only assume either my car was pushed to the back of the queue again and wasn’t built in June as advised (and of course, wasn’t informed) or it’s sat in Japan for over a month. Either way, it’s just another point to add to many to raise on the day. The initial estimated date at the dealer of 4th September has been brought slightly forward to 31st August. Obviously, that could vary by a few days which I completely understand (having dealt with logistics myself - both past and present) but the dealer is confident that there will be no issues for me with regards to collecting in September, for the ‘73’ plate, sounding quite relieved themselves - probably given my ridiculous extended wait. It’s just a pity that after my experience, I can't help but lack confidence in what they say. Again, the finance details and trade-in value has still yet to be sorted out - which I honestly thought I’d be getting called in for by now. It seems this will be done a little too ‘last minute’ for my own liking. I don’t think it’s ever run this close to collection on any vehicle I’ve bought new in the past. I’m reasonably sure they’ve all been done a few months in advance. I was hoping the dealer would give me the trade-in value and then I’d see if I could better it by a worthwhile amount elsewhere. As time is becoming short, I’m going to have to do this the other way around. Indeed Deb. As I'm sure you know, we're in the same boat. My order dates back to May 2022 - so I'm now into month 15. It's literally only in the last month/six weeks or so, I've finally been starting to get basic details back over my order. Until that point, like yourself, it seems the company has gone to quite some length to avoid contact. It took three complaints to Customer Relations before a 'build month' was acknowledged...and at that time I was a full year into waiting. Zero information was supplied until that one year anniversary. I don't feel I've been exactly 'impatient' or unfair. In the same amount of time, plenty of other NX orders had already been built, shipped and delivered. It really, really doesn't leave me with a good impression with the company as a whole and as a customer, yes, you feel completely unimportant. It's quite clear, in my humble opinion anyway, they've been rather picky over what cars they build. They don't seem to understand customers who are waiting notably longer are more than just 'a little frustrated'. Answers and solutions are needed. Especially if they would like future business. They really have messed up big time with NX orders. I know we're told production is ramping up, lead times are improving e.t.c... but it's funny how it seems to be the same long-standing orders/customers who seem to be waiting extraordinary lengths of time, are facing the same issues and the same lack of communication/updates. Our own 'waiting stories' haven't been a pleasant experience and far cry from what Lexus is supposed to represent in terms of customer service. If supply/lead times really are improving, then why have the likes of our orders seemingly been excluded from that? Again, these are points I will be constructively raising. Do they plan on making amends with those who have been left behind and let down, or will they merely 'shrug their shoulders'? As for the app? Well, I know that my NX is now believed to be at sea. According to my own app, the new car or indeed the order doesn't even exist. It never has from day one. It shows the UX I own now...and that's all it's ever shown. We'll get there in the end (by that I mean getting the car...). We've hung out for this long...! What I've said before and what I'll say again now is that I fear the damage has already been done between the customer and the company. I don't want it to be that way, but I have to be completely honest. Only time will tell, but at the moment... <slowly shakes my head>.

On a fast road, with a set of Bridgestone Duellers, the ride on the F-Sport is smooth. Much, Much smoother than the NX's IMHO

Theres a long post here when a CD is jammed which may be useful. https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sc430-2nd-gen-2001-2010/572620-cd-changer-jammed-7.html A more expensive option is to change the unit if that is the problem and not something like a wiring/fuse issue. Paul Frost has a used on on ebay currently.

hope this helps ! Malc

Well he’s not obliged to read but equally you’re definitely not obliged to post here ad nauseam. As for telling Brian not to read a topic he is a Lexus owner on a Lexus owner forum (see website name) and you are not. You defend your right to a presence here but basically you’re not here to contribute or learn but simply to promote the theory that Lexus owner-owned LCs are overpriced - and prices will fall significantly- in the forlorn hope you can buy one yourself. If current Lexus LC owners object to that somewhat pessimistic theory - promoted by a non Lexus owner on an owner forum, then they have every right to read that guff and object to it, rather than leaving you to peddle your pessimistic guff unchallenged. (Speaking of objecting to your pessimistic guff there is so much nonsense crammed in your last short “market analysis” reply to me that I haven’t got time to address it line by line - but I will later - don’t worry. I rather enjoy it.)

I think it also bears out my view of people in general, in that few can be categorised in a wholly general sense. Often people will say that such and such person is like x, when my experience has been that they're the opposite. We might all have a base level, but often how we behave is a reaction to either our environment at the time, or the person we're engaging with. I know that I can behave differently with work colleagues, friends or family members, for example. In the same way, a service employee can feel in either a superior or inferior position to the customer, or helpful or unhelpful, depending on the nature/behaviour of the customer, and so will act accordingly. Like I say, whlst we all have a base level, how people treat us will be as much about how we treat/approach them as it about their own nature or inclinations.

Yes as you say it's surprising when you see such differing reviews from the same place. I had the opposite experience when I asked Lexus Reading to check/replace some things and they came back and said no reason to change them when I'd already said I was happy for them to be replaced. They also listened to me over another issue including offering a tech to go out with me to listen to the noise I was reporting and then sorted the issues without a problem. Like you though I've had similar experiences in other dealerships (not Lexus) where I was told things needing replacing when clearly they didn't. It's a shame the whole car industry (and associated industries) seems to have such inconsistent practices leaving customers always on their guard and feeling that they are about to get ripped off.

Hello all, I am now in a position to give my view on the standards at the Lexus dealership I bought my RC300H from. I did not want to give full details before until I had given them the chance to rectify (which they have just completed). The dealer I used to have my last Lexus serviced at (Swindon) could not get a used model that i required so I had to purchase from another dealer. At the time I bought I explained I was not happy with the offside rear tyre at all (wont go into the specifics but I have worked in motorsport for many years and had a good reason to not be happy about it. The sales guy said Lexus technicians would not have approved it during the very recent service if it was not ok so I had to accept that. Anyhow I was delivered the car and the driver said 'you do know it only has one key?'. That riled me as it was an expensive purchase and at no point did the sales guy say it was short of a key. Then after the delivery driver had gone I looked at the service book which had not been shown to me before, I was told 3 services done by Lexus and all as they should be. The service book didn't match at all and I spoke to a Lexus contact I had who validated that the service book was accurate which meant that they had in fact not completed any major service at all and it was now 4 years old. Long story short I complained to Lexus HQ and within 30 minutes the dealer principle phoned me to sort things out. He agreed their service department had failed to do the correct service, he agreed that I was meant to have a second key but he said he couldn't do anything about tyre as passed the service. He said I needed to bring it back asap to have the brake fluid etc changed and have the full 4 year, 40,000 mile service done foc plus the second key paired. This dealer is 2 hours from my home and I said I was not prepared to lose time off work and drive over 2 hours each way in my own time to put right what should of been done in the first place. In all fairness to him he was brilliant, he arranged for a really nice loan car to be delivered to me and my car collected for the work to be done. When the service was completed a service person contacted me to advise that lo and behold the rear tyre was close to limit and would need changing in the next month or so and they would do at a special price of £255! I knew that the other tyre on the axle would need changing in next 8-10k so I said there is no way I'm paying for a brand new tyre when I queried this at the start and was told service said it was fine plus they did not supply me with any of the service paperwork to cross reference. They said they would speak with dealer principle and ten minutes later phoned back to say they were replacing both the rear tyres free of charge!!! They have now returned the car to me with all work completed and nothing to pay and collected the loan car. The driver was a really nice person as well and clearly passionate about Lexus. So I am extremely happy with what they have done, they acted rapidly, sorted the immediate issues (service and key / pairing) and also replaced the two rear tyres free! Absolutely brilliant work and I would highly recommend Snows of Southampton to anyone looking for a Lexus and will not hesitate to buy my next Lexus from them.

The best theft protection

My RX was stolen 11 April, no doubt via the wheel arch. What was particularly galling was to receive last week a penalty charge notice from the adjacent borough - the car was illegally parked in a residential bay on the evening of 12 April! I was amazed to find that the thieves hadn't even bothered to swap over the number plates. Were they incompetent or lazy? I doubt it - it would seem that despite having reported the matter to the police, nothing at all is done other than the paperwork for a crime reference number. All those number plate recognition cameras which ought to have kicked into action - are they even switched on? The local authority took photos of the car and reg number and were able to send a penalty notice to me, but were unable to realize the car was stolen. Thank you Hackney (not)! I have now replaced the RX but not with a Lexus and the replacement has an S5 tracker fitted and will soon have a Ghost II immobiliser fitted. Hopefully these will help reduce the odds of losing the new car. Whilst it may be possible to steal any car (as noted above) unfortunately there seem to be some especially vulnerable/ targetted. The other thread surprised me to identify that in London, the RX is now fancied by the tea leaves. A real shame as the build quality of mine was exceptional. Range Rovers seem to be the current proverbial tip of the iceberg. I heard on a recent pod cast by Chris Harris and friends that one of their pals recently bought a Range Rover. They live outside London most of the time but also have an apartment in London. Their insurance renewal appeared with a £50,000 excess on the policy!! So whilst it may be possible to steal any vehicle, the odds are more heavily stacked against some more than others. Regrettable that the RX is heading up the popularity charts with thieves. Peter

Lexus Newcastle have been brilliant as a service customer. No complaints from me whatsoever. Seems to be rather hit/miss elsewhere! Now just need to see if they let me drive an LC500 at my next fuel pipe recall or stick me in a UX….