Expensive Week For The Gs450H!

gareth1902 · March 18, 2015

So happily took the car in to Lexus for the service and MOT. Got the service plan and car felt fine so expected a very cheap day at the dealership sipping coffee all day.

Not so.

Front brake discs and pads need doing so I paid my £325, also a sidelight bulb was out which cost around £1.50 and £28 to fit it!! And the 2 yearly air con service with anti bac they recommend £90.

So with the wallet feeling somewhat lighter than it was, I was hit with further bad news.

Rear brake calliper seized - new one required, and leaking water pump - new one required. Total £560 more!! Anyway as they couldn't do these jobs there and then as the parts weren't in I am just wondering if you suggest just paying my £560 at Lexus and weeping or should I try to shop around independents to save a few quid? Always gone to Lexus for everything but at this rate they'll be bankrupting me!!! even if the coffee is good.........

Car is only 5 years old with FLSH and I've only had it a twelve month. Already had £300 for a new Battery plus all this. What's going on!

steve2006 · March 18, 2015

For the caliper I would be looking for a reconditioned one,many members have used this company for spares and calipers

http://biggred.co.uk/onlinestore.php or have a look on the link below

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PAGID-Brake-Caliper-Rear-Left-LEXUS-GS-300-430-450-H-/331317518343?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item4d24102007Shouldn't be a big job to get it fitted.

Water pump is not cam belt driven so not a major engine strip down to replace,depends if you want to go OEM or aftermarket but here's a decent brand at 80.00 quid instead of 190.00 from Lexus. Add another £30.00 for the gasket and O rings ( Lexus only)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LEXUS-GS-450h-OE-Quality-FAI-Water-Pump-2GR-FSE-Engine-Code-/171382760362?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&fits=Car+Make%3ALexus&hash=item27e73563aa

If you can find a decent independant to fit the parts you should be looking at no more than 150.00 labour to do the whole lot and around £200.00 for the parts.

If you do decide to go with Lexus why not check to see if they give a discount for Gold LOC members, even paying for a years membership with a dealer 10% discount you'll still be in the black :)

39buss · March 19, 2015

It may be worth mentioning the fact that Lexus rear calipers have a long history of seizing.

claytow · March 19, 2015

gareth1902

This sounds spookily like my day at Lexus on Monday... it wasnt Norwich Lexus was it?

Went in for Fuel Pipe recall, came out with leaking water pump and 2 rear seized calipers.

The tech actually took a picture, well sort of a picture apparently its hard to see but lots of pink crusty stuff around. Mines going in this week and with an LOC Gold membership it was £100 less than it should have been.

Membership definitely has its benefits!

gareth1902 · March 19, 2015

For the caliper I would be looking for a reconditioned one,many members have used this company for spares and calipers

http://biggred.co.uk/onlinestore.php or have a look on the link below

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LEXUS-GS-450h-OE-Quality-FAI-Water-Pump-2GR-FSE-Engine-Code-/171382760362?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&fits=Car+Make%3ALexus&hash=item27e73563aa

If you can find a decent independant to fit the parts you should be looking at no more than 150.00 labour to do the whole lot and around £200.00 for the parts.

If you do decide to go with Lexus why not check to see if they give a discount for Gold LOC members, even paying for a years membership with a dealer 10% discount you'll still be in the black :)

Can you explain what you mean when you say about the gasket and o rings £30 (Lexus only). does that mean I have to get them separately from Lexus? Confused

gareth1902 · March 19, 2015

gareth1902

This sounds spookily like my day at Lexus on Monday... it wasnt Norwich Lexus was it?

Went in for Fuel Pipe recall, came out with leaking water pump and 2 rear seized calipers.

The tech actually took a picture, well sort of a picture apparently its hard to see but lots of pink crusty stuff around. Mines going in this week and with an LOC Gold membership it was £100 less than it should have been.

Membership definitely has its benefits!

Hi thanks for the reply. Out of curiosity what did they charge you for your water pump and callipers?

rayaans · March 19, 2015

gareth1902

This sounds spookily like my day at Lexus on Monday... it wasnt Norwich Lexus was it?

Went in for Fuel Pipe recall, came out with leaking water pump and 2 rear seized calipers.

The tech actually took a picture, well sort of a picture apparently its hard to see but lots of pink crusty stuff around. Mines going in this week and with an LOC Gold membership it was £100 less than it should have been.

Membership definitely has its benefits!

Hi thanks for the reply. Out of curiosity what did they charge you for your water pump and callipers?

Air con reconditioning is always recommended lol - that was £90 you probably didnt have to spend

steve2006 · March 19, 2015

Sorry if my post was confusing, looking at the rxploded parts diagram it shows the WP gasket and 2 O ring seals which I would assume also need replacing at the same time, not sure if these would be supplied with the new WP or whether they are also available as aftermarket parts so quoted Lexus a the source to be sure.

If you need the part numbers feel free to pm me.

Peter Whitaker · March 19, 2015

Definitely I would shop around.

I have had extreme differences in service quotes - in some cases Lexus is quadruple!

However the trade off is whether they really know what they're doing with a complex car and do they have the equipment / machines for testing.

Also depends on the job... things like brake pads I would definitely go elsewhere.

A middle path could be Halfords Auto Centre or similar as they have to keep a standard.

claytow · March 20, 2015

gareth1902

This sounds spookily like my day at Lexus on Monday... it wasnt Norwich Lexus was it?

Went in for Fuel Pipe recall, came out with leaking water pump and 2 rear seized calipers.

The tech actually took a picture, well sort of a picture apparently its hard to see but lots of pink crusty stuff around. Mines going in this week and with an LOC Gold membership it was £100 less than it should have been.

Membership definitely has its benefits!

Hi thanks for the reply. Out of curiosity what did they charge you for your water pump and callipers?

Hi Gareth,

I havent the exact figures to hand but it was £444 for the water pump and around £185 per caliper all inc.

cruisermark · March 20, 2015

hi

guys is it not possible to just remove the pins , regrease and then replace or perhaps by new pins?

Hayne · March 21, 2015

Exactly what I was thinking. I doubt there is anything wrong with your old callipers, as they are just seized up. A quick strip down and grease to lube them up and I expect they would be a good as new. I have done this on several cars now and it has always worked. A new seal kit would probably be only about £20 if they ever leaked.

Yet another Lexus rip off. Main dealers are fine when a fault is covered under warranty, but at any other time, I would steer clear of them. In my opinion (and experience) they frighten people in to spending lots of money when they don't need to.

Main dealers won't repair anything; they are either incapable, or are only allowed to sell new parts.

Sorry to rant. I shall calm down now, but after diagnosis, they wanted to sell me a hybrid pump for £3240, when after my own investigation. all that was wrong with it was a £7 bearing!!

angus01 · March 26, 2015

Replaced my water pump today on my gs450h luckily I am able to carry out these repairs myself but any reputable garage will be able to carry out this repair a lot cheaper than the agent

marok · March 27, 2015

Sorry to rant. I shall calm down now, but after diagnosis, they wanted to sell me a hybrid pump for £3240, when after my own investigation. all that was wrong with it was a £7 bearing!!

Nice one, Giles, but how did you find out that it was a faulty bearing, and how did you know where to get a suitable replacement?

Did you replace it yourself?

Hayne · March 28, 2015

Hi Marok,

I borrowed a ramp for a day and drained the ATF out of the gearbox and removed the Hybrid pump (four bolts) and wiring loom to the pump controller. I removed the pump impeller housing screws (3 screws) and found that the shaft was seized and wouldn't budge. So I took the motor housing off (another 3 screws) and found that the front bearing was seized, preventing the motor shaft from turning.

It is a very clever and simple well engineered design, the pump and motor are in excellent condition, it was just the bearing that had failed. I took the bearing to a bearing supplier and they had one in stock for £7. They said this is a common size bearing readily available. I also bought the rear shaft bearing at the same time and re-assembled it, filled the gearbox up with new ATF, cleared the P2797 code and the car has now run perfect for the last 3 months, without problems.

Someone else on this forum read my post and did the same on his LS600h and he now has a working pump again too. He also has two friends with the same problem and I believe they have repaired theirs too.

A relatively simple and cheap repair, saving thousands of pounds. Lexus quote 9 hours to replace the pump. I took 7 hours, including investigating the problem and driving to the bearing shop. Just shows, they even charge you too many hours for a job that should take them no more than 4 or 5 hours to do when replacing a new pump.

This is the fault that every GS450h and LS600h owner dreads. EVERYONE SPREAD THE WORD THAT THIS IS AN EASY FIX AND DON'T GO TO A LEXUS DEALER WITH THIS PROBLEM AS YOU WILL BE RIPPED OFF !!! Otherwise, you will be throwing away a perfectly good pump for the sake of a cheap bearing.

I bought £50 worth of genuine ATF, 2x bearings at £14 and a ramp charge of £100. If a garage was to do this for you, it should cost around £500 parts and labour.

Giles.

marok · March 28, 2015

Outstanding, sir. Congratulations.
Some great advice there.

Peter Whitaker · March 29, 2015

Indeed.

May I ask a simple question.... how did you know what the problem was in the first place?

Did you break down and get towed to a local garage?

Or was it diagnosed by Lexus?

thanks

Pete

Hayne · March 29, 2015

Hi Pete,

The car just ground to a halt one day and showed the Hybrid System Fault message. I immediately restarted it and it ran fine in petrol only mode. I ran it for 6 months like this until I diagnosed the problem.

Lexus never saw the car; I would never let them near any car of mine as they seen to have a history of replacing parts for the sake of it instead of properly diagnosing. I didn't take it to a garage (I never take a car to a garage unless I know what the fault is likely to be), only when I hired the ramp for the day.

I read the fault code P2797 and did some research and saw that many other people have encountered the same problem with the same end result; a new pump!

I then checked the power to the pump controller and resistance of the pump motor windings and fuse, etc. I paid a small fee to JustAnswer to get some advice from a Lexus Tech and he gave me the same advise; new pump required.

I spoke to Lexus dealer and told them my issue and they too said that the only solution was anew pump at £3240.

So, it is at that point I decided to investigate the pump fault myself, with the solution found and fixed on the same day.

If you look at the post "GS450h Loss Of Power", that gives you all the details throughout my diagnosis.

Giles.

mikeyv · March 29, 2015

When you think of some of the crackpot schemes, foisted on us in the interests of the environment, how is it acceptable for a major car manufacturer to throw away a perfectly serviceable part, for the sake of a repair costing a few pounds?

Mind you, our marvellous rulers decided it was a good idea to pay us to scrap perfectly good cars, and replace them with economical diesels, which are now considered, only a few years later, to be poisoning the planet!

Wonder how long before they are bribing us out of our oil burners with another whizz bang scheme.

Hayne · March 29, 2015

Yes, hardly environmentally friendly. The scrappage scheme was a ridiculous idea. And now, the government want to phase out diesels by 2030 and Boris wants to start banning diesels from London. I have read that by 2020, plans are for diesels to have an extra £10 surcharge added to the congestion charge making it £20 per day if you have a diesel.

So they make it attractive for us to buy diesels and now we have a majority of them on our roads, they want us to get rid of them.

Of course, this is excellent news for Lexus UK !!! Hybrids will be a majority very soon, me thinks.

larryadler · April 2, 2015

I have read the comments on this topic with interest. It is now two years since I reluctantly parted company with my GS 300 SE-L, and still miss it to this day. The reason I changed marque.....ridiculous road tax cost, and loss of faith in Lexus dealers.

Interestingly I had both rear calipers replaced under warranty, and Peter Whitaker appears to believe that Lexus technicians are something exceptional to be able to work on such a complex vehicle....really thet just plug the OBD meter in, read the codes and you pick up the tab.

I am in the Hayne camp, I lost faith after my GS had the Xmas tree lights, ABS, Traction control, Engine management, you know the symptoms, they are all over this site. Took it to Lexus Dealer, OBD meter, yes Sir, 2 x oxygen sensors and ECR, that wil be £2500 please. When I bumped my gums, Lexus did parts half price, and dealer half price labour, now £1200.

Thank god for this site, following forum discussion, bought new fuel cap, £26, and problem solved, no more issues. When the engine switched on, fuel tank pressurises, and old filler cap rubber, (five and half years old) lets in air and sets of all the light. Now i aint no Lexus technician, but if I can find out that information, surely Lexus technicians can, but of course not as proffitable. Incidentley, Lexus were replacing the oxygen sensors and ECU until the car was 5 years old as they knew they had a problem but never admitted.

Still miss my GS, smooth, powerful, a cut above, but had my new motor two years now, and the dashboard doesn't creak or rattle. I would never rule out a Lexus return though, fantastic cars, and coffee, but dealer confidence an issue.

InIgo Lexus · April 2, 2015

I have had a nightmare week with Lexus. Was out last Wednesday everything running fine. Suddenly the petrol engine cut out so I parked up and tried to restart. Horrid spluttering and the car turned for about 10 secs then cut out. Called RAC. 2 sensors per cam reporting faults so got the car taken to Lexus.

ONE WEEK LATER, today, they tell me the timing chain has gone and I need a new engine. 16.5K + VAT. WHAAAAAT?

Guys I need your help.

InIgo Lexus · April 2, 2015

Also, Isn't a timing chain supposed to be a lifetime part?

Hayne · April 2, 2015

Sorry to hear that Mark.

Well, worst case, a used engine will be about £2-3k and probably a couple of days to fit it.

But, before you panic, its worth getting it properly diagnosed by a decent mechanic (not a Lexus dealer 'technician' !!!)

Usually, if a cam belt/chain snaps, the heads need removing and new valves and cams need fitting. I don't know about the GS450h, but I imagine it would be a similar process. It just needs someone to work out what has been damaged and replace the damaged parts.

A new engine? In my opinion; unlikely.

Its also worth doing your own research. There is probably someone else who has had the same problem who has shared the solution on the web.

I hope the diagnosis is not too serious for you.

Giles.

InIgo Lexus · April 2, 2015

Thanks Hayne, I have had a chat with a mech friend and fitting a new one is one thing but he was concerned about registering the engine with the electronic systems...but I have some work to do to fix this but I am heartened by your view. Thank you.