Top Gear Rcf Review

[jetskidia]

I guess Lexus will be cancelling their Top Gear magazine subscription

[matt-c]

Do Lexus have a TG magazine subscription?

[ricostuart]

Was not impressed with that review at all. Infact topgear has really let themselves down totally this season. Most segments all feel like filler parts to make the season longer to pamper to the american market.

[3 MSF]

Shame they DIDN'T give The Stig the car as he would've made Mr Clarkson look the fool. How can you even listen to a man that goes on about a car having 'more torques...' - not exactly familiar with terms you might reasonably expect of a qualified, knowledgeable automotive journalist...

He hadn't a clue about how to set the car up, and the torque vectoring differential told him who was boss when he tried to drive it like a lunatic. The Stig would've certainly showed a very different car, one more capable than Mr Clarkson was qualified to show.

I own an M4 and had the pleasure of test-driving the RCF today and they are very different vehicles, so why insist on judging all by the same limited criteria? In numerous ways, the Lexus gives so much more on the 'emotional quality' front, and would, without a doubt, provide you with a more than credible alternative as your every-day driver.

Poor show Jeremy - very poor.

[ganzoom]

Been a Lexus forum clearly people here wouldn't like Clarksons review of the RCF....

BUT, he does make a point, the RCF had a kerb weight of 1800kg, which means a real life gross weight of probably 2 tons!! The up and coming GSF weighs the same....that has much more space inside for people and luggage...and given similar powe/weight ratio I suspect wouldn't be much slower if at all.

Lexus KNOW how to make lighter cars, the IS300H, despite been a hybrid only weighs about 100kg more than the equivalent 3 series.

Than there's the price, the RCF is no cheaper than a M3, and though BMW isn't doing offers on the M3 at the moment eveyone is waiting for the 15-20% off list price deals to come out....So ask your selfs, forget the brand, but would you pay £10-15k more for a car that weighs more, has a worse power/weight ratio, and is less practical??

BTW: I'm no BMW fan boy. We've dropped £35k on a brand new IS300H which I love. The IS300H makes my BMW 335i look very old...and though I always said I'll replace the 335i with a Tesla S, if Lexus do an hybrid GSF, I would find it hard to resists :D

But on the RCF....Sorry Lexus but you can do better, a lot better :(

[stevet]

Better to compare it against the M4. Same price but Lexus is fully kitted out so I would of thought the M4 to be £10-£15k more expensive spec for spec. Both not as practical as the saloons. Plus the RC-F will still be fault free after 5 years.

[mikeyv]

Check pistonheads for a proper review and a balanced argument from the members, Clarkson is an immature, attention seeking bore, and I'd never judge any car on his say so.

As to whether the car is any good, there's only one way to see if it suits you, and that, obviously, is to drive it and make your own mind up.

By the way, there are more posts on this episode in the classic car thread.

[MrW]

Try Chris Harris's review on the RCF, much more balanced.

[Stuno1]

Try Chris Harris's review on the RCF, much more balanced.

Agreed. I still think Lexus dropped a nutt here. It is to fat... Fact. Reduced weight would have improved the cars handling characteristics no end. Never mind.

[3 MSF]

Been a Lexus forum clearly people here wouldn't like Clarksons review of the RCF....

BUT, he does make a point, the RCF had a kerb weight of 1800kg, which means a real life gross weight of probably 2 tons!! The up and coming GSF weighs the same....that has much more space inside for people and luggage...and given similar powe/weight ratio I suspect wouldn't be much slower if at all.

Lexus KNOW how to make lighter cars, the IS300H, despite been a hybrid only weighs about 100kg more than the equivalent 3 series.

Than there's the price, the RCF is no cheaper than a M3, and though BMW isn't doing offers on the M3 at the moment eveyone is waiting for the 15-20% off list price deals to come out....So ask your selfs, forget the brand, but would you pay £10-15k more for a car that weighs more, has a worse power/weight ratio, and is less practical??

BTW: I'm no BMW fan boy. We've dropped £35k on a brand new IS300H which I love. The IS300H makes my BMW 335i look very old...and though I always said I'll replace the 335i with a Tesla S, if Lexus do an hybrid GSF, I would find it hard to resists :D

But on the RCF....Sorry Lexus but you can do better, a lot better :(

I'm failing to see the point of your post. Firstly, I own a BMW M4, fully specced, and the M4 and RCF retail about the same around £65k.

Maybe the extra weight is the reason the RCF feels that bit more solid, firm and planted on the road. I don't have kids nor do I ferry folk around, so the space in the back is of little importance to me.

But I draw a close here - "Forget the brand" - well, that's where you still have opportunity. You see, it's the brand, their philosophy, their respect for people, their JD Power Survey 'Best Customer Service' awards year after year that say so much more than owning a stripped-out track car for the road.The RCF is beautifully isolated from the outside world as a function of strategically placed sound deadening materials, and they come with some mass.

My brand new M4 has 'been in' on a number of occasions already for exhaust valve, ECU, rear brake disc, whining from the e/g bay, broken interior component issues - that's more than my 5 previous Lexus vehicles put together! And I'm not biased - I've owned V8 M3, 335d M Sport Coupe, 323i Coupe, 328i Coupe, 330i Coupe, Alpina B3 BiTurbo, Alpina B3s BiTurbo... so, forget the brand? I think you perhaps don't get what 'Lexus' is all about; it's an experience, a good one, not just a car...

[MrW]

It is a little tiresome that it seems that its only a great car, in many circles, if it drifts easily.

Its just not the whole story.

[stevet]

Read the Pistonheads review. Much more in depth and also read the comments below it. Very interesting.

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=1487207

[ganzoom]

Been a Lexus forum clearly people here wouldn't like Clarksons review of the RCF....

BUT, he does make a point, the RCF had a kerb weight of 1800kg, which means a real life gross weight of probably 2 tons!! The up and coming GSF weighs the same....that has much more space inside for people and luggage...and given similar powe/weight ratio I suspect wouldn't be much slower if at all.

Lexus KNOW how to make lighter cars, the IS300H, despite been a hybrid only weighs about 100kg more than the equivalent 3 series.

Than there's the price, the RCF is no cheaper than a M3, and though BMW isn't doing offers on the M3 at the moment eveyone is waiting for the 15-20% off list price deals to come out....So ask your selfs, forget the brand, but would you pay £10-15k more for a car that weighs more, has a worse power/weight ratio, and is less practical??

BTW: I'm no BMW fan boy. We've dropped £35k on a brand new IS300H which I love. The IS300H makes my BMW 335i look very old...and though I always said I'll replace the 335i with a Tesla S, if Lexus do an hybrid GSF, I would find it hard to resists :D

But on the RCF....Sorry Lexus but you can do better, a lot better :(

I'm failing to see the point of your post. Firstly, I own a BMW M4, fully specced, and the M4 and RCF retail about the same around £65k.

Maybe the extra weight is the reason the RCF feels that bit more solid, firm and planted on the road. I don't have kids nor do I ferry folk around, so the space in the back is of little importance to me.

But I draw a close here - "Forget the brand" - well, that's where you still have opportunity. You see, it's the brand, their philosophy, their respect for people, their JD Power Survey 'Best Customer Service' awards year after year that say so much more than owning a stripped-out track car for the road.The RCF is beautifully isolated from the outside world as a function of strategically placed sound deadening materials, and they come with some mass.

My brand new M4 has 'been in' on a number of occasions already for exhaust valve, ECU, rear brake disc, whining from the e/g bay, broken interior component issues - that's more than my 5 previous Lexus vehicles put together! And I'm not biased - I've owned V8 M3, 335d M Sport Coupe, 323i Coupe, 328i Coupe, 330i Coupe, Alpina B3 BiTurbo, Alpina B3s BiTurbo... so, forget the brand? I think you perhaps don't get what 'Lexus' is all about; it's an experience, a good one, not just a car...

I dare to say you might be right…

I’ve always had Japanese cars before, including the Integra Type R (DC2) and 350Z. Ended up in a 335i, because the lure of the M3 was too strong, and the wife refused to even sit in a M3 on the basis it attracted too much attention :)

We’re only day 2 into our Lexus ownership experience, the IS300H has replaced a Civic. I always knew the Lexus was going to blow the Civic out of the water in-terms of refinement/experience, but what I didn’t expect to find was that actually I now prefer to drive the IS300H more than the 335i…Despite the fact I’ve spent £6K on mods to turn my 335i into a pseudo mini M car!!

Still the RC-F just doesn’t make sense to me, how can a sports coupe weigh so much, when the GS-F, a car that I’m now seriously considering as a replacement for my 335i, weighs the same but is much more practical….Your not going to tell me that the GS-F is badly built/sound insulated compared to the RC-F ;)

[3 MSF]

No - I won't do that - I'm not biased in any way. As an automotive engineer in a former life responsible for body shell construction, I learned alot about Unusual Interior Noise (UIN) and Noise, Vibration and Harshness (NVH) signatures and their root-causes. The GSF and RCF are completely different structures with different resonance and exitation frequencies. Smart use of minimum materials can have a dramatic effect on interior noise, and doors are almost a vehicle within themselves (very complex as an assembly process, usually demanding their own assembly lines away from the main vehicular bodies) and their design can contribute significantly to noise generation or reduction as opposed to a large quarter panel area and volume that will need suppressing as in the case of the RCF. For this reason, a bit of smart design (there will be a team focussed on this, if only to minimise the use of materials to minimise manufacturing costs through Value Analysis (VA - after the event) and even better, Value Engineering (up-front design and manufacturing engineering activities). The GSF will have had much of both, no doubt.

So, dont be surprised to hear that 'less is more', as the term 'lean' was derived through analysis of the Toyota Production system, that does 'more with less'.

[ganzoom]

Seen this on a Car and Driver

'Lexus managed to keep the GS F’s weight to a minimum, resulting in a claimed curb weight of 4034 pounds, only 76 more than the RC F coupe. Credit the GS’s more integrated structure; the RC F is cobbled together from the bones of the GS, the previous-generation IS convertible, and the newest IS sedan. The RC’s convertible-sourced bits, especially, are porky, since that car’s middle section came with rigorous bracing and thick sills to mitigate chassis twist caused by the lack of a roof.'

So essentially the RCF was handicapped at conception interms of been over weight...which is shame:(

But thats good news for any potential new IS-F...450Bhp in the IS300H chassis...Lexus is surely on to a winner there :D

[3 MSF]

I'm sure it's been oversimplified, and probably incorrect to a point. Different grades of steel are available, and not necessarily heavier (chemistry and processing / subsequent treatments can take care of that) with regards to bracing etc. Porky isn't a term I heard used around the Press Shop, but maths and physics must've provided the solution for the twist and strength requirements of the RCF.

All that aside, I have to agree that an ISF would be welcomed, and may come from a better starting point. As the RCF allocations seem to be rapidly running out (irrespective of the Top Gear 'review'(?), we're all going to need something else to drool over if you're not after the 5 series / E Class equivalent... :)

[noby76]

the RC-F is over 200kg heavier than the automatic M4 Coupe and yet the M4 betters it by only 0.4 secs from 0 to 60mph nothing in it if you asked me...infact this goes to show how good the RC-F is with over 200kg weight deficit when compared to the M4. have you not seen how heavy a Nissan GT-R is and yet manages to wipe the floor with Ferrari's and Gallardo's who's kerb weight are between something like 1400-1500kg?

the RCF might be heavier but has just over 40 bhp more than the M4 which weighs less and has less bhp this closes the gap between both cars in terms of power to weight ratio.

[MrW]

0-60 is just one measurement and actually means nothing in terms of a cars overall performance.

The GTR is quick to 60 as its 4WD, thus traction is much better.

[noby76]

there are 4WD Gallardo's and the GT-R still wipes the floor with those... yes am aware 0-60 is one aspect of a cars overall performance but just pointing out the fact that the M4's 0-60 is not that better compared to the bloated RC-F as some reviewers like to point out. I actually havent seen a proper comparison of the M4 and RC-F in terms of track times and handling capabilities. all the videos i see so far is reviers going on about how heavy the RC-F is and them trying out their drifting skills in them..

[3 MSF]

Check-out YouTube - there are even a couple of closed-circuit tests where the RCF beats the M4, especially when you throw a few bends in there. The M4 has so much torque and is so light that through the twistys it's all tyre smoke as traction is exceeded or at its limits.

A couple have interviews with very well respected professional drivers, and it's my recollection that they're pretty much all complimentary about the RCF, its traction, its chassis balance and so on. Its weight get's mentioned quite frequently too, although I did hear someone say it's carrying a bit less than Mr Clarkson these days...

[stevet]

Makes me laugh when Clarkson puts into 'expert' mode, then can't drive it! Says it all really :)

[3 MSF]

I think that was just before he shot off into the grass... Best place for him.

[is200 Newbie]

Would Lexus subscribe to the Top Gear kids show magazine? Clarkson is an "oaf" who heads a show about cars that very few of us will be able to afford in our lifetime ....

Didn't see him put this around the track with the more "expert" driver Stig behind the wheel or even try to explain away not doing so ... scared? ... or did I fall asleep at that point?

Don't think we will ever see the track time as he will be eating his words.

[lotusdave]

trouble is the public perception of the rcf is going to be influenced by tg. It is heavy but its also natural aspirated and rare. In a few years wed all have one! I don't want an m3 or m4 because they are ubiquitous and I wanted something left field. That's why the isf works for me. Rcf too if I had that kind of cash. I'd also have a gtr and indeed probably will one day.

[MrW]

As Dave says, TG like it or not has a huge following, so will have damaged Lexus to a small degree. Lexus UK won't be lending there LFA out to TG again that's for sure.