Nasty New Year's Fright.

[Titch LS]

New Year's Day and off to work. Get in the car to start my 2000 Mk4 as usual, turned the key for a second or so and BAM!, it immediately revs to the limiter and I'm not even touching the pedals! I switched off as quickly as I could and as I was running tight for time, I borrowed the missus's car to get me to work. It's had me thinking, maybe this was a rare case of Toyota Sudden Unintended Acceleration which has resulted in court cases (and deaths) in the U.S.A. Toyota have so far paid out $1.1Billion to claimants as a result. I'm now a bit wary that this could happen to me again, only this time, whilst I'm on the move. That would be really scary in a V8 LS, imagine if you were in a carpark. Also, as the engine was stone cold when it happened, I was wondering if it might have caused some wear to the engine components or am I worrying too much? (I'll try starting it again tomorrow, see what happens). Happy New Year to one and all.

[Scribe]

Scary. I'd be nervous turning it on again. Fingers crossed it'll be okay. And I doubt it has damaged the engine.

[Chris Skelton]

Check accelerator linkage in case it's somehow stuck open? (Under bonnet, though I guess you may as well check some 'carpet interface' inside!

[Titch LS]

Chris, I checked the cable linkage and it appears to be operating freely as it should. Looking at some U.S. sites it seems to be a fault on the electronic throttle side(fly by wire) of the system on many Toyota/Lexus vehicles from about 1998 onwards. It has become a bit of an issue in the States with owners taking Toyota to court as a result of SUA (Sudden Unintended Acceleration). One case involved an American police officer and his family who's Lexus ES became uncontrollable as a result of SUA. There were tragic circumstances. Also, although mainly affecting Camrys and Avalons, a handful of LS's have also been affected. The theory is that random electrical interferance upsets the electronics and causes the car to go to wide open throttle. Scary stuff. I believe it too. My next door neighbours jammed on wireless doorbell would stop the cental locking from working on both my wife's car and mine. As soon as the bell was off we could lock and unlock both cars. I'm not making it up. It happened more than once. By the way, I did check the carpets---no problem there.

[Scribe]

Less importantly, I sometimes can't lock or unlock my smart car where I work, though the key works fine inside it. I have to move around the site until the remote will work. I assume it's something to do with interference from a nearby radio mast. (When the car won't unlock I have to use the key to open the boot and then scramble inside and over the seats - in a very undignified way - to reach the internal door handle. I couldn't do this in the Lexus, of course.)

[Chris Skelton]

All these microwaves are probably causing Road rage as well!

Does anyone know?

Still, if we all die of brain cancer, the world has FAR too many humans in it anyway and it'll be the ones who are consuming the most who go!

I frequently refer to the old Citroen 2CV advert that has a list of features the 2CV DIDN'T have; then at the bottom, said "Nothing to go wrong"!!

Wipers have their own computers, apparently!

Was thinking of a Smart (Forfour), but now........

[aviator888]

I've had a very frightening experience 3 years ago on the new years eve. Accelerated from the traffic lights and the car just kept going on full power even tough i had taken my foot off accelerator pedal. Pushing the brakes did not seem to have any affect so i had to swith off the ignition to stop. I was scared to death and so was my 8 month pregnant missus in the passenger seat. Lucky it happened around midnight with very little traffic.

The car was Mercedes C32 AMG with supercharged 354 horsepower V6 engine and just 70 000 miles on the clock. Had to sell it because the incident was always going to be in the back of my mind..

[alien1974]

try doing a reset ie disconnect the Battery

[Titch LS]

Mel, thankfully you and your missus were safe after your experience of SUA in your Merc. Looking on line, I've noticed that SUA has affected quite a number of car makers and apart from Toyota/Lexus; there's Ford, VW, BMW, Mercedes, Hyundai to name just a few. They've all had the same occasional problem. If you read the court depositions, Toyota Corp. knows there is a problem with software design affecting the Electronic Throttle Control and is duly making out-of-court settlements to avoid bad publicity. There are currently 500 law suits pending against them in the U.S.

My engine instantly revving up like a banshee without any imput from me has made me realise that even a Lexus can develop a potentially fatal fault. I'm so glad it happened at start up and not whilst driving. I'm slightly nervous of driving it at all now to be honest. It started up today, no trouble. I will drive it, but from now on I will always have that niggle in the back of my mind when I'm behind the wheel. Never ever did I consider my LS could be unsafe to drive, --until now.

[cleverdick]

I sympathize with your predicament; even if you were to take it to the main dealer I doubt they'd take it seriously unless they could provoke the fault into recurring - which is unlikely.

This also brings me back to the point (and it's a sore point) that manufacturers won't generally issue a recall where older vehicles are involved, but not only that, they won't tell you what the cut-off age is beyond which they won't [issue a recall].

Too many of these systems just aren't designed to be fail-safe. It's a universal problem, in part arising from the lack of real-world experience (by the designers) into how components fail.

I don't necessarily buy into all these scare stories from the US involving cars out of control at highway speeds. It would always be possible to select neutral and coast to a stop.

Let us know what kind of a response you get from Toyota.

[Ruud]

I agree it would always be possible to put it in neutral, BUT imagine a 27 year old 'soccer mom' having this experience. Would common sense overrule panic at that time? I'm not sure...

[Titch LS]

Cleverdick, some drivers just aren't switched on enough in their understanding of how their autoboxes work, especially in America where it's very common to drive an automatic. Some drivers genuinely believe that putting the car into neutral whilst moving will damage their expensive gearbox. Also, blind panic takes them over while barrelling along out of control at 100mph, so they don't think rationally enough to put the car into neutral and apply the brakes. In a built up area with traffic and pedestrians about you only have split seconds to react properly if your car 'takes off' with SUA. That is the real scary scenario. (There's dash-mounted footage of SUA on Youtube). In the meantime, I'm going to contact Lexus just to get their view on my 'banshee' start-up. I'm not expecting too much in the way of a response.

[cleverdick]

Point taken I guess... Mind you, selecting park at 100mph could be interesting!

Don't discount the possibility of it being something to do with the cruise control system.

[Titch LS]

To protect the gearbox,I don't think the car lets you select Park or Reverse if you are travelling anything over walking pace. Not going to try it out though! As to the causes of SUA's--it's definitely software gremlins that are causing some (not all) SUA's worldwide, and not just in Toyota/Lexus either. Some Youtube SUA crashes caught on dash-mounted cameras are scary to watch. Like you say, it could have something to do with the cruise control. The expert software analysts used in ongoing U.S. court cases are scathing of Toyota's fail-safe software design. Recently, one Oklahoma lady got a huge payout from Toyota after it was proved that her crash was definitely down to poor software design that caused her throttle to rev uncontrollably. She was badly hurt and passenger killed.

As in Mel's accelerating Merc and in my LS, it's not a case of misplaced mats or foot on the wrong pedal, it's more sinister than that,--it's bugs in software that could ruin your day at any moment. I drove my LS to work today and you wouldn't think anything had happened.

[runsgrateasanut]

My Daughter said her Suzuki Wagon R suddenly went full throttle on start up. I tried to find out online what could cause this and I read that it could be to do with the faulty earthing of the car causing the throttle cable to act as an earth which overheats the inner lining of the casing causing the cable to stick.
Before I got rid of my Toyota MR3 G Limited which had been standing in a garage for six years I had extra earth cables put into the engine bay after seeing photo's of fires caused by faulty earths. Not sure the throttle cable was mentioned in those cases.
If your cable seems OK must be something else. S'pose a cable can be tested for current, somehow.

[brendangeorge]

Less importantly, I sometimes can't lock or unlock my smart car where I work, though the key works fine inside it. I have to move around the site until the remote will work. I assume it's something to do with interference from a nearby radio mast. (When the car won't unlock I have to use the key to open the boot and then scramble inside and over the seats - in a very undignified way - to reach the internal door handle. I couldn't do this in the Lexus, of course.)

Did you try replacing the Battery in your key? CRC2032 cost about £1.50 and 5 mins to do.

I have had 5 Lexus cars - current 430 for 13 years and 230K mikes never seenor herd of the starting problem you had - did you talk to a Lexus dealer about it?

Bren

[Titch LS]

Bren, I told Lexus Customer Care about it who said I should get my car checked out at my nearest dealer. It would not be a free check so I declined their invitation. I know they would not find any relevant codes. I found out that no car this has happened to (including non-Lexus) has ever left a tell-tale code. Based on this and the fact that it only occured the once and the car has behaved itself impeccably ever since, I decided not to waste my hard earned pennies. Hopefully it will never happen again. It was just an unnerving glitch.