Folding Door Mirrors In

Crowtree · October 3, 2014

Hi guys

I obviously know I can fold my mirrors in with the little button down on the right hand side under the dash but is there a way of having them automatically fold away when you park up and turn off the car ? Or lock the doors ?

ColinBarber · October 3, 2014

not without adding a 3rd party product.

DferBfer · October 4, 2014

Crowtree,

This is one of the areas in which I think Lexus have fallen short compared to e.g. Mercedes. Other than a 3rd party product (do you have more info available on the options, ColinB ?) all one can do is to fold the mirrors, turn the key to "off" and then press the mirror button again: at least this ensures that the mirrors open up when you next start the car. However,it's difficult to find the button - and the others in the same area - in the dark and I've been wondering if anyone has located a suitable substance that can be applied to the buttons to make them luminous.

Another area in which Lexus can't match Mercedes - I have a CLS 320 CDI - is in the quality of the Cruise control. Not only does the CC stalk rotate with the wheel - which makes it difficult to locate when turning - but the speed does not remain at that selected when travelling downhill, unlike the Merc

Finally, there does not appear to be a manual method of closing the Moonroof in case of failure of its normal electrical system. Again, my Mercedes comes with a metal winder for the purpose.

I'd be interested in others' views and in particular what aftermarket products can help to improve the overall 400h experience.

ColinBarber · October 5, 2014

Have you had a failure of the moonroof requiring you to manually close it? What about all the electric windows, do you expect manual options there too? Seems more like a concern with Mercedes reliability that they give that option - or the fact that they sell vehicles without electric motors and so already have the manual mechanism in place.

I've been driving Toyota/Lexus vehicles for quite some time, never really had a problem with the cruise control position. If the steering wheel is that much out of position then it doesn't really sound like the time to be playing with CC. The petrol only vehicles have very good speed consistency, a slight speed increase seems to be somewhat related to the RX400h hybrid drivetrain.

Not sure why Lexus didn't provide auto mirror close on the series II RX. Even though your vehicle is a 2009 model it was effectively designed in 2002. A reason that has been speculated in the past is that you do not want your mirrors to be frozen in a closed position in bad weather, and the RX is basically designed for the US market. However new Lexus models provide this feature.

DferBfer · October 5, 2014

Crowtree,

I can now answer the question I put to ColinB in my earlier response to you, having since found the Forum thread at www.lexusownersclub.co.uk/forum/topic/83673-remote-auto-folding-side-mirrors-for-lexus-rx300400h-anyone-had-excperience/ .

Regards

D

DanD · October 10, 2014

Colin beat me to it with his response: the RX series 2 is a 2002 deisgn. Did Mercedes or the likes have automatic folding mirrors back in 2002? I don't think Lexus was much out of tune with its competitors at the time. Not many other manufacturers provided adaptive Xenon lights, traffic sensitive satnav or electric tailgates as standard at the time either.

rns · October 11, 2014

But could it be possible to use just universal folding kit?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Intelligent-Car-Auto-Side-Rear-View-Mirror-Folding-System-UK-Shipping/191162049633

I did my Rav4 with it http://www.rav4world.com/forums/97-4-3-exterior/63262-retractable-wing-mirrors-3.html#post912785

Rav4 has the same switch only positioned in the center console. With it you need to connect to the signal from fold button and door lock/unlock and acc.

The solution offered in thread http://www.lexusownersclub.co.uk/forum/topic/83673-remote-auto-folding-side-mirrors-for-lexus-rx300400h-anyone-had-excperience/

connects somehow straight to the mirror motor wires and door lock wires inside the door.

cachaciero · August 12, 2016

On 10/10/2014 at 3:02 PM, DanD said:

Colin beat me to it with his response: the RX series 2 is a 2002 deisgn. Did Mercedes or the likes have automatic folding mirrors back in 2002? I don't think Lexus was much out of tune with its competitors at the time. Not many other manufacturers provided adaptive xenon lights, traffic sensitive satnav or electric tailgates as standard at the time either.

Late to this thread but....

Now lets see... 2002 Citroen C5 HDI Executive spec (2000 design).: Auto folding wing mirrors, Xenon lights Auto windscreen wipers tied to auto window close (and sun roof) traffic sensitive satnav. (if the traffic master premium paid) Rear parking sensors and lets not even consider a ride height adjustable suspension that dynamically alters car height and attitude depending on speed. On both the Prius I own and now the Lexus RX400H I am constantly surprised at how far behind the opposition they were / are in some respects.

cachaciero

rayaans · August 12, 2016

3 hours ago, cachaciero said:

Late to this thread but....

Now lets see... 2002 Citroen C5 HDI Executive spec (2000 design).: Auto folding wing mirrors, Xenon lights Auto windscreen wipers tied to auto window close (and sun roof) traffic sensitive satnav. (if the traffic master premium paid) Rear parking sensors and lets not even consider a ride height adjustable suspension that dynamically alters car height and attitude depending on speed. On both the Prius I own and now the Lexus RX400H I am constantly surprised at how far behind the opposition they were / are in some respects.

cachaciero

Id stay well clear of a Citroen to be honest - huge piles of junk.

cachaciero · August 12, 2016

Well every one to their own. I have owned big Citroens most of my life GS,CX (X2) XM's (X2) and C5 and by the standards of their day they were far from junk, they only got a bad rep because most garages did'nt have people with the intelligence to maintain them properly. Comparing the C5 with a newer Prius the cabin materials plastics and seat materials in the C5 are IMHO far superior.

No one Marque has the perfect car they all have their good and bad points, there isn't a car on the road today I would call junk just some cars which appeal to me more than others.

cachaciero

ChrisKaye · August 12, 2016

Don't see as many old Citroens about as Toyota/Lexus tho!

There's a reason for that but Citroen are innovative and cheap so there's the trade off.

rayaans · August 12, 2016

1 hour ago, cachaciero said:

Well every one to their own. I have owned big Citroens most of my life GS,CX (X2) XM's (X2) and C5 and by the standards of their day they were far from junk, they only got a bad rep because most garages did'nt have people with the intelligence to maintain them properly. Comparing the C5 with a newer Prius the cabin materials plastics and seat materials in the C5 are IMHO far superior.

No one Marque has the perfect car they all have their good and bad points, there isn't a car on the road today I would call junk just some cars which appeal to me more than others.

cachaciero

Ill be honest, I havent heard a good thing from any citroen owners- apart from my joiner who uses a Citroen van to carry wood in!

toffee_pie · August 12, 2016

Citroen, common. Any car enthuaist wont buy a Citroen. I dont care if they had Espresso makers in the glove box back in 2000.

cachaciero · August 12, 2016

Citroen common?? The last arguably true Citroens the XM and Xantia went out of production in 1998/9 since then any Citroen has been a re-badged Peugeot so I would argue it's hardly surprising that they are not that common. If they were that common I might have been able to find a good XM in which case I might not be here :-)

Most car enthusiasts are not car enthusiasts they are Marque enthusiasts, there is a difference.

@toffee_pie It might come as a surprise but there is a quite a large body of Citroen enthusiasts out there.

cachaciero

tom123 · August 12, 2016

3 hours ago, cachaciero said:

Citroen common?? The last arguably true Citroens the XM and Xantia went out of production in 1998/9 since then any Citroen has been a re-badged Peugeot so I would argue it's hardly surprising that they are not that common. If they were that common I might have been able to find a good XM in which case I might not be here :-)

Most car enthusiasts are not car enthusiasts they are Marque enthusiasts, there is a difference.

@toffee_pie It might come as a surprise but there is a quite a large body of Citroen enthusiasts out there.

cachaciero

Was a passenger in a fairly old Citroen Picasso recently. Glided over potholes and ridges in the road as if they weren't there, put my RX to shame. Also didn't have any rattles at all, not something that could be said of most of the RXs that I've been in!

cachaciero · August 13, 2016

9 hours ago, tom123 said:

Was a passenger in a fairly old Citroen Picasso recently. Glided over potholes and ridges in the road as if they weren't there, put my RX to shame. Also didn't have any rattles at all, not something that could be said of most of the RXs that I've been in!

I think it would be fair to say that most manufacturers have their strengths and weaknesses Citroens strength was their adoption of advanced technology particularly with respect to suspension, their weakness was in quality control and in ensuring that their dealer support network actually knew how to fix what the factory produced.

While Citroen actually became PSA in the nineties Citroen managed to hold on to their design ethos for a while and both the C5 and the early Picasso owe more to the Citroen heritage than that which came later, now PSA have announced that they will abandon the hydraulic suspension in favour conventional springs and dampers a retrograde step if ever there was one.

Gliderpilot · August 13, 2016

Before I stop the car I fold the mirrors in then stop the car and press the button again. When the car starts the mirrors fold out, beats messing with the wiring!

Quantum · August 13, 2016

5 hours ago, Gliderpilot said:

Before I stop the car I fold the mirrors in then stop the car and press the button again. When the car starts the mirrors fold out, beats messing with the wiring!

I do exactly that ^^^^^^

cachaciero · August 13, 2016

I agree that that works but it is essentially a workaround for a system deficiency, the lack of indexing on the nearside mirror when selecting reverse is a bit of a pain too.

rayaans · August 13, 2016

1 hour ago, cachaciero said:

I agree that that works but it is essentially a workaround for a system deficiency, the lack of indexing on the nearside mirror when selecting reverse is a bit of a pain too.

Like it's been mentioned before, the 2nd gen csme in 2003. Considering it takes 3 years if not more just to design a new Lexus, designing would have begun in 2000. Do citroen even test their cars? It takes ages just for testing and I don't doubt that Lexus spend a lot more time doing that than Citroen do.

I believe the man in charge of the 2016 RX said that designing started I'm 2012 so I would say although the RX400h is relatively new, it's actually a design that was thought about in 1999

What do you mean by indexing? My 05 RX300 would lower it's mirrors when put in reverse.

cachaciero · August 14, 2016

10 hours ago, rayaans said:

Like it's been mentioned before, the 2nd gen csme in 2003. Considering it takes 3 years if not more just to design a new Lexus, designing would have begun in 2000. Do citroen even test their cars? It takes ages just for testing and I don't doubt that Lexus spend a lot more time doing that than Citroen do.

I believe the man in charge of the 2016 RX said that designing started I'm 2012 so I would say although the RX400h is relatively new, it's actually a design that was thought about in 1999

What do you mean by indexing? My 05 RX300 would lower it's mirrors when put in reverse.

Dev times and testing I would agree that 2000 sounds about right for start or maybe consolidation of the final design, I suspect that Lexus like Citroen may well have been working on various aspects of the design long before that. Yes Citroen test cars, they have to just to ensure that they are going to be able to meet the various regulatory demands, all car manufacturers have to do this for new models. Do Lexus spend more time than Citroen (or Ford or Merc BMW)? I don't know, however as cost will be the major driver I would doubt that Lexus spend any more time than they have to. Though as Lexus supply both the European market and the US market it is likely that they will have to spend time testing for both regulatory areas. PSA do not supply to the American market so they will not have to spend time testing to satisfy the US market.

With respect to the RX400H as far as I can see from a body / suspension perspective the 400H is just a small evolutionary change from the 300. The thing which makes the 400H different is the Hybrid drive and all they did there was to scale the system that was already in use on the Prius and fit it.

Infact in some ways the system fitted to the 400H is not as well developed as the 2004 Prius solution which had a chain driven Atkinson cycle engine from the off it has taken another eleven years for Lexus to get there with the 450.

Interestingly I would argue that the 2004/2008 Prius is marginally underpowered the later 1.8 being better, however with the introduction of the 1.8 they changed the body design for the worse IMHO much prefer the looks of the 1.5 and the same is true of the Lexus much prefer the look of the 400 to that of the 450. The 450 begs the question why are they still using Nickel Hydride batteries and not Lithium which would have given major improvements in power to weight ratio. I don't know the answer to that question for sure but I suspect that it is more to do with leveraging profit out of existing technology rather than a quest for technical excellence.

Mirror indexing that is exactly what I am talking about if it worked like that on the 05 300 why does it not do that on my 400H? need to get my hands on some schematics anybody know where to go for comprehensive technical documentation other than Lexus themselves.

cachaciero

ColinBarber · August 14, 2016

Toyota have well documented why they don't use Lithium batteries, cost and reliability. The new Prius still uses Ni-MH batteries, again for reliability, cost, and they are able to charge them at higher currents (more efficient regen braking) without overheating. The mpg my wife's new Prius can get is very impressive.

As for the 400h and lack of features - it is an old design now so things like Sat Nav now look outdated. Auto folding mirrors etc. is probably more of a commercial and marketing decision. It's not as if Toyota didn't have the technology, they just choose to not include many options on UK vehicles compared to their local or US market.

The 400h does drop its mirrors when in reverse, the same as the RX300 and RX350. You just need to make sure the adjuster switch is in L or R position and not neutral. It would be nice if the reverse position could be adjusted and stored in memory, but it just drops to a factory set position.

DferBfer · August 14, 2016

Hi Cachaciero,

Mirror indexing works on my 2009 RX400h: I assume it's an option one can select in one of the settings menus.

cachaciero · August 14, 2016

2 minutes ago, ColinBarber said:

Toyota have well documented why they don't use Lithium batteries, cost and reliability. The new Prius still uses Ni-MH batteries, again for reliability, cost, and they are able to charge them at higher currents (more efficient regen braking) without overheating. The mpg my wife's new Prius can get is very impressive.

As for the 400h and lack of features - it is an old design now so things like Sat Nav now look outdated. Auto folding mirrors etc. is probably more of a commercial and marketing decision. It's not as if Toyota didn't have the technology, they just choose to not include many options on UK vehicles compared to their local or US market.

The 400h does drop its mirrors when in reverse, the same as the RX300 and RX350. You just need to make sure the adjuster switch is in L or R position and not neutral. It would be nice if the reverse position could be adjusted and stored in memory, but it just drops to a factory set position.

Yes I have read / seen somewhere Toyota's justification for staying with NiMh and if every other manufacturer was saying the same thing then I might be convinced. However my 70 odd years of life has taught me to be very cynical and questioning where money is concerned. Toyota spent lot's of money developing the NiMh system and like every manufacturer they will want to maximise the return on investment and put off further development as long as they can.

Your point about Toyota / Lexus not choosing to include options is I feel very valid and I suspect probably reflects their concentration on the US market and either their lack of attention to what their competition in Europe was doing or just not being bothered, the European market being of lesser importance however it is that lack of attention which causes people like me to be justifiable critical of the product in some areas.

It is worth considering that Boeings 787 is an all electric aircraft that relies on very compact Lithium Battery packs which under some circumstances have far higher discharge / charge rates than anything a Prius will have so I don't accept Toyota's arguments about charge current limitations. However on the 787 there have been a couple of isolated incidences of Battery problems so there may be some merit in the reliability argument.

Mirror in my case maybe the mirror position switch is the "gotcher" I shall go and give it a try later thanks for the suggestion.

ChrisKaye · August 14, 2016

Also, with delivery of the new Toyota Mirai cars into the UK (hydrogen fuel cell), I wouldn't be surprised if they skipped Lithium Ion tech altogether...

Just can we get the infrastructure in place to support a radical leap forward? Looking at the adoption of LPG and recharging stations has me worried that it doesn't pay to REALLY innovate these days [emoji853]