Sad Day For My 450H

[tonyricha]

I guess I knew it couldn't last for ever but am disappointed by the failure of my hybrid pump, sounds exactly the same a Hayne's GS450 did. 2 things have irrated me:

1 No warning, I thought not quite normal some time before the "Check hybrid" message came up (anybody know how you check a hybrid system in lane 2 of the M25?) The car was still running so I called Lexus MK only to be told "don't drive the car" so got it recovered. It seems the problem is made worse by driving it but I suspect the damage was already done by the time a warning came up, seems crazy it doesn't tell you to stop.

2 The car has had 19 Lexus full ( not essential ) services, is still under a service plan, out of warranty only because they would no longer cover it at 7 years of age but Lexus refuse to help with the cost of repair, still trying to make their profit rather than help a loyal customer of 10 years.

So it seems this lovely car is headed for scrap as they want more than their trade in offer just before this problem occurred.

Any thoughts ? oh and it passed the hybrid healthcheck very recently

Will not own another expensive car, just lease now so always under a warranty.

[royoftherovers]

On the face of it, this seems like an unmitigated disaster.

Tony was in my view,the champion of the 450h with over 200,000 mikes on the clock.

For Lexus UK not to support him seems very bad news indeed; perhaps contact with Lexus American colleagues MIGHT YIELD NEWS AS TO HOW THEY DEAL WITH THE PROBLEM?

If the car recently passed the Hybrid Healthcheck, then why does the 12 month warranty not cover the failure ?

It would be helpful to know the cost of the replacement/repair as in my view, if it amounts to significantly less than the cost of a new car it might seem appropriate to effect the repair.

Just my thoughts.

Regards

John

[ColinBarber]

If the car recently passed the Hybrid Healthcheck, then why does the 12 month warranty not cover the failure ?

Unfortunately it is only the hybrid Battery that is covered, not any other part of the hybrid drivetrain.

[tonyricha]

They quote £3600 for a gearbox then about 5 hours labour all plus VAT! seems out of the question for a car Lexus offered me £2,500 trade in against a new IS300.

I think Lexus have earned enough out of me so don't want another one.

[tonyricha]

Not just the agg and cost but the way it does not alert you when it is destroying itself, seems like a serious design flaw to me.

[dandydons]

Sorry to hear Tony. One other option to consider is trying to get a used one. There is a guy on eBay breaking a whole car although it does look like he's after top dollar prices http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LEXUS-GS-GS450H-FULLY-COMPLETE-ENGINE-2008-2GR-3-5-HYBRID-BREAKING-/181467603084?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item2a404fe08c Alternatively instead of scrapping yours may also be worth breaking if you can be bothered with the hassle. Shocking that lexus won't contribute with your service history. Mine is on 165k miles and always took some comfort from your posts. Cheers , Kev

[ColinBarber]

Not just the agg and cost but the way it does not alert you when it is destroying itself, seems like a serious design flaw to me.

I understand how you feel however things can just fail. Even if you did get an advanced warning the outcome would still be the same.

Are you still using the vehicle? I'm assuming it still runs, just with the hybrid system disabled.

[Fig]

Display of ignorance time

I have a GS300 which only has a proper engine

What does the hybrid pump do?

[tonyricha]

Not a lot now apparently! no not using it as I don't know the consequences ie will it stop somewhere? At the moment it is at Lexus M.Keynes as I don't really know what to do.

[LexIS200Sport]

Hi Tony, sorry to hear what happened :(

I'm actually at Lexus MK right now and I think I saw your car parked outside. Hopefully there is some solution to get it back on the road without too much cost.

[tonyricha]

Naw, they are not interested, just a little embarrassed by how much service money I have spent there!

[tonyricha]

They are on the phone right now trying to sell me a new one! May need to think about that for a wee while

[Exdee]

Recent thread below whereby gentlemen had same issue. He's driving on!

I would be very surprised if the car needs to be scrapped just because the hybrid element is not working properly.

Link

[ColinBarber]

My understanding is the transmission uses a conventional pump driven by the engine and also an electric pump for when the petrol engine is off. The hybrid system detects the pump isn't working and stops the transmission being damaged by not allowing Battery only operation. Based on this it should be safe to drive without damage, you just don't get the full benefit of the hybrid system. If the car is going to be scraped anyway I guess you don't have much to lose.

Not sure why a full transmission is being quoted, the pump is available on its own, although probably even more labour would be required to strip it down and replace it.

I have heard that although the failure will not allow Battery only mode the hybrid system isn't fully shut down so you still get the performance and economy boost from the electric motor and regenerative braking, you just don't get the stop/go and full EV benefit. Not sure if this is true.

[tonyricha]

Thanks for that, does make sense, I believe the electric pump is situated inside the gearbox and we all know Lexus only change complete units hence the outrageous quote. What do you think guys, should I let it go for dismantling or bring it home and see if anybody fancies taking it on?

[LexIS200Sport]

I reckon you should try looking for a 2nd hand transmission unit and get it fitted :)

Your car appears to be in very good shape and it will be a shame scrapping it. Furthermore, the Battery (probably the next most expensive component) is still in good nick, as you mentioned.

[royoftherovers]

http;//www.lexus.com/recall.

Look closely at this Tony and see if your vehicle is included.

Regards

John

[tonyricha]

Thanks John but I cant see any mention of hybrid pump, have you heard anything about this? 2 failures on here within 2 weeks seems to be a worry.

[royoftherovers]

Log onto Club Lexus Tony...a US forum and type in your symptoms inc warning lights which showed up. Then look to see what comes up.

I think it is important for you to tell the US Forum members of your symptoms NOT the Lexus explanation of what they think it is !!

Regards

John

[tonyricha]

Thanks John, I had a look about and oh dear, some poor chap in Norway has had 3 hybrid pumps fail at low mileage, complete nightmare ! Made me realise how lucky I am to have got this far before it all went wrong.

I think mine ran low on inverter coolant, it was a hot day and when we unloaded it from the transporter (cooled down) the warning had gone. It now starts and runs fine but its difficult to trust.

Apparently this problem is quite common in Prius and becoming more so on GS450h.

I will not own another high tech car, just going to lease a new car for 3 years so it is always under a warranty.

[tonyricha]

Anybody want this car? I have had a very low bid on it ?

[KentIS300]

Hi Tony,

Even with a fault, Lexus if they get it in, they will put it in an auction (ie BCA) and they will put a minimum reserve on it of £4500 ... !!! The trade value of your car even with a mechanical fault is not £2500!!! no way!

I will give you an example a 2007 GS450h with 84.000miles is guided at GLASS guide £6,500 trade value. And Black CAP value below avg condition £5,400, average condition £5,950, and clean condition at £6,450.

A retail suggested sale value of £8,450 to £9,050

Now where on earth they ended up offering you £2,500???? I think the dealer is better off convincing you buy a new car from them, they would have a profit of the car you buy, then they would have a massive profit of the car you exchange and the person with the real loss will be you.

I am sorry to hear your story.

I have some problems with my 407 Coupe 2.7 V6 HDi, typical AISIN transmision solenoid failed, but I have decided to order the parts from the states and have a gearbox specialist replace them. (Peugeot wanted £1,500.00 at least for the job).

Same thinking with my GS300 the ABS/Brake pump failed (Lexus wanted 3 times the value of the car for it) ... got a used one. And when I enquired Lexus about the pins on my rear break pads .... (they were very corroded and I wanted them replaced). Lexus in US sells them as rear brake pads fitting kits. When I called Lexus in canterbury to enquire about the part. They said that the pins are not supplied seperatelly and I have to buy the WHOLE caliper! ??? I said are you kidding, shall I give you a part number to type in the system, when I told them I got the part number from a US site, they have gonne on about not being Lexus UK and they will not recognise it. They hung up the phone to me when I asked for their name. The Lexus Canterbury manager would not call me back so I could file a complaint... I then called Customer relations of Lexus and filed a complaint by them, then the canterbury manager called me and the outcome was so what you want us to do...? I gave up.

I think Lexus customer services and support for cars that are outside of any official warranty, they don't want to know...

I still think the best customer service and support I received was with my Mercedes CL500, where the car was 8yrs old and they have done complete both rear quarters replacement painted them, painted the boot, roof, bonnet. Had to take the car in 3 times to get it to my standards ... more less it cost them £9.000!!! and all that was good will gesture!

For £2,500 I would have the car and repair it ;)

[ColinBarber]

Thanks John, I had a look about and oh dear, some poor chap in Norway has had 3 hybrid pumps fail at low mileage, complete nightmare ! Made me realise how lucky I am to have got this far before it all went wrong.

I think mine ran low on inverter coolant, it was a hot day and when we unloaded it from the transporter (cooled down) the warning had gone. It now starts and runs fine but its difficult to trust.

Apparently this problem is quite common in Prius and becoming more so on GS450h.

there are two different pumps - one is the inverter coolant pump and the other is the transmission pump. Given that your dealer is suggesting a new transmission I'm assuming your failure is not the coolant pump.

Transmission pump issues don't occur on the Prius, or the RX - they don't have them. The coolant pump on the Prius is subject to a recall - I've not heard of the replacement pumps failing.

[doro708]

Hi Tony,

I understand your frustration and and anger about your car but just think like that , you had a high tech car that it has been used 200k+ miles almost trouble free until now, a car which is high tech like you said , a car that served you well. Because you had this problem now and because Lexus dealer is a disgrace that not make the car to be bad. Tell me a car that you could buy in our days and that will last for 200k+ miles without a major intervention, not many definitely. I know you feel is not fair what happened and they way you are treated by lexus and we all support you and agree with you but still like others i think you should try to find a lexus specialist that can give you more information, try to fix the car with a used and cheaper part , then sell it . There are a few guys on eBay with some gs 450h for breaking and i am sure you will be able to find whatever is wrong with your car. I hope i have not offended you in any way , i just wanted to show my support for you and if i can help you with something i will be more than happy to do it.

From this guy i have bought a few thing in the past and he is a great guy , he has a gs 450h breaking so you could send him an email and ask him to give you a price for the part that you will need. http://www.ebay.co.uk/usr/giedrola13?_trksid=p2059210.m2749.l2754

[tonyricha]

Thanks to all you guys for your help and suggestions, I knew the car wouldn't go on forever but what niggles me is I have paid Lexus a lot of money for 19 proper (not Essential) services, the idea being to lessen the chance of these issues. If it wasn't serviced I could accept flat refusal to meet me on the costs. Also the warranty I bought until they wouldn't cover it any more ( but didn't bother to notify me )

I am not even sure what is wrong as when I unloaded it from the transporter it started with no warnings on the dash, ran sweet and gearbox worked in both directions. The after sales manager has again started and moved it and he says the same. Only the workshop said it needs a new gearbox. I wonder if the inverter overheated and shut down until it cooled off, it was a very hot day.

I really need a car to work in and find it difficult to mess about with it for too long.

By the way the trade in offer from Lexus MK since this is £900 against a new IS300 but after 10 years as a loyal customer (MUG ?) I don't think I want another Lexus.