Why Do We Like Our Thirsty Lexus's?

[petayV8]

I was at my mates the other day who drives a E39 530d chipped and tuned. Its nice ill admit. I was telling him about my car and he just couldnt understand why i would drive a car that gets 22MPG that isnt even that quick and how i could justify spending my money on at the pumps. He said if he took me out in his 530d it would change my mind instantly and still achieve 50mpg. by then i was actually struggling to defend my case of what justifies me having a 2.0L petrol that does poor MPG, or even a petrol in general.

but when i was driving home i just think the smoothness, great sound and reliability just does it for me. Even if i was into fast cars ide still get a V8 petrol or bigger 6 cylinder car. I just dont know what it is but diesel just doesnt do it for me, despite the MPG and power. To me a car with a diesel isnt a car i could live with and the fact of the matter is i dont mind spending my money on petrol. I dont drink (much) and dont smoke so petrol it is lol. Am i stupid?

[harrylime]

I have a diesel Skoda Octavia, it is my workhorse. It is utterly reliable, pretty good to drive, does 50 mpg all day long, is not excessively noisy, has a huge boot for a hatchback, has a towbar fitted for my trailer and copes with everything I throw at it. I bought privately and the mileage is low, it is still worth what I paid for it over two years. It is, to all intents and purposes, a Golf with a bigger boot. It is a really good car and measured by logic alone, is all the car I will ever need.. However, I also have a Lexus LS 400. In logical terms, and considering the fuel consumption and additional cost of running another car I do not need it.

However, the Lexus is more than the sum of its parts. The refinement is in a different league, it is incredibly quiet and provides a sense of well being and relaxation that is absent in the Skoda. The principal difference is that I look forward to journeys in the Lexus and if I have a long journey to make, the differences between the two cars are magnified. Also, I would not like to put a glass of water on my Skoda PD engine whilst it is running, or I would be cleaning glass off my drive. I have done it on the Lexus engine - not a ripple.

My first job was a mechanical engineering apprenticeship, and the engineering on this car is astonishing

[petayV8]

Some good points there. Having a work horse is a good idea. I find it hard to use my car for many practical useage due to the simple fact its not the type of car you sling a pair of muddy boots in! Etc even less so with a LS

However seems the government isnt to keen on the idea of owning multiple cars

[The-Acre]

A friend of mine bought a Mercedes E320 last year, on an 04 plate. Immaculate, and I must admit it had me going slightly green at first. One year on and a brake repair cost him £1,500, now he's looking at another £1,500 for a gearbox repair. Maybe that's why we're daft enough to own thirsty cars!. And to be honest, averaging over 30 mpg on a trip this week, I think is pretty good for such a big car.

[petayV8]

Yeah totally with you Phil. forgot to mention how much my mates spent on his 530d in repair costs. turbos, suspension the lot. luckily his friends a mechanic but still parts arent free. All ive done with my IS200 is change the oil. and the way i see it £20 or £30 quid extra a month in fuel costs vs driving a diesel is worth it for that alone

[ChrisIS200SportTTE]

For me it's the looks Pete. Nothing from the same age range looks as good as a first gen IS to my eye. :)

[bobbyc]

I agree with the comments above. I still maintain that a Lexus is a more refined car than a BMW. Yes the BM has it good points (large range of engines, good craftmanship, etc). However as it stands at the moment it cannot match the Lexus for reliability. People associate BMW with well made German technology and to a point this is true. However there is no point in owing a car which delivers 20 mpg more than the Lexus if it keep breaking down (and they do) it is a fault ecomony.

To me the quietness of the car and the feel of the cabin is worth the extra cost of petrol, because as has already been mentioned you do look forward to driving a Lexus.and you cannot really put a price on that.

In relation to the diesel v petrol debate. I am very wary of diesel cars for the simple reason almost every forum (all brands) have endless complains about things going wrong. If I was buying one I think I would have in the back of my head that a dual mass flywheel was on the cards at any time and that would be £1500, the values would block, the head gasket would go etc etc etc. This could very well be a completely illogical view but it has always concerned me to the point that I have never really considered one.

[petayV8]

Good comments guys. I think at the end of the day it boils down to what priorities we have as a individual and we are all different and should be respected both ways. For me the quietness and engine note is a biggie for me and reliability because im careful woth the money ive got as im not exactly swimming in it

[petayV8]

Well if they dont improve diesel reliability theycan forget trying to sell them to americans as manufacturers have been pushing the last few years

[harrylime]

I had a BMW 330D estate, which was a wonderful car. However, £4000 worth of repairs whilst under warranty scared me off BMW diesels for ever, including clutch, dual mass flywheel, airmass meter etc . I loved that car though, including the diesel engine characteristics with 6 cylinder smoothness. You genuinely could not tell it was a diesel. It also did 40mpg plus regardless of how I drove it. Funnily enough, I've always been obsessive about mpg figures, researching cars endlessly before making my choice. For my LS 400, I decided that life is too short,, and I now do low miles anyway

[petayV8]

Very much for one life live it!

[Keith_W]

Similar to what most have said.......I wouldn't trust 'modern' diesels as far as I could throw them, especially the German ones. I totally get the point of them (I have been out in a mapped 335d) but the restricted rev range and all the torque coming in one big lump doesn't really appeal to me. And then there are the absolutely inevitable repair bills; even the DPFs (which are wear and tear items frankly) cost a fortune to replace. Don't forget the inflated forecourt price of diesels over their petrol equivalent as well.

For me, knowing that I will only spend on consumables, makes a big difference...this, along with the driving experience of a petrol, means it will be unlikely that I will return to a diesel car (if I do it would probably be a Honda).

I suppose I'm quite lucky that the main reason for 'justifying my thirsty lexus' is the 416bhp I get in return!!:D I could however completely justify the same fuel economy for the Lexus way of delivering the whole driving experience.

[Jitc85]

A good thread, and some good points made here.

In terms of refinement, it's hard to beat a good 6 cylinder engine, and smoothness and noise is spot on. Diesels just sound awful. Although the new diesels are very quick, economical etc, I'd still buy a petrol! Have to enjoy it, until it runs out! I prefer older cars anyway, more character.

[IHgs300]

Some good points there. Having a work horse is a good idea. I find it hard to use my car for many practical useage due to the simple fact its not the type of car you sling a pair of muddy boots in! Etc even less so with a LS

However seems the government isnt to keen on the idea of owning multiple cars

Recently our GS300 has been used to collect a greenhouse, horse bedding, duck food, and a load of glass sheets. As long as whoever uses it covers everything with sheets and cleans it afterwards it's ok by me.

Miss the ski hatch from the IS200 though.

Would be a different matter if the car was nearly new though,

[noby76]

I too haven’t been sold on diesel cars.. almost all suffer from 5th injector problems, DPF issues, dual mass flywheel, clutches, and turbo problems. I must admit a mates 530d I rode in a while back did not sound like a diesel and felt really punchy aswell but only for a few rpm and then goes dull..but am still not sold on the thing.. to me diesel is really not for everyone and most jump on it due to the attractiveness of the mpg figures and if you actually sit down to do the maths the savings made from say driving a 50mpg diesel car for 400 miles over an equivalent 30mpg petrol car over 400 miles is about £30 saved to a 60litre tank full. This does start to add up the more miles one does but comes with the uncertainty and unreliability of the parts listed above. So I keep asking myself does the benefit of saving around £30 per tank fill up outweigh potential issues known to affect diesel engines regardless of manufacture?. I know some manufactures do better than others but they all seem to suffer from these problems.

Most diesel owners brag about how much torque their engines pack but forget torque gets chucked out of the window if an equivalent petrol makes the same horse power and more so if that petrol has a form of valve timing. E.g. a 2005 E60 530d makes 500NM (369ft lb) at around 1750rpm which sounds very astonishing when compared to say an IS300 which makes only 288NM (212 ft lb) at 3800rpm. Horse power calculation formula is always (ft lb x rpm / 5252)

so if we punch the 530d ‘s figure into this formula at 1750rpm were the BM generates this monster tourque, the engine is actually producing 123bhp at the crank this is 369 x 1750 /5252 = 123bhp. at 3800rpm the IS300 an equivalent engine size without a turbo is producing 153bhp at the crank this is 212 x 3800 /5252 = 153bhp this means the less torquey car can out accelerate the tourquey one so long as it’s in the right gear and come 4000 to 4500 rpm the diesel will be grabbing the next gear as its run out of revs but petrol can still hang onto the gearing to 6200rpm before engaging next gear. so huge torque figure really does not mean anything if its not being generated at a higher rpm. will certainly feel very fast at low rpm's tho..

[dave1]

Not really sure why you are bringing bhp etc into the discussion. There is an awful lot more to owning and driving cars than being able to "out accelerate" other cars. I am sure that the vast majority of Lexus owners do not (as per thread title) "like their thirsty Lexus" because it can out accelerate a diesel.....which is actually rather a strange statement anyway. Some diesels will out perform some petrols and vice-versa. Acceleration figures and handling depend on a lot more than an individual cars engine/transmission and setup, one of the biggest contributory factors is the input from the driver!

Lexus, in general, tend to be well built, comfortable and reliable with many features as standard which are "extras" on many other marques....although this does seem to be changing now.

[LexIS200Sport]

I like my thirsty Lexus because it is Japanese and the Japanese make awesome things.

[noby76]

all because most diesel drivers you encounter and other forums I am active in like to brag a lot about the torque their engines are able to make.

[dave1]

Since that seems somewhat unrelated to this thread why not just open a new thread to discuss it or just open thread one of the forums you are active in where you encounter this bragging which you mention.

[noby76]

whats your problem dave did you wake up on the wrong side of the bed today??

[dave1]

No, but fail to see the relevance of your input to this thread!

[noby76]

if you fail maybe someone else did...

[Bluesman]

Come on boys everyone is allowed their own opinion or take on the subject and because we don't agree with it doesn't make us right.

Big smiles all round just like when we are driving our LS's. Mike

[petayV8]

Smiles per gallon ;)

[petayV8]

Sorry guys i brought up a 530d in my original post as this is where it got me thinking. didnt mean to bring any confrontation into it. but no i certainly did not buy a Lexus for speed racing! im guessing the only people who did are IS-F owners!

For me German diesels and all other diesel sold in this country are built with one purpose in mind and thats MPG, and thats all their good at imo. The reason i said sold in this country is because there are real diesels out there built for power and thats when the fun starts :)

ide take a cummins any day of the week