Potential Manufacturing Defect

[ToreOe]

Hi Dominik,

No news as such. A new car with the same spesifications as mine is on order, expected delivery is Januray 2015.

At the last meeting with Lexus I was told that there was signals from Lexus that the cause of the issue had been identified, but there was no estimate on when a fix would be implemented, tested and ready to be rolled out.

I did not want to wait any more, and decided to go with at new car even though they offered me a compensation to keep waiting for "the fix".

-Tore

[dblacha]

Hi Tore,

thanks, so this is a good news! I didn't know that you succeeded with the car exchange.

I'll wait for the fix, however, I'm getting a little nervous, because after the "software fix", which temporary caused that vibrations was less intensive,

I feel now that the issue is gradually more intensive again. Maybe it's due to the environment temperature goes down.

I hope, that what you wrote, the fix is coming and you will get a new car without this defect :-)

Regards!

Dominik.

[ToreOe]

Dominik,

The vibrations in my car does indeed vary with the temperature, but mine is worse at high temperatures. This summer, with ambient temperatures approaching 30C, the car was practically unusable. Now with temperatures about 5C the vibrations are hardly noticable most of the time.

I too feel that the issue has gotten gradually worse from I got the car 7 months ago untill now, but as you say, it can be related to temperature.

-Tore

[dblacha]

Yesterday I found linked thread on australian forum: http://au.lexusownersclub.com/forums/topic/12573-is-300h-vibrations/

Indeed, it could be exhaust pipe resonans.

[ToreOe]

@Dominik:

I cannot say that this isn't the cause for all IS300h vibration issues, but I have had cars with exhaust pipe resonance and they were very different from what my IS300h is doing.

If I had to make a bet, it would be that we are victims of an issue called "Hybrid driveline resonance". There has been done quite some research on this. This document gives a good, if somewhat technical explanation: http://www.ece.eng.wayne.edu/~hying/images/getPDF.pdf

After the temperatures came down, my car has been quite vibration free for some time, but has started acting up again lately. I am looking forward to getting the replacement soon.

-Tore

[dblacha]

@Tore:

great document! Thanks,

Dominik.

[ganzoom]

So is this issue common on UK cars? Or is isolated to a small number of cars due to manufacturing intolerance?

[ColinBarber]

So is this issue common on UK cars? Or is isolated to a small number of cars due to manufacturing intolerance?

People in the UK don't seem to report this, not sure if it is worse for LHD vehicles.

[ToreOe]

@ganzoom:

From what I gather, it seems to be an issue with only a very limited number of cars. As a statistically insignificant example, at a dealer event I spoke to 12 other IS300h owners from my region. Neither of these had any resonance issues. Some of them had noticed a bit of vibrations at certain speeds, but nothing unusual even for a "luxury car" and nowhere as bad as mine.

-Tore

[ToreOe]

Hi all,

I found something slightly worrying when I changed to winter tyres this weekend. My right rear wheel was worn down to 2mm. This is after 11000km.

My car have Continental 225/45-17Y, as I had the dealer change the stock 18" wheels to 17" before I took delivery of the car. (It is a "Luxury" model, which in Norway is the top spec, similar to "Premier" + all available extras in the UK.)

Front tyres are at 5.1mm and the left rear is at 3.3mm.

I have reported this to my dealer, and they think it might very well be related to the resonance issue. Which, by the way, got much more noticable with winter tyres.

-Tore

[Finnlexus]

I have the vibration problem as well (located in Finland) and am starting to think it might be an issue with the tyres <> wheel alignment. Has anyone with this issue had the wheel alignment checked? When I changed to winter tyres it felt as if the vibration was gone, but after a couple hundred km it started again. It feels as if the tyres would suffer from sawtooth wear.

[ToreOe]

Janne,

My car has had a 4-wheel alignment check with laser equipment as part of the tests and checks done by Lexus. All angles were spot on.

In my car, the vibrations are related to engine speed only - within the speed range in which they appear (63km/h to 95km/h). They only occur at 1300 and 1800 rpm, and the vibrations are at 43Hz and 60Hz. I would believe that if the vibrations came from the tyres, they would relate to road speed, not engine RPM?

-Tore

[Finnlexus]

Yes, you're correct, but my suspicion about the tyres comes from the fact that I've begun to think the vibration might be related to speed. Also what's strange is that the road surface seems to have an impact. On my way to work there's one strech of road where the asphalt changes from quite rough to very smooth and the vibration practically vanishes.

[ToreOe]

All,

Just wanted to inform you that I have now, finally, returned my IS300h (named "Shakin' Stevens" by my friends) to Lexus.

I am picking up a brand new IS300h today. Boy do I have butterflies in my stomach. Have several long journeys planned for this week and the weekend, so I'll get to test it for vibrations pretty quick. If the new car has the same vibrations, I don't know what I'm gonna do...

My car was top spec built to order, so there was a 4 month wait to have the replacement car built. It's been a long wait.

-Tore

PS, I have a brand new CT200h F-Sport as a loaner now. It really makes me realize what a great car the IS is.

[ColinBarber]

Good luck

[ToreOe]

Thanks,

I've driven the new car 131km today. This car has the vibrations too, but to a significantly lesser degree. If I didn't know what to listen/feel for, I'd probably never noticed.

The new center console material looks a lot better than the "old" plastic, but the shark fin antenna for the GPS doesn't match the style of the car I'm afraid.

Will take the car for a 500km trip Saturday, and probably report back.

-Tore

[ToreOe]

All,

I've driven the car 700km now. For all practical purposes, Lexus has fixed the virbration issue for me by giving me a new car :D

The vibrations in this car are so weak, I would never have noticed if I hadn't been sooo tuned to a 43Hz vibration for so long...

Oddly, what I find most different between the new and the old car is the engine. The old one didn't run very smooth (although not worse than I expected from an oversized 4-banger). The new one just purrs. While engine starts and stops in the old one was absolutely noticable (causing an audible clunk most of the times), in this car I cannot feel them at all.

I'm happy.

-Tore

[dblacha]

Congratulations Tore!!!

I'm happy that our action have at least symbolic progress.

I'm close to the 30k service and I'll let them try do something with the vibration, because it is more and more irritating.

You wrote that ICE is better sounding? It's more damped or just sounds different?

Regards,

Dominik.

[ToreOe]

Dominik,

The difference is that the ICE in the new car runs noticably smoother. Less vibrations and less sound from the engine. It feels quicker too, with better response to the thottle. The old car "growled" when pushed, the new one just goes with a purr.

Hard to explain in a language that is non-native to me :)

-Tore

[dblacha]

Thanks Tore!

Do not worry, english isn't my native language too :-)

Quicker, smoother, no vibration... I'm depressed. Really ;-)

I checked the 2015 specification, it looks the same, still 8.3 0-100 and the same power, so maybe they just changed the software to get a better response feeling. Just guessing.

Do you feel it in an each drive mode? Eco/Normal/Sport?

Definitely I should take a ride the 2015 and check it myself,

regards,

Dominik.

[ToreOe]

Dominik,

Quite frankly, I have only tried Normal mode. Never used Eco or Sport on the old one either.

According to the seller there should be no difference in the driveline between the 2014 and the 2015. I just think I got a bad one last time...

-Tore

[dblacha]

Tore,

So maybe they just upgraded the Normal mode.

Seriously you even didn't try the sport mode?

It's an enormous difference in the response comparing with the normal mode.

Even more when you are using the virtual gears and you are keeping the revs over the 4000rpms. It's a beast :-)

Fortunately, even with those conditions, consumption is still acceptable.

BTW: how the consumption is in 2015?

regards,

Dominik.

[ToreOe]

Dominik,

I'm 45 years old and have run out of testosterone :) Traffic around here is dense and the old car was not very inspiring to drive due to the vibrations. I never got around to take it for a drive just to have fun. I might do that now, though.

I have only driven the car 1000km, and I'm still on the first tank. I think it's to early to say much about consumption yet.

However, on the old car the consumption stabilized on 0.6l/100km after 5-7000km, showing 0.57l/100km on the computer. The new car shows 0.56l/100km on the computer after the first 1000km. I think that looks promising.

-Tore

[dblacha]

I'm 40+ too :-)

Interesting is how they did that the car is now "quicker" while the power is the same.

I would be good to check the RPM on the same driving mode and the same speed.

Maybe they work around booth, vibrations and performance by raising RPM for wider driving conditions?

Can you observe please, when you f.e. going stable 90kph on the flat road, what the RPM is?

regards,

D.

[ToreOe]

Dominik,

Going 90kph is hard in Norway ("normal" speed limit is 70kph on most roads). Finding a flat road harder. Our roads either go up, down or around a bend.

However, the engine seems to work mostly around 1300rpm under light to moderate load. Just like the old one.

When I say "quicker", I most likely mean the response when I press the throttle. Like when I'm at a junction and need to get into traffic. The old car would hesitate before it accelerated, this one just goes. (And yes, it is even zippier in Sport mode :-)).

-Tore