Gave Her A Service....now Wont Start. Bugger.

[ianbloke]

Hi there,

Apologies for zero posts - I became a proud owner only a couple of weeks ago.

Generally I am pleased as punch with the car. Done a couple of bits around her & found her incredibly well engineered & really built for reliability. Good stuff. I had an Alfa before

But at the weekend I did a good service - rotor arms, dissy caps, leads & spangly iridium plugs! All went smoothly (apart from getting the plastic covers from around the dissy). Put her back together & guess what.....will not start!

So spent the whole evening putting the old parts back on! One by one. Bugger. Obviously thought firing order. Then thought best to check caps & rotors. Still no go although didn't put the old ones back as they were knacked. Finally plugs (no go) & finally leads.

I did the right thing & got Bosch caps & arms, NGK leads & plugs.

Anyone have any idea what I have done to my beautiful car?

It cranks & fires, but dies after a second or two. There is both petrol & spark.

Maybe I did something to the timing - I did wrestle with one of the caps due to a plastic shield being held by a bolt I couldn't see. Also I dropped the MAF (doh) but I don't really think this is my problems (unplugged it shows same symptoms).

My car is a 1995 LS 400.

Can anybody help? Any suggestions will be gratefully recieved. And being a bit of a car lover, I will undoubtedly return the favour in the future (to someone or other on the forum!). Cheers.

[ROYT]

Hi there,

Apologies for zero posts - I became a proud owner only a couple of weeks ago.

Generally I am pleased as punch with the car. Done a couple of bits around her & found her incredibly well engineered & really built for reliability. Good stuff. I had an Alfa before

But at the weekend I did a good service - rotor arms, dissy caps, leads & spangly iridium plugs! All went smoothly (apart from getting the plastic covers from around the dissy). Put her back together & guess what.....will not start!

So spent the whole evening putting the old parts back on! One by one. Bugger. Obviously thought firing order. Then thought best to check caps & rotors. Still no go although didn't put the old ones back as they were knacked. Finally plugs (no go) & finally leads.

I did the right thing & got Bosch caps & arms, NGK leads & plugs.

Anyone have any idea what I have done to my beautiful car?

It cranks & fires, but dies after a second or two. There is both petrol & spark.

Maybe I did something to the timing - I did wrestle with one of the caps due to a plastic shield being held by a bolt I couldn't see. Also I dropped the MAF (doh) but I don't really think this is my problems (unplugged it shows same symptoms).

My car is a 1995 LS 400.

Can anybody help? Any suggestions will be gratefully recieved. And being a bit of a car lover, I will undoubtedly return the favour in the future (to someone or other on the forum!). Cheers.

Are you sure the caps are seated properly?

[steve2006]

Agree with above comment, it is apparently possible to fit the rotor arms 180 degrees out so I would set the timing marks up and recheck.

[Mybikesacx500]

I can sympathise, my new (to me) beautiful Lexus died on me just after I got it, but I did eventually sort it,( faulty coil)

I don't know what a bad MAF does to the engine, I would have expected it to run, but the fact that unpluging it doesn't change the symptoms could also mean it is faulty.

Someone who has run there car with the MAF disconnected could comment.

Timing out would fit the symptoms too....

[lexusn1ce]

I can sympathise, my new (to me) beautiful Lexus died on me just after I got it, but I did eventually sort it,( faulty coil)

I don't know what a bad MAF does to the engine, I would have expected it to run, but the fact that unpluging it doesn't change the symptoms could also mean it is faulty.

Someone who has run there car with the MAF disconnected could comment.

Timing out would fit the symptoms too....

also check the 2 wires that run past the plastic cam covers about midway down the front of the engine i think its the knock or the cam sensor because if its mis routed it gets cut by the fan belt and has similar symptomes to what you describe. I know i did it lol

[Mybikesacx500]

I can sympathise, my new (to me) beautiful Lexus died on me just after I got it, but I did eventually sort it,( faulty coil)

I don't know what a bad MAF does to the engine, I would have expected it to run, but the fact that unpluging it doesn't change the symptoms could also mean it is faulty.

Someone who has run there car with the MAF disconnected could comment.

Timing out would fit the symptoms too....

also check the 2 wires that run past the plastic cam covers about midway down the front of the engine i think its the knock or the cam sensor because if its mis routed it gets cut by the fan belt and has similar symptomes to what you describe. I know i did it lol

Cam sensor I think, mine was almost cut through as well, only a few strands left when I noticed it- if yours was like that, disturbing it could easily have finished it off.

I did the same thing with my Fiat Panda, replaced the oxygen sensor, wouldn't start , completely dead. Looking around where I had beeen working, found the crank sensor wire disconnected

[ianbloke]

Thanks for all the replies. Really appreciated :D

Agree with caps not seated properly. This evening (so far!)I have had the caps properly off & checked the rotors. A bit of net searching revealed they could go upside down.

Found that the caps couldn't fit wrong way! Perhaps they have changed the way the part is pressed due to so many ***** ups. But it definitely clicks into place. And now the caps are a definite fit. Being rather meticulous today. Wonder why...

Going to have a squizz around the wires as suggested. As well as the cam sensor

Mybikesacx500 - in case you ever get a MAF problem (see comment about owning an alfa - becomes part of maintenance for them f*ckin things). You can disconnect it & get the car to start, but in order to maintain you have to keep the revs up yourself. Can also drive without MAF, but you need to drive like you robbed it to stop stalling).

Just going to put the new parts back on. I just love doing all jobs three times. What I live for

Thanks again. Feeling more chill about it all today & pleased no-one thinks its catastrophic *removes noose*

[ianbloke]

Hi all. Just a bit of an update. Not the best news tho...

Had a bit more of a play & couldn't figure it, so I got recovered by the RAC. The fella had not clue (but I didn't expect much). Got to to my mechanic who knows what he's doing......

A few days later & 300 notes lighter, I am still not really the wiser!

At the garage they somehow managed to get it firing albeit very badly, whereas I struggled to get it to start - they put the original knackered rotor arms & caps back on (I thought they were too far gone but hey - shows what I know!).

She's a bugger to start but with persistence she cranks up. If you can manage to get the car to maintain firing on what seems to be 4 cylinders, with the revs hunting up down & everywhere, & then leave the car to warm up it is now driveable. She hesitates a little under hard acceleration but otherwise all good.

Bugger.

Just before I picked up the car from the garage the engine light came on & gave fault codes for lambda probe & crank sensor (or was it cam sensor?). Both on the RH bank.

Whats the general consensus? Buy the bits & just see (I am not a rich man. Yet. Nor will I be at this rate!). Have a bit more of a squizz around myself - clean the crank sensor. Perhaps this boot loom everyone seems to have trouble with?

All seems a bit odd that these sensors should be coming on at roughly the same time....

Hope everyone elses Lex's are :D Nice to get in the old girl even if it does take 20 mins to get off the line

[ROYT]

Do the boot loom check and fix if needed, this fault causes weird problemss.

If it were my car I would go for the crank sensor first.

[Mybikesacx500]

Perhaps that dropped MAF sensor is bad, there's a chap on here could sell you second hand parts, maybe temp. sensor too??

[ianbloke]

Thanks for the replies guys.

ROYT - took your advice & replaced the crankshaft sensor & also the oxygen sensor (lambda probe). Also stripped & sorted boot loom. To no avail though. Bugger.

Still got a fault code but alas do not have an OBD II reader. Really getting to my wits end with this.

It has altered the symptoms a little though:

* Really difficult to start from cold. It starts & runs for maybe a second & then dies.

* Any attempt to give it some gas at this point results in car dying.

* Finally get it to start (after maybe 30 attempts) & it idles rough as you like for a few minutes.

* Any attempt to give it some gas at this point results in car dying.

* When car is warmed up a little it seems to have a misfire & hesitates under acceleration (stationery).

* Rev the car when stationery to over 4000 RPM & get a rather tasty backfire. (trying not to replicate this too often as it can't be good for her).

Mybikesacx500 - beginning to agree with you. But after several £00's I am skint so unless so would like to be a bit more sure before shelling out. Does it sound like a MAF issue or am I clutching at straws?

Unsure of temp sensor - again what sort of symptoms does a bad one give?

Personally thinking TPS. As budget has recently become tighter ( ) thinking this might be a good start.

Any opinions? MAF? TPS? Temp sensor? Fuel pump? Perhaps a coil? Can of petrol & box of matches? Cheers fellas.

[ROYT]

Thanks for the replies guys.

ROYT - took your advice & replaced the crankshaft sensor & also the oxygen sensor (lambda probe). Also stripped & sorted boot loom. To no avail though. Bugger.

Still got a fault code but alas do not have an OBD II reader. Really getting to my wits end with this.

It has altered the symptoms a little though:

* Really difficult to start from cold. It starts & runs for maybe a second & then dies.

* Any attempt to give it some gas at this point results in car dying.

* Finally get it to start (after maybe 30 attempts) & it idles rough as you like for a few minutes.

* Any attempt to give it some gas at this point results in car dying.

* When car is warmed up a little it seems to have a misfire & hesitates under acceleration (stationery).

* Rev the car when stationery to over 4000 RPM & get a rather tasty backfire. (trying not to replicate this too often as it can't be good for her).

Mybikesacx500 - beginning to agree with you. But after several £00's I am skint so unless so would like to be a bit more sure before shelling out. Does it sound like a MAF issue or am I clutching at straws?

Unsure of temp sensor - again what sort of symptoms does a bad one give?

Personally thinking TPS. As budget has recently become tighter ( ) thinking this might be a good start.

Any opinions? MAF? TPS? Temp sensor? Fuel pump? Perhaps a coil? Can of petrol & box of matches? Cheers fellas.

'Difficult to start cold' gives these options in the w/shop manual.

water temp sensor circuit

intake air temp. circuit

injector circuit

cold start injector circuit

ISC valve circuit

fuel system circuit

fuel quality

vacuum leakage

plugs/distributor

engine ECT ECU

Scary list but not every thing can be faulty!

If it wont start or idles rough, could be the cold start injector faulty/blocked/disconnected

If the car will idle smoothly but not rev up this is often lack of fuel pressure.

This could be the fuel pump or some restriction in supply,say fuel filter blocked.

These are cheap enough and worth a try but I think you will need to have a fuel line pressure check to eliminate the pump.

You could try removing the plugs one bank at a time to find which are misfiring, if

all on one side swap that coil will be faulty

A code check may save time and money...

[lexynik]

sorry to chip in with what could be a silly question as im not up to speed on 400s !!

would a 95 400 be obd2 or would it be the paper clip method to extract codes that i have read about in some sections ? if paper clip type should be easy enough to grab the fault codes and narrow down the problem no ? ,,,,,,,,,,, sorry if wildly wrong just read and posted didnt go back and research extensively

[ianbloke]

Hi All,

Thanks again for all advice on getting my lex up & running smooth again.

Took advice on board & done a few bits...

Got a second hand MAF just to be sure...no joy. Ah well, got a spare now.

Next fuel related....changed the fuel filter & cleaned injectors. No good either.

Got a engine temp switch from japspares - I was looking around for where this lives & disconnected (what In think is) the RH cam sensor. Promptly forgot to plug the cam sensor back in & stone me....she started!! :D :D :D

Fair play to those who suggested. There doesn't seem to be a break in the wire but TBH its damn difficult to see.

Just to clarify though - the sensor I unplugged is on the RH bank tucked up just below / to the right of the plastic dissy cover. It has a grey plastic plug & red / white wires into it. Before I commit another 70 odd notes just want to check I have the right part...?

The car runs OK without it - just a low / sporadic idle without it. Which leads me to think it was this little bleeder that was the source of my problems all along (I was servicing etc due to low idle).

Help as always hugely appreciated.

[lexynik]

ahh good news.glad youve made some headway with it,well done

[ianbloke]

ahh good news.glad youve made some headway with it,well done

Cheers....luck more than judgement tho!

[ROYT]

ahh good news.glad youve made some headway with it,well done

Cheers....luck more than judgement tho!

Glad you are getting there!!

[lexynik]

lmao - yeah luck plays a hand for sure but perseverence and effort which got you back under the bonnet and still trying to sort it made it happen-its just good to hear of hard work payin off,im sure it doesnt feel like it has maybe to you at the moment if youre now just back to the original problem but at least you are a bit wiser now and have narrowed it down a bit

[Manc]

Hi All,

Thanks again for all advice on getting my lex up & running smooth again.

Took advice on board & done a few bits...

Got a second hand MAF just to be sure...no joy. Ah well, got a spare now.

Next fuel related....changed the fuel filter & cleaned injectors. No good either.

Got a engine temp switch from japspares - I was looking around for where this lives & disconnected (what In think is) the RH cam sensor. Promptly forgot to plug the cam sensor back in & stone me....she started!!

Fair play to those who suggested. There doesn't seem to be a break in the wire but TBH its damn difficult to see.

Just to clarify though - the sensor I unplugged is on the RH bank tucked up just below / to the right of the plastic dissy cover. It has a grey plastic plug & red / white wires into it. Before I commit another 70 odd notes just want to check I have the right part...?

The car runs OK without it - just a low / sporadic idle without it. Which leads me to think it was this little bleeder that was the source of my problems all along (I was servicing etc due to low idle).

Help as always hugely appreciated.

Hi, sorry i missed you at the time of the post.... i might've saved you a small fortune Did you clean the throttle body out?? that is what causes the car to choke when you floor it.. its got tiny shafts to control the jets of air going in to the engine, these get blocked with carbon after a decade of driving - mine did anyway. Started with the lack of power when accelerating... did job myself in less than 2 hrs (with brews), and only cost a can of cleaner.

This site or lexls.com tells you how .. or post a reply... speak soon