Just My 2p,s Worth (for What Its Worth)

[moonpig]

Well as people do looking for a new car etc online thought i would put something up here just for my 2p's worth really. :shutit:

I have a 220d but its going friday, for a new skoda (no laughing!). A lot is said about poor fuel consumption and to be honest its not the best but i didnt ever buy mine for that, poop build quality is also something you hear about but once the rattly dash was sorted and a few things like oil leaks (picked up on service i didnt and wouldnt have noticed!) its been fine, all done free so no cost to me just a little time to drop the car off etc. 6th gear is an issue i never did get my head round unless your doing 85plus (errr someone tells me :winky: your honour!) its no use at all unless you want to drive the car feeling bogged down and lumpy. To be honest i have rarely used 6th dont do much long motorway stuff but 5th is good for 70mph and gives just as good if not better MPG, and its not revving too hard either.

Once you get the hang of the 1st gear i found it to be, for an oil burner, a rapid (not fast) smooth car, comfortable, and does everything well, if anything a little too well i had a few teething problems with mine creaking dash mainly, but once that was sorted its been pretty good. My humble opinion is that its a nice car ... for me a little too nice does everything too well and lacked a little character really ... well unless you try to take it out in the snow!! then character a plenty if you can get it moving!... would i buy one again i guess is the main question... well probably i think i would! i have only really had one problem and thats when i had the MOT it was burning so clean that the machine wouldnt believe there was a car there!!..... did wonder if thats the case why the tax man doesnt see it that way??

The deeler service, after a little misunderstanding, i have found to be excellent although a little steep and very few independants (round here anyway) and T-wells lexus are more than helpful and at the risk of being a sexist git its worth going just for the reception staff (its been a few months since i was last there) very helpful and ummm easy on the eye would probably be a nice way of putting it! in fact have i got time to book it in for something else before friday! hehe.

If someone is on here looking for a new car and is tempted all i will say is try it for yourself, and go with what you think i am sure there are people that have had problems with theirs but isnt any brand like that?

[Propwash]

Well as people do looking for a new car etc online thought i would put something up here just for my 2p's worth really. :shutit:

I have a 220d but its going friday, for a new skoda (no laughing!). A lot is said about poor fuel consumption and to be honest its not the best but i didnt ever buy mine for that, poop build quality is also something you hear about but once the rattly dash was sorted and a few things like oil leaks (picked up on service i didnt and wouldnt have noticed!) its been fine, all done free so no cost to me just a little time to drop the car off etc. 6th gear is an issue i never did get my head round unless your doing 85plus (errr someone tells me :winky: your honour!) its no use at all unless you want to drive the car feeling bogged down and lumpy. To be honest i have rarely used 6th dont do much long motorway stuff but 5th is good for 70mph and gives just as good if not better MPG, and its not revving too hard either.

Once you get the hang of the 1st gear i found it to be, for an oil burner, a rapid (not fast) smooth car, comfortable, and does everything well, if anything a little too well i had a few teething problems with mine creaking dash mainly, but once that was sorted its been pretty good. My humble opinion is that its a nice car ... for me a little too nice does everything too well and lacked a little character really ... well unless you try to take it out in the snow!! then character a plenty if you can get it moving!... would i buy one again i guess is the main question... well probably i think i would! i have only really had one problem and thats when i had the MOT it was burning so clean that the machine wouldnt believe there was a car there!!..... did wonder if thats the case why the tax man doesnt see it that way??

The deeler service, after a little misunderstanding, i have found to be excellent although a little steep and very few independants (round here anyway) and T-wells lexus are more than helpful and at the risk of being a sexist git its worth going just for the reception staff (its been a few months since i was last there) very helpful and ummm easy on the eye would probably be a nice way of putting it! in fact have i got time to book it in for something else before friday! hehe.

If someone is on here looking for a new car and is tempted all i will say is try it for yourself, and go with what you think i am sure there are people that have had problems with theirs but isnt any brand like that?

Hi, I am due to pick up an is220d next week some time and was looking forward to it, until I joined this forum. There appears to be a lot of bad press and I am sure maybe for good reason. I am trading in a X-Type 2.0 V6 which I enjoyed very much, but a change was due. I was also a member of the Jaguar forum and the constant that I have found is that there is always someone to grumble and there are always common faults no matter what make and model. I know that it should not be that way as we are spending alot of money on something that is only depreciating, but one car is no different from another in reliability really. There may be fewer issues with BMW and Audi, and perhaps they should be the bench mark, but, technology aside have they changed their basic design that much? They should be near perfect. Ultimately your choice of transport it is down to a few key items, price, looks, personal preference and practicality. Don't knock it. The real horror stories aside, which apply to any marque, I am sure that cars are generally fine, we are all different and have differing experience and experiences, just as well I say.

I am looking forward to owning my car and discussing other topics on the forum.

[colbecoz]

Well as people do looking for a new car etc online thought i would put something up here just for my 2p's worth really. :shutit:

I have a 220d but its going friday, for a new skoda (no laughing!). A lot is said about poor fuel consumption and to be honest its not the best but i didnt ever buy mine for that, poop build quality is also something you hear about but once the rattly dash was sorted and a few things like oil leaks (picked up on service i didnt and wouldnt have noticed!) its been fine, all done free so no cost to me just a little time to drop the car off etc. 6th gear is an issue i never did get my head round unless your doing 85plus (errr someone tells me :winky: your honour!) its no use at all unless you want to drive the car feeling bogged down and lumpy. To be honest i have rarely used 6th dont do much long motorway stuff but 5th is good for 70mph and gives just as good if not better MPG, and its not revving too hard either.

Once you get the hang of the 1st gear i found it to be, for an oil burner, a rapid (not fast) smooth car, comfortable, and does everything well, if anything a little too well i had a few teething problems with mine creaking dash mainly, but once that was sorted its been pretty good. My humble opinion is that its a nice car ... for me a little too nice does everything too well and lacked a little character really ... well unless you try to take it out in the snow!! then character a plenty if you can get it moving!... would i buy one again i guess is the main question... well probably i think i would! i have only really had one problem and thats when i had the MOT it was burning so clean that the machine wouldnt believe there was a car there!!..... did wonder if thats the case why the tax man doesnt see it that way??

The deeler service, after a little misunderstanding, i have found to be excellent although a little steep and very few independants (round here anyway) and T-wells lexus are more than helpful and at the risk of being a sexist git its worth going just for the reception staff (its been a few months since i was last there) very helpful and ummm easy on the eye would probably be a nice way of putting it! in fact have i got time to book it in for something else before friday! hehe.

If someone is on here looking for a new car and is tempted all i will say is try it for yourself, and go with what you think i am sure there are people that have had problems with theirs but isnt any brand like that?

Hi, I am due to pick up an is220d next week some time and was looking forward to it, until I joined this forum. There appears to be a lot of bad press and I am sure maybe for good reason. I am trading in a X-Type 2.0 V6 which I enjoyed very much, but a change was due. I was also a member of the Jaguar forum and the constant that I have found is that there is always someone to grumble and there are always common faults no matter what make and model. I know that it should not be that way as we are spending alot of money on something that is only depreciating, but one car is no different from another in reliability really. There may be fewer issues with BMW and Audi, and perhaps they should be the bench mark, but, technology aside have they changed their basic design that much? They should be near perfect. Ultimately your choice of transport it is down to a few key items, price, looks, personal preference and practicality. Don't knock it. The real horror stories aside, which apply to any marque, I am sure that cars are generally fine, we are all different and have differing experience and experiences, just as well I say.

I am looking forward to owning my car and discussing other topics on the forum.

This is an extremely negative forum. I had an IS200 Sport before, and was on that forum. It was upbeat, positive, constructive, helpful, friendly and sometimes funny bordering on hilarious. Made some good friends on there too. This one for the 250/220D is soul destroying, in particular if you've bought the IS220D like I did. I spent a wad of cash on mine, and was sure I'd bought well after many test drives and loan cars. Now I feel cheated, and very worried about my purchase. Seems that people are preffering to boost and talk up the emblem mobiles like merc and BMW. I joined as a gold member I guess over two years ago because I loved the Lexus Owner Club and Forum. Now I feel depressed and a bit angry st all the negativity. So that's my 2 penneth worth.. (I might just let my Gold membership lpse now..)

Col...

[javadude]

Ignore them. It's an awesome car.

[dave1]

I am due to pick up an is220d next week some time and was looking forward to it, until I joined this forum. There appears to be a lot of bad press and I am sure maybe for good reason. I am trading in a X-Type 2.0 V6 which I enjoyed very much, but a change was due. I was also a member of the Jaguar forum and the constant that I have found is that there is always someone to grumble and there are always common faults no matter what make and model.

I am looking forward to owning my car and discussing other topics on the forum.

As you say, forums such as this tend to get a lot of negativity because they are used as a place to highlight problems and owners looking to get assistance from others who may have experienced similar problems. If you put the problems into perspective you will almost certainly find that the vast majority of owners are very happy with their car. Also we all have different expectations. Having had several 220d as loan/courtesy cars I can't find a lot to fault on them although it is not a car I would ever purchase.

A lot of people buy oil burners without considering whether it is really a suitable choice for the type of use that it will get. Anyone doing regular short journeys with no longer journeys should never buy a diesel car of any marque and if prospective buyers discussed their requirements with responsible clued-up sales staff fewer people would purchase a diesel if it was going to be used in a way likely to cause problems.

I hope you enjoy your Lexus, they are a great marque.......I have been a Lexus owner for almost 8 years.

[Is200Scott]

I have been a member of LOC for quite some time whilst owning my Is200 Sport (which I loved for almost 8 years) and LOVED how helpful everyone has always been on here and how good / funny some posts are.

I have started reading this section of LOC as last week I traded the old girl in (the Is200 that is - not the misses) for a luuuuuuvely Is250 SE MM. I have been very surprised with the lack of activity on this section of LOC and also the general negativity which seems to be aimed at anything other than the Is250 Auto (although much more towards the 220d). I think a lot of it is that sometimes people only post when they have a problem and also that Lexus owners are not used to problems with their cars (as they are so great and reliable!).

I for one LOVE my new Is250 and my other half likes it so much its put her off all other makes she was considering (Audi / BMW) before and she now wants an Is220d is red (we love the avatar pic of yours javadude!!), she's test drove one and loves it, it's just a waiting game now until one comes in (Red with MM, 17 inch wheels and grey leather seem rare at a good price).

As for another point, a friend of mine has had a torrid time over the last year with his Jag X-Type diesel estate. Nothing but problems, he's had to pay out for a new turbo had EGR valve problems, all sorts of things wrong one after another, he went on the Jag forums and said they are totally negative. He only bought it because he was told how good / reliable they were by lots of people. Now he says any car can be a 'dud' and is going to get what he wants without worrying about what other people tell him about it. He's had it for a year now and wants shut for............. a Lexus Is220d.

Scott

[philj69]

Well as people do looking for a new car etc online thought i would put something up here just for my 2p's worth really. :shutit:

I have a 220d but its going friday, for a new skoda (no laughing!). A lot is said about poor fuel consumption and to be honest its not the best but i didnt ever buy mine for that, poop build quality is also something you hear about but once the rattly dash was sorted and a few things like oil leaks (picked up on service i didnt and wouldnt have noticed!) its been fine, all done free so no cost to me just a little time to drop the car off etc. 6th gear is an issue i never did get my head round unless your doing 85plus (errr someone tells me :winky: your honour!) its no use at all unless you want to drive the car feeling bogged down and lumpy. To be honest i have rarely used 6th dont do much long motorway stuff but 5th is good for 70mph and gives just as good if not better MPG, and its not revving too hard either.

Once you get the hang of the 1st gear i found it to be, for an oil burner, a rapid (not fast) smooth car, comfortable, and does everything well, if anything a little too well i had a few teething problems with mine creaking dash mainly, but once that was sorted its been pretty good. My humble opinion is that its a nice car ... for me a little too nice does everything too well and lacked a little character really ... well unless you try to take it out in the snow!! then character a plenty if you can get it moving!... would i buy one again i guess is the main question... well probably i think i would! i have only really had one problem and thats when i had the MOT it was burning so clean that the machine wouldnt believe there was a car there!!..... did wonder if thats the case why the tax man doesnt see it that way??

The deeler service, after a little misunderstanding, i have found to be excellent although a little steep and very few independants (round here anyway) and T-wells lexus are more than helpful and at the risk of being a sexist git its worth going just for the reception staff (its been a few months since i was last there) very helpful and ummm easy on the eye would probably be a nice way of putting it! in fact have i got time to book it in for something else before friday! hehe.

If someone is on here looking for a new car and is tempted all i will say is try it for yourself, and go with what you think i am sure there are people that have had problems with theirs but isnt any brand like that?

Hi, I am due to pick up an is220d next week some time and was looking forward to it, until I joined this forum. There appears to be a lot of bad press and I am sure maybe for good reason. I am trading in a X-Type 2.0 V6 which I enjoyed very much, but a change was due. I was also a member of the Jaguar forum and the constant that I have found is that there is always someone to grumble and there are always common faults no matter what make and model. I know that it should not be that way as we are spending alot of money on something that is only depreciating, but one car is no different from another in reliability really. There may be fewer issues with BMW and Audi, and perhaps they should be the bench mark, but, technology aside have they changed their basic design that much? They should be near perfect. Ultimately your choice of transport it is down to a few key items, price, looks, personal preference and practicality. Don't knock it. The real horror stories aside, which apply to any marque, I am sure that cars are generally fine, we are all different and have differing experience and experiences, just as well I say.

I am looking forward to owning my car and discussing other topics on the forum.

The lexus really is not a bad car, its just the old addage of do something for someone and they will tell there friend however do something wrong and they will tell ten of their friends. i have not owned mine that long but i love it. Its comfortable, not too expensive to run and yeah the mpg's not mint and its not exactly quick but if i plod along i get just under 40 to the gallon on my way to work and back. Its a pleasure to live with. just relax and enjoy the fact that you are not following the herd so to speak. And the dealer i bought mine from inc the warranty, has been so helpful its been an experience which has only added to pleasure of owning this luxury brand.... and no car brand is without their faults or quirks lol.

[Monsterped]

This is an extremely negative forum. I had an IS200 Sport before, and was on that forum. It was upbeat, positive, constructive, helpful, friendly and sometimes funny bordering on hilarious. Made some good friends on there too. This one for the 250/220D is soul destroying, in particular if you've bought the IS220D like I did. I spent a wad of cash on mine, and was sure I'd bought well after many test drives and loan cars. Now I feel cheated, and very worried about my purchase. Seems that people are preffering to boost and talk up the emblem mobiles like merc and BMW. I joined as a gold member I guess over two years ago because I loved the Lexus Owner Club and Forum. Now I feel depressed and a bit angry st all the negativity. So that's my 2 penneth worth.. (I might just let my Gold membership lpse now..)

Col...

Hey Col

I can understand your feelings on buying a 220d after reading the threads regarding the various issues. Mine has, I think it's fair to say, been probably one of the worst in the UK and frankly I'm extremely hacked off about it even though it's a company car. The aim of my posts about the issues I've had has been to inform other owners of potential pitfalls (and to perhaps have a rant) not to scare people like yourself over their purchases. It would genuinely trouble my conscience if, knowing the sh*t I've been through, another owner suffered a worst fate than the near misses I've had through ignorance of the potential problems.

Look at it this way, you know what to look for if the car ever miss-behaves.

I guess I've been unlucky with mine, doesn't mean you'll be!! Good luck and happy ownership!!

PS - I still think the IS looks waaaaaay better than the BMW etc german competitors.... although not quite as nice as the Scirocco that's being built this week for delivery to me in about 3-4 weeks time!!

[Gunther]

The biggest thing that sticks out in my opinion is that you have to question your reasons for buying any diesel, especially if it's a Lexus. The choices for engine and gearbox don't exist really (other than Sport of non-sport), and the economy is so-so. No Auto, no options for less/more power.

I never really had a problem with mine, it ran very well, but if I was to buy a Lexus again, I would buy Petrol Auto - that is hat Lexus have always made very very well.

Lexus is a car to waft along in, and 99% of people buy one for 2 reasons: Quality and Reliability.

The IS220d isn't really a "Waft along" car - mainly because it's a manual and it's not a car to drive fast - at high revs it sounds strained and a little wheasy. Power delivery for a modern diesel is narrow and the gears are strange. The flatspots make it tricky unless you really build the revs up first!!

Quality and Reliability are actually OK for the Lexus, and I don't think worse than any modern diesel.

But. The main reason for buying a diesel? Economy I would say. But. That is where the IS250 Auto is almost as good (may be 10-20% less). I Know one or 2 have recently said it's not possible to get IS250 economy close to a IS220d, but I had one for a day when my 220d went for service, and driven gently I got 26 in busy town and 38 on a 18 mile Dual Carriage way run. That isn't bad. My 220d was 28-30 in town and 38-48 on a run.

At that point I knew I had made a bit of blunder in not buying the 250 Auto. You would have to do a lot of miles to feel any real benefit. The IS250 Auto was about £1000-1400 more than a 220d SE Manual. The price difference too small really and the benefits of the 250 Auto are so much more than just that extra money.

Also, Lexus owners are used to excellent reliability, and would normally have to go to a dealer once a year for maintenance. Many IS220d owners have had to go back too often.

I think anyone ho is thinking about an IS should seriously consider these points.

I change my cars every 18 months, and I am already thinking of next car. May be RX450h, or wait for new GS, though next 5 series looks nice too.

[Propwash]

Guys, thanks for the positive vibes. let's look to the brightside from now on. Can't wait to get my lovely black car on the road!!!

[dgman]

This is an extremely negative forum. I had an IS200 Sport before, and was on that forum. It was upbeat, positive, constructive, helpful, friendly and sometimes funny bordering on hilarious. Made some good friends on there too. This one for the 250/220D is soul destroying, in particular if you've bought the IS220D like I did. I spent a wad of cash on mine, and was sure I'd bought well after many test drives and loan cars. Now I feel cheated, and very worried about my purchase. Seems that people are preffering to boost and talk up the emblem mobiles like merc and BMW. I joined as a gold member I guess over two years ago because I loved the Lexus Owner Club and Forum. Now I feel depressed and a bit angry st all the negativity. So that's my 2 penneth worth.. (I might just let my Gold membership lpse now..)

Col...

Hey Col

I can understand your feelings on buying a 220d after reading the threads regarding the various issues. Mine has, I think it's fair to say, been probably one of the worst in the UK and frankly I'm extremely hacked off about it even though it's a company car. The aim of my posts about the issues I've had has been to inform other owners of potential pitfalls (and to perhaps have a rant) not to scare people like yourself over their purchases. It would genuinely trouble my conscience if, knowing the sh*t I've been through, another owner suffered a worst fate than the near misses I've had through ignorance of the potential problems.

Look at it this way, you know what to look for if the car ever miss-behaves.

I guess I've been unlucky with mine, doesn't mean you'll be!! Good luck and happy ownership!!

PS - I still think the IS looks waaaaaay better than the BMW etc german competitors.... although not quite as nice as the Scirocco that's being built this week for delivery to me in about 3-4 weeks time!!

it is strange how cars are visually polarising,my view on the scirocco is that it looks just like a squashed golf whereas my 220 looks as fresh as the day that i bought it and you can't say that about many cars four years on.

[Matus]

But. The main reason for buying a diesel? Economy I would say. But. That is where the IS250 Auto is almost as good (may be 10-20% less). I Know one or 2

it is true that 220d is not the most economical diesel, it is true that is250 is very good and not thirsty package at all, but the 250, when talking about new car, is more expensive, servicing is more expensive, resale value is lower than 220d (at least here) and AFAIK the tax is higher in the UK.

[Matus]

This is an extremely negative forum. I had an IS200 Sport before, and was on that forum. It was upbeat, positive, constructive, helpful, friendly and sometimes funny bordering on hilarious. Made some good friends on there too. This one for the 250/220D is soul destroying, in particular if you've bought the IS220D like I did. I spent a wad of cash on mine, and was sure I'd bought well after many test drives and loan cars. Now I feel cheated, and very worried about my purchase. Seems that people are preffering to boost and talk up the emblem mobiles like merc and BMW. I joined as a gold member I guess over two years ago because I loved the Lexus Owner Club and Forum. Now I feel depressed and a bit angry st all the negativity. So that's my 2 penneth worth.. (I might just let my Gold membership lpse now..)

Col...

this is why I come here once-twice per month.

I used to be here twice per day...

[colbecoz]

This is an extremely negative forum. I had an IS200 Sport before, and was on that forum. It was upbeat, positive, constructive, helpful, friendly and sometimes funny bordering on hilarious. Made some good friends on there too. This one for the 250/220D is soul destroying, in particular if you've bought the IS220D like I did. I spent a wad of cash on mine, and was sure I'd bought well after many test drives and loan cars. Now I feel cheated, and very worried about my purchase. Seems that people are preffering to boost and talk up the emblem mobiles like merc and BMW. I joined as a gold member I guess over two years ago because I loved the Lexus Owner Club and Forum. Now I feel depressed and a bit angry st all the negativity. So that's my 2 penneth worth.. (I might just let my Gold membership lpse now..)

Col...

this is why I come here once-twice per month.

I used to be here twice per day...

Matus, I'm glad someone else feels about the same as I do. Every day I used to look forward to the Lexus Forum. Excited at what I could learn, hearing positive solutions to problems communicated in a non-depressing manner. On here, it seems to be.. "We're all Doomed Mr Mannering!!!". I seldom visit this one now and stick mainly to the IS200 forum. There are heaps of good guys on there willing to give great help and advice in a friendly manner.....

Col.. :shutit: :duh:

[Gunther]

This is an extremely negative forum. I had an IS200 Sport before, and was on that forum. It was upbeat, positive, constructive, helpful, friendly and sometimes funny bordering on hilarious. Made some good friends on there too. This one for the 250/220D is soul destroying, in particular if you've bought the IS220D like I did. I spent a wad of cash on mine, and was sure I'd bought well after many test drives and loan cars. Now I feel cheated, and very worried about my purchase. Seems that people are preffering to boost and talk up the emblem mobiles like merc and BMW. I joined as a gold member I guess over two years ago because I loved the Lexus Owner Club and Forum. Now I feel depressed and a bit angry st all the negativity. So that's my 2 penneth worth.. (I might just let my Gold membership lpse now..)

Col...

this is why I come here once-twice per month.

I used to be here twice per day...

Matus, I'm glad someone else feels about the same as I do. Every day I used to look forward to the Lexus Forum. Excited at what I could learn, hearing positive solutions to problems communicated in a non-depressing manner. On here, it seems to be.. "We're all Doomed Mr Mannering!!!". I seldom visit this one now and stick mainly to the IS200 forum. There are heaps of good guys on there willing to give great help and advice in a friendly manner.....

Col.. :shutit: :duh:

This is interesting. Like I have said many times, I was happy with my ISd. When I tested it in 2007 I thought it was good enough for me to buy. So. I did. But the longer I lived with it, the more the grass on the opposite side looked greener. Why? Because the ISd didn't, for me at least, have that passion. It did almost everything too well (except the drive) and there was no Auto option, and the hype of good quality and reliability, for me at least wasn't that important. Why? Because I sell my cars normally before warranty is out!! So if it breaks, it goes back under warranty.

I would still say that the IS is a good car, but "greatness" comes with character, and I'm not sure it has really developed any. Not for me anyway. I'm not being negative - don't get me wrong - it's just that IS doesn't stir your soul. The feel of Luxury and the gadgets are excellent, but then a Honda Accord or Avensis gioves you almost all of that for less money, cheaper costs etc and the Honda can have Auto diesel.

Then when you add the fact that the ISd has attracted a lot of "new to the marques" because it made some sense as a company car in 06/07 (no other Lexus really did then, except may be the GS 450h, emissions were a killer on the rest), and you have some un-loyal types who will quite happily come here and poop the forum, and move to another maker.

So, in a nutshell, the IS200 had loyal followers, people who bought a car that was readily modifiable, had a real character, reliable and largely bought by people who paid their own money; The new IS has lots of diesel owners, many company cars, and less loyalty to the brand. Also, the earlier models were bought by people who were very vocal people for whom the car wasn't good enough - too many rattles, poor economy, break downs etc. It is no wonder. Even my Lexus dealer admitted too many ISd cars had problems.

The IS250, especially Auto, is a proper Lexus though. Smooth, refined. No complaints there are there?

So I agree that this forum can be disappointing at times, but mind you, I haven't become a posting member on thge BMW forums. Why? There is no need - my BMW is running sweet and there are so many more threads that answer all your questions.

I do miss my ISd - the reversing camera and the MLS were superb. It looked unique in a car park. In fact I am looking to replace my car in Sept 10 and will probably be a GS450h owner. Possibly a RX450, but for me it's too big. The GS hjas a small boot, so that does worry me.

[TestPilot]

Always look on the bright side, they say... :( I'm still waiting for the insurance industry to sort out my IS250C (short version - I'm the first poor sap in Europe to have had one pranged, so they can't work out how expensive it will be to fix it... or not). But as a result, I've now had a month driving a BMW 325d M Sport auto convertible and a further month (so far) driving an IS220d manual. Both 08 plates.

The bimmer was a good looking beast, had the M Sport kit on, 18inch alloys etc. Sadly that meant sports seats which I would have avoided if buying myself - a bit of a squeeze for my not-oversized backside and a bit hard when recovering from whiplash. Also sadly the weather was not good for top-down (the hire company would not have wanted it full of snow, I'm sure!).

Likes - generally good visibility, stylish looks, the blue badge, "extended" exterior lighting.

Dislikes - no satnav, no parking camera, fiddly radio, VERY flat-spotty engine, boot small and odd-shaped, compared to 250C. Harder ride.

Also I personally dislike the cheap-looking orange instruments and orange glow around the cabin. I know that BMW claim its the best colour for night vision, but...

I think I got about 35 to the gallon, didn't make records 'cos I thought I'd only be in it a week or two.

The 220d pleasantly surprised me. Lots of torque in the band (2000-2500). Many of the goodies I had on my C, though oddly no leather...

I don't see the problem with gearing. When just trundling, it's happy in 4th at 30, 5th at 40, 6th at 50-60. If you want some action, then think ahead and drop a cog or two before activating the loud pedal. Perhaps I just think I'm back in my old Swedish turbo wardrobe.

Fuel economy is not what I expected - the first tank averaged 33.1, oddly exactly what was on the overall average when I got it. Taking the cost of diesel into account, pence-per-mile not much different to the 250.

I do see the criticism of the SatNav lock-out. It is very annoying to have to Agree each time you start, and (if I got this right) not being able to select a destination when on the move - even from the passenger seat. Unless I got more of a bump on the head than I thought, both of these are fixed on the C.

Overall, I won't be sorry to leave the 220d manual for the (or another) 250 auto (as somebody said, more of a "wafty" car), but I genuinely do prefer it to the 325d.

Oh and it's great to have the reversing camera again!

[Tango]

I do see the criticism of the SatNav lock-out. It is very annoying to have to Agree each time you start, and (if I got this right) not being able to select a destination when on the move - even from the passenger seat. Unless I got more of a bump on the head than I thought, both of these are fixed on the C.

It's not the car, it's the way the software has been written. The 2009/10 DVD satnav discs allow operation of the satnav on the move regardless of which year of second generation IS you are sitting in.

Regarding the forums, it has been said before it's the Lexus Owners Club, not necessarily a Lexus fan club. Members give their personal opinions, many based on their own experience, and many find it useful regardless of whether it's negative or positive. Personally I believe, and always have done, that Lexus made a mistake in introducing the 220D into the European market just to satisfy the commercial fleet requirements. The gearing is poor and the reliability hasn't been good (it's lost Lexus it's historical first place in the JD Power survey). Personally I think it's a dog, and a mongrel at that. Thank goodness it's not going to be developed further.

[TestPilot]

It's not the car, it's the way the software has been written.

That has such a ring to it! Makes sense, but I read that Lexus (in the States?) were reluctant to address the problem. Glad to hear that it *is* something that can be retro-fitted.

[Gunther]

Testpilot. Question-

Do you think a 325d is more flat spotty than a 220d? I am astounded! The peak torque starts at only 1300 RPM, so there is no room for a flatspot. Certainly not on mine. I've had both for some time and can tell you the BMW 325d will eat the 220d and spit it out in any gear at any time!! 3.0d 6 v 2.2 4 - no contest in smoothness, power delivery, or anything. Different cars and not comparable.

The ride is very hard (and can be uncomfortable), I agree, but handles like the dogs :tsktsk: because it is sold as a performance car, so you choose carefully when buying a BMW with the MSport kit.

[TestPilot]

Hi Gunther

Do you think a 325d is more flat spotty than a 220d? I am astounded!

Well, I can only say how the one I had was. Perhaps it wasn't a typical example. On several occasions, when accelerating from lowish revs (I'd think around 1500 to 1800...), there was no response... until the auto finally decided to kick right down - then the revs would shoot right up and I'd have to lift, then wait for it to change up. Most unpredictable. Maybe a gearbox fault, but that wouldn't account for the initial nothingness. (And I'm familiar with turbo lag after more than a decade in wardrobes.)

Note - despite the similarities of operation between the 3 series auto box and the IS250's, I was usually using the "normal" auto range - if I had had the car for longer, I'd probably be using the sport and manual ranges more and would have learned different ways to avoid that behaviour.

The 220d doesn't have masses of grunt at the bottom end, true, but the delivery from 1500 up to 2000 is smooth enough (again speaking for the one I have). It's willing enough up to around 4500 too (though having driven 5 cyl engines for a very long time, then six with the 250, it surprises me how low the engine note is for the revs shown on the tacho). And, as I hinted, being a manual means there's more control over where the revs are to start with. This one does seem to have the idle set a bit high (about 1100) - don't know if that's typical.

(Don't think I have a downer on bimmers - I really like the new Z4, for one)

What I really got out of this comparison is that I made the right choice between the 3 series convertible and the IS on equipment and practicality, and that going for the petrol Lex hasn't landed me with huge fuel bills compared to the diesel.

Obviously I can't comment on the reliability of the 220d... well I hope not anyway. :shutit:

[Gunther]

Overall then it's the gearbox causing your issues, not the engine. Let me explain......the BMW has an adaptive gearbox, and being a courtesy car ( if that's what it was) will have been driven in a differing manner of ways (hammered largely ;) ), so the Gearbox software was probably baffled and didn't know who was doing what LOL. It's a common problem with German adaptive auto's, but if you drive consistently for a few miles (a couple of hundred) it learns what you want to do and behaves much better.

It can be reset too (there is asequence you have you follow) without an ECU reset.

PS - no gearbox I have ever come across is as a good as a Lexus autobox

[colbecoz]

Overall then it's the gearbox causing your issues, not the engine. Let me explain......the BMW has an adaptive gearbox, and being a courtesy car ( if that's what it was) will have been driven in a differing manner of ways (hammered largely ;) ), so the Gearbox software was probably baffled and didn't know who was doing what LOL. It's a common problem with German adaptive auto's, but if you drive consistently for a few miles (a couple of hundred) it learns what you want to do and behaves much better.

It can be reset too (there is asequence you have you follow) without an ECU reset.

PS - no gearbox I have ever come across is as a good as a Lexus autobox

I agree with Gunther. I like the gearboxes in the IS200 sport and the 220D. There are a lot more cr&ppy gearboxes around I can tell you. This forum made me feel (stupidly) that I'd bought a bummer in the 220D. Especially after I had paid for it with my own hard earned cash and not had it thrust upon me as a company/fleet car. Anyway, I'm over that now, and I love my 220D. For those who love knocking the 220D, that's fine.. go and buy a Merc, Beamer, Skoda or whatever, but just stop the negativity. We can all rip anything to bits if it doesn't suit our personal ideas of perfection, but, I prefer the positive approach. Problem + solution = Positive outcome. My old Granny used to say "if you can't say anything good, then don't say anything at all!".

Well i suppose I've had my three pence worth now lol....

:winky: :winky: :D :P

[TestPilot]

... the Gearbox software was probably baffled ...

That could well be the problem then. Loaners don't come with handbooks (or at least not after the first user ).

... no gearbox I have ever come across is as a good as a Lexus autobox ...

That's so true. The Lex autobox is sooo smooth. And has an extra cog over the bimmer in this case too.

This forum made me feel (stupidly) that I'd bought a bummer in the 220D.

I'd say don't worry, it's certainly made a good impression on me after all the carping I'd seen on the forum.

[philj69]

Overall then it's the gearbox causing your issues, not the engine. Let me explain......the BMW has an adaptive gearbox, and being a courtesy car ( if that's what it was) will have been driven in a differing manner of ways (hammered largely ;) ), so the Gearbox software was probably baffled and didn't know who was doing what LOL. It's a common problem with German adaptive auto's, but if you drive consistently for a few miles (a couple of hundred) it learns what you want to do and behaves much better.

It can be reset too (there is asequence you have you follow) without an ECU reset.

PS - no gearbox I have ever come across is as a good as a Lexus autobox

I agree with Gunther. I like the gearboxes in the IS200 sport and the 220D. There are a lot more cr&ppy gearboxes around I can tell you. This forum made me feel (stupidly) that I'd bought a bummer in the 220D. Especially after I had paid for it with my own hard earned cash and not had it thrust upon me as a company/fleet car. Anyway, I'm over that now, and I love my 220D. For those who love knocking the 220D, that's fine.. go and buy a Merc, Beamer, Skoda or whatever, but just stop the negativity. We can all rip anything to bits if it doesn't suit our personal ideas of perfection, but, I prefer the positive approach. Problem + solution = Positive outcome. My old Granny used to say "if you can't say anything good, then don't say anything at all!".

Well i suppose I've had my three pence worth now lol....

:winky: :winky: :D :P

nice post colbeoz. i love my lexus, and much the same as you i paid for mine outright with the little bit of savings i had. i did have to think twice after reading all the griping about the 220d....

[SiWhite]

...For those who love knocking the 220D, that's fine.. go and buy a Merc, Beamer, Skoda or whatever, ...

I had a 220D, I thought it was a great car but at the same time I felt it was robbing me with every tank of fuel I put in. So I did change it ... for an IS250 which is just the dogs bollocks. My only regret is not buying the IS250 in the first place.

:)