Lexus 220d / 250 Se

[joebloggs]

I have been reading these forums for a couple of weeks, and have just bought a Lexus 220d SE MM. This was registered in Sept 57 and bought from Nottingham, had it for just over a week. Got to say I love the Lexus and really glad I bought it - Looks good and much better interior imho than a BMW 3 Series, which was my alternative. My only probelm is the petrol diesel debate.

When I was looking I test drove both the 250SE manual and the 220d Sport manual. I loved the smoothness of the 250 petrol engine, but what put me off the 250 was the emmissions and particularly the Car Tax. Already up to £300 pa and I understand it is going up to £400 pa soon. Although I know that's not a lot compared to cost of car, I could well imagine it would grate every year when due.

I therefore decided to go for the diesel, but I am now not sure I made the right choice. The 250 diesel I test drove was a Sport and I have since read this is geared different to the SE 220d. I find the gearing of the SE a bit odd, never having owned a diesel before. 6th is only useful at very high speeds and I find myself driving in third a lot.

My car is getting about 36mpg based on the limited number of miles I have done so far. So I have a couple of questions.

1. Read a lot on this site about poor mpg for diesel, but realistically how many does a 250 SE get on normal 'A' road driving. To be honest I don't do enough miles in a year to worry too much about this, but if I was getting less than 25mpg I wouldn't be happy. How many do most people genuinely get?

2. Not read much about cost of car tax on here, are owners of the 250SE just resigned to this - for same tax could be driving a big 4 x 4?

3. Seems the car of choice on here is a petrol automatic - now I have never owned an automatic and never fancied one - I like to drive an change gear and think an automatic would remove some of the fun from driving??

4 - and here's the biggy - according to the Lexus GB site, if you buy an approved used Lexus you have a 30 day No Quibble exchange policy. If I now think I would be prefer a 250SE do you think I would be able to invoke this. Have any of you done it or no of anyone who has and how much hassle is involved.

Sorry it's a bit long, don't want to ramble, and as I say, I am genuinely happy with the choice of the Lexus, just kind of wish I had gone for the 250SE petrol.

[Gra56]

I have been reading these forums for a couple of weeks, and have just bought a Lexus 220d SE MM. This was registered in Sept 57 and bought from Nottingham, had it for just over a week. Got to say I love the Lexus and really glad I bought it - Looks good and much better interior imho than a BMW 3 Series, which was my alternative. My only probelm is the petrol diesel debate.

When I was looking I test drove both the 250SE manual and the 220d Sport manual. I loved the smoothness of the 250 petrol engine, but what put me off the 250 was the emmissions and particularly the Car Tax. Already up to £300 pa and I understand it is going up to £400 pa soon. Although I know that's not a lot compared to cost of car, I could well imagine it would grate every year when due.

I therefore decided to go for the diesel, but I am now not sure I made the right choice. The 250 diesel I test drove was a Sport and I have since read this is geared different to the SE 220d. I find the gearing of the SE a bit odd, never having owned a diesel before. 6th is only useful at very high speeds and I find myself driving in third a lot.

My car is getting about 36mpg based on the limited number of miles I have done so far. So I have a couple of questions.

1. Read a lot on this site about poor mpg for diesel, but realistically how many does a 250 SE get on normal 'A' road driving. To be honest I don't do enough miles in a year to worry too much about this, but if I was getting less than 25mpg I wouldn't be happy. How many do most people genuinely get?

2. Not read much about cost of car tax on here, are owners of the 250SE just resigned to this - for same tax could be driving a big 4 x 4?

3. Seems the car of choice on here is a petrol automatic - now I have never owned an automatic and never fancied one - I like to drive an change gear and think an automatic would remove some of the fun from driving??

4 - and here's the biggy - according to the Lexus GB site, if you buy an approved used Lexus you have a 30 day No Quibble exchange policy. If I now think I would be prefer a 250SE do you think I would be able to invoke this. Have any of you done it or no of anyone who has and how much hassle is involved.

Sorry it's a bit long, don't want to ramble, and as I say, I am genuinely happy with the choice of the Lexus, just kind of wish I had gone for the 250SE petrol.

On the road tax issue, I paid £205 for my IS 250 SEL-MM in September so I am not sure where your figure of £300 comes from. The diesel optionfor me was a none starter mainly due to the poor gearbox. As I get on average 37MPG from my petrol engine I know it was the right choice

[Gra56]

I have been reading these forums for a couple of weeks, and have just bought a Lexus 220d SE MM. This was registered in Sept 57 and bought from Nottingham, had it for just over a week. Got to say I love the Lexus and really glad I bought it - Looks good and much better interior imho than a BMW 3 Series, which was my alternative. My only probelm is the petrol diesel debate.

When I was looking I test drove both the 250SE manual and the 220d Sport manual. I loved the smoothness of the 250 petrol engine, but what put me off the 250 was the emmissions and particularly the Car Tax. Already up to £300 pa and I understand it is going up to £400 pa soon. Although I know that's not a lot compared to cost of car, I could well imagine it would grate every year when due.

I therefore decided to go for the diesel, but I am now not sure I made the right choice. The 250 diesel I test drove was a Sport and I have since read this is geared different to the SE 220d. I find the gearing of the SE a bit odd, never having owned a diesel before. 6th is only useful at very high speeds and I find myself driving in third a lot.

My car is getting about 36mpg based on the limited number of miles I have done so far. So I have a couple of questions.

1. Read a lot on this site about poor mpg for diesel, but realistically how many does a 250 SE get on normal 'A' road driving. To be honest I don't do enough miles in a year to worry too much about this, but if I was getting less than 25mpg I wouldn't be happy. How many do most people genuinely get?

2. Not read much about cost of car tax on here, are owners of the 250SE just resigned to this - for same tax could be driving a big 4 x 4?

3. Seems the car of choice on here is a petrol automatic - now I have never owned an automatic and never fancied one - I like to drive an change gear and think an automatic would remove some of the fun from driving??

4 - and here's the biggy - according to the Lexus GB site, if you buy an approved used Lexus you have a 30 day No Quibble exchange policy. If I now think I would be prefer a 250SE do you think I would be able to invoke this. Have any of you done it or no of anyone who has and how much hassle is involved.

Sorry it's a bit long, don't want to ramble, and as I say, I am genuinely happy with the choice of the Lexus, just kind of wish I had gone for the 250SE petrol.

On the road tax issue, I paid £205 for my IS 250 SEL-MM in September so I am not sure where your figure of £300 comes from. The diesel optionfor me was a none starter mainly due to the poor gearbox. As I get on average 37MPG from my petrol engine I know it was the right choice

Should have said that 95% of my driving is motorway thats why the MPG is good. Around town i'm getting around 26mpg average

[ihpj]

Interesting post. I personally think that you've confused yourself. The IS 250 Auto emits 214 g/km and thus costs £204 (annual) RFL; you can check this from the DVLA website or even Parkers. On the issue of the 'no quibble exchange' thats only if there is a fault with the car and they are not able to fix it, but there is also a mileage limit IIRC 1500 miles. You cannot invoke this if you're 'just not happy' with the car.

As for the box, I would now almost exclusively plump for an Auto every time, especially if the car has an engine bigger than 2.5L. Modern day Auto boxes are now so very good that if you look at the specs. (vs. manual) theres very little in it - plus with these ever-so-intelligent boxes, why would you want a manual? I was a staunch stick-shift person, but now find Auto just so useful and easy.

Each to their own I guess :)

[Northern Boys Luv Gravy]

The IS250 manual emits more CO2 than the automatic version, pushing it into Band G (the highest). This means that a manual IS250 owner will pay £300 in RFL this year if the car was registered after 23/3/06 and that is going up to £400 next year I believe. So an auto driver will save about £200 a year in RFL and a bit in fuel costs as well. It's a no brainer for me - auto every time.

With regard to the no-quibble guarantee - I think you can just swop it if you are not happy - that's what "no quibble" means.

[Sagitar]

Interesting post. I personally think that you've confused yourself. The IS 250 Auto emits 214 g/km and thus costs £204 (annual) RFL; you can check this from the DVLA website or even Parkers. On the issue of the 'no quibble exchange' thats only if there is a fault with the car and they are not able to fix it, but there is also a mileage limit IIRC 1500 miles. You cannot invoke this if you're 'just not happy' with the car.

As for the box, I would now almost exclusively plump for an Auto every time, especially if the car has an engine bigger than 2.5L. Modern day Auto boxes are now so very good that if you look at the specs. (vs. manual) theres very little in it - plus with these ever-so-intelligent boxes, why would you want a manual? I was a staunch stick-shift person, but now find Auto just so useful and easy.

Each to their own I guess :)

Be wary of some of the mileage figures published on this site. Some are based upon the display in the car and in my experience it tends to be optimistic. Yesterday I drove from Manchester to Ampthill, filling up just before the journey. I did the whole journey with cruise control set at 70 m.p.h and the tank average showing on the display at the end of the journey was 37.3 m.p.g. On some quiet motorway journeys, the tank average displayed has exceeded 40 m.p.g.

But, but, but: the overall consumption figure calculated on the basis of every mile done and every gallon put into the tank since new, i.e. not depending upon the display, is as below. This is for an IS 250 SE-L auto and I think is pretty typical.

[Gra56]

Interesting post. I personally think that you've confused yourself. The IS 250 Auto emits 214 g/km and thus costs £204 (annual) RFL; you can check this from the DVLA website or even Parkers. On the issue of the 'no quibble exchange' thats only if there is a fault with the car and they are not able to fix it, but there is also a mileage limit IIRC 1500 miles. You cannot invoke this if you're 'just not happy' with the car.

As for the box, I would now almost exclusively plump for an Auto every time, especially if the car has an engine bigger than 2.5L. Modern day Auto boxes are now so very good that if you look at the specs. (vs. manual) theres very little in it - plus with these ever-so-intelligent boxes, why would you want a manual? I was a staunch stick-shift person, but now find Auto just so useful and easy.

Each to their own I guess :)

Be wary of some of the mileage figures published on this site. Some are based upon the display in the car and in my experience it tends to be optimistic. Yesterday I drove from Manchester to Ampthill, filling up just before the journey. I did the whole journey with cruise control set at 70 m.p.h and the tank average showing on the display at the end of the journey was 37.3 m.p.g. On some quiet motorway journeys, the tank average displayed has exceeded 40 m.p.g.

But, but, but: the overall consumption figure calculated on the basis of every mile done and every gallon put into the tank since new, i.e. not depending upon the display, is as below. This is for an IS 250 SE-L auto and I think is pretty typical.

My figures are based on actual fuel vs mileage completed and does not rely on the display. I don't drive aggresive and set the cruise to 80. I think the radar cruise control helps a lot with the figures. This car is used for business and the actual to date is around 37 mpg overall,, 95% motoraw driving. This figure can be verified by my accountant. Do you think we make these MPG figures up?

[Sagitar]

Do you think we make these MPG figures up?

I think the Lexus display does sometimes . . . .

As of this morning I have done 9086 miles in mine and put in 303.78 gallons giving 29.9 m.p.g

Would anyone else like to quote some actual total figures?

[joebloggs]

"On the road tax issue, I paid £205 for my IS 250 SEL-MM in September so I am not sure where your figure of £300 comes from"

I was told by Lexus the Road Tax was £300 and it was the sales person who said it would go up to £400. These figures are from the DVLA site

F is for emisions of 185 and G is for over 225/

F Over 185 Annual £205.00 six monthly £112.75

G Over 225 for cars registered on or after 23/03/06 Annual £300.00 6 - mothly £165.00

Looking at the Lexus site again, the Auto has emmissions of 214 so currently in band F but the manual is 231 so very much in band G, hence £300 at present. I was only lookig at the manual.

[Tango]

Looking at the Lexus site again, the Auto has emmissions of 214 so currently in band F but the manual is 231 so very much in band G, hence £300 at present. I was only lookig at the manual.

I originally wanted the IS250 Sport with a manual gearchange, but after test driving the IS250 Se-L Auto with the Multi media pack I swiftly changed my mind, and two years later I don't regret it one little bit. :) Have also added all the Sport options and then some, so am more than happy with the spec.

If you get really bored then put it in manual mode and use the stick shift or paddles to change gear, the only thing you'll miss is having to use your left foot (it's always handy for braking :winky: ).

Buying a diesel was never going to be an option for me....fortunately :shutit: Not too worried about mpg in all honesty, as long as it's performing properly. Mine returns between 26-29 average with my normal driving, but a long motorway journey with cruise set at 75-80 mph takes it nearer 40 mpg.

[Scarlet Pimpernell]

Welcome mate!!

I would, in all honesty, go test drive the Auto immediately if I was in your position. And a long test drive at that, especially if you are not used to an Auto.

I've personally never owned an Auto before, but have driven loads (mainly BMW's and Merc's) and the Lexus IS250 Auto, in SE trim with MM ranks very very highly in my book. If it's your own cash (assuming it is) then it will hold it's value better too.

All I can say is that whilst I'm still a "stick shift" driver and enjoy driving, the IS is only really convincing IMHO as an Auto V6 Petrol. It is super smooth, reasonably economical, and drives like a Lexus should. You really cannot tell a change up or down, unless kickdown (i.e. stamping on the pedal to force a shift down to a lower cog).

If I still had the 30 day rule, I'd swop it for a 250 Auto anyday - even a base model!

Don't get me wrong - the diesel is not a bad car, it's just very different. With issues that some have suffered around the 5th injector etc there is some room for improvment... And with so so economy etc etc (and the price of derv) it doesn't quite make sense from an economy point of view. Having said that, hopefully the '57's are all perfect now!

Seriously buddy - I would get down back to the dealer asap! Then you can make our own informed choice!! As Tango says - on a run, there really isn't that much difference between manual oiler and the 250 Auto - with Diesel 5% more expensive and the only giving you 10% better economy at best, the difference really isn't worth it! And this is from someone who's had the diesel for almost 2 years!

[joebloggs]

Looking again at the approved pre- owned I think the 250SE Auto is going to be out of range.

I don't want a base spec as I want leather interior and the MM. No quibble says it's same dealer and the dealer I got it from only has one auto at present and thats up at £31.5K. This is £4.5 k more that the window price on the one I bought and I doubt I would be in a good bargaining postion regarding that.

So, excluding the auto debate, if it was a choice of the 220dSE or the 250SE with a manual what would thoughts be then?

(Also I'd go back to my original question about emissions on the manual 250.)

Had a couple more trips in mine since opening the thread, and I have got to say that overall I still really like it - I'll keep my eye on the sites for the next 10 days or so to see if another comes up, but otherwise I'll probably stick with the one I have.

Couple of other points strike me -

1. My only real issue is the gearing, I seem to spend most of the time in 3rd and 4th on the runs I make and don't change up as much as I would in my previous cars, but if I got an Auto I'd not change gears at all so may be for me it's a half way house. I only do about 10-12k per annum, mainly on my daily commute, so I don't need an auto to because of doing of thousands of miles per month;

2. Most of the comments on the 250 Auto are in respect of smoothness and refinement, but this is the most expensive car I have owned to date, coming from Honda Civic, Mazda 6, Ford Mondeo and for smoothness and refinement I personally can't fault it.

I suppose the advantage of having the petrol would be to retain my current driving style whilst not losing that refinement - but paying quite a lot more per annum in RFL and fuel for this.