Car Road Tax

[Linas.P]

21 minutes ago, dutchie01 said:

Its just a cultural difference nothing else. In France the opinion on food is very different than in the UK or Holland. Take French out for lunch and first there will be a discussion of 20 minutes about the food followed by another 20 minutes about what wine to pair it with. Every village has a market where farmers sell their produce and cooking is more than using a microwave.

That is my point - it is not like French are nationalists, or that they somehow protective of their produce, but they simply care more about what they are buying and are kind of passionate about what they eat. If there are products that are better, they buy those items regardless where they coming from. However, quite a lot of fresh vegetables and food products are local, just because they are better.

[Malc1]

CAR ROAD TAX 

maybe a simple sedum green roof affixed on every car to reduce / cancel the VED …… and to make that vehicle automatically ULEZ proofed  🤔

Malc 

[Boomer54]

5 minutes ago, Malc1 said:

CAR ROAD TAX 

maybe a simple sedum green roof affixed on every car to reduce / cancel the VED …… and to make that vehicle automatically ULEZ proofed  🤔

Malc 

Get back to you after I work out how that plays with the roof down.

[Boomer54]

16 minutes ago, Linas.P said:

That is my point - it is not like French are nationalists, or that they somehow protective of their produce, but they simply care more about what they are buying and are kind of passionate about what they eat. If there are products that are better, they buy those items regardless where they coming from. However, quite a lot of fresh vegetables and food products are local, just because they are better.

Can't help ,but feel we are not quite getting a meeting of minds because you keep taking this back to fresh produce. No one is arguing about that stuff. In France one can't drive through a Village ,or Town of any size without tripping over market stalls. That kind of consumer activity rarely happens in the UK anymore where local people buy small batch produce from local producers.  For example data points. French agri GDP 1.6%. Uk equivalent 0.5% ...enough said I think.

I am talking about the entire world of stuff not so classified and on that issue I think the French are inordinately protective and that has nothing to do with consumer behaviour per se, or some belief in the higher perceptive ability of French people to discern 'better'. It's simple French bureaucracy.

 

 

[Linas.P]

6 minutes ago, Boomer54 said:

I am talking about the entire world of stuff not so classified and on that issue I think the French are inordinately protective and that has nothing to do with consumer behaviour per se, or some belief in the higher perceptive ability of French people to discern 'better'. It's simple French bureaucracy.

Maybe you can help me with specific example of such product? 

Outside of maybe certain French business only allowing French cars, which is doubly unfair, because French cars are junk. That said I never came across such issue, except that French cars were significantly cheaper, but it wasn't the case of foreign cars not being available to choose, just French cars being noticeably discounted (was certainly the case in SocGen/ADR).

[Malc1]

25 minutes ago, Boomer54 said:

Get back to you after I work out how that plays with the roof down.

Sadly convertible owners will have to pay HUGE VED 😂🤣🥳

Malc 

[Spock66]

On 8/18/2024 at 5:14 PM, Linas.P said:

First of all, you have clearly not understood Indian "caste system", basically a type of slavery which still exist in India... and this is important. Infosis is not a significant, nor world class institution, it is business of slavery. Also they are not "akin Microsoft", they are IT consultancy/integrator, there is huge difference between making the product and just installing it on clients PC. In short - his wife parents money is dirty, very dirty and actually even bloody.

What utter rubbish, you can't even spell Infosys correctly.

[Linas.P]

1 hour ago, Spock66 said:

you can't even spell Infosys correctly.

Doesn't make much difference...

Also first hand experience, we had "strategic partnership" with them to supply helpdesk and developers and I was appalled looking at working conditions, even visited their sites in India. And those working there considered themselves lucky as we were paying for "premium" quality staff, others working on their standard projects were treated even worse. It is total slavery, that is how they are competitive, because they can offer rock bottom prices at the cost of their staff.

[Jgtcracer]

1 hour ago, Linas.P said:

Doesn't make much difference...

Also first hand experience, we had "strategic partnership" with them to supply helpdesk and developers and I was appalled looking at working conditions, even visited their sites in India. And those working there considered themselves lucky as we were paying for "premium" quality staff, others working on their standard projects were treated even worse. It is total slavery, that is how they are competitive, because they can offer rock bottom prices at the cost of their staff.

I wonder what their fresh produce is like!?!

[Malc1]

I thought not to interject here, but I shall

I know a little of this …….. Delhi population usually buy all the fruits and veggies family meal supplies from the all-over market stalls, everywhere …….. there’s just about zilch UK style food supermarkets ……. the trucks and trucks of fresh stuffs arrive every evening from about 10pm when the trucks are allowed “ in “

Everyone ….. about 25 million in Delhi ….. buy their fresh fruits and veggies this way ….. those less well off buy the left overs from prior days deliveries …… and the very poor get their foodstuffs for free anyway …… very few ever go hungry ….. it’s the Hindu Culture 

I suspect other India cities towns and villages enjoy similar 

 

And I shan’t even begin to delve into the Caste system on here….. that’s forever been ……. some 400 castes and the belief and  “ need “ to see death as the way upward into the next level …….. don’t attempt to “ knock it “  …… it’s millennia old theology and belief and stands this one fifth of the World population in good stead  

Malc 

 

and I shan’t mention a single word about. CAR ROAD TAX in Delhi 🤣😂 

[GMB]

Linas got it right about some aspects of French life compared to ours but may I add a couple of points. The French buy mostly French cars because they are a bit cheaper, but probably more importantly, every village has a Renault or Citroen or Peugeot garage in it. Try and find a Lexus garage in the South of France. The village markets are great and the produce is better and sometimes cheaper than the supermarkets and you are supporting the local economy which the French find very important.

In summary, every country has its good and bad aspects, nowhere is perfect but daily life in the sunny South of France is very nice indeed.☀️

[Linas.P]

5 hours ago, GMB said:

Linas got it right about some aspects of French life compared to ours but may I add a couple of points. The French buy mostly French cars because they are a bit cheaper, but probably more importantly, every village has a Renault or Citroen or Peugeot garage in it. Try and find a Lexus garage in the South of France. The village markets are great and the produce is better and sometimes cheaper than the supermarkets and you are supporting the local economy which the French find very important.

In summary, every country has its good and bad aspects, nowhere is perfect but daily life in the sunny South of France is very nice indeed.☀️

One other thing about French... they always buy good tyres. Even some banged-up, rotten out citron cobbled together with tape has all around premium brand rubber. Obviously... it helps that best tyre manufacturer is French and Michelin tyres are indeed cheaper in France (as local product), but I wouldn't even say Michelin is most popular, I have seen all mainstream brands fitted... however what I have not seen (at least not often) are no name chinesium dich finders 3000, very very rarely I see car in France that has some dangerous brand tyres. I know some legislation helps - it is illegal to fit different tyres on the same axle in France (as is in most of Europe but not UK, it is just ridiculous that this isn't a law), so that means that at very least maximum different number of different brand tyres on the car are 2... yet in UK it is normal to see even expensive cars with 4 odd tyres, some branded, some new, some chinesium, some nearly bald.

It could almost be argued that French cares for cars where it matters, they don't wash cars, they don't care about scratches and dings, but they do care about safety and there is nothing more important than tyres.

I would also add - in France I don't go to village markets, I just don't need to, the normal supermarket has all fresh and tasty produce, one does not need to go looking far to find good quality food. One can also find good quality food in UK if they know where to look, if they are willing to wake-up 5AM drive 50 miles and go to some sort of farmers or fishers market and buy in bulk, in France you could also do it, but you don't need to. 

I do agree that finding foreign cars services and dealers is more complicated in France, except maybe VW, Fiat (and whole Stellantis are common), German brands are in all bigger cities, but local French cars are on every corner indeed. 

Main point - I was arguing against the statement that French are "nationalists or protective", they are to some degree, but no more than any other nation. What I am trying to say - the choice of goods in France and primarily decided by market forces like consumer expectations, quality and price, only secondarily or tertiary are the nationalism or protectionism. French buy French food, because it is fresher, tastier and better quality, not because they are nationalists, and French buy French cars because they are simply cheaper, not because they are protective of junk brands like Peugeot or Renault... and also because most French do not care about cars, for them it is white good and they can't comprehend spending money on car as if it is some sort of "luxury", it will be banged-up, scratched-up and driven until wheels fall off and then replaced. And French automakers are actually competitive in the market of cheap, basic shaite-boxes that are disposable, they were never able to make proper "luxury" car, but they make shaite-boxes well and that turns out the type of car that French people desire. Obviously, there are always exceptions to the rule, but this is generally true, not even stereotype. 

[Malc1]

and the 🐌 🐌 🐌 le escargot are legendary as are the legs of those yummy frogs dancing around the Citroen picnic basket 

Nowhere does that as good as the French ……. Marco Pierre to the rescue with proper proper Champagne too …… 

UK Harry Ramsden Chish & Fips with a wally ( gherkin ) must be best …… surely 🤩🥳👍……. swilled down with a coke of course 

Aaaaaaggggghhhhh 🤣😂🤣😂

Malc 

[Malc1]

I used to be intrigued at the concept of really really fresh fish in Delhi …… 00s of kms from the sea 

But of course,  the fishmonger just pops over to his pond and catches whatever freshwater fish he has there in stock ……. fresh and delicious …… not sure about the fries tho’. 😳

Malc 

[Malc1]

Back to 

CAR ROAD TAX 

I was just trying to take this India theme to a logical conclusion but you won’t be at all surprised to believe that the India system is sooooo impossibly convoluted and our UK system is so comparatively simple ……… if we was India Sadiqs ability to raise an additional pseudo ULEZ would be hilarious and car owners would forever have an open cheque book ….. or credit card these days I guess …… or apple pay / Google pay whatever 😳

Doubtless dear old Sir Keir and his Queen of Thieves will take note of the very best global methodology for “ tax take “ from subservient motorists 

Good luck …… make sure your bank accounts can be looted with ease 🥵

Malc 

[GMB]

 

Not so sure about this statement :- "Main point - I was arguing against the statement that French are "nationalists or protective", they are to some degree, but no more than any other nation".

 

I know it was a while ago but...... Protective French practices?  The Gendarmes stood by in another place near Beziers while 50,000 litres of cheap Spanish red was poured from the stainless steel vats into the street. Oh, and they smashed up the aisles in Carrefour where Spanish plonk was on display. Not to mention the burning of tyres on the main roads  and so on.

BTW The picture below is from the Autoroute at Le Boulou where the Spanish border meets the French border ( unmanned ) on the Pyrenees 

The protesters in France said they were demonstrating against unfair competition, as they were unable to match the low price of foreign wine, which caused problems in selling their own products.

Image:A union leader says 'honest workers have decided to revolt'

The activists also smashed up and set fire to a cargo of tomatoes from Morocco.

According to The Telegraph, Frederic Rouanet, the wine growers' union president for the Aude region, said: "It is out of the question to accept the situation as it is.

 

 

"Starting from today, we are going to remove the possibility of buyers being able to get cheap wines from elsewhere... we are going to stop Spanish imports.

"This is the start of an economic war that we are going to wage."

The illicit action also received official backing from Alain Ginies, the vice president of Aude's council, who said: "We have always been close to our wine growers, and we still are today.

"Our two economic strengths at the departmental level are tourism and viticulture."

Balaclava-clad wine terrorists attacked the Biron merchant in Sete overnight, local media reported.

 

 

They cracked open five vats, sending wine gushing into the nearby streets of the port town. Sete is around 20 minutes by car from Montpellier in Languedoc-Roussillon.

Miliants claimed allegiance to the activist winemaker group CRAV, short for Regional Action Committee of Winemakers and sometimes known just as CAV.

It follows an arson attack on offices owned by the Vinadeis wine group. And it shows that anger over imports of Spanish wine has hit breaking point.

 

 

Emergency services arrived on the scene in Sete to contain the spread of wine and stop it from flooding nearby carparks. No one is believed to have been injured.

One CRAV representative told France 3 television in Languedoc, ‘Why did we do it? Because we are never listened to.’

He repeated an oft-cited allegation by the group that some Spanish wine entering France had come from South America. There is no proof.

[Malc1]

……… and then came the European Union and blissful harmony ?

Malc 

[Boomer54]

7 hours ago, GMB said:

Linas got it right about some aspects of French life compared to ours but may I add a couple of points. The French buy mostly French cars because they are a bit cheaper, but probably more importantly, every village has a Renault or Citroen or Peugeot garage in it. Try and find a Lexus garage in the South of France. The village markets are great and the produce is better and sometimes cheaper than the supermarkets and you are supporting the local economy which the French find very important.

In summary, every country has its good and bad aspects, nowhere is perfect but daily life in the sunny South of France is very nice indeed.☀️

Well I say you cannot beat the rainy N West of England. To satisfy honour I challenge you to a duel with washing up gloves at dawn (as long as I can come to the Sth of France for it).

[Boomer54]

 "Michelin tyres are indeed cheaper in France (as local product)"

You keep making my point for me. The French are protective of their market even if that means finding ways to price below market ! Nowt much to do with " being local".

[Boomer54]

Linas,

I am beginning to wonder where you actually live when you write;

" One can also find good quality food in UK if they know where to look, if they are willing to wake-up 5AM drive 50 miles and go to some sort of farmers or fishers market and buy in bulk, in France you could also do it, but you don't need to. "

I can roll up at any time of day driving 3 mins ,or walking 20 mins to get to Booths where they will quite easily be comparable to anywhere you might shop in France. When in Skipton I can walk to Drake and Macefields butchers and buy meat of any description that will exceed most you can buy in France (not all). If I am staying with my daughter In Hesketh bank I can walk to the local butchers there, Johnsons, and get lovely local Meat produce all butchered on the premises. I could keep going . but why bother. I am sure many other posters on here have similar experiences where they live in the UK. France produce being exceptional   in a quality level and not availaible here in the Uk is a myth. What is not a myth is the size of country , pop density per sq KM and what this means for more localised markets.  Hence France; 643,800 Km 2; Uk 244,370km 2; Pop density France 123 per KM 2 ; UK 277.

These numbers clearly have an effect on how markets develop. and why the UK footfall favours chain supermarkets whereas in France local markets are still very important. However, I have been in many French supermarkets and in terms of quality they offer no significant upside to some UK supermarkets like Waitrose, Booths, and dare I say the Continental Lidl and Aldi won't be far behind on some green produce, but clearly not all as their Fresh dept is nonexistent.

Grey,

The example you posted is just one that I remember from French actions to protect their markets. Now if that was really because French produce was better and French consumers were willing to pay more for it then ergo French suppliers would not be forced to be taking those actions to protect their sales has foreign produce would not be bought in any quantity.  So, let's stop talking myth , and think about how consumers actually do behave WHEN they are given choice.

[DavidCM]

Are we talking here of the same Frogs who made UK paratroops landing at the recent D Day commemorations have their passports stamped?

I don't think the Frogs were much on evidence when the Germans appeared early on in WW2...cue "cheese eating surrender monkeys".Same applied in WW1..instant white flags and we ,and other nations,had to save their backsides then.

[Mossypossy]

5 minutes ago, DavidCM said:

Are we talking here of the same Frogs who made UK paratroops landing at the recent D Day commemorations have their passports stamped?

I don't think the Frogs were much on evidence when the Germans appeared early on in WW2...cue "cheese eating surrender monkeys".Same applied in WW1..instant white flags and we ,and other nations,had to save their backsides then.

Hmmm

[Malc1]

...... and in my part of Kent I can buy really freshly picked bananas every day    👍👋👋

 

( btw that's a slight fib 🤔) 

Malc

[Boomer54]

32 minutes ago, DavidCM said:

Are we talking here of the same Frogs who made UK paratroops landing at the recent D Day commemorations have their passports stamped?

I don't think the Frogs were much on evidence when the Germans appeared early on in WW2...cue "cheese eating surrender monkeys".Same applied in WW1..instant white flags and we ,and other nations,had to save their backsides then.

Fair dos as we say up here they were probably busy bringing in their fresh produce (sic)

[Boomer54]

16 minutes ago, Malc1 said:

...... and in my part of Kent I can buy really freshly picked bananas every day    👍👋👋

 

( btw that's a slight fib 🤔) 

Malc

But you can get fresh fish straight out of the sea ! I know 'cos your neighbour is always tell😉ing you off for sticking your rod out of the window.