Winter fuel payment

[Boomer54]

27 minutes ago, Malc1 said:

Aren’t they too dumb to realise they’re being embarrassed …….. charging off willy nilly into the abyss ……. I’m reading that RR Rachel Reeves Queen of Thieves simply failed to do a sufficient Impact Assessment  ……. a sign of likely things to come ……. 
OAPs considered to be a “ soft touch “ with zero ability to make a fuss of any consequence ……..

hahahaha 11.4 million without a Voice eh !  How wrong those dimwits must be 🤣😂

 

it’s either going to be that Warm Aid Concert or getting ASLEF and the RMT on-side 

How can we get any of this going ? Or maybe it’s a little too soon ……. 

thoughts …….. 

Malc

I suppose the intrinsic problem with my 'big idea' is most of the people who might do that sort of charitable gig are just the sort that will not want to embarrass a labour govt.

[Malc1]

6 minutes ago, Boomer54 said:

I suppose the intrinsic problem with my 'big idea' is most of the people who might do that sort of charitable gig are just the sort that will not want to embarrass a labour govt.

I would think they’re all of an age where worrying about embarrassing any Govt isn’t a factor ……. I occasionally bump into Bob Geldof in a local Oxfam charity shop buying bits and bobs …… but that’s my only link to any of ‘em

Anyone else here have any discernible contact with any of ‘em ?  

Malc 

[Lmafudd]

It's a very interesting thread isn't it!
 

With regards to the USA/UK election system - I have no preference other than the US one is far too long. Content wise then there is no difference as ALL POLITICIANS LIE! Whether they lie to your face or, most usually, through some deceptive method like blaming the 'others' for forcing a punitive change to policy, they all do it. They can't blame themselves can they? The Labour party, for a long time, managed to hide their intents by saying nothing and only ever opposing government moves by just being Johnny Opposites. Now they are in 'power' they can't use this ploy and must actually take actions. This is where it all goes wrong. 
 

We all know that all governments will let us down at some time, the trick is to decide which will disappoint us the least and vote for them.

[Boomer54]

31 minutes ago, Malc1 said:

I would think they’re all of an age where worrying about embarrassing any Govt isn’t a factor ……. I occasionally bump into Bob Geldof in a local Oxfam charity shop buying bits and bobs …… but that’s my only link to any of ‘em

Anyone else here have any discernible contact with any of ‘em ?  

Malc 

"Anyone else here have any discernible contact with any of ‘em ?"

Sort of. These days when I am shaving bare to the waist I feel some Stones coming on. Usually "You can't always get what you want".  

[Malc1]

I’m hearing that this issue is likely to be raised in the House as soon as ……. any idea when the House next Sits to raise this Petition whatever  ?
 

Might we have time to set “ Warm Aid “  in motion 🤔

Malc  

438,588. Signatures til now 

[fourbanks]

3 hours ago, Lmafudd said:

It's a very interesting thread isn't it!
 

With regards to the USA/UK election system - I have no preference other than the US one is far too long. Content wise then there is no difference as ALL POLITICIANS LIE! Whether they lie to your face or, most usually, through some deceptive method like blaming the 'others' for forcing a punitive change to policy, they all do it. They can't blame themselves can they? The Labour party, for a long time, managed to hide their intents by saying nothing and only ever opposing government moves by just being Johnny Opposites. Now they are in 'power' they can't use this ploy and must actually take actions. This is where it all goes wrong. 
 

We all know that all governments will let us down at some time, the trick is to decide which will disappoint us the least and vote for them.

well said 🙂 

[Malc1]

Just now we’re at 

440,123     Petition Signatures 

 

Malc 

 

[Malc1]

441,245. Signatures to the AGE. UK.  Petition 

Malc 

 

[Phil xxkr]

2 hours ago, Malc1 said:

441,245. Signatures to the AGE. UK.  Petition 

Malc 

 

On the radio this morning Dennis Reed from Silver Voices offered up a sensible trade-off re WFA. Only deny it to those paying higher rates of tax 🤔. Just might diffuse things. Then we shall see how many truly can do with out it. 🙂

[LenT]

10 minutes ago, Phil xxkr said:

Then we shall see how many truly can do with out it. 🙂

MrsT and I have always been in this fortunate position - and yet have always received it!

When it first arrived I contacted the Pensions Department and informed it that we don’t need it, save on the admin and send it to someone else.  If our circumstances changed, I would get back to it.

A protracted debate then ensued because the Civil Servants involved apparently couldn’t accommodate this request.  So rather than spend any more of our diminishing lifespan arguing the point, we just accept it with good grace and pass it on.

I’m much more concerned that the various personal arrangements we made to provide a modest but comfortable retirement after long working lives will be targeted by a Government now desperate to buy off those who funded it and who wish to impose their version of social equality and freedom.

As one pundit recently pointed out, the Labour Party has formed four Governments in its hundred year history.  All but one have ended with higher unemployment and a reduced economic situation than when it entered office - the exception being the very first because that only lasted seven months!

Unfortunately, it appears that this is a lesson that has to be relearnt  every couple of generations. 

[wharfhouse]

1 hour ago, Phil xxkr said:

On the radio this morning Dennis Reed from Silver Voices offered up a sensible trade-off re WFA. Only deny it to those paying higher rates of tax 🤔. Just might diffuse things. Then we shall see how many truly can do with out it. 🙂

That to me would have been the most sensible solution and if RR had done the right analysis first just maybe she would have come to the same conclusion in terms of what it would actually save - but of course she didn't and just made an unfounded change to the detriment of many. Given Liz Truss' short lived reign, what RR is doing is at least as bad if not worse - but in this case she is virtually unassailable unless enough Labour MPs got behind those already voicing their concerns but can't see that happening unfortunately... 

[Malc1]

441,928       signatures thus far

 

Malc

[Phil xxkr]

2 hours ago, LenT said:

MrsT and I have always been in this fortunate position - and yet have always received it!

When it first arrived I contacted the Pensions Department and informed it that we don’t need it, save on the admin and send it to someone else.  If our circumstances changed, I would get back to it.

A protracted debate then ensued because the Civil Servants involved apparently couldn’t accommodate this request.  So rather than spend any more of our diminishing lifespan arguing the point, we just accept it with good grace and pass it on.

I’m much more concerned that the various personal arrangements we made to provide a modest but comfortable retirement after long working lives will be targeted by a Government now desperate to buy off those who funded it and who wish to impose their version of social equality and freedom.

As one pundit recently pointed out, the Labour Party has formed four Governments in its hundred year history.  All but one have ended with higher unemployment and a reduced economic situation than when it entered office - the exception being the very first because that only lasted seven months!

Unfortunately, it appears that this is a lesson that has to be relearnt  every couple of generations. 

Couldn’t agree more! 

[Phil xxkr]

2 hours ago, LenT said:

MrsT and I have always been in this fortunate position - and yet have always received it!

When it first arrived I contacted the Pensions Department and informed it that we don’t need it, save on the admin and send it to someone else.  If our circumstances changed, I would get back to it.

A protracted debate then ensued because the Civil Servants involved apparently couldn’t accommodate this request.  So rather than spend any more of our diminishing lifespan arguing the point, we just accept it with good grace and pass it on.

I’m much more concerned that the various personal arrangements we made to provide a modest but comfortable retirement after long working lives will be targeted by a Government now desperate to buy off those who funded it and who wish to impose their version of social equality and freedom.

As one pundit recently pointed out, the Labour Party has formed four Governments in its hundred year history.  All but one have ended with higher unemployment and a reduced economic situation than when it entered office - the exception being the very first because that only lasted seven months!

Unfortunately, it appears that this is a lesson that has to be relearnt  every couple of generations. 

Len I think you must have experienced a "senior moment" 😂. Trying to return the WFA is tantamount to you implying that they were wrong in giving it to you in the first place - heaven forfend

As I mentioned in a previous post withdrawing of the WFA  is not about saving money it's about means testing as a principle across all "benefits". So we are now in this bizarre situation of having to qualify to receive any State largesse, the State Pension being one of them. If you don't then over time all your assets will be drained away until you do qualify and hence becoming a vassal of the State and one of them. Like you I am fortunate to have come from an era where aspirations, ambitions and above all self-sufficiency were encouraged traits and characteristics. But I fear these are no longer too be admired but admonished as not representing todays anti-evolutionary stance of equality, fairness, diversity etc. as they pursue their la-la land entropic views of how the world should be run. 🙁

[ROYT]

Strange they have to rob pensioners, can't pay doctors but they can afford £6m plus a day for  illegal immigrants

in centrally heated and probably air conditioned hotels.

 

 

 

[Malc1]

It’s quite clear, to me anyway, that OAPs have little positive value to this Govt , indeed the sooner they’re shot of us the better it will be for Rachel Reeves Black Hole elimination ……. DWP payments would significantly diminish and Sir Keir’s financial problems would somewhat evaporate …….. or indeed enable  more funds to pay the Civil Servants and other State Payroll beneficiaries 

I'm being cynical I guess BUT that’s the way I’m feeling …….. it’s just disgraceful that many many 000s of those OAPs less fortunate than us here might really have to make the choice between heating or eating this winter 

As I’ve said before here ….

SHAME ON YOU   SHAME ON YOU     Sir Keir Starmer 

there will be many unnecessary deaths placed firmly at your door this winter 

 

Malc 

[First_Lexus]

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/are-labour-about-to-u-turn-on-the-winter-fuel-payment/

Starmer is fast discovering what we all knew. Government is difficult, and a big majority comes with its own challenges. Labour will usually prioritise the ‘young’ over the ‘elderly’ as it knows more of its support is likely to come from younger (less experienced and more naive?) voters.

The choice has been made. Public sector pay increases at the expense of the Winter Fuel Allowance. It’s a clear decision point, and one which I feel they’ll live to regret. They are, after all, only the ‘current’ Government…

[LenT]

2 hours ago, Malc1 said:

it’s just disgraceful that many many 000s of those OAPs less fortunate than us here might really have to make the choice between heating or eating this winter 

So right, Malcolm.  It’s astonishing that having spent a substantial period of time as the Shadow Minister, the first decision that Reeves makes appears to be so flawed.  Unfortunately, it highlights the general lack of expertise on the new Front Bench.

For example, have any of them actually run a successful business in a competitive market?  Certainly not the boy Streeting, now in charge of the NHS - the UK’s largest employer and currently the world’s fifth largest, just ahead of amazon! 

Apart from that omission, quite how studying History as opposed to, say, science or medicine, is considered an appropriate knowledge base I have yet to hear him explain.

[Phil xxkr]

53 minutes ago, LenT said:

So right, Malcolm.  It’s astonishing that having spent a substantial period of time as the Shadow Minister, the first decision that Reeves makes appears to be so flawed.  Unfortunately, it highlights the general lack of expertise on the new Front Bench.

For example, have any of them actually run a successful business in a competitive market?  Certainly not the boy Streeting, now in charge of the NHS - the UK’s largest employer and currently the world’s fifth largest, just ahead of Amazon! 

Apart from that omission, quite how studying History as opposed to, say, science or medicine, is considered an appropriate knowledge base I have yet to hear him explain.

I thought that the idea of learning from history was to not repeat the mistakes of the past. Clearly I was misguided 😊

[Malc1]

AGE. UK.  Petition 
 

443,318.     have signed the Petition 

Malc 

[Kevin Williams]

[LenT]

26 minutes ago, Kevin Williams said:

Who wrote this?

I support the sentiment.  The new Government has yet to demonstrate that it has an effective solution to a problem that bedevilled the previous administration.

But the grammar….not so much. 

[Malc1]

AGE UK   Petition

 

443,656     ..signatories just now   ............. 

 

................. keep 'em coming everyone ........... and with Ra Rah .... Rachel  Reeves not having ( clearly, properly )  done her Impact Assessment on OAPs  and Sir Kier  Starmer her boss man in overall charge of this debacle blaming everyone else it seems .............. 

 

Malc

[First_Lexus]

15 hours ago, LenT said:

For example, have any of them actually run a successful business in a competitive market?  Certainly not the boy Streeting, now in charge of the NHS - the UK’s largest employer and currently the world’s fifth largest, just ahead of Amazon! 

Apart from that omission, quite how studying History as opposed to, say, science or medicine, is considered an appropriate knowledge base I have yet to hear him explain.

I think it’s less about the subject studied and more about a lack of ‘real’ life experience prior to politics. Too many of those that rise to Cabinet (on all sides) have trodden the same path, ie University, involvement in student politics, followed by a ‘job’ with either an arms length public body, party body, charity or similar. From there they become a PPC and then into Parliament. Thus they are seemingly ‘groomed’ for their political career without ever having ‘lived life.’ There are exceptions - Angela Rayner being a notable one - but then again I’m not too keen on her either! 😂

The days of MPs having a career BEFORE public service seem to have long since gone. Shame!

One other point. Has anybody noticed how many MPs go into office with ‘normal means’ but leave office seemingly quite wealthy? I wonder how that happens…😇🤔

[Scotlex]

14 minutes ago, First_Lexus said:

I think it’s less about the subject studied and more about a lack of ‘real’ life experience prior to politics. Too many of those that rise to Cabinet (on all sides) have trodden the same path, ie University, involvement in student politics, followed by a ‘job’ with either an arms length public body, party body, charity or similar. From there they become a PPC and then into Parliament. Thus they are seemingly ‘groomed’ for their political career without ever having ‘lived life.’ There are exceptions - Angela Rayner being a notable one - but then again I’m not too keen on her either! 😂

The days of MPs having a career BEFORE public service seem to have long since gone. Shame!

One other point. Has anybody noticed how many MPs go into office with ‘normal means’ but leave office seemingly quite wealthy? I wonder how that happens…😇🤔

Totally agree. Many of them have very little life experience.

Nicola Sturgeon couldn't even drive when she was in power 🙄

No wonder she thought that all the roads were fine 🙈