First car! Do you hand over keys?

[Vinay]

Hi everybody,

Thanks to the wealth of information on this forum, I finally built up the courage and bought my first car- a MY 2011 IS250 Advance.

Still reading through the manuals, and faffing with the key fob, and figuring out how the endless features and automation works on the car. Car has been parked mostly because of a lose bonnet cable now corrected. 

Was quoted £410 to update navigation and have bought an AC vent phone holder which has served me well. Have put updating the 12 year old maps on hold for now.

Have also booked the Nextbase home installation service for hardwiring the dash cams and want to check how do you experienced folk arrange access to the key for the electrician in such scenarios ?

Do you hand it to them, or would it be okay to be with the person 100% of the time while retaining access to the key while they install the dash cams? I might watch and learn for next time 😜.

I've booked the car with Lexus twice and didn't think much of using their checkin process and leaving the key with them.

Also, the manual states removing the mechanical key (after locking glovebox and trunk) before handing electronic fob over to the valet.

Will this not leave the key at risk of cloning?

The at home installation is stressing me out more than it should.

[J Henderson]

Welcome 🙂

Do you have 2 keys or just the one?

I'm sure you're worrying over nothing, but you could maybe put the key in the centre console and just watch the person whilst they work. Should only take about an hour at most.

£410 to update the maps? Sheesh, I would put that on hold indefinitely. When I first got my car I was told it would be circa £200 and I was loathe to pay that much.

Better off using free apps like Google maps or Waze.

[IS300FSPORT]

Just had a quick read over your message your hiring an electrician to hardwire a dashcam at your house?

Personally I wouldn't be worried you're hiring a tradesman from a reputable source to come & install it for you. Of course, there are always precautions you can take.

- Ask for ID & take a pic of it

- Any CCTV installed at your house or ringdoor bell capture the footage of them arriving date & time a pic from trom the window usually does the trick (make sure camera sound & flash is off ask your partner for assistance doing this) also get his reg plate. Have to be honest it is overkill but best play safe if your worried. 

- Politely ask him/her not to leave off your premise without the key

- Installing a dashcam with a permanent 12v feed power on will most likely leave your cars 12v Battery dead in a number of days if you're not using it frequently. Assuming your doing it so you have parking mode recording in the event of an impact whilst your not with the vehicle it is a handy feature, but ask the installer if there is an option to configure the power management for the camera so it stops recording when the Battery voltage drops below say a certain value 12.2 volts to avoid you from being stranded (no start condition). A new Battery is usually 12.6volts. If your not hardwiring the camera to the fusebox you really dont need an electrician.

Look on youtube how to fit a camera its a 30 min job at most route the cable from your 12v socket under the plastic trim/carpet upto the roof liner & stick it or suction mount on windscreen & your ready to go. If its a one channel camera thats job done. If its 2 channel you will need to route another lead from the front camera to the rear camera to stick on the rear windscreen. Adjust accordingly & configure on your mobile app specific for the camera.

- Google maps does the trick with live traffic updates & maps & its free dont bother with updating the cars map. Just purchase a *quality mobile phone charger & phone holder compatible with your mobile. 

- Focus your efforts on maintaining the car Tyres, brakes, battery  wipers, servicing, address if any advisory items from previous MOT test for peace of mind. 

IS250 for a first car impressive 👏 

I'd imagine it may be thirsty on petrol consumption.

& What is your insurance cost out of interest?

[Linas.P]

3 hours ago, Vinay said:

Hi everybody,

Thanks to the wealth of information on this forum, I finally built up the courage and bought my first car- a MY 2011 IS250 Advance.

Still reading through the manuals, and faffing with the key fob, and figuring out how the endless features and automation works on the car. Car has been parked mostly because of a lose bonnet cable now corrected. 

Was quoted £410 to update navigation and have bought an AC vent phone holder which has served me well. Have put updating the 12 year old maps on hold for now.

Have also booked the Nextbase home installation service for hardwiring the dash cams and want to check how do you experienced folk arrange access to the key for the electrician in such scenarios ?

Do you hand it to them, or would it be okay to be with the person 100% of the time while retaining access to the key while they install the dash cams? I might watch and learn for next time 😜.

I've booked the car with Lexus twice and didn't think much of using their checkin process and leaving the key with them.

Also, the manual states removing the mechanical key (after locking glovebox and trunk) before handing electronic fob over to the valet.

Will this not leave the key at risk of cloning?

The at home installation is stressing me out more than it should.

This is more for mk2 forum, but that is fine.

Do NOT update the maps, the sat-nav is horrible either way, for £410 you can get whole replacement unit with android auto (apple car play if referable) etc. which will freshen the car overall. Also I don't believe latest maps are even available on mk2 (2005-2012), I think last one was like 2018 or 2020, meaning you still going to have outdated maps, just not as much outdated. 

I probably would be fine giving the keys to electrician, because I assume it works for some company, so it is quite unlikely that he will steal your car. Optionally, you can simply unlock it for him and walk away - he will not need key for anything else.

When in valet mode you give electronic key, nor the metal one, so not sure what you mean by "key cloning" - you keep the metal one on your key chain presumably... on one hand it would not make it easier/harder to clone electronic key, because electronic key is not cloned, it is the signal that is intercepted when locking/unlicking the car, so having access to physical key makes no difference. Also cloning electronic key would only allow to unlock the doors, but not to start the car, so it is kind of useless, can't think of utility of that. As for making replacement key - one does not need your key, instead they need "virgin key" (which is like £600) and then they can program it to your car.

In short - giving the key with or without the metal part is as risky as valet parking inherently is. I mean yes - somebody can steal the key and with the key steal your car, that is inherent to valet parking.

24 minutes ago, IS300FSPORT said:

I'd imagine it may be thirsty on petrol consumption.

About as thirsty as any car with 208hp and 2.5L engine... in fact probably above average in that regard. 

[HighlandJohn]

11 hours ago, Linas.P said:

Also I don't believe latest maps are even available on mk2 (2005-2012), I think last one was like 2018 or 2020, meaning you still going to have outdated maps, just not as much outdated. 

I'm pretty sure my 2008 SE-L has the original satnav disc in it, would changing it for one from [say]2018/9 > 2020 be sufficient to get the updates to that year be OK? I did some reading and put off doing so for fear of 'bricking' the head unit which I understood could happen?

[Linas.P]

3 minutes ago, HighlandJohn said:

I'm pretty sure my 2008 SE-L has the original satnav disc in it, would changing it for one from [say]2018/9 > 2020 be sufficient to get the updates to that year be OK? I did some reading and put off doing so for fear of 'bricking' the head unit which I understood could happen?

I am not sure, because in my mind that is all not worth it, considering how outdated the sat-nav is and how much better is to simply used google maps. 

That said I know there is some final year for updates, it may be 2020. So that sat-nav is officially EOL and can't be updated anymore past that point.

If you using original disk meant for that unit, then no it should not brick it, and also if you put faulty DVD, then simply putting back the old one should resolve all the issue. The bricking is only the risk with newer HDD based sat-navs, not DVD ones.  

[HighlandJohn]

Many thanks.   Something to think about in the better weather.  

[ahmedali44]

I would do it myself or easy way is plug into cigarette lighter and sat nav update bit expensive . I updated mine in 2017 got from Germany and was v cheap dvd version for about £30 . Is urs dvd or sd card ?? As sd version more expensive 

[Linas.P]

31 minutes ago, ahmedali44 said:

 Is urs dvd or sd card ?? As sd version more expensive 

2011 will be SD card.

[ahmedali44]

Should try sat nav update website as I'm sure won't cost more then 60ish on USB version , if u go into sat nav menu will tell u which version ur nav is . Some 2011-2012 still take dvd depending on sat nav version as on eBay 30-40

[Vinay]

I've just collected the second key from the dealer today.

Relieved to know the fob can not be copied to switch on the ignition.

Looks like I'd stay downstairs with the car as the installation doesn't seem too complicated a task. Car's parked further down the road due to engineering works being carried out so no CCTV unfortunately.

Good idea about the auto cuto off to preserve Battery. Shall check with the electrician.

I'd be surprised if the annual mileage crosses the 3k mark.. guess we'll know in an year. Mostly for long drives in the summer. I find myself driving in "S" mode to limit to 3rd gear as I found the box too eager to upshift in "D" leading to less engine braking and using the brakes too often. Also higher gears are uncomfortable over speed humps. I'm light on the throttle as it's mostly 20mph near by.

Insurance is an arm and quarter of a leg but it was a very similar figure for any Mazda 3 pre 2019, Auris 1.6, or the old petrol Corolla.T I'm paying £100 more than a workmate with 4 years NCB who drives a honda CRV.  The quote for a petrol Yaris was barely less than for other cars. Hybrid cars (even Yaris, or is300h, Auris1.8) was triple the quoted figures for Mazda 3/IS250. I think it's the poverty tax of not having a garage to properly secure a catalytic converter.

My assumption was map navigation is HDD based as it I couldn't find any reference to DVDs for navigation on the console screen. Good to know the risks involved, and setting expectation that it'll not be the latest anyway. Really don't want to change the console if not needed - so hope Waze/ Google maps works well on longer journeys.

Thanks - the dealership cleared all MOT items so not too fussed. Comes with 1 year lexus warranty so will keep an eye out for the common culprits. Might get the brake pins greased later next month to avoid seizing. Perhaps wax the car too if the weather's nice over the weekend. 

I've been quoted more than £1300 for a 3 year service plan (1 major service) and 3 MOTs.  Will check with Toyota too if they can share a reasonable quote instead. Else, to the local independent it goes!

Also, thank you everyone for the warm welcome!

[Vinay]

5 hours ago, Linas.P said:

 

Sorry- just figured out I didn't use the quote feature right.

[Linas.P]

22 minutes ago, Vinay said:

I've just collected the second key from the dealer today.

Relieved to know the fob can not be copied to switch on the ignition.

Looks like I'd stay downstairs with the car as the installation doesn't seem too complicated a task. Car's parked further down the road due to engineering works being carried out so no CCTV unfortunately.

Good idea about the auto cuto off to preserve battery. Shall check with the electrician.

I'd be surprised if the annual mileage crosses the 3k mark.. guess we'll know in an year. Mostly for long drives in the summer. I find myself driving in "S" mode to limit to 3rd gear as I found the box too eager to upshift in "D" leading to less engine braking and using the brakes too often. Also higher gears are uncomfortable over speed humps. I'm light on the throttle as it's mostly 20mph near by.

Insurance is an arm and quarter of a leg but it was a very similar figure for any Mazda 3 pre 2019, Auris 1.6, or the old petrol Corolla.T I'm paying £100 more than a workmate with 4 years NCB who drives a honda CRV.  The quote for a petrol Yaris was barely less than for other cars. Hybrid cars (even Yaris, or is300h, Auris1.8) was triple the quoted figures for Mazda 3/IS250. I think it's the poverty tax of not having a garage to properly secure a catalytic converter.

My assumption was map navigation is HDD based as it I couldn't find any reference to DVDs for navigation on the console screen. Good to know the risks involved, and setting expectation that it'll not be the latest anyway. Really don't want to change the console if not needed - so hope Waze/ Google maps works well on longer journeys.

Thanks - the dealership cleared all MOT items so not too fussed. Comes with 1 year lexus warranty so will keep an eye out for the common culprits. Might get the brake pins greased later next month to avoid seizing. Perhaps wax the car too if the weather's nice over the weekend. 

I've been quoted more than £1300 for a 3 year service plan (1 major service) and 3 MOTs.  Will check with Toyota too if they can share a reasonable quote instead. Else, to the local independent it goes!

Also, thank you everyone for the warm welcome!

Any decent dashcam kit should have Battery "protector"...

It doesn't really matter what mileage you are doing, but if you don't drive at least for 15-20 minutes every other week, then Battery will die eventually. Nothing really new - 3/4 weeks and they get low on charge and if you do it repeatedly then batteries ten to die.

I wouldn't use S-mod or bother changing gears, you will get used to it. I was about to say you can downshift from D in facelift, but that is only on F-Sport if memory serves Advance does not have paddle-shifters (although they could be retrofitted).

Also Toyota does not do service any cheaper than Lexus. Sadly nowadays there are no Essential Service and I see why people don't see value servicing 12 years old car in Lexus... as it is really too much when you don't get warranty included. As long as you service it once a year and ideally after no more than 5000-6000miles it should be fine. 

[LenT]

 

20 hours ago, Vinay said:

Still reading through the manuals,

An excellent start!  

20 minutes ago, Vinay said:

Good idea about the auto cuto off to preserve battery. Shall check with the electrician.

I fitted my BlackVue camera with their Power Magic Pro - a device that connects the camera to the Battery and supplies power when the ignition is off.  It monitors the Battery charge so that if it drops below a pre-set level, it disconnects the camera to preserve the Battery.  Most good cameras will offer a similar system.

https://blackvue.co.uk/products/power-magic-pro/

20 hours ago, Vinay said:

Was quoted £410 to update navigation

Waste of money.  I would agree with Linas about that.  It’s an inefficient and clunky system at the best of times.  I don’t think Lexus support the system any more anyway.  I once contacted an independent that claimed to offer an SD update - they failed to respond to two emails, so I gave up on them.  In fact I use my far superior Garmin system and others rely on very efficient apps on their smart phones.

Quite why a company that can source Mark Levinson audio can’t buy in a decent satnav is one of Life’s automotive mysteries.

[LenT]

38 minutes ago, Vinay said:

I’ve been quoted more than £1300 for a 3 year service plan (1 major service) and 3 MOTs.  Will check with Toyota too if they can share a reasonable quote instead. Else, to the local independent it goes!

Doesn’t the Service Plan also include Intermediate Services?  Servicing is either done on a mileage basis or annually, after all.  Your Service Plan also protects you from any price increases over the three year period.

Logically, a car doesn’t really get cheaper to maintain as it gets older.  In many cases it’s quite the reverse - it’s just that owners spend less because it’s equated to the diminishing value of the car.

Of course a good local independent may be just as competent, although may lack the Lexus support material, tooling and information.  This may be less significant for an older car. 

[Vinay]

2 hours ago, LenT said:

Doesn’t the Service Plan also include Intermediate Services?

That's correct - 2 intermediate and 1 major service.

2 hours ago, LenT said:

Logically, a car doesn’t really get cheaper to maintain as it gets older. 

True- I'd request quotes from other Lexus dealers nearby too for comparison. My car is still new 😜.

[LenT]

8 hours ago, Vinay said:

That's correct - 2 intermediate and 1 major service.

Well - and this my personal opinion - if I’ve understood you correctly, that’s £1300 for 1 main and 2 intermediate services, plus 3 MOTs, by Lexus-trained mechanics using Lexus approved parts. All guaranteed by Lexus and at a fixed price for three years.

That sounds like a reasonable deal to me.  In fact it sounds so reasonable that I have been on just such a three year deal, renewed every three years, with Lexus MK ever since I bought my car from them.  In return I feel that the Dealer reciprocates my commitment to them and responds with an excellent level of service. 

But that’s just my personal experience!  😊

[Linas.P]

5 hours ago, LenT said:

Well - and this my personal opinion - if I’ve understood you correctly, that’s £1300 for 1 main and 2 intermediate services, plus 3 MOTs, by Lexus-trained mechanics using Lexus approved parts. All guaranteed by Lexus and at a fixed price for three years.

That sounds like a reasonable deal to me.  In fact it sounds so reasonable that I have been on just such a three year deal, renewed every three years, with Lexus MK ever since I bought my car from them.  In return I feel that the Dealer reciprocates my commitment to them and responds with an excellent level of service. 

But that’s just my personal experience!  😊

Yes, but that was in 2021 on 2015 car, meaning it gives you Lexus Relax warranty. At that point I agree - it is totally worth it.

This is on 2011 in 2024, no Lexus Relax included. In short it was £1,300 service plan on 6 years old car that is worth £12,000+warranty vs. £1,300 on 13 years old car worth £6,000 and no warranty.

Honestly, the main problem is that Lexus discontinued Essential Care, because I remember having 2 year service plans for £500 (£180+£320). That makes perfect sense and in fact independent service probably would cost just as much. The service plan only makes sense when warranty is included in it, else it is certainly too expensive for cars over 10 years old.

Also Lexus "approved" parts is questionable. Any parts are always at extra cost, except of things like air filters and oil filters, so yes they use Lexus parts, but you have to pay for them so I just can't see how is that benefit. You may as well buy the parts at 30% of the cost from US or UAE and bring them to your independent?

[J Henderson]

4 hours ago, Linas.P said:

You may as well buy the parts at 30% of the cost from US or UAE and bring them to your independent?

Good advice, but before ordering anything, you'll have to make sure you have an independent garage that is willing to fit customer-supplied parts. Many will refuse to do so.

 

[Mr Vlad]

What a bone of contention getting an 'old' car serviced at its main dealership. 

Personally speaking I will Always take a Lexus to Lexus for its servicing and MOT. It's because I was loyal to Lexus Stockport that they gave me a new UX250H free of charge for FOUR days when they replaced the faulty alternator on my beloved is250. 

To you sceptics. Would your independent do that? I doubt very very very much they would. 

Simple thing is. You Get What You Pay For.

Pay peanuts you get monkeys working on your car. 

As for installing a dash cam into a car. Unless one is unfortunately disabled then why can't one fit it ones self?

[Linas.P]

3 minutes ago, J Henderson said:

Good advice, but before ordering anything, you'll have to make sure you have an independent garage that is willing to fit customer-supplied parts. Many will refuse to do so.

Never had that issue with independent garages. Dealers and chains don't take parts from outside, but as far as I am concerned - all independent garages takes parts from outside, but then they say "warranty for work only" and that is fair. 

3 minutes ago, Mr Vlad said:

Simple thing is. You Get What You Pay For.

Pay peanuts you get monkeys working on your car. 

I have found plenty of monkeys working in Lexus as well. I can't say I was really impressed with any particular service with Lexus. It was alright, but nothing more.

Courtesy car is nice and independent garages I use don't offer this at all, but if the difference is 60% in price, then I can deal with that.

The problem with Lexus in particular is that there are very very few independents that know the cars, so normal service - oils and filters... fine, but anything more than that is trouble. 

I used to take Lexus only to Lexus, and I probably will still do this going forward. I mean I took my £1000 GS300 to Lexus last time and it was £280 for minor service, so not exactly good value... and service was alright. I mean sure I can afford it and I like convenience, but I can see how it is actually TERRIBLE value for money and why people would say "nah... I am good". 

Because here is the thing - once car is 10 years old, the dealer service adds no value. I have serviced my old IS250 in Lexus all the way to 200k (I think last service was 186,000) and when it got written-off I got it valued ~£4,000, it would have been £4,000 either way, with service history and in perfect condition or with no service history and in crap condition. Obviously, bear in mind - that was done back in the day when "Essential Case" was the thing, so I actually not spent anything extra, I would even doubt it was possible to get it done cheaper than what I paid at Lexus, but those times are long gone.

[Bluemarlin]

Whilst I agree with most of what you say (Linas) although I take my 13 year old car to Lexus. For me, at that age the value comes not from the service itself, but the fact that it's required to maintain the 10 yr plus warranty.

[Linas.P]

On 2/23/2024 at 3:31 PM, Bluemarlin said:

Whilst I agree with most of what you say (Linas) although I take my 13 year old car to Lexus. For me, at that age the value comes not from the service itself, but the fact that it's required to maintain the 10 yr plus warranty.

You mean to maintain hybrid warranty? 

Yes that is is correct, but now imagine if you had non-hybrid without any warranty. Would it still be worth it?

[Bluemarlin]

On 2/25/2024 at 7:05 PM, Linas.P said:

You mean to maintain hybrid warranty? 

Yes that is is correct, but now imagine if you had non-hybrid without any warranty. Would it still be worth it?

No, I mean the Lexus 10 year plus extended warranty, that can be bought for all cars, and requires servicing by Lexus.

[H3XME]

26 minutes ago, Bluemarlin said:

No, I mean the Lexus 10 year plus extended warranty, that can be bought for all cars, and requires servicing by Lexus.

No point taking it there if your car is older though is what Linas is saying. Cars 2014 or newer can only take advantage of it now.