Lexus theft response

[beyond the blue]

A few months ago I contacted Lexus customer services to enquire if they had any plans to address the can-bus vulnerability of the ES. The reply was they had nothing in the pipeline at that moment. Last week I asked again to see if there was any update on their stance, before I shell out hundreds of pounds on secondary protection. This is their response I received today.

 

 

Lexus Customer Relations ref: CASE ******

Dear Mr *******

Thank you for your email regarding your Lexus ES Premium Edition.

I am sorry to advise that we do not centrally have any device or solutions that we can offer from Lexus to protect and prevent this type of can bus attack on the ES model.

From what we can see, The Lexus ES has been extremely low volume in attack thankfully and is not a highly targeted model. 

Whilst we do not directly manufacture second stage immobilisers, these are being requested by some insurance parties to enable policies and/or reduce premiums. 

It is widely reported to us by owners and in the press that these second stage immobilisers can be effective in preventing a vehicle from being started, even if a key was physically stolen and present.

We know that it would not prevent access into a vehicle however. Sadly, if a thief wishes to gain access to any vehicle, it is very difficult to prevent this.
 
Regrettably I do not have additional options or products from Lexus that I can provide. I can only apologise that I cannot offer a more positive response at this time and appreciate your contact and enquiry seeking to protect your vehicle and asset.

If I may assist you with anything else please do feel very welcome to let me know.

Kind regards

Toyota (GB) PLC - Lexus Division

[Spock66]

I read this as the person writing the response knows it's a pretty crap answer, but above their pay grade to do anything about it.

[george72]

Poor but a predictable response. I wonder what figures they are looking at? 

If they have a fix for the RX why not the ES? Surely the set up is the same

[LenT]

 

2 hours ago, beyond the blue said:

Regrettably I do not have additional options or products from Lexus that I can provide. I can only apologise that I cannot offer a more positive response at this time and appreciate your contact and enquiry seeking to protect your vehicle and asset.

Ironically, just to the right of this post was a puff for the ‘World Premier of the all-new Lexus LBX’ dated June 5, 2023.

The opening paragraph claims:

Lexus has a proud history of pushing boundaries and challenging the status quo. Since its founding in 1989, it has repeatedly pioneered new thinking and new products that have changed people’s perceptions and reshaped the luxury car market. It has constantly evolved the concept of what luxury means, not just by creating desirable and exciting products, but also by redefining the complete ownership experience.

Well, it would appear that Lexus is certainly continuing to redefine the complete ownership experience - but possibly not in the interests of their customers.  And suggesting that a customer should resort to aftermarket products to protect their investment is  certainly a new concept of what luxury means!

[ColinBarber]

1 hour ago, george72 said:

If they have a fix for the RX why not the ES?

Cynically, the ES hasn't made it into the top 10 most stolen list so bad publicity hasn't forced them.

[Guest]

Your response is similar to what I received when mine was stolen, no acknowledgment of any vulnerability and no solution even though they have one for the RX. I got mine back yesterday after 2 months being repaired, next Wednesday it’s being part exchanged against a Volvo. I have cancelled my service plan and will never touch a Lexus/ Toyota product again, I would probably have stayed with Lexus in the future but the complete difference in which they approached the RX and ES vulnerabilities sealed it for me, as has been mentioned the relatively small ES sales seems to make them think it’s not worth fixing. Well, whether you own an ES or a RX the problem is exactly the same, pity Lexus cannot see that.

[wewillnotbefobbedoff]

 

Edited January 5 by ColinBarber

[Navnan2]

12 hours ago, wewillnotbefobbedoff said:

 

I wonder why your post was edited Andy?

[ColinBarber]

1 hour ago, Navnan2 said:

I wonder why your post was edited Andy?

If you went to the linked post you would see why. We don't allow duplicated posts across multiple threads/forums.

[NICO1972]

Truly very disappointing, as my experience with 2 attempted thefts including poor action on trying to resolve this issue quickly has LED me to sell my car quickly. Now driving a very good Audi A6 Avant but keeping my SC430, which I still love driving by the way. Overall, my experience with Lexus has been a bit of a setback. I thought very highly of the brand but knowing that they will not be doing their best to keep existing customers reassured when they clearly have a serious weakness with the CANBUS system is hugely concerning.

[Boomer54]

40 minutes ago, NICO1972 said:

Truly very disappointing, as my experience with 2 attempted thefts including poor action on trying to resolve this issue quickly has led me to sell my car quickly. Now driving a very good Audi A6 Avant but keeping my SC430, which I still love driving by the way. Overall, my experience with Lexus has been a bit of a setback. I thought very highly of the brand but knowing that they will not be doing their best to keep existing customers reassured when they clearly have a serious weakness with the CANBUS system is hugely concerning.

But don't you think keeping the SC 430 is just a reminder of bad memories? Do you really want the burden of carrying that baggage around with you. I am always glad to help out others in alleviating stuff like this. Just feel free to reach out your hand for a little help in discarding that issue.😀

[NICO1972]

2 hours ago, Boomer54 said:

But don't you think keeping the SC 430 is just a reminder of bad memories? Do you really want the burden of carrying that baggage around with you. I am always glad to help out others in alleviating stuff like this. Just feel free to reach out your hand for a little help in discarding that issue.😀

Nice one, it actually helps me forget this problem so it is a keeper for sure!

[dutchie01]

How things have changed over time. The original LS400 was starting to sell in the states with 8000 units sold when two (2 )owners complained about the cruise control. They recalled all 8000 cars, called the owners when it would be convenient washed the car and filled to the max with petrol. Owners living over 100 mls away from a dealer were visited by an engineer to perform the recall. Compare that to todays reaction... Seems todays management is full of bean counters looking at spreadsheets instead of customers.

[Slucky]

The response by Lexus is pathetic and utter cow dung.

This is the reason I had to get rid of my much loved ES, after an attempted theft with a damaged side panel and headlight cable. When I took it to Lexus, the reps instantly recognised the damage and knew about it, without me saying anything.

I have a feeling the ES is slowing being discontinued and Lexus does not want to deal with all the theft problems, why spend money on an old horse when it can be used on new models.

[PDM]

1 hour ago, Slucky said:

The response by Lexus is pathetic and utter cow dung.

This is the reason I had to get rid of my much loved ES, after an attempted theft with a damaged side panel and headlight cable. When I took it to Lexus, the reps instantly recognised the damage and knew about it, without me saying anything.

I have a feeling the ES is slowing being discontinued and Lexus does not want to deal with all the theft problems, why spend money on an old horse when it can be used on new models.

I am surprised that Lexus is so "relaxed" about the ES thefts:

https://media.lexus.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/3/pdf/Lexus-UK-Sales-Figures-December-End-of-year-2023.pdf

It seems 2023 was the best year yet for ES in the UK and is sold 1866 units, which is not far behind the new RX (sum up sales of plugin and non plugin versions) which is odd considering it's the launch year for gen 5 RX and one would expect sales to be high for a new release.

Paul

[ColinBarber]

25 minutes ago, PDM said:

which is odd considering it's the launch year for gen 5 RX and one would expect sales to be high for a new release.

The RX is a substantially more expensive vehicle so comparing sales is difficult and the new NX has definitely taken some of the RX sales. 
 

The RX theft issue is greater for Lexus because there are quite a few more on the road because it is all 2016 to 2022 RX vehicles affected rather than just 2019 to 2023 for the ES. SUVs are more desirable too. So theft numbers are higher and Lexus received bad publicity as a result. 

[PDM]

10 minutes ago, ColinBarber said:

The RX is a substantially more expensive vehicle so comparing sales is difficult and the new NX has definitely taken some of the RX sales. 
 

The RX theft issue is greater for Lexus because there are quite a few more on the road because it is all 2016 to 2022 RX vehicles affected rather than just 2019 to 2023 for the ES. SUVs are more desirable too. So theft numbers are higher and Lexus received bad publicity as a result. 

Agreed, Colin. I'm still surprised that they sold more gen 4 RX in 2022 (RX and RXL) than gen 5 (plug and no plug) in 2023. According to the data this was absolutely not the case when we moved from gen 3 to gen 4 (and the mk1 NX was already in the market for the RX gen 3 to gen 4 transition and the MK2 for the gen 4 to gen 5).  Perhaps there were some exceptional deals to be had on MY22 RX models at that time.

Cheers,

Paul

[Tickedon]

The figures are for Lexus registrations - I suspect part of the issue will also be the delays with supply, which wasn’t such an issue in pre-Covid years. Plenty of others may have ordered a new vehicle, like an RX, but until it’s delivered and registered it won’t show up in these kind of published figures. 

[PDM]

3 hours ago, Tickedon said:

The figures are for Lexus registrations - I suspect part of the issue will also be the delays with supply, which wasn’t such an issue in pre-Covid years. Plenty of others may have ordered a new vehicle, like an RX, but until it’s delivered and registered it won’t show up in these kind of published figures. 

It will be interesting to see it evolve in 2024.

Paul

[mister_johnn]

This reply from Lexus gets me  ... they had quite a few chances of advising me (or anyone else) about theft rising on these models, they are aware, but obviously will never admit it. I wish there was a way to find all the people affected (Lexus and Toyota) and take them to court...

Almost 2 months later I'm still waiting for a settlement payment which made me lose about £8.500 in 1 year of ownership, plus the fact that the insurance doesn't cover extra costs... a week before the car was stolen I did a full service, tires, wipers, MOT... costing almost £1.500... so yes, almost 10k down... plus when I purchased the car I was "lucky" to buy it almost 4.4k under the market value (according to Autotrader)... Plus my insurance premium will be up for the next 5 years... 😠

Sorry for the rant, but felt the need to say it...

[talaipwros]

16 hours ago, PDM said:

Agreed, Colin. I'm still surprised that they sold more gen 4 RX in 2022 (RX and RXL) than gen 5 (plug and no plug) in 2023. According to the data this was absolutely not the case when we moved from gen 3 to gen 4 (and the mk1 NX was already in the market for the RX gen 3 to gen 4 transition and the MK2 for the gen 4 to gen 5).  Perhaps there were some exceptional deals to be had on MY22 RX models at that time.

Cheers,

Paul

Some of us wanted the V6

[PDM]

1 hour ago, talaipwros said:

Some of us wanted the V6

Yeap - that was my reason too!

Paul

[Spark plug]

My first cars were not provided with alarms and fancy electronic locking by the makers you had to fit your own after-market alarms and immobilizers back then. They had simple locks and were easy to steal and the makers didn't want to know. I still use a Disclock on the steering wheel as a visible deterrent...

[Slucky]

The ES is based on the same platform as the Toyota Avalon and Camry, and the Avalon has now been discontinued. The ES and Avalon share a similar timeline. So wouldn't be surprised, if the ES was retired. Whereas the Camry is now been updated to the 2025 Camry and share all the similar designs to the new Prius - https://www.toyota.com/upcoming-vehicles/camry/

So why is there no ES 2025? The ES 2024 has nothing new to offer. 

 

[Tickedon]

2 hours ago, Slucky said:

The ES is based on the same platform as the Toyota Avalon and Camry, and the Avalon has now been discontinued. The ES and Avalon share a similar timeline. So wouldn't be surprised, if the ES was retired. Whereas the Camry is now been updated to the 2025 Camry and share all the similar designs to the new Prius - https://www.toyota.com/upcoming-vehicles/camry/

So why is there no ES 2025? The ES 2024 has nothing new to offer. 

 

That Camry could almost be a Lexus… one nice looking car and interior!