The dealership called, they expect me to buy a new Lexus 🤷

e-yes · December 10, 2023

Hi,

I have had my ES for three years now. The finance term ends July next year and the very same gentleman who did the handover in January 2021 called me up this Friday and inquired what I wanted to do.

No complaints with the car so far. Had that exceptional warranty claim which I think the dealership was very supportive with and was handled without much fuss.

Exceptional warranty ? because the warranty repair costed Lexus around £8000.00 and keeping that in mind.. I would say, I am happy with the way it was handled and would not mind giving more business to the same dealership.

Just thinking out loud here...

What concerns me is the very real risk of theft. Currently I do have a way to park my car in a way that the front left side is left inaccessible. However we no longer have the Honda Jazz which we used to "block the ES" in the driveway for additional detriment.
If I got another ES, I am not 100% sure all the kinks with the new infotainment and electronics have been ironed out as yet. Happy to see that all the physical controls have been retained though.
If I got another ES, the theft risk is still there.
I am not fussed about number plates and don't fancy getting a cherished one, however I quite like the number plate I got with my current ES. Don't think I will be able to retain that number plate.
Can't guess which way the cost of financing will go in 2025 and beyond. Signing up for a new finance contract in 2024 only to see better rates after the purchase will cause buyers' remorse 😕
IMO, the point of buying a Lexus is to pay it off asap, take good care of it and drive it till the wheels fall off.

I have asked for a test drive of the NX 350h though. Will see how it goes.

--E

Dippo · December 10, 2023

I think you can retain any number plate - as long as the DVLA can make money out of it, they're not bothered what the registration is.

RONNIE W HODGEKINSON · December 10, 2023

34 minutes ago, Dippo said:

I think you can retain any number plate - as long as the DVLA can make money out of it, they're not bothered what the registration is.

ABSOLUTELY..!!!

Cs150 · December 10, 2023

A personal decision of course on if getting a new one is appropriate. Based on my recent interaction with multiple Lexus dealers I got the impression sales are quite poor and they are desperate for business. Whilst this time of year is not good for the trade I sensed an air of desperation from some of them. The theft risk must be having a negative impact on business.

talaipwros · December 10, 2023

4 minutes ago, Cs150 said:

A personal decision of course on if getting a new one is appropriate. Based on my recent interaction with multiple Lexus dealers I got the impression sales are quite poor and they are desperate for business. Whilst this time of year is not good for the trade I sensed an air of desperation from some of them. The theft risk must be having a negative impact on business.

yeah, they gave me a call if I want to swap mine for a new one. Good grief, I just bought it guys.

Ken R · December 10, 2023

I have had my NX450h for 21 months on a 36 month deal and Lexus finance has been in contact with me to change/upgrade. Will give it some thought although interest rates at present make it less attractive.

eightk · December 10, 2023

3 hours ago, e-yes said:

What concerns me is the very real risk of theft. Currently I do have a way to park my car in a way that the front left side is left inaccessible. However we no longer have the Honda Jazz which we used to "block the ES" in the driveway for additional detriment.

If I got another ES, the theft risk is still there.

I’d have a conversation with the dealer specifically mentioning the theft weakness being your major sticking point as per your list above. Then test drive the NX - and if that’s got the same canbus problems…

malcolmw · December 10, 2023

If you are thinking of an NX350h, this has a totally different software arrangement than previous models which should stop CANBUS attacks. As a sort of proof, our insurance company gave us a refund of premium after we changed from the previous NX300h.

BTW, I should have thought with the new percentage sales of ZEVs required in 2024 and Toyota not having many to offer, they would be trying to shift as many ICE or hybrids as they can now and then stop marketing them next year to improve their overall EV percentage.

RONNIE W HODGEKINSON · December 11, 2023

10 hours ago, Ken R said:

I have had my NX450h for 21 months on a 36 month deal and Lexus finance has been in contact with me to change/upgrade. Will give it some thought although interest rates at present make it less attractive.

Gosh.. Had a look at the UX 250 When i was in the Dealership Ken And Really Liked It Only Negative Thing I Could say Was That the Back seating Was Quite Tight and The Boot Space limited but Apart from that Ken.. Really liked the Car...One thing ..i,m sold on Lexus Cars..!!!! Just love My NX.......

Ken R · December 11, 2023

4 hours ago, RONNIE W HODGEKINSON said:

Gosh.. Had a look at the UX 250 When i was in the Dealership Ken And Really Liked It Only Negative Thing I Could say Was That the Back seating Was Quite Tight and The Boot Space limited but Apart from that Ken.. Really liked the Car...One thing ..i,m sold on Lexus Cars..!!!! Just love My NX.......

I've looked at and driven the UX. Very impressed but agree with you Ronnie I'm terms of the rear seat space. My main concern was lack of boot space but other than that it's a car to be considered in the future.

Tickedon · December 11, 2023

Based on SMMT data, Lexus year to date registration figures for the UK are up 58% (to November). Toyota is up 7%. The Lexus figures for 2023 should be similar to 2019 (last pre-Covid year), but are already higher than any year in the last decade plus other than 2019 (you have to go back to 2006/2007 to see higher registrations).

That said, does look like there has been a slow down in retail sales across the industry (fleet sales have been propping up the figures for most manufacturers ) so perhaps not surprising your sales contact is trying to drum up more business.

Given that all current model years of the ES (based on Openpilot compatibility) don’t seem to have an encrypted canbus and so are more vulnerable than most cars to theft, I also wouldn’t be looking to purchase (another) one.

The new NX is lovely, doesn’t have a vulnerable canbus (touch wood), but like you I tend to run my cars for 5-7 years and so seems early to trade it in - but perhaps not given the canbus and potentiall theft situation. Dealers do seem to have quite a few nearly new NX 350h and 450h+ cars to shift at the moment - and so I suspect there are deals to be done if you’re not too picky on exact specifications and don’t want a brand new car…

Andy B · December 11, 2023

18 hours ago, Ken R said:

I have had my NX450h for 21 months on a 36 month deal and Lexus finance has been in contact with me to change/upgrade. Will give it some thought although interest rates at present make it less attractive.

Same here Ken - I have had my NX350h for just under 2 years on a 36 month PCP deal (so still 14 months to run). I've had 2 emails recently (one from Lexus Financial Services and one from Lexus UK itself) stating that as the end of my agreement is "on the horizon" (must be a faraway horizon 😉) I might be looking to change/upgrade. Anyway, I'm definitely not looking to change my car until the PCP deal ends, at the earliest. Furthermore at that point I might reluctantly look at other brands if Lexus don't sort out all these theft vulnerability issues that exist currently.

Mincey · December 11, 2023

4 hours ago, Tickedon said:

Given that all current model years of the ES (based on Openpilot compatibility) don’t seem to have an encrypted canbus and so are more vulnerable than most cars to theft, I also wouldn’t be looking to purchase (another) one.

Isn't the latest model ok or have I missed something?

Tickedon · December 11, 2023

4 hours ago, Mincey said:

Isn't the latest model ok or have I missed something?

There seems to be a view if Openpilot works, it means it isn’t encrypted and thus vulnerable to theft via canbus. The ES 2023 went on the “not compatible, encrypted” list, but that assumption is now disputed based on Toyota’s own technical docs for MY23 which are in line with other unencrypted cars: https://github.com/commaai/openpilot/wiki/Toyota-Lexus

serbarry · December 11, 2023

I personally would not swap a 3 year-old car with a same but newer one. It would make sense to me to replace it with a different model though (NX?) especially if it is less vulnerable to theft. In general I would prefer to settle the payment as soon as possible and this is why I tend to keep a car for a long time rather than replacing it with a newer model after 3-4 years and keep paying it.

e-yes · January 8

I took the car in for service and MOT today. The dealership had arranged for an NX350h Takumi for the test drive / loan car.

Sadly, as lovely as it is the NX however doesn’t work for me. The seats even in the Takumi trim are not as comfortable as the ES with the extending thigh support.

And the ride is also a tad on the harsh side compared to the ES.. that although I think can be fixed with replacing the tyres with non RFT ones. The seats however cannot be upgraded any further from the highest Takumi trim. And the biggest hurdle… my wife didn’t like it at all ! and we were both quite happy to drive back home in the ES. She sat in the NX and didn’t even want to test drive it.

Other than the above mentioned issues, NX is I must say quite well appointed. The strange cruise control buttons need getting used to but not a deal breaker. Anyone who has had no experience with ES will be very impressed especially with the Takumi trim.

I guess I will look into Ghost and bollards.

—E

Gary H · January 9

A shame you didn't like the NX350h Takumi @e-yes - as that's exactly what I have! I'm pleasantly surprised they had one available to test drive as my dealer was unable to get any NX350h for majority of the 16 months I had to wait for mine... They did have an NX450h - but it was literally always out in use... So basically, the first time I'd experienced one out on the road was my own car...

I've never experienced the ES unfortunately but it's very much a car my eye was on if my circumstances were different.

Personally, I do like what I have but of course, it's each to their own. I've only had it four months but has already proven itself to be an excellent motorway cruiser. Well equipped and I personally find it comfortable (although I do see your point over the thigh support). Certainly more so than the UX250h it replaced...and that was decent for what it was.

e-yes · January 9

10 hours ago, Gary H said:

A shame you didn't like the NX350h Takumi @e-yes - as that's exactly what I have! I'm pleasantly surprised they had one available to test drive as my dealer was unable to get any NX350h for majority of the 16 months I had to wait for mine... They did have an NX450h - but it was literally always out in use... So basically, the first time I'd experienced one out on the road was my own car...

I've never experienced the ES unfortunately but it's very much a car my eye was on if my circumstances were different.

Personally, I do like what I have but of course, it's each to their own. I've only had it four months but has already proven itself to be an excellent motorway cruiser. Well equipped and I personally find it comfortable (although I do see your point over the thigh support). Certainly more so than the UX250h it replaced...and that was decent for what it was.

The loan NX was a 73 reg, pretty much "fresh off the boat" unit as it had a mere 340 miles on the odometer ! My guess would be that I am probably amongst the first few who are getting to test drive that specific one.

It is certainly a lovely Lexus... other than the two things that glitched for me personally, I don't see why it won't sell well if Lexus could ship enough of them to UK. I would end up replacing the tyres to non RFTs after some time... that's all.

I have had the UX300e Takumi and UX250h F-Sport as loan cars and the 300e was quite plush (and heavy !) but certainly not better than the NX Takumi.

--E

January 9

On 12/10/2023 at 1:47 PM, e-yes said:

very real risk of theft. Currently I do have a way to park my car in a way that the front left side is left inaccessible. However we no longer have the Honda Jazz which we used to "block the ES" in the driveway for additional detriment.

Just some ideas on this, find a relay or fuse (somewhere inside the car easy to reach) and maybe remove that each time - then nobody can start it. Not ideal, but might work.

Get a proper good GPS tracker fitted as well, in case if it is fitted it can be tracked by the police? Might lower your insurance too.

LenT · January 9

1 hour ago, CT200NI said:

Just some ideas on this, find a relay or fuse (somewhere inside the car easy to reach) and maybe remove that each time - then nobody can start it. Not ideal, but might work.

A suggestion I’ve made a couple of times - which I believe achieves this - is to fit a ‘Kill Switch’. When I had a Lotus Elan it was a simple switch that broke the low tension lead to the distributor. I don’t know if this can be done with modern ignition systems.

But what I have seen is a ‘Kill Switch’ to the fuel pump. This achieves the same effect, in that the engine will churn over but fail to fire up. I can’t imagine that attacking the Canbus will reveal this cause - but I may be wrong!

Short of running through a spark/fuel diagnostic analysis - or calling out the AA - I can’t imagine the average chummy hanging around to sort out the problem!

This one video installation- others are available….

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