Letting my RCF go

Jon_B · November 13, 2023

Hi All,

It’s been a while since I posted on here. Sadly, it is time for me to part with my beautiful RCF and I wondered if anybody on here could give any guidance with a valuation to sell privately for a fantastic low mileage example.

The car was first registered in Jan 2015 and is finished in Azure Blue metallic with a black interior. Its only covered 20661 miles, 1 previous owner and with a complete Lexus service history and Lexus warranty (currently until next service due in Jan). Garaged whenever not in use.

The car has:

Mark Levinson sound system
TVD (Torque Vectoring Differential)
Sunroof
ACC (Adaptive Cruise Control)
PCS+ (Pre Collision System)
Quicksilver exhaust on the car (fitted by Lexus https://quicksilverexhausts.store/products/rc-f-inc-rc-f-carbon) but I also have the original exhaust.
RR Racing Intake System

Many thanks,

Jon.

Rob RCF · November 13, 2023

They can be difficult to sell privately, so you might need a bit of patience, especially considering the time of year.

Since it's a modified car you'll have to factor that into the price a bit. You'll probably get more money returning the car to stock and then selling the mods separately, but up to you.

The valuation is a bit tricky to say because there aren't many private sales. But you definitely want to be somewhere between the wholesale price and the retail price. The wholesale price is what a dealer would pay to buy your car off you - to find this out you can phone them up and ask if they would like to buy it. The retail price is what it would sell for, so basically the price shown on autotrader for similar dealership cars. The WBAC/motorway type valuation is also a "wholesale" price, although it will likely be lower than what a dealer would give you. Hope that makes sense somewhat.

Good luck with the sale. I sold mine a couple of months ago. Tried to sell privately at first, but ended up going to a dealer as I wanted to shift the car and frankly, it was just way more convenient.

Flytvr · November 13, 2023

1 hour ago, Rob RCF said:

They can be difficult to sell privately, so you might need a bit of patience, especially considering the time of year.

Since it's a modified car you'll have to factor that into the price a bit. You'll probably get more money returning the car to stock and then selling the mods separately, but up to you.

The valuation is a bit tricky to say because there aren't many private sales. But you definitely want to be somewhere between the wholesale price and the retail price. The wholesale price is what a dealer would pay to buy your car off you - to find this out you can phone them up and ask if they would like to buy it. The retail price is what it would sell for, so basically the price shown on autotrader for similar dealership cars. The WBAC/motorway type valuation is also a "wholesale" price, although it will likely be lower than what a dealer would give you. Hope that makes sense somewhat.

Good luck with the sale. I sold mine a couple of months ago. Tried to sell privately at first, but ended up going to a dealer as I wanted to shift the car and frankly, it was just way more convenient.

Agree with all this.

Depends on how quickly you need to sell it, but I’d be tempted to price it competitively. The market isn’t on the up by a long shot 😢

DamianLEX · November 13, 2023

Currently RCF market is the worst I have ever seen. So many good cars listed for £25k…

I would bet you get max £23k for yours at the moment. Maybe wait 3/4 months and hopefully get much better figure?

I cannot see any RCF sold in last 2 months and some of them dropped even £5k already:/

looks like market is looking for a bottom.

RadicalCoupe-Fuji · November 14, 2023

If you're in no rush, I'd hold on for 6 months. Even if the proces dont improve it will make showing & testing the car better & safer with lots more daylight & less wet roads.

Flytvr · November 14, 2023

Once again, agree with all that’s been said. All I will add, is that I don’t think the market has hit bottom…. nowhere near bottom yet. Maybe worth just Mororwaying it and sticking the money in a savings account. Then, sit and watch your money grow and the car market continue to fall. I’m tempted to do this myself.

Boomer54 · November 14, 2023

I suspect a lot will change when the BOE begin the process of reducing financing costs with their central bank rate. The effect of rising rates is like a giant size Hoover in that it sucks moneyflow from the majority of the economy and redirects it. The effect of course being to squeeze out demand and reduce inflation.

Cars are a type of asset albeit depreciating and thus they are affected like so many other assets. Best guess at this time is for rates to begin reducing during the course of next year so it might be wise if you can to defer making any sell decision. Although as I said it is a depreciating asset so there is also a cost to waiting. On balance though I probably would wait. Election year next year so the much vaunted BOE independence will get tested to the max by little guys running from Downing Street to Threadneedle Street saying " If you want to keep your job Rishi says get cutting".

GMB · November 14, 2023

42 minutes ago, Boomer54 said:

If you want to keep your job Rishi says get cutting".

Well, we are all up the creek now that the one of the authors of the tory cutbacks is back in the seat - Lard Cameron.

I more year of useless tory damage to everyone then a Labour government who will likely say that they cannot put it right quickly so it will take another 5 years of hardship.

We are all doomed - DOOMED!😮

Boomer54 · November 14, 2023

1 minute ago, GMB said:

Well, we are all up the creek now that the one of the authors of the tory cutbacks is back in the seat - Lard Cameron.

I more year of useless tory damage to everyone then a Labour government who will likely say that they cannot put it right quickly so it will take another 5 years of hardship.

We are all doomed - DOOMED!😮

Didn't really want to get into politics as in my opinion it's tainted ground for conversations that go bad quickly. I just made the point that people selling cars are affected by the current economic climate and that next year may change due to pressure from politicians in power at the top looking to keep a job.

Grey One · November 14, 2023

I don't think I'm adding any new input here, but my tuppence worth is to suggest that you consider the 'Marginal Utility' of keeping the car, and enjoying it, versus the cash in the bank if you sell it. If the wolf is at the door, then the cash is more important, but if you can afford to hold onto the car and enjoy it, rather than sell at a poor market price, that may be a better option at the moment....

PRT68 · November 14, 2023

Sadly, I think the tax rate of £675 is the main stumbling block to this age of vehicle.

I can afford to purchase one of these, but for the amount of times I would use it, the cost of tax per use is very high. That £675 is say £60 per month by direct debit. I use my RC300h once maybe twice per week, so in an F version that's £7.50 in tax alone per journey!

Looking on the Lexus sales site and Auto Trader, there are lots of 15/16 versions for sale, and no 17/18/19 models which come under the lower tax rate of £180. This can't be a coincidence.

I realise some may say if you can afford the car you can afford to run it, but many are looking at figures now, and in this case they don't compute.

I don't mean to come across as being rude, just stating facts unfortunately.

Boomer54 · November 14, 2023

18 minutes ago, PRT68 said:

Sadly, I think the tax rate of £675 is the main stumbling block to this age of vehicle.

I can afford to purchase one of these, but for the amount of times I would use it, the cost of tax per use is very high. That £675 is say £60 per month by direct debit. I use my RC300h once maybe twice per week, so in an F version that's £7.50 in tax alone per journey!

Looking on the Lexus sales site and Auto Trader, there are lots of 15/16 versions for sale, and no 17/18/19 models which come under the lower tax rate of £180. This can't be a coincidence.

I realise some may say if you can afford the car you can afford to run it, but many are looking at figures now, and in this case they don't compute.

I don't mean to come across as being rude, just stating facts unfortunately.

Not rude in the slightest. You have succinctly made a very valid point. Indeed, I deliberately bought a pre 2006 SC 430 knowing I would be dodging the higher road tax bullet. Sure you are right in suggesting it is a factor in play for these cars.

DamianLEX · November 14, 2023

1 hour ago, PRT68 said:

Sadly, I think the tax rate of £675 is the main stumbling block to this age of vehicle.

I can afford to purchase one of these, but for the amount of times I would use it, the cost of tax per use is very high. That £675 is say £60 per month by direct debit. I use my RC300h once maybe twice per week, so in an F version that's £7.50 in tax alone per journey!

Looking on the Lexus sales site and Auto Trader, there are lots of 15/16 versions for sale, and no 17/18/19 models which come under the lower tax rate of £180. This can't be a coincidence.

I realise some may say if you can afford the car you can afford to run it, but many are looking at figures now, and in this case they don't compute.

I don't mean to come across as being rude, just stating facts unfortunately.

I would agree with tax issue but there is one white RCF on AT for £27k 2017 £180 tax and none interested... Assuming this car is quite ok and can get relax warranty then 2015/2016 should be sold for £20k? It looks interesting to watch what happens next but not to sell atm.

GMB · November 14, 2023

The costs of owning a car like this have gone up a lot. Tax is actually £695 same as my IsF. Insurance the same if you are lucky. Major service the same plus a bit

. That equals 2 grand a year, a bit less for an interim service.

I am keeping mine. It has gone SORN for about 6 months to be reviewed in Spring.

On the insurance point, the modifications will add a substantial penalty too.

Keep it and enjoy it☺️

Jon_B · November 14, 2023

Nice to see you are still on here Dav @Flytvr, it’s been some time since I last saw you at Kemble.

Many thanks for all the comments and some very interesting points there. I do agree the new tax rate is a concern. My RCF has always been purely used for fun driving so more of a Sunday car you could say. I have only done 600 miles in the car since last January.

The modifications only added £30 to my insurance so no great concern there. I have done the usual of trying Carwow, Motorway and talked to Lexus and the lowest offer I have had is £25k from all of these. From what you are all saying on here, it may well be worth me taking this.

For me it’s a personal decision not financial, that said I still want to get the best price i can for the car. My 17-year-old daughter passed away unexpectantly 11 weeks ago whilst we were on a family holiday which has changed everything for me, and particularly what is important going forward. So, I thought I might let the car go and use the money to help my son who has just started his own business.

Thanks again for taking the time to get back to me with your thoughts.

GMB · November 14, 2023

21 minutes ago, Jon_B said:

The modifications only added £30 to my insurance so no great concern there

That's good news. I was quoted an extra £200 just for a bit of plastic stuck to the boot lid. I must have been speaking to the wrong companies. I did get round the issue about the rear spoiler but I won't bore you with the long fiasco getting it sorted.

Really sorry to hear about the personal issues. We lost our daughter too. It's a nightmare. Every sympathy from someone who knows what you are going through.

Linas.P · November 14, 2023

15 hours ago, DamianLEX said:

Currently RCF market is the worst I have ever seen. So many good cars listed for £25k…

I would bet you get max £23k for yours at the moment. Maybe wait 3/4 months and hopefully get much better figure?

I cannot see any RCF sold in last 2 months and some of them dropped even £5k already:/

looks like market is looking for a bottom.

Depends on time perspective, yes it is probably weakest in like 4 years -yes! But we forgetting how ridiculous were the priced during pandemic.

So it may be little bit down for many RC-F to be under £30k now, but it is not unusual at all, in 2016-2017 there were already RC-F for £25,000, bare in mind those where 3 year old cars back then, now they are 8 year old cars. The cheapest one I can remember was white on black basic model (meaning no-TVD, no-PCS, no-Sunroof) with £40k miles for £23,888 - that is in 2016 or maybe 2017! There was another white with sunroof and red seats for £24,000 with 36k miles, I should have taken screenshots really as it is hard to prove now. And the prices were around this point (£25-30k) between 2016 and 2019, then pandemic kicked in and suddenly all RC-Fs become £32,000+ (except one Cat-N that was lingering for a while at £16,000-£19,000 price point with very horrible repair job, I even considered PX-in my RC200t for it with RC-F owner paying some money to me, but ended-up deciding against such foolish move).

That said I agree on perspective - it seems that pandemic craze is going away and cars will start depreciating again, or have already started catching-up with were they should be.

Note as well that IS-F at this stage in their life (~8 years old) were already getting close to £10,000... the nicer ones where like £14,000-£16,000. So if RC-F were to catch-up with depreciation levels it mean to have had if not for pandemic, then the prices could really look bleak for current owners looking to sell.

Linas.P · November 14, 2023

20 hours ago, Jon_B said:

Hi All,

It’s been a while since I posted on here. Sadly, it is time for me to part with my beautiful RCF and I wondered if anybody on here could give any guidance with a valuation to sell privately for a fantastic low mileage example.

The car was first registered in Jan 2015 and is finished in Azure Blue metallic with a black interior. Its only covered 20661 miles, 1 previous owner and with a complete Lexus service history and Lexus warranty (currently until next service due in Jan). Garaged whenever not in use.

The car has:

Mark Levinson sound system

TVD (Torque Vectoring Differential)

Sunroof

ACC (Adaptive Cruise Control)

PCS+ (Pre Collision System)

Quicksilver exhaust on the car (fitted by Lexus https://quicksilverexhausts.store/products/rc-f-inc-rc-f-carbon) but I also have the original exhaust.

RR Racing Intake System

Many thanks,

Jon.

Beautiful car and seems to be fully loaded, can't really tell you how much you should ask for, but if you not in the rush, then just buy the highest cost package from Auto-traded (it is £60-80 if memory serves), list it there and forget about it (it allows you unlimited number of re-lists). Cars like this will take some time to sell privately. I was selling my RC200t which I would argue is even less desirable, but the car had every option, had full dealer history, was detailed and kept in the garage under the cover and I didn't budge at all on price. I bought it just pre-pandemic December 2019 form Lexus for £15,500, I have listed it for £19,000 and after 8 months guy came and picked-it up for £19,000... I think all he got from me was 80% full tank and keychain. When cars have all options and are in great condition there is no basis to negotiate the price, I literally said to few buyers "I will not negotiate over the phone, come, see the car if you find any imperfection then we can negotiate", the first guy that came could not find any issue, measured paint thickness etc. All was perfect. He was the only one who came and he bought the car. My car had 54,000 miles, but bear in mind this was the middle of pandemic and the highest price point ever. I have seen he tried to sell the car again last year for £20,000 and it sold, I just doubt it sold for £20,000 as the prices were already on the way down.

Your car with 20k miles and all option should not have issues selling and I doubt there is anything to pick-on, just some time to wait for the right buyer.

MNMJ · November 14, 2023

Auctions give a clue about the market:

RCF Carbon sold at auction through Collecting Cars. 71,000 miles

3 Nov. £21,750 winning bid, plus £1566 buyers fee (7.2%) on top = £23,316

https://collectingcars.com/for-sale/2015-lexus-rc-f-500-carbon-edition

It will be interesting to see if this arrives at a dealer.

Rob RCF · November 14, 2023

18 hours ago, DamianLEX said:

I cannot see any RCF sold in last 2 months and some of them dropped even £5k already:/

My former car ~~appears to have sold. No longer on AT and showing as taxed. It was up for £36k iirc.~~

Scratch that! It's back on AT, but the price has been reduced by £2.5k in 2 months. Quite a sudden change!

7 hours ago, PRT68 said:

Sadly, I think the tax rate of £675 is the main stumbling block to this age of vehicle.

This was one of the main things that put me off honestly, and the fact that it seems to increase every year. Meanwhile if I had bought a 1 year newer (2017) car I would only be paying £180!