RX450h now 2nd most stolen car in UK

[Tickedon]

3 hours ago, Lex loafer said:

I was quite clear: the most stolen cars in 2023. Not a Lexus on the list. 
 

 

Yes, for the specific 12 month period you’ve chosen. But you also said “No Lexus to be seen, the truth is out there” - and indeed it is, where Lexus cars do feature on the top 10 list depending on exactly which 12 month period the figures cover!

[larryadler]

Justo turn this subject on it head, anyone had their RX stolen and got it back, and if recovered what state was it in?
If not recovered, did the insurance payout meet your expectations?
We are all aware that the Police today only issue a crime number, and tough luck old pal, but does anyone know of a police prosecution for the scumbags nicking our pride and joy?
 

[GMB]

14 hours ago, larryadler said:

We are all aware that the Police today only issue a crime number, and tough luck old pal, but does anyone know of a police prosecution for the scumbags nicking our pride and joy?

What's a Police? There are no Police. The only time I had to ring a police station I was told there was no-one available. ( It was to report thieves in the act of stealing a neighbour's car - the thieves were there 15 minutes and just took it away ). Sad isn't it.

BTW - the police stations are closed now anyway.

[larryadler]

I certainly can’t disagree with your comments, today in the U.K. we have an excuse for a police service. I had incident of vehicle theft and theft from vehicle on my dash cam, with facial evidence of offenders, tried to contact the police, and my call was transferred to E.Bob, whatever that is, and no one answers the phone. After 20 minutes of trying to contact someone, I gave up, if it ain’t important to them, it ain’t important to me, but that is the times we live in!
But, god forbid you do 34mph in a 30 and they come after you big style, points on licence, fine, and the inevitable insurance company rub their sweaty little palms with glee as they increase you premium.

Rant I’ve, going back to bed 😂🤣

[First_Lexus]

On 1/24/2024 at 6:05 PM, larryadler said:

We are all aware that the Police today only issue a crime number, and tough luck old pal, but does anyone know of a police prosecution for the scumbags nicking our pride and joy?

It is interesting to reflect that the introduction of elected ‘Police and Crime Commissioners’ was intended to be the start of greater local accountability and policing priorities in line with those of the communities they represent.

A few years on, and they seem to be largely ineffective. Hardly anybody actually bothers to vote for them, and nice words don’t seem to be backed up by action.

Anyway, I’m going to try writing to mine (link to all of them enclosed). ‘Strong local policing’ is one of his five priorities, and I’ll be interested to see; a) if he replies; b) whether the reply addresses my question/concerns or if it is simply a standard response, and; c) if he does address my question directly what the response is (i.e. does he want Officers to attend car thefts, thefts from property etc.)

https://www.apccs.police.uk/find-your-pcc/matthew-barber/

I know it’s a bit of a trope, but ‘perception is reality’ and there does seem to be fairly widespread disaffection, with current policing focussing on the ‘wrong’ things. Hunting people down for their opinions expressed on Twitter, or catching car thieves? 

 

[Lincoln]

Have finally agreed a renewal for insurance on my RX450hL (68 plate). Was awaiting the deemed 3-week "ideal time" prior to renewal to seek a quote. Filled in MSE's car insurance+ machine looking for fully comp on SDP at 8k miles a year, and it came back with a set of the cheapest three = £1,356 from Saga, £1,586 at Sainsburys & £1,684 with Admiral (all a bit horrid after £600 cost for the  previous year). Rest of the list of offerings went airborne, running up to somewhere over £3k! The three "cheapies" each tried the rush-rush by saying their offering had to be accepted within 7 hours.

Anyway, decided to give Adrian Flux a buzz - having already had a property covered with them. A kindly gent called Jeff (perhaps Geoff?) spent some time going through the requirements - I explained about having had the security plates fitted some months ago and my use of a Milenco steering lock etc. He did a quick (presumably online) check and saw they were coming up worse than Saga, so he excused himself and went off to badger some underwriters, quite successfully in the event. He came back with £1,221 from Axa, with free legals, plenty of Euro travel etc. - reasonable package. Painful by comparison with last year, but in truth I had been fearing worse in view of all the recent alarming publicity.

 I trust other folks are also finding their way through this ghastly maze - Good Luck!

[GMB]

I'm hoping the insurance companies will get a grip on the situation. They cannot go on refusing business, driving customers away and charging ridiculous amounts. It almost seems as if there is a hidden agenda, but I think it is sheer greed.

Hopefully when they do their accounts at the end of the year they may see that their tactics are losing them profit. Despite their increases they have had less money from me this year because I SORNed one car for winter, up yo now it has worked out well - keeps the car nice away from the salt etc.  Maybe that's an intention, I don't know.

They really are a major pain in the butt.

[Tickedon]

4 hours ago, GMB said:

I'm hoping the insurance companies will get a grip on the situation. They cannot go on refusing business, driving customers away and charging ridiculous amounts. It almost seems as if there is a hidden agenda, but I think it is sheer greed.

Hopefully when they do their accounts at the end of the year they may see that their tactics are losing them profit. Despite their increases they have had less money from me this year because I SORNed one car for winter, up yo now it has worked out well - keeps the car nice away from the salt etc.  Maybe that's an intention, I don't know.

They really are a major pain in the butt.

Insurers have been quite happy to stop insuring Land Rovers which have a bigger market share than these Lexus. They lose money by insuring a vehicle and then having to pay out its full value due to theft. Far better to simply not cover it - and given the Lexus market share vs number of cars out there, it’s not even a rounding error. 

[Sundance]

15 hours ago, GMB said:

I'm hoping the insurance companies will get a grip on the situation. They cannot go on refusing business, driving customers away and charging ridiculous amounts. It almost seems as if there is a hidden agenda, but I think it is sheer greed.

Hopefully when they do their accounts at the end of the year they may see that their tactics are losing them profit. Despite their increases they have had less money from me this year because I SORNed one car for winter, up yo now it has worked out well - keeps the car nice away from the salt etc.  Maybe that's an intention, I don't know.

They really are a major pain in the butt.

Why ever not? I agree with Al, no business is going to pursue loss leaders if the loss gets out of hand or too large to recover. Insurers are not obliged to insure you or your items if it's not considered profitable. It's not greed, it's basic economics.

Ultimately the manufacturers will suffer if their product is considered not fit for purpose (ie. too easy to steal) so it's down to them to make cars more secure rather than the insurer agreeing to make a loss.

[GMB]

1 hour ago, Sundance said:

Why ever not? I agree with Al, no business is going to pursue loss leaders if the loss gets out of hand or too large to recover. Insurers are not obliged to insure you or your items if it's not considered profitable. It's not greed, it's basic economics.

That would be fine if the refusals to insure actually made any sense, I would not insure a car with such a likelihood of being stolen either. They blanket refuse or increase prices so that all Lexus cars suffer from the failings of a few. An example; my ISF was refused. It does not have canbus, no bad history, did only 1000 miles last year.  They just told me that the underwriters have put the ISF in an "uninsurable" bracket.  So, it's baby out with bathwater time.  Maybe if they were a bit more discriminating it would not seem so unfair.

 

[Tickedon]

17 minutes ago, GMB said:

That would be fine if the refusals to insure actually made any sense, I would not insure a car with such a likelihood of being stolen either. They blanket refuse or increase prices so that all Lexus cars suffer from the failings of a few. An example; my ISF was refused. It does not have canbus, no bad history, did only 1000 miles last year.  They just told me that the underwriters have put the ISF in an "uninsurable" bracket.  So, it's baby out with bathwater time.  Maybe if they were a bit more discriminating it would not seem so unfair.

 

There doesn’t appear to be a “Lexus premium” for my car insurance. It’s a huge amount of money (that’s mostly my fault for being in London), but quotes for comparable plug-in SUVs are comparable- those in slightly lower insurance groups are fractionally less, those in higher groups are fractionally more (e.g. Audi Q5). Just as you’d expect. 

[GMB]

3 minutes ago, Tickedon said:

There doesn’t appear to be a “Lexus premium” for my car insurance. It’s a huge amount of money (that’s mostly my fault for being in London), but quotes for comparable plug-in SUVs are comparable- those in slightly lower insurance groups are fractionally less, those in higher groups are fractionally more (e.g. Audi Q5). Just as you’d expect. 

Oh well, maybe we just have to get used to the new criteria and standards for car insurance and accept the status quo.

It's funny how it just seems to follow the new political trend to push people away from ICE and polluting cars. Hidden agenda? Maybe, maybe not?   3 cylinder 998cc car or low power ( 4 x AAA batteries) electric option anyone?

[Sundance]

It's quite possible that people are reading far more into premium increases than is necessary or indeed fact-based. I certainly can't imagine those involved in mundane economic underwriting having the wherewithal to take a so-called political trend into account when making their calculations. 😄

We have an under-staffed and under-funded Police force who appear to rely almost entirely on cctv, dashcams or private cameras these days and whilst they are taking hours if not days to be located, rewound, viewed and interpreted the stolen vehicles have already left Felixstowe in a container! 🤷‍♂️

[harrig]

On 1/24/2024 at 7:11 AM, PDM said:

Sorry to hear this.

Please write to Lexus Customer relations and ask them why you had not been notified about the existence of the security plate. cr@lexus.co.uk

Also consider posting on here:

https://mag.lexus.co.uk/car-security-advice-and-tips/

Hope your Dad's insurance is quick to pay out.

Paul

Thanks for the advice, I emailed them about my 2021 model, they replied with a call next day and booked my vehicle in with the local dealer next week, all free of charge which is what you expect from Lexus

[Masiv44]

Mine are still on back order, supposedly.

[fezman]

Well I've been badgering Craig at Lexus CR for a while and my last email I took a chance and copied in the chief exec (Scott Thompson) - taking a guess at his email address. After about a week I got a reply (not copying in the CEO) that basically said we've fitted the protection plates for you and we are not doing anything else. The email went on and on, but it was just hot air. They even alluded to the fact that because it wasnt a safety issue DVSA will not issue a recall. They totally miss the point they can OFFER a recall to all affected owners - just like JLR. 

They did acknowledge they know this issue is brand and reputation damaging, but didn't seem to care! 

They tried to use the excuse that all insurance premiums are going up. They absolutely ignored the point I made that a BRAND NEW RX was at least £500 cheaper to insure than my 12 month old gen 4. The new one has encrypted canbus. What they seem to be totally ignorant / or choosing to ignore, is that until a public recall is issued and the design flaw remedied, then thieves will continue to target lexus vehicles, premiums for affected vehicles will rise disproportionately, resale values will plummet. Dealers must be haemorrhaging money on the used fleets they have. 

Anyhow, I suspect that whatever the outcome, this will be my last Lexus.  The simple matter for me is that as a Lexus owner since 2007, on my 5th vehicle, they appear to have simply turned away from loyal customers and refuse to come up with a robust solution. 

On 2/9/2024 at 2:18 PM, harrig said:

Thanks for the advice, I emailed them about my 2021 model, they replied with a call next day and booked my vehicle in with the local dealer next week, all free of charge which is what you expect from Lexus

As for this Harrig, what I really expect from a premium brand such as lexus is much much more than the unannounced sticking plaster of a solution that they have come up with.  Even with the plates any attempted theft will likely leave a repair bill in the thousands. 

[H3XME]

11 minutes ago, fezman said:

They absolutely ignored the point I made that a BRAND NEW RX was at least £500 cheaper to insure than my 12 month old gen 4. The new one has encrypted canbus. 

1) They have absolutely nothing to do with insurance companies. They cannot regulate their prices or anything like that, so there's not really much to say to that point.

2) The £500 cheaper quote for the new car is most likely down to not enough data for the 2024 model, not the fact it has a canbus plate / ecryption that the insurance company probably doesn't even know about. Give it a year and see if it's still cheaper.. The future claims will possibly cause a hike in the insurance premiums to the level of your MK4. I doubt it'll retain £500 cheaper. 

However, If things will keep going the way they are, the new Lexuses will end up like Sierra Cosworth 35 years ago. Nobody will have them because nobody will insure them.

[Tickedon]

On 1/24/2024 at 2:19 PM, Lex loafer said:

I was quite clear: the most stolen cars in 2023. Not a Lexus on the list. 
 

 

The Daily Mail now have an excellent article, using DVLA data to rank cars with the number stolen vs the numbers registered. Ie in percentage terms, rather than just the highest numbers.

The Lexus RX is number 1 on the list, with *1 in 46* of all those registered stolen last year!

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13060215/Britain-stolen-cars-Interactive-graphic-targeted-thieves-list-Lexus-RX-Range-Rover.html#:~:text=According to MailOnline analysis of,SORN) being nabbed by thieves.?utm_source=LexusOwnersClubUK&utm_medium=ForumLinks

[BillSt]

36 minutes ago, Tickedon said:

The Daily Mail now have an excellent article, using DVLA data to rank cars with the number stolen vs the numbers registered. Ie in percentage terms, rather than just the highest numbers.

The Lexus RX is number 1 on the list, with *1 in 46* of all those registered stolen last year!

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13060215/Britain-stolen-cars-Interactive-graphic-targeted-thieves-list-Lexus-RX-Range-Rover.html#:~:text=According to MailOnline analysis of,SORN) being nabbed by thieves.?utm_source=LexusOwnersClubUK&utm_medium=ForumLinks

Interesting that the NX is not even in that top 10.

The RAV4 is.

Lexus is also the most stolen brand in 2023.

If the RX is 1 in 46 across the whole of Britain, what will it be in just Greater London and SE?

It would be particularly interesting to see this breakdown by Model Year to see if the new keys and software have had an effect. An analysis the Lexus UK could easily do if they really cared about their customers.

[PDM]

39 minutes ago, BillSt said:

Interesting that the NX is not even in that top 10.

The RAV4 is.

Lexus is also the most stolen brand in 2023.

If the RX is 1 in 46 across the whole of Britain, what will it be in just Greater London and SE?

It would be particularly interesting to see this breakdown by Model Year to see if the new keys and software have had an effect. An analysis the Lexus UK could easily do if they really cared about their customers.

And given it is mainly gen 4 that are being stolen, what is it as a fraction of those?

[Spock66]

Radio silence from Lexus continues.....

[fezman]

19 hours ago, H3XME said:

1) They have absolutely nothing to do with insurance companies. They cannot regulate their prices or anything like that, so there's not really much to say to that point.

2) The £500 cheaper quote for the new car is most likely down to not enough data for the 2024 model, not the fact it has a canbus plate / ecryption that the insurance company probably doesn't even know about. Give it a year and see if it's still cheaper.. The future claims will possibly cause a hike in the insurance premiums to the level of your MK4. I doubt it'll retain £500 cheaper. 

However, If things will keep going the way they are, the new Lexuses will end up like Sierra Cosworth 35 years ago. Nobody will have them because nobody will insure them.

1. Apart from Lexus being responsible for the design flaw that allows the RX to top the stolen charts. Which if they PUBLICLY fixed then thieves would be deterred / unable to steal, quid pro quo reducing the risk, then premiums would follow suit. So Lexus absolutely have a major influence on insurance premiums 

2. All insurance premiums are based on risk (driver / age / location / security flaws / etc) the main thing affecting rx gen4 is canbus. Rx gen 5 is encrypted, removing this risk from the calculation, hence the lower premiums. 
 

But you are correct, they will soon be economically uninsurable, and therefore worthless. 

[BillSt]

45 minutes ago, fezman said:

1. Apart from Lexus being responsible for the design flaw that allows the RX to top the stolen charts. Which if they PUBLICLY fixed then thieves would be deterred / unable to steal, quid pro quo reducing the risk, then premiums would follow suit. So Lexus absolutely have a major influence on insurance premiums 

2. All insurance premiums are based on risk (driver / age / location / security flaws / etc) the main thing affecting rx gen4 is canbus. Rx gen 5 is encrypted, removing this risk from the calculation, hence the lower premiums. 
 

But you are correct, they will soon be economically uninsurable, and therefore worthless. 

So very much in Lexus’ interest to recall ALL gen4 and upgrade. Correct THEIR mistake.

[fezman]

11 minutes ago, BillSt said:

So very much in Lexus’ interest to recall ALL gen4 and upgrade. Correct THEIR mistake.

Exactly Bill. But as @Spock66 says the radio silence continues 

[larryadler]

I think this topic is getting a little over the top now!

Whilst I agree Lexus may have a responsibility to ensure owners protect their vehicles, there are owners out there who, quite frankly don’t give a monkeys whether it gets nicked or not, there view is that’s why we have insurance.

Because we value our vehicles, not all are the same, despite the risks, which no doubt they are oblivious to, until the wheel comes off, none of them would consider enhancing the vehicle security, given the know issues. Fitting another immobiliser, quality steering lock, etc, and yes I hear you shout, the near side wing damage will be there, but so will the car, as it can’t be driven away !

I would suggest that the insurance increases are not the fault of the vehicle, although I agree a Lexus advertised recall would probably be beneficial, but we also have to criticise the lack of Police patrols on our streets, to deter these thefts, and be aware of the stolen list menu, so if these vehicles are seen in the early hours, they should be checked. But the Police service is a very poor example of what it was years ago, as the coverage on nights, is basic to say the least, an embarrassment to be frank.

Just to put some sense back into this insurance argument. I traded my Audi Q5 for my RX, and have a quote based on the Audi, that came in at £850, with the cheapest quote on my RX being £940!

These quotes are from Marshmallow, hedgehog, Ncl, and Nutshell, never heard of them before, but Tesco , Direct line £1100. Yes, it’s far too expensive, agreed, but go and trade your RX in to insure something cheaper, I almost guarantee you will get a kicking on the trade in value, far higher than the insurance premium, because the values have dropped significantly over the last couple of months, but you still have the balance of a 10 year warranty and reliability!

There ends my thought on this subject.