A Favourable UK Review

wivenhoe · August 15, 2023

Thought this may be of interest - a very positive review by a journalist who has driven the car for more than 1,000 miles, rather than 1 hour.

John Adams · August 16, 2023

The only thing I disagree with is the seats. I really think a car of this price point should have leather seats like all the premium competition. To me they look cheap but of course that is just my opinion and others will obviously like them.

wivenhoe · August 16, 2023

If it had been an option on the Takumi I would have selected leather. Strange thing is, everyone I have had in the car say they prefer it ! Mine is the strange sounding Orage but is mid-blue.
I do wonder how it will age but the Ultrasuede website says it has superior durability but I’m not sure about trumpeting it is flame resistant - I’d rather not test that in an EV

John Adams · August 16, 2023

20 minutes ago, wivenhoe said:

If it had been an option on the Takumi I would have selected leather. Strange thing is, everyone I have had in the car say they prefer it ! Mine is the strange sounding Orage but is mid-blue.
I do wonder how it will age but the Ultrasuede website says it has superior durability but I’m not sure about trumpeting it is flame resistant - I’d rather not test that in an EV

Mine is Greyscale colour. Don't get me wrong it is not bad but I think leather is more appropriate. A neighbour has just picked up a Merc EQC and sitting inside I thought it looked better. I was more envious though of the software which is miles better than the RZ in all areas. For example it gives a detailed breakdown as to where the energy is being used such as aircon etc plus % soc and other things I think would be useful. Also, if you put a destination in the satnav which is greater than the range, it suggests charging point stops on the route which sadly the RZ doesn't do. Perhaps a forthcoming software update?

wivenhoe · August 16, 2023

John. I had 6 Merc’s and each one had a more advanced infotainment than other marques. I don’t find the Lexus Charging network any use whatsoever.

I use Zap Map which in CarPlay is excellent. Before leaving you can filter the speed of chargers, types of locations, % charge etc and save a route with chargers in it. As you near a charging site it will tell you how many are available, those which are out of service etc, choose one and then you can use Maps or Google Maps to navigate to it. You can also pay on a lot of the charging site using the app.
I looked at the EQC but to get a similar spec it was about £ 10k more than a Takumi and the charging speed was a bit slower and the real range about the same.

wivenhoe · August 18, 2023

John - I was in the dealers yesterday and sat in a RZ with ‘leather seats’. I know Lexus do make it clear that they are not real leather but if I had bought the car I would have been mightily disappointed with the ‘synthetic leather’. It felt ‘slippery’ and plastic - I have to say the Ultrasuede definitely felt better !

John Adams · August 19, 2023

As I said Bob, I don't think the Ultrasuede is bad, just that in my opinion leather for a Lexus is much better and feels more upmarket especially for the price of the RZ.

By the way, have you had any update on the spare key and locking wheel nuts? I've told I should get the key next month and the wheel nuts at the year end, Why the wheel nuts take so long is a mystery to me

wivenhoe · August 19, 2023

No info on key - I’ll chase.
I think I may have a ‘Friday’ car. The AC charging has failed and replacement part is due 12 Sept. I can’t charge at home but the DC is ok so paying about 80p / Kw rather than 30p / Kw.

They run diagnostics last Thu to find the charging problem - unfortunately something is now draining the 12v Battery so today the car wouldn’t open, even with the mechanical key. The doors have electrical switches so flat Battery means they won’t open. I have a Tracker fitted and had got an alarm notice early this morning but thought it was just wrong notification - found out since the Tracker monitors the 12v Battery in case thieves disconnect to try to overcome any tracking software. Hence the Battery was flat

The dealers couldn’t help but Lexus Assist / AA were superb, arrived within 15 minutes. Much fiddling and a bit of brute force on the door with the mechanical key they managed to open the car and bonnet. Put a mobile charger on and the car started. The guy said he couldn’t replace the £ 150 Battery as it was warranty and wouldn’t anyway as something was draining it. He said this would be ongoing until Lexus sorted it. I went for a drive and charged the car. Everything fine.

Since the diagnostics I couldn’t access the car in the App - it kept saying that there was a system fault meaning the car couldn’t be ‘woken up’ - now know that is confirmation the 12v Battery is flat.

I’ve got the ‘cannot wake car’ again in the App so now know the car is not drivable. Senior guy in the dealers said they would sort collection and curtesy car Monday.
it is so ironic that I switched to Lexus because the Range Rover was unreliable despite only being 2 years old.

The AA guy was amazed that a Lexus was having this trouble - he also knew I had to call them out when the AC charging failed the night before our 240 mile drive - I had an error message saying Charging Malfunction and the car refusing to charge at home. It was this that resulted in the diagnostics last Thu that kicked off the 12v Battery issue. I don’t think the technicians really know the RZ systems.

talaipwros · August 19, 2023

2 hours ago, wivenhoe said:

No info on key - I’ll chase.
I think I may have a ‘Friday’ car. The AC charging has failed and replacement part is due 12 Sept. I can’t charge at home but the DC is ok so paying about 80p / Kw rather than 30p / Kw.

They run diagnostics last Thu to find the charging problem - unfortunately something is now draining the 12v battery so today the car wouldn’t open, even with the mechanical key. The doors have electrical switches so flat battery means they won’t open. I have a Tracker fitted and had got an alarm notice early this morning but thought it was just wrong notification - found out since the Tracker monitors the 12v battery in case thieves disconnect to try to overcome any tracking software. Hence the battery was flat

The dealers couldn’t help but Lexus Assist / AA were superb, arrived within 15 minutes. Much fiddling and a bit of brute force on the door with the mechanical key they managed to open the car and bonnet. Put a mobile charger on and the car started. The guy said he couldn’t replace the £ 150 battery as it was warranty and wouldn’t anyway as something was draining it. He said this would be ongoing until Lexus sorted it. I went for a drive and charged the car. Everything fine.

Since the diagnostics I couldn’t access the car in the App - it kept saying that there was a system fault meaning the car couldn’t be ‘woken up’ - now know that is confirmation the 12v battery is flat.

I’ve got the ‘cannot wake car’ again in the App so now know the car is not drivable. Senior guy in the dealers said they would sort collection and curtesy car Monday.
it is so ironic that I switched to Lexus because the Range Rover was unreliable despite only being 2 years old.

The AA guy was amazed that a Lexus was having this trouble - he also knew I had to call them out when the AC charging failed the night before our 240 mile drive - I had an error message saying Charging Malfunction and the car refusing to charge at home. It was this that resulted in the diagnostics last Thu that kicked off the 12v battery issue. I don’t think the technicians really know the RZ systems.

I had the same issue with an ID3

If it is less than a month reject the vehicle, give it back and take your money. It happens.

wivenhoe · August 19, 2023

Unfortunately it is 3 months old so rejection isn’t as easy. I have said it is not fit for purpose so I’ll see what they say next week.

talaipwros · August 20, 2023

8 hours ago, wivenhoe said:

Unfortunately it is 3 months old so rejection isn’t as easy. I have said it is not fit for purpose so I’ll see what they say next week.

I quote from https://www.autotrader.co.uk/content/advice/how-does-the-consumer-rights-act-protect-you-when-you-buy-a-car

The Consumer Rights Act stipulates that dealers will only get one chance to repair or replace the product, so dealers can’t make multiple attempts to fix a problem unless otherwise agreed. If they fail to remedy the fault in one attempt or within a reasonable time period, you’ll be entitled to a full or partial refund.

So give them one chance only.

I wonder if the Liverpool discounted takumi car is rejected as well as it says one previous owner rather than "our demonstrator"

John Adams · August 20, 2023

12 hours ago, wivenhoe said:

No info on key - I’ll chase.
I think I may have a ‘Friday’ car. The AC charging has failed and replacement part is due 12 Sept. I can’t charge at home but the DC is ok so paying about 80p / Kw rather than 30p / Kw.

They run diagnostics last Thu to find the charging problem - unfortunately something is now draining the 12v battery so today the car wouldn’t open, even with the mechanical key. The doors have electrical switches so flat battery means they won’t open. I have a Tracker fitted and had got an alarm notice early this morning but thought it was just wrong notification - found out since the Tracker monitors the 12v battery in case thieves disconnect to try to overcome any tracking software. Hence the battery was flat

The dealers couldn’t help but Lexus Assist / AA were superb, arrived within 15 minutes. Much fiddling and a bit of brute force on the door with the mechanical key they managed to open the car and bonnet. Put a mobile charger on and the car started. The guy said he couldn’t replace the £ 150 battery as it was warranty and wouldn’t anyway as something was draining it. He said this would be ongoing until Lexus sorted it. I went for a drive and charged the car. Everything fine.

Since the diagnostics I couldn’t access the car in the App - it kept saying that there was a system fault meaning the car couldn’t be ‘woken up’ - now know that is confirmation the 12v battery is flat.

I’ve got the ‘cannot wake car’ again in the App so now know the car is not drivable. Senior guy in the dealers said they would sort collection and curtesy car Monday.
it is so ironic that I switched to Lexus because the Range Rover was unreliable despite only being 2 years old.

The AA guy was amazed that a Lexus was having this trouble - he also knew I had to call them out when the AC charging failed the night before our 240 mile drive - I had an error message saying Charging Malfunction and the car refusing to charge at home. It was this that resulted in the diagnostics last Thu that kicked off the 12v battery issue. I don’t think the technicians really know the RZ systems.

I have had intermittent ac charging problems from day one which also happened on the demo car I had. It either works or you get a loud clicking noise for ages and I have to keep unplugging and plugging in again. I have reported this to Lexus but they don't seem to think it is a problem but as I can still charge with a bit of faffing around it will have to wait until I can take the car in which is a 200mile or so return journey. I'm beginning to think my long association with Lexus will soon be over.

wivenhoe · August 20, 2023

30 minutes ago, talaipwros said:

I quote from https://www.autotrader.co.uk/content/advice/how-does-the-consumer-rights-act-protect-you-when-you-buy-a-car

The Consumer Rights Act stipulates that dealers will only get one chance to repair or replace the product, so dealers can’t make multiple attempts to fix a problem unless otherwise agreed. If they fail to remedy the fault in one attempt or within a reasonable time period, you’ll be entitled to a full or partial refund.

So give them one chance only.

I wonder if the Liverpool discounted takumi car is rejected as well as it says one previous owner rather than "our demonstrator"

Thanks for the advice. I’ll use it in my discussions with them.

wivenhoe · August 20, 2023

12 minutes ago, John Adams said:

I have had intermittent ac charging problems from day one which also happened on the demo car I had. It either works or you get a loud clicking noise for ages and I have to keep unplugging and plugging in again. I have reported this to Lexus but they don't seem to think it is a problem but as I can still charge with a bit of faffing around it will have to wait until I can take the car in which is a 200mile or so return journey. I'm beginning to think my long association with Lexus will soon be over.

That’s exactly what mine does when plugged in a 7kw charger. It just keeps clicking - I’ll mention that others have the same problem, but in my case it doesn’t charge. I hope you don’t get the Charging Malfunction error - if you do, disconnecting the 12v Battery rectifies it but I do wonder if the 3 times I was forced to have this done then caused the Battery draining I now have, or even the failure of the charging black box.
They are replacing the large black box on top of the motor - looks very expensive. If I were you I would tell them you know of a failure of the black box which had the same clicking issue before it totally failed.

The wheels falling off and the low temperature charging issue on the BZ caused a reputational hit to Toyota. I think the RZ could go the same way for Lexus.

When I had the problems with the Range Rover the dealer said they would back me in rejecting the car but said as the defects were manufacturing ones, there was a good chance the replacement would have them too. At the time any new car was 9+ months wait so we decided to keep the car and the dealer was excellent in immediately sorting out the issues as they arose. The service manager left and I lost confidence in them sorting the probs - I am feeling the same way about Lexus as the 2 technicians that have worked on the car said it was all new to them and they hadn’t experienced the issues before, so were starting from scratch.

I really like the car but to me it’s in the same league as the Range Rover - when it doesn’t have any faults, it’s a great car but the faults / unreliability start to outweigh the good drives. Like the Velar, I don’t know with confidence when I get in it (if I can) all will be good. With the miss-selling of the remote parking, the App not being as described and now the unreliability issues, I think Lexus have totally dropped the ball with the RZ.

Kevin Williams · August 20, 2023

9 hours ago, John Adams said:

I have had intermittent ac charging problems from day one which also happened on the demo car I had. It either works or you get a loud clicking noise for ages and I have to keep unplugging and plugging in again. I have reported this to Lexus but they don't seem to think it is a problem but as I can still charge with a bit of faffing around it will have to wait until I can take the car in which is a 200mile or so return journey. I'm beginning to think my long association with Lexus will soon be over.

John, I certainly never thought I would read this post... I think, like Genesis, Lexus have some work to do, and quickly...

wivenhoe · August 20, 2023

Kevin - I listen to the Car Dealer podcast and one of the guys is always disparaging about Genesis. A different guy seems to like them and said they have now agreed franchises with some of the big dealers as they recognise having only 2 Showrooms and no local service facilities was a problem - what do you think Genesis need to do because if I do reject the RZ then that is a brand I would look at they have availability - or is that a really bad sign ?

Kevin Williams · August 21, 2023

13 hours ago, wivenhoe said:

Kevin - I listen to the Car Dealer podcast and one of the guys is always disparaging about Genesis. A different guy seems to like them and said they have now agreed franchises with some of the big dealers as they recognise having only 2 Showrooms and no local service facilities was a problem - what do you think Genesis need to do because if I do reject the RZ then that is a brand I would look at they have availability - or is that a really bad sign ?

Bob, Genesis, have no doubt improved since June/July because there were numerous problems with their cars, and their people…! I ordered a GV60, which was ‘finally’ delivered on 30^th June. I rejected the car before it came off the trailer… I am happy to PM you the reasons…? I was a member of the GV60 Facebook Group, and I read about another member who was having serious problems with her GV60. I obtained an email address of the lady that lives in Northumberland. I exchanged several emails with her, and was totally gobsmacked to read what she was experiencing with her car and some of the people that work/ed for Genesis, including their MD…

If you want to communicate with the lady. I am happy to ask her if she is happy to answer emails from you…

This lady and her husband have had several different electric cars…

If you would like to hear from her direct. Please let me have your email by PM…?

You can ask the above question from this lady…?

ColinBarber · August 21, 2023

23 hours ago, wivenhoe said:

I am feeling the same way about Lexus as the 2 technicians that have worked on the car said it was all new to them and they hadn’t experienced the issues before, so were starting from scratch.

It's a new model, with new technology and only a couple of hundred in the country - I wouldn't expect any of the technicians to have any meaningful experience yet.

There are always teething problems with new models, even ones that are iterative in design, so whilst your issues have been unfortunate I don't think you neccessarily have a Friday car or the signs are there that this will forever be an unreliable model.

On 8/20/2023 at 8:58 AM, John Adams said:

I have had intermittent ac charging problems from day one which also happened on the demo car I had. It either works or you get a loud clicking noise for ages and I have to keep unplugging and plugging in again. I have reported this to Lexus but they don't seem to think it is a problem

This is disturbing if you have experienced this on two vehicles and the dealership is dismissing you. I would take a video of the issue - the last thing you want is a 200 mile round trip just to be told they couldn't replicate the issue. I'd also take it up with Lexus customer relations - they will probably tell you that they have never heard of this issue and you should just speak to your dealer but hopefully behind the scenes they will make enquires.

John Adams · August 21, 2023

18 minutes ago, ColinBarber said:

It's a new model, with new technology and only a couple of hundred in the country - I wouldn't expect any of the technicians to have any meaningful experience yet.

There are always teething problems with new models, even ones that are iterative in design, so whilst your issues have been unfortunate I don't think you neccessarily have a Friday car or the signs are there that this will forever be an unreliable model.

This is disturbing if you have experienced this on two vehicles and the dealership is dismissing you. I would take a video of the issue - the last thing you want is a 200 mile round trip just to be told they couldn't replicate the issue. I'd also take it up with Lexus customer relations - they will probably tell you that they have never heard of this issue and you should just speak to your dealer but hopefully behind the scenes they will make enquires.

Colin, I have been discussing this and a number of other issues with Lexus CS. I can't say much at the moment but I will report back when I am able. I was initially told by CS that I wasn't plugging it in right which was puzzling because I never had a problem plugging in my NX450 using the same chargers. I should add that the dealer has admitted that none of their technicians have a clue about this car as they have had no training. All queries have to go via them to Lexus CS which further delays any response

dutchie01 · August 21, 2023

So, Lexus brings a new model to market with new technology without training the technicians beforehand? Is that correct? Do they think the cost of training all technicians countrywide is not justified given the small number of cars they expect to sell?

wivenhoe · August 21, 2023

Looks like that as 2 dealers staff have said the same thing I’m sure those with Toyota BZ will be finding the same.
I’m taking mine in again - getting an ES curtesy car.
They are saying they think the Tracker is draining the 12v Battery - I pointed out to them it was fitted 3 months ago and the 12v Battery was fine until the day after the car was with them for diagnostics.
If they try to tell me the issue was caused by the Tracker then I’m leaving the car with them and talk to Customer Service about rejecting the car for constant defects on the car.

F.A. · August 24, 2023

@wivenhoe
Just another perspective of Genesis. I appreciate it’s still early days but here goes

We have a Genesis Electrified GV70 since March 23 and purchased this over the RZ450e for many reasons, after having a Toyota or Lexus since 2003. Availability was one of them but I wasn’t impressed with the overall package and EV spec. The final nail in the coffin was the way Lexus have handled the Carbon Fibre issue with our GSF.

The buying process and Genesis PA have been absolutely fantastic.
The car itself from a reliability, built quality ( apart from one issue, see below) point of view has also been fantastic.
Range, charging, performance, comfort, app and tech usability has been spot on and overall we are extremely happy with the car.

We have had one issue which has really let the side down a bit and that was the boot door being slightly out of alignment. It went back to Genesis to be realigned and unfortunately the service department failed to listen to my request about not washing the car, despite me stating 6 times. Our car came back gleaming but with several scratched areas and damage to two areas of PPF. They also lost our boot floor 🙄. Fortunately the Service manager has done everything he can to rectify this and have covered the cost of rectifying the damage from our detailer and supplied a new boot floor.

If you are in the market for a RZ450e but are having second thoughts about it, I would seriously consider an Electrified GV 70.

talaipwros · August 24, 2023

43 minutes ago, F.A. said:

@wivenhoe
Just another perspective of Genesis. I appreciate it’s still early days but here goes

We have a Genesis Electrified GV70 since March 23 and purchased this over the RZ450e for many reasons, after having a Toyota or Lexus since 2003. Availability was one of them but I wasn’t impressed with the overall package and EV spec. The final nail in the coffin was the way Lexus have handled the Carbon Fibre issue with our GSF.

The buying process and Genesis PA have been absolutely fantastic.
The car itself from a reliability, built quality ( apart from one issue, see below) point of view has also been fantastic.
Range, charging, performance, comfort, app and tech usability has been spot on and overall we are extremely happy with the car.

We have had one issue which has really let the side down a bit and that was the boot door being slightly out of alignment. It went back to Genesis to be realigned and unfortunately the service department failed to listen to my request about not washing the car, despite me stating 6 times. Our car came back gleaming but with several scratched areas and damage to two areas of PPF. They also lost our boot floor 🙄. Fortunately the Service manager has done everything he can to rectify this and have covered the cost of rectifying the damage from our detailer and supplied a new boot floor.

If you are in the market for a RZ450e but are having second thoughts about it, I would seriously consider an Electrified GV 70.

That's good to know, thanks.

What's real life range ?

F.A. · August 24, 2023

In the current climate 80% charge is showing a range of 220. The predicted range it shows has proven to be quite accurate. AC knocks off about 5 miles and we drive it like a normal car.
We mainly charge at home or at one of our business premises, which has been flawless. When we have used a rapid charger, the speeds are impressive. It comes with a 5 year subscription to Ionity which gives you a rate of 23p/ kw and we have seen sustained rates of 230kw. We have a couple on routes out of Bristol but it’s a shame there aren’t more around the UK.

Looploop · May 26

So im hearing really a lot of negative things about the rz, are these issues including the 12 Battery with one car or all of the RZs. I really don not need to be taking the car regularly to the garage. I’m really considering cancelling my lease order before it’s too late. It seems the dealers are not knowledgable regarding the rz. Need to be able to ask questions and get correct answers from Them.