Painted Callipers, what a ballache

[Linas.P]

20 minutes ago, Poundy said:

I think we may misinterpret the reason for the cost increase and the reason for the declaration of upgraded items. Like fitting larger quality painted wheels, or expensive aftermarket upgraded painted calipers, is a different ball game to painting your own fitted items. The extra premium is for no other reason than to offset the likelihood of the insurer having a higher pay out to replace the non standard Items. Therefore not declaring none safety or vehicle performance affecting items should not affect any claim other than them only reimbursing you for the OE item value.

That is my take on it as well. Unless modification is increasing performance of the car the declaration is simply to protect insurance interest in case you decide to claim it on the policy. Because there is difference between insuring IS250 that costs £4000 and the one that has £4000 worth of wheels on it.

So if not declared and those wheels get stolen, then don't expect insurance company to pay for them, or if the car is heavily modified (say show car) then don't expect insurance to modify it to the same level. In case of total loss you just getting market value based on year mileage and model of your car, nothing more and nothing less... unless it is agreed value policy, in which case one would get agreed value.

Now again - I recommend reading the contract you are signing and if needed consult with legal experts (not on the forum), but when I declare mods on insurance my point of view is such - does the item changes car performance (for better or worse)? If yes then it is a mod and has to be declared and does the item increases car value, or is expensive itself, and if I want it to be covered. If I want it to be covered then I will declare it and I will fight with insurance company to cover it, in the end of the day they hiked my price and mods were listed, they have to pay. Or if I don't want that mode to be  covered then I will not list it and I accept that it is not covered and will be lost.

Practical example - F-Sport wheels are worth ~£800-£1200, my IS250 at the time was worth maybe £2500. I did not declare them as a mod and if car was stolen I would not expect them to be covered. When car got written-off I simply took those wheels of the car. Now to make it more "spicy", I suspect the car was written of primely because of the wheels, basically when other guy crashed into me I hit the kerb and it was little scratch on the bumper and right front wheel from his car + both left side wheels kerbed. I can't imagine insurance written the car off for the bumper, but in my claim I said I want all wheels to be refurbished (because 3 out of 4 were scratched) and I want front tyres replaced, because left front sidewall was ripped as result of hitting the kerb. So if they had no issue with that - I doubt they would ever have issue with much more subtle things like painted calipers or brake pads.

[matt8]

Tinted windows (legal ones)? Any take on that being a mod?

[J Henderson]

22 minutes ago, matt8 said:

Tinted windows (legal ones)? Any take on that being a mod?

Kind of a funny one this... When shopping for insurance last time out, I found the quotes could actually get lower when declaring that the windows were tinted. Work that one out!

In any event, I don't declare my tints or anything else I've done to my car. As far as I'm concerned I haven't changed anything that would warrant claiming extra for. ie: I have different wheels than it came with stock, but they are still LEXUS ones, and exactly the same size and spec.

If I was slammed on coilovers, had a set of £2K+ JDM wheels, or had upsized to 19" or something, then yes of course I would declare that (and did, when I had ISF wheels on a few years ago).

But if one of my windows gets smashed in a bump, or by a thief I wouldn't be expecting the cost of re-tinting the glass to be met by the insurance company.

If painting calipers is considered an "offence" in the insurers eyes, I would guess there are literally hundreds of thousands of uninsured cars on the road today.

[matt8]

Thought provoking topic. Has changed my view on things, that’s for sure.

Tints incoming!

[Notamech]

20 hours ago, J Henderson said:

Kind of a funny one this... When shopping for insurance last time out, I found the quotes could actually get lower when declaring that the windows were tinted. Work that one out!

In any event, I don't declare my tints or anything else I've done to my car. As far as I'm concerned I haven't changed anything that would warrant claiming extra for. ie: I have different wheels than it came with stock, but they are still LEXUS ones, and exactly the same size and spec.

If I was slammed on coilovers, had a set of £2K+ JDM wheels, or had upsized to 19" or something, then yes of course I would declare that (and did, when I had ISF wheels on a few years ago).

But if one of my windows gets smashed in a bump, or by a thief I wouldn't be expecting the cost of re-tinting the glass to be met by the insurance company.

If painting calipers is considered an "offence" in the insurers eyes, I would guess there are literally hundreds of thousands of uninsured cars on the road today.

But the problem with not declaring tints is the insurance companies will try and use that to void your policy as you are in breach of contract by not declaring it. It doesn't matter if you dont intend to claim replacement tints in case of an accident. 

[Poundy]

On 8/5/2023 at 11:09 AM, ColinBarber said:

Insurers rarely pay out for modifications even when declared unless you have a specific policy that covers them. The premium increases because the risk increases - with cosmetic upgrades it has the potential to attract more interest in the vehicle (both theft and people wanting to race). Repainting your callipers the same colour as factory isn't an issue (and shouldn't be declared), but painting them bright red is.

 

Adding a PPF increases labour just to remove it - that's why they increase premiums if you declare it, and if you don't they could give you a bill for the extra work needed. I've never heard of a standard policy replacing a PPF even if declared.

True, and the reason my Jag came back repaired with new bumper and bonnet but no PPF or Ceramic coating applied.

However if I had declared it and paid an increased premium, I would certainly have asked the question.

[Linas.P]

On 8/5/2023 at 12:35 PM, J Henderson said:

Work that one out!

One of the key arguments of people in US states where tint is legal on all windows is that it protects car from thief i.e. "people don't steal what they can't see" and it is unlikely that somebody would smash the window just to find out if there is anything to take.

5 minutes ago, Poundy said:

True, and the reason my Jag came back repaired with new bumper and bonnet but no PPF or Ceramic coating applied.

However if I had declared it and paid an increased premium, I would certainly have asked the question.

I am sure if you have declared the PPF and ceramic coating you would have paid more for insurance - yet I doubt they would agree to pay for refitting it... Isn't that funny?

[Poundy]

19 minutes ago, Linas.P said:

One of the key arguments of people in US states where tint is legal on all windows is that it protects car from thief i.e. "people don't steal what they can't see" and it is unlikely that somebody would smash the window just to find out if there is anything to take.

I am sure if you have declared the PPF and ceramic coating you would have paid more for insurance - yet I doubt they would agree to pay for refitting it... Isn't that funny?

To be fair I was well pleased with the outcome as I phoned them on the Sunday night after rear ending someone lol! And it was all sorted and booked in for the repair on the Monday with collection arranged 3 days later, top job done.

The only downside was 3 months later getting a threatening letter off the other parties insurer saying they would be taking me to court for their clients costs because my insurers hadn't settled with them 🥲

After a few long winded phone calls my insurers sorted it, even so I sent a letter of complaint over the hassle I received. Imagine my surprise when nearly 1 year later I received a nice letter of apology and an inconvenience cheque for £300.

[Linas.P]

10 hours ago, Poundy said:

To be fair I was well pleased with the outcome as I phoned them on the Sunday night after rear ending someone lol! And it was all sorted and booked in for the repair on the Monday with collection arranged 3 days later, top job done.

The only downside was 3 months later getting a threatening letter off the other parties insurer saying they would be taking me to court for their clients costs because my insurers hadn't settled with them 🥲

After a few long winded phone calls my insurers sorted it, even so I sent a letter of complaint over the hassle I received. Imagine my surprise when nearly 1 year later I received a nice letter of apology and an inconvenience cheque for £300.

Well ... I hope that to be the case considering how much it costs.

But most of delays on insurance is usually caused by negotiations, or by trying to figure out whose fault it was. Once party at fault is agreed and damage is agreed, things usually move quickly. So if in your case there was no contest who was at fault and how much it will cost to repair that moved quickly. Now it is bizarre that TP insurance sent a letter to you - what they expect you to do?! If your insurance does not want to settle they have to take insurance to court not you, it is only in cases where somebody is uninsured they can go after the person, but you were insured so all should be dealt by insurance. I would say this is almost not a fault of your insurance (in terms of contacting you), the TP insurance should answer why they felt it was appropriate to even contact you. 

It is strange how people do not know who is at fault or fight to death to claim they are not at fault when they are. 3 out of 3 accidents that I had, other party contested it and said it was my fault, dashcam footage was very handy indeed, but since my first accident I have moved over to using claims management companies rather than insurance itself and there are many benefits of doing that. My first case took nearly 6 months to settle, my other two were settled within 2 weeks, just because of claims management company "pre-approving" it (meaning they consider it 100% non-fault and they pay it out before they even get the money from TP insurance and then they sue them or whatever is required to recover the cost). Now sadly - claim management companies only deals with 100% non-fault, if you are at fault some of them don't even look at it, and some other charge ridiculous fees. 

[zoricib]

On 8/5/2023 at 11:26 AM, Linas.P said:

I can't imagine insurance written the car off for the bumper, 

@Linas.P, you'd be surprised. My bumper was scraped in a car park and the other party's insurance deemed my car a total loss - so they gave me the option of a 2k payout or give them the car & possibly a higher payout.

[Linas.P]

1 hour ago, zoricib said:

@Linas.P, you'd be surprised. My bumper was scraped in a car park and the other party's insurance deemed my car a total loss - so they gave me the option of a 2k payout or give them the car & possibly a higher payout.

That is where claims management companies works quite well - because they would not care what TP insurance is saying, they just get your car and damage valued (importantly with your input). 

E.g. on my second accident in 2016 the insurance company estimated my then 157k miles IS250 SEL to be worth £2860 and damage to be worth ~£3500, so a total loss, cat-B basically. Instead, I went to claim management company which basically turn the numbers around - ~£3300 for the car and ~£2800 to repair, importantly setting residual value of just £571, meaning that if I were to buy it back that is only as much as I needed to pay. Because at the time I was not happy to get car written-off and £3300 still could not buy me comparable car I insisted on either pricing the car at £4800 or car being repaired and got my own quote for repairs, which totalled £1800, for painting bumper, front fended, refurbishing all wheels and replacing all tyres. So £4800 value and £1800 repair was the proposal claims management company brought forward to insurance and the settled right away for repairs. 

My third crash wen more or less the same, but economics of it were different. First of all my car already had 192k at the time, I didn't even bother with insurance valuation, but claims management company right away valued it at £3700, which was way more than it was worth and estimated ~£2800 for repairs again. This time I was more than happy to take £2800 and buy the car back, because it only had literally scratch on the bumper and no actual repairs were need, sure I have kerbed the wheels, but they were already kerbed anyway (naughty I know)... the only downside being ~£800 buy back price. So I got my car back and £2000 in cash and then sold it for £2800 with Cat-N. 

I guess my point is - you stand no chance negotiating with insurance companies as you have no leverage, but if you get claims management company then you have all leverage you need. And insurance was on time bomb when it comes to hire car... because you see, I had no hire car cover on my policy, so my insurance would have given me some sort of Yaris or Polo... but claims management company does not care, their policy was to provide like for like hire car for all non-fault claims. So they got me £300/day brand new BWM 330i (literally 3 month old with 5000 miles on it). So every day insurance company delayed the decision it costed them £300. No wonder they settled right away!

[zoricib]

and to mention no category on the car either. The damage was paint only so was happy to take the settlement. Cost me about £250 to get it resprayed