Ghost 2 immobiliser, not yet!

[WhiteHart]

Ask the Ghost 2 importer for some recommendations for fitting( someone put a video up on the owners club of good advice) and they kindly give me some suggestions of companies that are trained by them.

One of them called me to check on model and called me back, and said a big NO. 

The Lexus software on the latest NX450 will not work with the Ghost. 
Ghost are said to working new software. So just a heads up. 

[WhiteHart]

Sorry I cannot find the video that a member kindly posted. It's a guy in the midlands who fits Ghosts talking about making sure the people who you get to fit the Ghost 2 know what they doing. One of things is the price which should be £499 and this is due to the other thing which is time, it should about 2 hours plus to fit one. Auto Watch UK Ltd ( The importers ) seem helpful, it does take a few days to get a reply.They do say that "We train and approve independent trade installers to fit our products."

[Hayzee]

Some cautionary experience with the Ghost II from the RAV4 owners forum

https://www.toyotaownersclub.com/forums/topic/209692-2022-rav4-stolen/page/29/#comment-1705199

[wendle]

19 hours ago, WhiteHart said:

Ask the Ghost 2 importer for some recommendations for fitting( someone put a video up on the owners club of good advice) and they kindly give me some suggestions of companies that are trained by them.

One of them called me to check on model and called me back, and said a big NO. 

The Lexus software on the latest NX450 will not work with the Ghost. 
Ghost are said to working new software. So just a heads up. 

I had the same problem with my LC back in 2017, they need a car to play with to make it work, i let them have my LC, 4 hours later they got it to work, haven't had any problems since.

[Mad_4u]

You should contact Autowatch directly as I did and they send me a list of installer near my address.

I have installed Ghost2 on my NX 300H and never had issue with it.

[Fusspot]

Ditto. I've just had a Ghost II fitted to my new NX350H (MY24 spec) with no problems. It works as described.

Having said that, the Autowatch recommended installer I used said this model of the NX had revised cabling to the previous models he's installed, and needed to speak to a couple of contacts to confirm some details.

Within the limits of what one can do to protect one's assets, I'm glad I went for this product.

[WhiteHart]

10 hours ago, Fusspot said:

I've just had a Ghost II fitted to my new NX350H (MY24 spec) with no problems.

All I can think is the software is different between MY24 NX350 and MY24 NX450. Hopefully not a long wait. 

[WhiteHart]

Had a call today from the guy who told not to have the Ghost fitted yet. He said he and Autowatch have had a 450+ sent from a dealer ( not to sure about a dealer giving 450+ to play with might have to question that.) and they have run tests and that it now works without any problems just less buttons to push to start. 
so I will have it done in a week or so time.  

[Hillie]

I have had the Scorpion X fitted to my NX450H+ F-sport 4 weeks ago and no major concerns. The only caution I would advise (as desxribed to me bu the installer) is to make sure the PIN code uses at least two button groups  e.g Window or Mirrow AND steering wheel buttons otherwise valet mode may not work.  I was told that the steering wheel controls operate off LIN bus (a lower performance / lower cost version of CAN bus) and this can be a little laggy.  I have also noticed that it is better to wait for the vehicle to power up before entering the PIN,  e.g wait for all the dash check lights to go off.

In terms of testing I am checking different things every day including remote functions such as the App controlled climate control,  remote door locking through the App,  on demand charging,  scheduled charging and so far everything is working.  I will be checking the Valet mode over the weekend when I have some time to just sit in the vehicle and play.

[WhiteHart]

Update about me having a ghost fitted. I booked the guy who was honest about fitting it and he came and put the ghost in, and after three hours it was done. The problem was only one button would work to put a code in. A few days later he came back with someone from Autowatch and they spent hours working on the button issue they resolved it and had multiple buttons for the code. 

But had a problem with the LTE which would not turn off, they told me that the ghost was not on that part of the Lexus system but they were looking for buttons.

The person from Autowatch came back to try to fix the problem and after hours of work could not fix’s it and took the ghost out. The problem seemed to fix itself just by driving the car and took the car to Lexus and they checked the whole system and found nothing.

I will park it at work when I go on holiday and will have the Ghost fitted when I return. The service from both the Ghost people was excellent.

 

[WhiteHart]

Back from my holidays and booked to have a Ghost fitted on Tuesday. I did park in a private and very secure underground car park for 10 days due to paranoia. 
So will update all when it’s done. 

[AWC]

Apparently, the latest Lexus models have an encrypted CAN bus making then immune to the current CAN injection attacks which is why the Ghost 2 is not compatible. I can't see Lexus releasing the encryption key to an external company any time soon which puts the value of any conventional CAN bus immobiliser in question.

[Hayzee]

13 hours ago, AWC said:

Apparently, the latest Lexus models have an encrypted CAN bus making then immune to the current CAN injection attacks which is why the Ghost 2 is not compatible. I can't see Lexus releasing the encryption key to an external company any time soon which puts the value of any conventional CAN bus immobiliser in question.

Alex....do you know when this mod was applied in terms of Manufacturing date?

[AWC]

25 minutes ago, Hayzee said:

Alex....do you know when this mod was applied in terms of Manufacturing date?

Colin, I believe it's from 2023 models onwards but not absolutely certain.

[szhrmp]

I am getting my car next week and was planning to install the ghost2.

where did you get the information that it is not compatible anymore, e.g. did you try to install it yourself?

also - why would lexus install the passenger metal plate if the canbus cannot be hacked anymore?

 

Peter

[AWC]

40 minutes ago, szhrmp said:

I am getting my car next week and was planning to install the ghost2.

where did you get the information that it is not compatible anymore, e.g. did you try to install it yourself?

also - why would lexus install the passenger metal plate if the canbus cannot be hacked anymore?

 

Peter

Peter, I took delivery of my 2023 RX in July and was thinking of fitting a Ghost 2 but when I checked on the Autowatch website my car wasn't listed on the compatibility list. I've also read that Lexus have said the 2023 models are no longer susceptible to CAN bus attack but without explanation. Other mentions of how the manufacturers have been working very hard to develop encrypted CAN bus systems as these thefts are poor publicity for them.

I ended up buying a Stopcock Elite Pro as a visual deterrent as I didn't want to pay a lot of money to fit a potentially pointless immobiliser.

On this group: 

On 8/19/2023 at 8:13 PM, peniole said:

Yes the new RX and NX platforms are on an encrypted, dealer said scrambled, CANBUS.

[peniole]

I also got confirmation that the ES from MY23 forward also have had the vulnerability addressed.

[WhiteHart]

£60 grand plus, £500 is worth piece of mine. And who knows how long before the scum find other ways to take away our hard earned stuff. 

[szhrmp]

With encrypted canbus, will it be possible to install an aftermarket tracker? I recon S5 trackers just plug in to the Battery somewhere.

Peter

[AWC]

36 minutes ago, szhrmp said:

With encrypted canbus, will it be possible to install an aftermarket tracker? I recon S5 trackers just plug in to the battery somewhere.

Peter

Shouldn't be a problem fitting a tracker but doesn't the NX have the Lexus tracking built in?

[WhiteHart]

3 hours ago, WhiteHart said:

piece

Sorry bad spelling. Peace is all I am looking for. 

[szhrmp]

3 hours ago, AWC said:

Shouldn't be a problem fitting a tracker but doesn't the NX have the Lexus tracking built in?

It is all about your comfort level - e.g. the hackers might find a way to break Lexus encryption, so their tracker/immobiliser will not work anymore (e.g. the garages will have a way to decrypt the traffic in order to generate you a new key).

Some aftermarket trackers give you a notification if somebody drives the car away without they key being present.

I prefer having several layers of security (and peace) 😀

 

[WhiteHart]

A reply from Lexus UK about Can-bus
 

I appreciate your enquiry and wish to understand how best to protect your vehicle, as we are aware of the rising trend in theft within the motor industry, to which we are sadly not immune.

The new generation Lexus NX has seen changes in production which do prevent the currently known can-bus style attacks from being effective. Having said this, we believe that criminal gangs are constantly working on new and novel tools and attack methods. 

Therefore we cannot offer any guarantee that any vehicle cannot be attacked via this method, sadly nor can we provide assurance that any vehicle cannot be stolen by the multitude of attack methods that are being employed in organised and well prepared criminal gangs. 

[WhiteHart]

Sadly had delay my booking for the Ghost as the COVID return to my house. So will book it again soon. 

[szhrmp]

I am just confused, some people seem to successfully manage to install the ghost on NX with model year 23 - but apparently this should not be possible.

maybe not all canbus traffic is encrypted ? Only the one going to the lights?