150w vacuum pump + 220v converter?

[Nooblexus]

Rx400h 2008.

150w ac vacuum pump.

12v 220v converter.

will it blow fuses?

How much Watts can rx400h put out for 2 hours straight?

[Nooblexus]

Or even maybe 180w to be safe

[steve2006]

I wouldn’t connect anything like an inverter to a hybrid 12 Volt auxiliary Battery, the Battery is not designed for a constant high current draw of around 15 Amps (roughly based on your wattage figures).

Even a standard 12 V 70 Ah car Battery would be lucky to last 4 hours before being flat.

 Could you explain a little more on what you are trying to do?

[ColinBarber]

1 hour ago, Nooblexus said:

Or even maybe 180w to be safe

The power outlet's are protected by a 15 A fuse but the sockets are not really designed to exceed 10 A. So 120 to 140 W depending on the voltage. If connecting anything of high power, even for a few minutes, you should put the vehicle into Ready mode so the power is supplied by the hybrid battery/petrol engine and not the 12 v aux Battery.

[Nooblexus]

Cool, sure i ll put the engine running, but I won't damage the car and won't blow fuses right?

Or 12v socket will blow? Seems like it would 100% blow or melt

Would it be a better idea to connect to 12v Battery directly and bypass a 10a 120w fuse? Not sure how to do it though with these commercial standard chinese converters 😞

 

How can these converters claim 300w output? How is that possible?

 

Must be connected directly to the Battery right?

 

 

 

I guess i have to find a converter with Battery clamps then, indeed, bad idea to suck juice out of 12v plug 

 

[scudney]

What exactly are you trying to do?? 🤔

[MJB18]

It's been a while since I did this stuff - but I think 150 Watts at 220 Volts is less than 1 Amp.

It'll depend on the efficiency of the 12 VDC to 220 VAC converter, but even if its only 25% efficient it will only pull 4 amps on the DC side.

But like I said - it's been a while so I might be talking b***cks!

 

[ColinBarber]

21 hours ago, Nooblexus said:

Cool, sure i ll put the engine running, but I won't damage the car and won't blow fuses right?

Or 12v socket will blow? Seems like it would 100% blow or melt

The fuse is there to prevent anything melting, but yes what you are suggesting is likely to blow the fuse.

You would need to put in a dedicated socket that can handle the current you are suggesting, with appropriate gauge cable and a fuse of suitable value near the Battery connection - or directly connect the converter to the Battery when you use it.

 

41 minutes ago, MJB18 said:

It's been a while since I did this stuff - but I think 150 Watts at 220 Volts is less than 1 Amp.

It'll depend on the efficiency of the 12 VDC to 220 VAC converter, but even if its only 25% efficient it will only pull 4 amps on the DC side.

But like I said - it's been a while so I might be talking b***cks!

It's only 0.7 A at 220 V but that would mean 12.5 A at 12 V even with no conversion losses. Power = voltage x current

[Nooblexus]

2 hours ago, MJB18 said:

It's been a while since I did this stuff - but I think 150 Watts at 220 Volts is less than 1 Amp.

It'll depend on the efficiency of the 12 VDC to 220 VAC converter, but even if its only 25% efficient it will only pull 4 amps on the DC side.

But like I said - it's been a while so I might be talking b***cks!

 

But 12v by 10 amp fuse is only 120 watts output safe max 

Ac vacuum pump wants 150watts+ for 1 hour continuously...

I almost bought a silly simple dc ac converter without Battery clamps

 

So i simply attach converter to Battery, start vacuum pump and then start the engine to charge Battery right?

[Nooblexus]

On 7/2/2023 at 1:44 PM, steve2006 said:

I wouldn’t connect anything like an inverter to a hybrid 12 Volt auxiliary battery, the battery is not designed for a constant high current draw of around 15 Amps (roughly based on your wattage figures).

Even a standard 12 V 70 Ah car battery would be lucky to last 4 hours before being flat.

 Could you explain a little more on what you are trying to do?

But it should not be a problem if i run ac vacuum pump for 40 minutes right?

I believe aux Battery is a small 40ah ?

 

Or 40a x 12v is 480 watts

Even if i don't run the engine (which i would of course ) it would take 

480w devided by 150 w roughly top max 3 hours continuesly?

Not a agm Battery for sure, i bet it would stop putting out 150w juice much earlier like at 2 hours?

 

Still safe with my 40 minutes required 

Is this a correct ish math ?

I won't damage main hybrid Battery right?

 

[Linas.P]

If you want more than 120W, then you should connect inverter to Battery directly, not via power outlet. That is not to say I recommend it, so be warned about it and do it at your own risk.

I have 2000W inverter connected directly to car Battery and was using successfully with vacuum (1600W) and with DA polisher (claims 800-1200W).

The alternator theoretically outputs 14.4V at 150A so that is 2160W, now obviously in practice it does not output as much, car need some power to run and you still want Battery charging, so I would say should never exceed 1000W continuous or 1500W peak. But if we talking about 300W continuous that would not be a problem.

[Nooblexus]

good, so walk in a park with my puny 150w vacuum pump 😉

thanks for the tip, bruv

 

PS. how much Watts does the engine need to start spinning initially let's same at summer and winter?

in rx400h is the aux Battery kick starts the engine or main hybrid batter?

if aux Battery can't provide enough juice will this high load demand spread onto the main hybrid Battery or is there a safety switch/fuse to prevent that... I hope?

 

[ColinBarber]

4 hours ago, Nooblexus said:

Or 40a x 12v is 480 watts

Even if i don't run the engine (which i would of course ) it would take 

480w devided by 150 w roughly top max 3 hours continuesly?

Not a agm battery for sure, i bet it would stop putting out 150w juice much earlier like at 2 hours?

 

Still safe with my 40 minutes required 

Is this a correct ish math ?

A normal lead acid Battery shouldn't be run down anywhere near to a completely discharged state as it damages it. Even going to 50% is not good for it so you would need to at least halve your figures.

4 hours ago, Nooblexus said:

I won't damage main hybrid battery right?

No

2 hours ago, Nooblexus said:

in rx400h is the aux battery kick starts the engine or main hybrid batter?

Hybrid Battery

 

2 hours ago, Nooblexus said:

if aux battery can't provide enough juice will this high load demand spread onto the main hybrid battery or is there a safety switch/fuse to prevent that... I hope?

No, not if the vehicle is not in 'Ready' mode. If the vehicle isn't Ready then all 12 V systems are being powered by the aux Battery. Once you are in Ready mode then the hybrid system is supplying 14.4 V, charging the aux Battery and powering all 12 V systems. The petrol engine will then cut in/out as required to keep the hybrid Battery at a minimum state of charge.

[Linas.P]

To be fair I don't know the complications that are introduced by hybrid Battery.

On conventional car I connected it directly to starter Battery leads (which in your case is aux battery) and when engine is running my starter Battery did not lose any charger (in fact it got fully charged in mean time). This means alternator was enough to both power the polisher/vacuum and charge Battery. In such way the starter Battery basically becomes a large capacitor which absorbs any peaks. Checking with multimeter the alternator was still outputting 12.8-13.2V with the load.

Now in hybrid case I don't know if the hybrid Battery would be impacted in any way. 

[Bluemarlin]

In a hybrid there's no alternator, so the 12v Battery directly powers any accessories and is charged by the hybrid Battery. That in turn is charged by the engine. So, as long the car is in ready mode, with the ability to run the engine, the hybrid Battery will remain charged as it keeps the 12v Battery charged.

So, in ready mode, your running time is down to how much petrol you have. In theory, the maximum practical power output will depend on cable size/length and fuses, and whether the hybrid Battery can keep the 12v Battery above 50% faster than you're drawing from it. Connecting direct to the 12v Battery, with a sufficiently sized and fused cable, will take the onboard fuses out of the equation.

That's my understanding of it.

If you want to be really specific then you'd need to  know the charging output of the hybrid Battery, and you can also find various calculators on boating and motorhome sites, where using 12v batteries with inverters are an everyday thing.

 

[ColinBarber]

17 minutes ago, Bluemarlin said:

If you want to be really specific then you'd need to  know the charging output of the hybrid battery, and you can also find various calculators on boating and motorhome sites, where using 12v batteries with inverters are an everyday thing.

The DC-DC converter has a 120 A rating, so around 1700 W and is actually fused at 120 A. The car itself is going to use around 300 W when in Ready mode without the lights being on so in theory you can load up to around 1400 W without draining the aux Battery, although I wouldn't recommend going that close to max capacity as it's going to be a real pain to replace the 120 A fuse if you blow it.

[Nooblexus]

3 hours ago, Bluemarlin said:

In a hybrid there's no alternator, so the 12v battery directly powers any accessories and is charged by the hybrid battery. That in turn is charged by the engine. So, as long the car is in ready mode, with the ability to run the engine, the hybrid battery will remain charged as it keeps the 12v battery charged.

 

 

how is hybrid Battery being charged by the engine then if not via alternator?

[ColinBarber]

13 minutes ago, Nooblexus said:

how is hybrid battery being charged by the engine then if not via alternator?

The hybrid system contains an electrical generator within the transmission that charges the hybrid Battery and can power the electric motor

[NemesisUK]

 Don't leave the transmission in N as the system can't recharge the hybrid Battery even if the engine is running.

[Nooblexus]

Duly noted, merci