IS300H

[HotSpur-Lexus]

Ladies & Gents, 

 

New to the forum - just awaiting my sign up details to be approved before logging as myself.

I have a question I hope you guys can help advise on.

I was at a Lexus dealer (in the UK) today and looking at an IS300H to be used as a daily and city car, wife has an SUV and I have a performance car that I use rarely on sunny days, but need something that I can use regularly, jump in and just drive, no fuss and have been looking at either and IS300h (approx. 2018) or an E220 CDI (approx. 2017) - there is little difference in the price of the two cars and there are an abundance of vehicles available at both MB and Lexus to choose from.

I really want something that is turn key, and go...ULEZ will be an issue as more cities turn that way...and I will be using it to teach my son (17yo) to drive, he is happy to learn in an Auto as Manual's are all but a thing of the past for the mainstream (IMHO).

I wanted to glean reliability of a IS300H circa 2018, as I am tired of unreliability (BMW and older Mercedes) in not so much the cost to put right, but the time it takes to sort and loss of car whilst repaired.

If anyone with experience can advise on IS300H reliability, aswell as thoughts of IS300H vs E220 CDi (I know the C-class is more of a direct rival, but I hate the stick on iPAD they have so it's IS or E in terms of my short list).

 

Any insights and thoughts would be helpful.

 

Also not too clued up on spec, so is it in ascending order Executive then Advance then Premium,....and then later Comfort when came along how does that fit in?

 

Thanks

HS

[Herbie]

I don't know much about the IS300h specifically but Lexus reliability is excellent.

If you pay for a service plan at the dealership it's a bit expensive as opposed to servicing at a local garage but two great advantages are that you lock in to todays prices, therefore avoiding any price rises and also each service qualifies the car for a 12-month warranty (called Relax) that is available until the car is 10 years old or 100k miles. You also get an annual Hybrid Health Check that covers warrants the high voltage traction Battery for the next 12-months and that can go on until the car reaches 15 years old. If you want to service the car elswehere, a stand-alone Hybrid Health Check can be done at the dealers for about £60.

The biggest "problem" with hybrids is that they do need to be used regularly or the 12V Battery goes flat quite quickly if it's not used. Some people use a trickle charger if it's not going to be used for, say, about four weeks - they only have a small capacity.

If you've never had a hybrid before, they're brilliant but a little quirky. For instance, they have no starter motor, no alternator, and anything that would normally be belt-driven from the engine is instead, electric, because the engine doesn't run all the time.

The hybrid system 'starts' the car by booting the computers and getting it into READY mode. When it needs the petrol engine to run it energises MG1 (a 650V motor/generator) and uses that to spin the engine up to 1,000rpm, before applying petrol and a spark to ignite it.

The aircon compressor is run by a 500V 3-phase AC variable frequency motor and I think the power steering is run by a 48V motor.

I'd tell you more but my tea's ready

[RONNIE W HODGEKINSON]

If you Can Push the Boat Out Go for The NX300h It is One AMAZING Car And Has everything you Will Ever Need..In My Lifetime It Ranks as Thee Bestest car I Have EVER owned...!!!! And The Lexus Relax 10 Year Warranty Is just the Icing on The Cake... Welcome To Lexus..!!!  Ron

[Notamech]

It all depends on your use case frankly. I came from a w212 e class with an OM651 engine which I sold because of ULEZ. While it was  was a fantastic car that i enjoyed several trips in it did have its fair share of problems at only 65k miles. It was a diesel and I would often hear a chain rattle on startup. Was advised that tensioners failing on these is common. Additionally the engine mounts were shot quite early and required replacing. Even towards the end i had an issue where the parking brake would stick and one of the door speakers would intermittently cut out. Also the driving dynamics were pretty bad given that its a big floaty barge. It did quite poorly on the hills of snowdonia with very bad understeer and some amount of roll. It had a diesel motor but my use is primarily in the city doing around 10-15 miles a day it would take long to heat up and at the back of my mind i was always worried about the egr and spf clogging up but it never did for as long as i owned it. It was verrrry comfortable and spacious though. I loved driving it on the motorway. And the interiors i thought were very well designed. The standard sound system on that was better too. If considering the merc make sure you read up on the engine and its reliability. I think the W213 (the one you're considering) had some issues with the cam lobes & rockers prematurely wearing on the 2.0l Diesel. Im not sure about the petrols.

 

Comparatively i find the IS 300hs interiors do not feel as premium as the Mercedes and since its a more sport oriented design vs comfort it is not as comfortable or spacious. The standard sound system is terrible so if you're looking at this get a prenium nav system with the upgraded sound system. But other than that the car is fantastic. So far much better ownership experience than the mercedes. Only had to change the waterpump at 90k. Everything else just normal service items. Super smooth and reliable. I feel good about not polluting as much as i did with the non ulez compliant diesel. The car heats up incredibly fast which is very useful in the winter. There's no problem with doing short 5-10 mile journeys just change the oil earlier but don't have to worry about dpf or egr clogging. I find the pickup at roundabouts to be much better than the merc. I get a better mileage and the tax is much lower. More conpa t as well for city use. Driving dynamics are much better than the e class. Also lexus offer a 10 year warranty on cars under 100k if they're serviced annually at lexus. 

 

If I had to do it over again. I would stick with the lexus brand due to reliability and performance of the hybrid drive train but would spend a bit more and get a GS300/GS450 h premiere instead. Primarily for the additional comfort and luxury but with similar driving dynamics to an IS. 

[DBIZO]

21 hours ago, HotSpur-Lexus said:

Ladies & Gents, 

 

New to the forum - just awaiting my sign up details to be approved before logging as myself.

I have a question I hope you guys can help advise on.

I was at a Lexus dealer (in the UK) today and looking at an IS300H to be used as a daily and city car, wife has an SUV and I have a performance car that I use rarely on sunny days, but need something that I can use regularly, jump in and just drive, no fuss and have been looking at either and IS300h (approx. 2018) or an E220 CDI (approx. 2017) - there is little difference in the price of the two cars and there are an abundance of vehicles available at both MB and Lexus to choose from.

I really want something that is turn key, and go...ULEZ will be an issue as more cities turn that way...and I will be using it to teach my son (17yo) to drive, he is happy to learn in an Auto as Manual's are all but a thing of the past for the mainstream (IMHO).

I wanted to glean reliability of a IS300H circa 2018, as I am tired of unreliability (BMW and older Mercedes) in not so much the cost to put right, but the time it takes to sort and loss of car whilst repaired.

If anyone with experience can advise on IS300H reliability, aswell as thoughts of IS300H vs E220 CDi (I know the C-class is more of a direct rival, but I hate the stick on iPAD they have so it's IS or E in terms of my short list).

 

Any insights and thoughts would be helpful.

 

Also not too clued up on spec, so is it in ascending order Executive then Advance then Premium,....and then later Comfort when came along how does that fit in?

 

Thanks

HS

Which? magazine‘s customer survey ranks Lexus’ reliability at top. You’ll find people on this forum consider the IS300h an example of that. Things can always go wrong, but the IS300h is probably as good as fault rates get. The engine is naturally aspirated, the transmission uses step-less (continuous) gearing, the hybrid system is mature and helps reduce wear of the engine and breaks. It’s a very different car to the German peers, you best go for a test drive if you haven’t driven Toyota’s eCVT transaxle before.

As for trim, the higher the better, go for Advance at minimum, and higher if you expect more driving assistance (lane keep, blind spot) and premium car hifi.

A weak point of the car is the small 12V starter Battery. If you plan on leaving the car for more than a week, particularly at an airport, I’d ask the dealer to fit a brand new one when negotiating the details. You never know how long the car spent on the dealer’s forecourt or in a private garage, unused. Deep discharge reduces the useful lifetime of lead acid batteries. I learned this the hard way. 

Another thing to understand is this car likes to be warmed up to feel awake. This is because without the full potential of the hybrid Battery if mot charged or cold, the Atkinson engine is rather torque poor at low revs, making it sometime feel sluggish.  

Overall, it’s a very dependable, pleasant machine. 

 

 

 

[GMB]

I think, go left field and go Wartburg. Cheap economical, free smog. It's the future of motoring in the UK.

[Notamech]

I had an older w212 facelift e class before the is300h. While not the same e class you are considering i can summarise the pros and cons of both. But can say that which car is best for you will depend on your needs more than anything. 

E-class pros :

-Better, more premium feeling interiors. 

- Very luxurious and spacious

- Soft ride quality good on bumps and cruising on motorways but bad on hills

- The standard sound system is decent

Cons: 

- Things break down quite often. In my 1 year of ownership. My timing chain tensioner was on its way out, i had to replace engine mounts at just 65k and i had a turbo pipe split. All of which were expensive repairs. 

- even when selling it. I had an issue with the parking brake getting stuck and a door speaker cutting out intermittently

- The ride i thought was too soft. Good for comfort on a motorway but not good for a B road or hills. 

- I did feel a tad bit guilty about polluting as mine was an older non ad-blue version 

The model you are considering is newer so wont have all the same issues but the 2.0 l diesel variant i think had problems with tappets and lobes wearing out prematurely requiring replacement. I personally wont be going back to any European car brand anytime soon nor would recommend it if buying out of warranty. 

Is300h:

Pros

-  So far ive only had to replace a waterpump at 90k which is fair and understandable. 

- No dpf to get clogged up. Especially since my main use is short city drives

-Very smooth and quiet drive

- Found it more powerful than the merc that I had especially at roundabouts the car moves when i want it to. The merc had a 1 second hesitation that i thought was a bit dangerous. 

- Dont feel guilty about polluting. 

- The tax is super low £10 for my 2014 exec is300h vs 130 that i used to pay for the merc

- Driving dynamics are a bit better at higher speeds. The ride is harsher on my 18 inch wheels but the handling is much better. Very predictable and i didn't experience any understeer or roll around bends. 

-Most maintenence is very easy to do and can be done DIY as well once the car is older and if you plan to keep it long

- Slightly more compact and better to manoeuvre in the city

-Looks stunning. I found the merc ugly in comparison but this is subjective 

-10 year 100k mile warranty if serviced with lexus. So more peace of mind. 

Cons:

-Interior while decent is not as luxurious and premium feeling as the merc. Again subjective. 

- Given it was designed to have a sportier feel. It is a bit cramped and feels less spacious. Rather everything feels very snug. The boot definitely has less space than an e class. I struggled to fit my kids stroller and luggage in the is300h. The merc would wallop a whole load. 

Overall id say youve got to decide what your priorities are and decide accordingly. But the lexus is definitely one with lesser issues. 

[Linas.P]

As far as reliability goes IS300h will basically have no competitors, there is nothing in the same league on either BMW or MB side. 

IMHO - IS300h has plenty of flaws of it's own, but you said you have performance car so perhaps it is not relevant for you. But reliability isn't one of the issues with the car, so if that is your only criteria, then go for it.

Just a side comment... I do agree that manual is dead for mainstream, but I would still insist to learn how to drive on manual. Whenever it will be needed or not it won't hurt. 

[Herbie]

26 minutes ago, Linas.P said:

I do agree that manual is dead for mainstream, but I would still insist to learn how to drive on manual. Whenever it will be needed or not it won't hurt. 

Seconded.

Pass in a manual and you automatically get to drive autos too, but not the other way round.

[HotSpur-Lexus]

An update - Whilst I liked the IS300H...I was looking online last night and took a liking to the ES300H so went back to the dealer today and bought an ES instead.

Guess I need to head over to the ES board now.

Thanks for your comments all - appreciate everyone who took the time to reply.

[Tony1452]

15 hours ago, HotSpur-Lexus said:

An update - Whilst I liked the IS300H...I was looking online last night and took a liking to the ES300H so went back to the dealer today and bought an ES instead.

Guess I need to head over to the ES board now.

Thanks for your comments all - appreciate everyone who took the time to reply.

Hi, I bought my Lexus from Lexus Leicester. Had it since August 2021. Great people to deal with from the moment I phoned them to enquire about the car after seeing it on their website. I travelled from the Wirral to complete the deal and didn’t have to be persuaded to take out their annual servicing plan. I pay just over £41 a month (cheap as chips)for it and it includes the 12 month warranty. I use the local Lexus dealership, who always collect it and return it to me same day. It went in for a recall last week and when it was brought back to me, their driver had put a couple of gallons of juice in it. 
I don’t do many miles and it’s still hasn’t covered 40k miles. If I needed to sell it, not that I will, I’d still get a decent amount for it. 
As I said to a member of the staff I spoke to last week: I’ve had cars since 1966, and never been without one. Throughout all of those years, Lexus are best people I’ve ever had dealings with. They put the customer first, unlike many other dealerships who aren’t interested once you’ve driven your purchase off their forecourt.

Enjoy your new car, I can’t fault my Lexus.

Edited April 24, 2023 by Tony1452
Correct grammar

[Thackeray]

As you've now bought an ES, I'm a bit late to comment on the IS300h but I'd second what others have said. I've had mine for six years and nothing has needed repairing or failed. I've had new tyres and just to be on the safe side I decided to buy a new 12v Battery even though the car has never failed to start. But nothing else has been needed apart from annual service. I wouldn't go back to Mercedes because the better reliability of Lexus is something I put a high value on.

I have the impression that although German (and come to that French and Italian) car makers do brilliant engineering design, they haven't cracked the factory process in the way Toyota and other Asian makers have. So I would guess that the ES will be just as reliable as my experience of the IS

[Digifant]

Well, I own mine for 4 years. It was 20k on the clock at purchase date. I completely satisfied with it, but I can't say that reliabiltiy is something exceptional. Just as good as other good car makers. 

I would recomend you to begin from thinking where are you going to maintain and repair your next car. I mean at dealer or by yourself or at garage. Merc has more spare parts makers to choose out there, lexus, expensive OE or cheap sh*t. 

P.S. I had some issues with my car which a bit disapointed me, not much, but I never had the small starter Battery issue, even when I stuck in europe for half year during covid, while my car was standing without movement all that time. And the Battery is still factory!!!)))

[IS300FSPORT]

9 hours ago, Digifant said:

Well, I own mine for 4 years. It was 20k on the clock at purchase date. I completely satisfied with it, but I can't say that reliabiltiy is something exceptional. Just as good as other good car makers. 

I would recomend you to begin from thinking where are you going to maintain and repair your next car. I mean at dealer or by yourself or at garage. Merc has more spare parts makers to choose out there, lexus, expensive OE or cheap sh*t. 

P.S. I had some issues with my car which a bit disapointed me, not much, but I never had the small starter battery issue, even when I stuck in europe for half year during covid, while my car was standing without movement all that time. And the battery is still factory!!!)))

Do you mind sharing what issues you have experienced?

[Digifant]

3 hours ago, IS300FSPORT said:

Do you mind sharing what issues you have experienced?

Sure. Currently my car has about 45k miles on a dash. No road accidents. Very well maintained and beloved. 

1 Front axle clear balljoint/bushing free play. Still has to be solved, but more likely it's control arms rear bushings, I've spotted cracks in rubber there.

2 Propshaft and differential rubber joint big cracks and it already has free play in there. The most pain about it that you can't get it sepparately from propeller shaft. Probably because of it's ballanced on factory as a one complete unit.

3 Front brake pads accesories failure. Meantime the pads are not even at half life from new.

4 Transmission. at speed of +- 55mph light vibration noise. 

5 Tyre wear issue. I know that it's common to that model, but I totally disagree that it is normal.

6 Weak paintwork. rust spot begin to appear. Have no doubt that it's factory painted.

7 Decreasing fuel economy issue. When I bought the car it was about 45mpg. now it's 39mpg. I wouldn't add this to that list, but somebody said here about clogging dpf and egr. so I have no doubt that this issue is because of clogging fuel injectors, oxigen sensors and e.t.c. I find it comparable problem.

 

[IS300FSPORT]

@Digifant Thanks for sharing. In all honesty I wouldnt deem them as reliability issues.

Front axle ball joint failure, prop shaft, transmission. 

Subject to road conditions & potentially a rough driving style by the previous owner, pot holes etc. May be wear and tear?

brake pads accessories damp conditions with the car being sat idle will not help owners will start to see seized brakes

Paint work I have to agree with chips very easily if untreated will rust.

Tyre problem again I agree no real reason for abnormal wear if pressures and alignment are spot on. 

Fuel economy maybe because of winter your seeing a dip.

Overall Lexus is a reliable brand less of the electronic gremlins, & engine issues is where they win. However the suspension components are like any other car neglected roads certainly do not help.

Im sure if you compared it to the similar cars in its class it will take the win 3 series, A4, C class etc. Compare MOT failure rate by manufacturer theres no debate.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/105772/best-and-worst-cars-mot-pass-rates-revealed%3famp

[GMB]

The only issue that I have come across with the IS cars that I own is stone chips. I can't really blame Lexus for that.

Both cars are spot on - up to now🙂. I would be a bit concerned if I had so many issues and hope that you get them easily resolved.  BTW IsF is 2012 and 200t is 2017.

Maybe lexus quality standards are slipping a bit because the IsF feels bulletproof whereas the 200t feels a bit less solidly built, if that makes sense.

Fingers crossed🙀🤞.

 

[HotSpur-Lexus]

Thanks all - interesting read and introduction to Lexus ownership - my car yet to arrive, it is however imminent...I hear from this and other threads as well as people that the IS300H is pretty bulletproof particularly the engines, drivetrain and hybrid system which is a result of years of producing these cars and perfecting the mechanics...what I also understand is that the ES300H is practically the same major engine, eCVT and Battery components as the IS300H, therefore I expect (or hope) that it will be equally as reliable.

I have also found that this Lexus forum compared to some BMW ones that I have been on for years is far more welcoming, informative, has less sarcastic and malicious actors, and thus a valuable resource and place to visit to learn more about the brand and ownership.

Thanks once again.

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, HotSpur-Lexus said:

Thanks all - interesting read and introduction to Lexus ownership - my car yet to arrive, it is however imminent...I hear from this and other threads as well as people that the IS300H is pretty bulletproof particularly the engines, drivetrain and hybrid system which is a result of years of producing these cars and perfecting the mechanics...what I also understand is that the ES300H is practically the same major engine, eCVT and battery components as the IS300H, therefore I expect (or hope) that it will be equally as reliable.

I have also found that this Lexus forum compared to some BMW ones that I have been on for years is far more welcoming, informative, has less sarcastic and malicious actors, and thus a valuable resource and place to visit to learn more about the brand and ownership.

Thanks once again.

The ES has the next generation hybrid system compared to the IS, I believe the engine is a new version as well, I came from an IS to an ES, no problems with the IS but don’t regret the change

[Digifant]

On 4/25/2023 at 2:45 PM, IS300FSPORT said:

@Digifant Thanks for sharing. In all honesty I wouldnt deem them as reliability issues.

Front axle ball joint failure, prop shaft, transmission. 

Subject to road conditions & potentially a rough driving style by the previous owner, pot holes etc. May be wear and tear?

Brake pads accessories damp conditions with the car being sat idle will not help owners will start to see seized brakes

Paint work I have to agree with chips very easily if untreated will rust.

Tyre problem again I agree no real reason for abnormal wear if pressures and alignment are spot on. 

Fuel economy maybe because of winter your seeing a dip.

Overall Lexus is a reliable brand less of the electronic gremlins, & engine issues is where they win. However the suspension components are like any other car neglected roads certainly do not help.

Im sure if you compared it to the similar cars in its class it will take the win 3 series, A4, C class etc. Compare MOT failure rate by manufacturer theres no debate.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/105772/best-and-worst-cars-mot-pass-rates-revealed%3famp

Regards to road conditions, definitely not rough style of driving, most likely not previous owner because at the time when I bought the car everything was alright. I'm not sure about the propshaft joint but in front axle was very good. But I do agree that amount of speed bumps is a real trouble for suspension reliability.

Brakes have been well maintained but it still didn't help. 

Totally agree with the chips on the the hood or wheel arch but my paint issue is in the middle of the inside engine bay.

Fuel economy. no, no dip in winter. I will check again after I will replace bushings, tires and do alignments. 

I'm not denying that Lexus is still reliable car but it's definitely not an obvious win comparing the others. These MOT statistics doesn't make sense at all. MOT just says that the cars safe enough to use, but it doesn't say that it is in good condition. It's very subjective. I have extended warranty and MOT passing at Lexus dealer. When I pointed on my front axle issue, they checked and say that it's good and gave me Mot, meantime it's not good. Tire skipping is definitely not good when I turn the steering to lock. That's why I always sceptic about warranty and MOTs.