New owner of IS200t advice, tunes?

Kam_Lexus_IS_200t · April 13, 2023

Hi all I'm a new member here having just registered today. I've just bought my IS200t late last year with just over 19k mileage and having owned it for the last couple of months I've come to love it a lot. It is a premier edition and one of the main things I wanted was adaptive cruise so I jumped to the opportunity to buy this Premier under the assumption that all Premier models came with this (I was wrong, they don't), so I'm glad I bought the one which had this option fitted although I'm quite disappointed that this was not fitted to Premiers as standard.

Nevertheless, I wanted a IS200t over the IS300h and IS250 because of the power, direct shift gearbox (which I assume is a dual cultch correct me if I'm wrong) and turbo power of course. I've enjoyed the car a lot but wonder if I could push it beyond 241.2bhp and 350nm of torque. I would love to hear what power levels are achievable with ECU tunes, air intakes and maybe an exhaust system but I'm keen on keeping the same exhaust as I don't like loud exhaust. My understanding is that this car does use the same gearbox as the IS350 and the same brakes as well so there is room for a performance gains without effecting the wear and tear levels of the gearbox. However, I'm not expect and I'm quite new to all this and would love to hear everyone's opinion on all of the above.

And on another note I'd like to know if there are some things I need to be weary of in terms of things going wrong and maintenance. It is a rare car in this country with 130 or so sold with 20 of these being Premiers, so I'd like to look after it to the best of my abilities.

Thanks in advance for your recommendation and advice it's much appreciated.

rayaans · April 13, 2023

There aren't any tunes available due to the ECU being locked.

However, tuning boxes are available such as racechip which do give some gains albeit not what is advertised

Kam_Lexus_IS_200t · April 13, 2023

I assumed it is a difficult ECU to deal with and in terms of tuning boxes I both hate and like them I hate the idea of having something plugged in all the time and bits of plug in things in the engine bay. But I do like the idea that it can be removed quite easily.

Would love to know if 300bhp and 450nm is achievable and would would it take?

Linas.P · April 13, 2023

54 minutes ago, Kam_Lexus_IS_200t said:

Hi all I'm a new member here having just registered today. I've just bought my IS200t late last year with just over 19k mileage and having owned it for the last couple of months I've come to love it a lot. It is a premier edition and one of the main things I wanted was adaptive cruise so I jumped to the opportunity to buy this Premier under the assumption that all Premier models came with this (I was wrong, they don't), so I'm glad I bought the one which had this option fitted although I'm quite disappointed that this was not fitted to Premiers as standard.

Nevertheless, I wanted a IS200t over the IS300h and IS250 because of the power, direct shift gearbox (which I assume is a dual cultch correct me if I'm wrong) and turbo power of course. I've enjoyed the car a lot but wonder if I could push it beyond 241.2bhp and 350nm of torque. I would love to hear what power levels are achievable with ECU tunes, air intakes and maybe an exhaust system but I'm keen on keeping the same exhaust as I don't like loud exhaust. My understanding is that this car does use the same gearbox as the IS350 and the same brakes as well so there is room for a performance gains without effecting the wear and tear levels of the gearbox. However, I'm not expect and I'm quite new to all this and would love to hear everyone's opinion on all of the above.

And on another note I'd like to know if there are some things I need to be weary of in terms of things going wrong and maintenance. It is a rare car in this country with 130 or so sold with 20 of these being Premiers, so I'd like to look after it to the best of my abilities.

Thanks in advance for your recommendation and advice it's much appreciated.

The only difference between Premier and F-Sport is that Premier had an option for adaptive cruise, whereas F-Sport didn't even had an option, basically you could not get adaptive cruise on F-Sport even if you wanted to pay all money in the world for it (Lexus is just weird)! My personal opinion - you missing out on F-Sport dials which is kind of party peace of this model and adaptive cruise on IS was never really great, it is not "all speed system" like on NX, RX, LS, LC... basically it is older system which cut's off below 30MPH. The all speed system is actually good. The facelift (from ~2018) got LSS+ which includes Adaptive cruise on all models.

Everyone to their own, but the engine was worst part in my experience (I had RC200t) and as a matter of fact old IS250 keeps-up with RC200t all the way to ~45-50MPH and only the 200t takes off. So for most part 200t isn't even faster despite having 30 more HP. Where it does get faster is from ~60 to 100MPH sort of range, at that point it really feels strong, but in UK that is jail territory. Gearbox isn't dual clutch, it is still torque converter, but it is quite good 8-speed gearbox (AA81E) - very similar to IS-F, RC-F and indeed same as RC350. I think the only difference from IS-F is that AA81-E comes without external cooler, whereas AA80E has it, sadly I found it to be poor match the the short power band engine... just keeps hunting for gears.

Anyhow... back to your question about the tune. As Rayaan said - just not possible, but not only because ECU is locked. You actually can get more power unless you replace turbo as well. The turbo fitted to 8FARTS mazes out at 17PSI... and that is what it is already running at from the factory, so to get more power, you need more air and to get more air you need different turbo. So yes, it is not possible because of ECU, but it is further not possible without a turbo.

What you can do instead, you can tune (or hack) ETC as it has built-in delay. Lexus calls "unintended acceleration prevention", which is made for dumb americans who keeps crashing into the gates and shops. Removing that delay would improve response and some say may cut 1s from 0-60. Apart of that what is left are only cosmetic mods.

21 minutes ago, Kam_Lexus_IS_200t said:

I assumed it is a difficult ECU to deal with and in terms of tuning boxes I both hate and like them I hate the idea of having something plugged in all the time and bits of plug in things in the engine bay. But I do like the idea that it can be removed quite easily.

Would love to know if 300bhp and 450nm is achievable and would would it take?

Tuning boxes don't work on 200t either. People claim they do, but take it to dyno and there is no difference... the only thing they can do is to remove that delay and that is all.

To get it to 300hp you need new turbo (£1000-2000) and new aftermarket ECU (£1000-£1800) - something like https://linkecu.com or https://www.haltech.com, then some custom boards to control your dash (probably £80 in parts, but you need to write your arduino code yourself) and finally tune (£500). I don't believe it needs any other work as Lexus tuned it very conservatively. Gearbox, suspension and brakes are already from IS350, so they are good enough. So I reckon £4000-£5000 and you can have 300hp... as well you likely will be the first one to do it in UK.

I honestly don't believe it is worth it, it would be cheaper to get different car and you probably would have some spare money left. But you are more than welcome to try 🙂

Kam_Lexus_IS_200t · April 13, 2023

Firstly I’d like to say that I appreciate your detailed response and yes I agree that Lexus can be weird at times. The lexus LFA dash is a thing that I am missing out on, oh well. On the topic of cruise control did you state that the IS200t facelift variant has adaptive cruise control at all speeds? And I wonder what it whether it still uses laser based or radar. From my understanding the older one which mine is uses laser which can cut out in heavy rain or snow.

After reading all that you have stated it’s not worth upgrading anything really and what I should be doing is appreciate the strong reliability of Lexus’ in general compared to German revivals. If really wanted power I could have gone for a 340i or something but reliability and owning something a bit more less bland and more rarely is certainly better. So what are the positives of this car that you would note?

And on the topic of reliability would you regard this as a reliable car not just in terms of comparing this to NA Lexus’ because NAs tend to be more reliable anyways but in terms of comparing this to a VW Golf R, BMW or Audi for example?

In short, I was looking for a saloon that is stylish, extremely reliable, fast enough to be fun, comfortable with a good sound system. Hopefully, I hit the mark with this one unless there was a better car out there that ticked all those boxes.

I forgot to mention how do you even go about removing the “unintended acceleration prevention”?

Linas.P · April 13, 2023

20 minutes ago, Kam_Lexus_IS_200t said:

On the topic of cruise control did you state that the IS200t facelift variant has adaptive cruise control at all speeds?

After reading all that you have stated it’s not worth upgrading anything really and what I should be doing is appreciate the strong reliability of Lexus’ in general compared to German revivals.

And on the topic of reliability would you regard this as a reliable car not just in terms of comparing this to NA Lexus’ because NAs tend to be more reliable anyways but in terms of comparing this to a VW Golf R, BMW or Audi for example?

So what are the positives of this car that you would note?

I forgot to mention how do you even go about removing the “unintended acceleration prevention”?

It would have had it (it does have it in other markets), but there was never a facelift of IS200t in UK. In (end of) 2016 Lexus simply dropped IS250 and IS200t models as they were not selling at all. I am not sure if it is full speed system or not, or if it is laser, I just know it is now fitted to all Lexus and Toyota as standard (since ~2017-2019 depending on the model).

Yes sadly Lexus are not really "tuning friendly" cars... I as well forgotten to mention that 300hp would have been about the limit anyway and any gains after that would have been impossible. The main reason is that the engine has integrated header (part of the block), so there is no way of making higher power beyond ~280-320hp as the header would become bottleneck.

In terms of reliability it is hard to say, I don't think judgement is out yet, but Lexus sold a lot of them worldwide (they are called IS/RC300 in the rest of the world) and so far everything seems to be reliable. On mine driver seat motor failed and Lexus warranty picked-up the bill (£4200), but I reckon that could have happened to any car and it is not mechanical. Apart of that I sold mine with 70k miles and up-to that point there were not a single issue with engine, gearbox, suspension or anything else... so I would consider it as reliable if my example is anything to go by.

You know - it is sad to say, but there were not many good things that I can think of. There is running joke on this forum about me owning the car "just for the looks", but that was about it. I loved the looks of mk3 IS when it launched and always wanted one, RC was even better in my opinion, so I decided I will get it one day. Had RC300h for weekend and hated it - just too slow, then there was opportunity to get RC200t for very good price and I went for it. Car was fully loaded, had every possible option and the colour combo I liked, so I guess that is what I liked about the car, and I am kind of completionist, so I don't like to see any placeholder buttons or read about the features my car could have had, this one had everything. It was surprisingly practical, folding rear seats, it was in good condition... but as far as 200t engine is concerned, not much good I can say. Fuel consumption was bad (worse than RC-F - literally), the gearbox itself was good, but I think Lexus didn't properly adjust it for the engine, so it was indecisive and hunting for gears. I guess in summary - the price was right, the car was loaded, I actually sold it for more than I bought it for, so all in all quite lucky, but just couldn't live with that engine. If they had RC350 in UK that would be my choice. By the way car is for sale now again, seems like the new owner was only able to live with it for a year as well - https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202210010315645

They are indeed stylish and reliable, Premier has ML so I am sure sound system is good... would it be better with 3.5 V6... likely... I never understood why Lexus decided not to bring IS/RC350 here - they are faster and more fuel efficient, but we just can't have them here for some reason. Maybe one day when they get cheaper I will go onto the mission to engine swap one... as a matter of fact it should be quite straightforward deal, 2GR-FSE should be pretty much bolt on and with 306hp representing significant improvement, the rest of the car is already identical.

Regarding reprogramming ETC - I know it is possible, but I don't know any place that I could recommend to do it. Basically the difference from ECU is that throttle controls are not encrypted and could be exported changed and reimported, basically just making throttle more responsive, but sadly I don't have much more info about it. There was somebody claiming on here to have done it to their IS200t, so maybe they will come along and share how it's done.

Kam_Lexus_IS_200t · April 14, 2023

I was under the same assumption that the IS200t facelifts never made it to the UK but a few weeks ago I was proven wrong by this one https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202303235538837. I genuinely thought someone listed their IS300h as an IS200t but it is indeed an genuine facelift IS200t. I guess a few slipped by before Lexus stop selling these in the UK.

The Lexus I have didn’t have it’s previous services carried out at Lexus but I’m hoping to get it done at Lexus to gain that 1 years warranty that you get with every service and as I fear the electrics may be something that may fail rather than mechanical as you pointed out with your seat motor. And on that note I noticed someone minor I’m not sure if it’s me but when I press or hold the boot release button near the steering wheel it never works? I know it works on the key but it don’t work when I press that maybe because my engine is on but will need to double check that hopefully it ain’t a fault.

Whatever case may be with power I still believe it’s enough to be fun and I enjoy it to be fair and far better than a CVT 300h. I also like the fact non of the vents are fake *cough Audi and Kai*.

In terms of fuel it isn’t that bad at first I thought it was and it is when driving locally in congested traffic but on long motorway drive it does do well last week I managed 39.1 mpg the highest I’ve ever gotten. I doubt the IS350 or RC F can manage high number likes that. But yes it is disappointing when driving around town I did expect it to better than that.

And yes the ML is fantastic and given the opportunity I would jump to buy an IS350 if there were any sold here which they weren’t unfortunately. But a 3.5 V6 won’t do good in fuel economy, road tax and even to insurance so another thing to consider. I’m also super curious whoever converted their IS200t to a 3.5l V6 and where do you even get an engine like that from apart from importing it?

Mr_Groundhog · April 14, 2023

1 hour ago, Kam_Lexus_IS_200t said:

I was under the same assumption that the IS200t facelifts never made it to the UK but a few weeks ago I was proven wrong by this one https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202303235538837. I genuinely thought someone listed their IS300h as an IS200t but it is indeed an genuine facelift IS200t. I guess a few slipped by before Lexus stop selling these in the UK.

The Lexus I have didn’t have it’s previous services carried out at Lexus but I’m hoping to get it done at Lexus to gain that 1 years warranty that you get with every service and as I fear the electrics may be something that may fail rather than mechanical as you pointed out with your seat motor. And on that note I noticed someone minor I’m not sure if it’s me but when I press or hold the boot release button near the steering wheel it never works? I know it works on the key but it don’t work when I press that maybe because my engine is on but will need to double check that hopefully it ain’t a fault.

Whatever case may be with power I still believe it’s enough to be fun and I enjoy it to be fair and far better than a CVT 300h. I also like the fact non of the vents are fake *cough Audi and Kai*.

In terms of fuel it isn’t that bad at first I thought it was and it is when driving locally in congested traffic but on long motorway drive it does do well last week I managed 39.1 mpg the highest I’ve ever gotten. I doubt the IS350 or RC F can manage high number likes that. But yes it is disappointing when driving around town I did expect it to better than that.

And yes the ML is fantastic and given the opportunity I would jump to buy an IS350 if there were any sold here which they weren’t unfortunately. But a 3.5 V6 won’t do good in fuel economy, road tax and even to insurance so another thing to consider. I’m also super curious whoever converted their IS200t to a 3.5l V6 and where do you even get an engine like that from apart from importing it?

What's the mileage like (actual real life mileage) in the city, B-roads, motorways... ?

Linas.P · April 14, 2023

1 hour ago, Kam_Lexus_IS_200t said:

I was under the same assumption that the IS200t facelifts never made it to the UK but a few weeks ago I was proven wrong by this one https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202303235538837. I genuinely thought someone listed their IS300h as an IS200t but it is indeed an genuine facelift IS200t. I guess a few slipped by before Lexus stop selling these in the UK.

The Lexus I have didn’t have it’s previous services carried out at Lexus but I’m hoping to get it done at Lexus to gain that 1 years warranty that you get with every service and as I fear the electrics may be something that may fail rather than mechanical as you pointed out with your seat motor. And on that note I noticed someone minor I’m not sure if it’s me but when I press or hold the boot release button near the steering wheel it never works? I know it works on the key but it don’t work when I press that maybe because my engine is on but will need to double check that hopefully it ain’t a fault.

Whatever case may be with power I still believe it’s enough to be fun and I enjoy it to be fair and far better than a CVT 300h. I also like the fact non of the vents are fake *cough Audi and Kai*.

In terms of fuel it isn’t that bad at first I thought it was and it is when driving locally in congested traffic but on long motorway drive it does do well last week I managed 39.1 mpg the highest I’ve ever gotten. I doubt the IS350 or RC F can manage high number likes that. But yes it is disappointing when driving around town I did expect it to better than that.

And yes the ML is fantastic and given the opportunity I would jump to buy an IS350 if there were any sold here which they weren’t unfortunately. But a 3.5 V6 won’t do good in fuel economy, road tax and even to insurance so another thing to consider. I’m also super curious whoever converted their IS200t to a 3.5l V6 and where do you even get an engine like that from apart from importing it?

Wow... that is good find... I assume somebody has already ordered and by the time it got delivered it was already face-lifted car. As you can see it has larger sat-nav screen and radar cruise, which was fitted as standard and not as an option like in pre-facelift.

Yes - Lexus Relax works for 10k miles/12 months from last dealer service, until 100k miles... regardless if the car was serviced by dealer before or not. So that is kind of nice as you can always get it. That said I am not sure Relax would cover something like seat motor. Mine was still under 12 months sale warranty, which is more comprehensive. Lexus electrical part is usually good as well and to be honest Lexus went to town when repairing it. A single motor was "weak" (the one which tilts the back) and they replaced all motors, all controllers, all wiring, all rods, all gears etc. If it would have happened out of warranty I probably would just had that motor replaced for few £100. Or maybe replaced the whole seat for £500. I was actually surprised they didn't just replaced seat, but apparently Lexus doesn't make whole replacement seats. Remember RC seats folds forward, so perhaps that is weakness only relevant to RC. I have not heard of anyone else having such issue in Lexus (although seat motors failing is not uncommon for electric seats in other cars).

The fuel economy I guess was impacted by tyres... Your comes with R18/225/255, mine had R19/235/265... but my fuel consumption was just ridiculous - 18MPG in the city and more than 32MPG on motorway (I have seen 36MPG once when driving at 50MPH limit on roadworks), if I would do "normal motorway speeds" say ~85MPH, then MPG would drop to ~28. It isn't my driving style either - my IS250 in exactly the same driving pattern did 26/44MPG. Obviously fuel situation wasn't helped by Lexus fitting Potenza RE050a to RC which are rated F for fuel economy. RC-F can do ~36MPG on motorway doing 80MPH (on R19/255/275) and in my experience 22-24MPG in the city. RC350 is even better - easy 40+MPG on motorway (as it comes with updated Atkinson cycle) and say 26MPG in town (US figures are lower, because their gallons are smaller).

I don't think anyone has done 3.5L swap... I am just saying maybe one day I would do it when cars gets cheap. Not exactly in the mood to pay £20k for RC200t just to pay another £10k to engine swap it, when I can buy RC-F for £27k. But yes - if you need to source 2GR-FSE, then you would need to import it from US or middle-east.

IS300FSPORT · April 14, 2023

@Kam_Lexus_IS_200t "Whatever case may be with power I still believe it’s enough to be fun and I enjoy it to be fair and far better than a CVT 300h"

That statement is subjective but as an owner of an IS300H let me assure you it has its own advantages. (Maybe I am biased)

The IS300H has far more advantages over the 200T & this is based on facts:

- Better on Fuel MPG

- Road tax is cheaper

- Demand/Resale value (People want Hybrids or EV) trending

- Brakes last a long time as with most Lexus Hybrids

- Naturally aspirated engine long term reliability less to go wrong. I.e No turbo, yes there is the Hybrid system but proven to go on for mega miles.

& to add the in gear acceleration of an IS300H has never let me down in comparison to rivals in sport mode.

Of course the 2.0T may well be a good engine but the power is restricted due to it being paired to an old drivetrain (automatic) gearbox & leaves owners disatisfied due to lack of power. With respect most owners of the IS200T who usually join this forum are always asking the usual question "How Do I increase the power? " have a browse on here its the same theme. With Linas always stepping in & giving his wisdom.

If I was in the market for a 2.0T I'd just go out & buy a Golf R or S3 etc with the added bonus of 4wd. There are far more capable machines out there with turbo charged engines with modern tech yes reliability is questionable but maintenance is key. Even the 330d is a contender when it comes to economy & performance.

Ultimatley from the last decade the GS450H or the RX450H from the Hybrids takes the crown the IS300H is just an average car that ticks alot of boxes.

Linas.P · April 14, 2023

17 minutes ago, IS300FSPORT said:

- Brakes last a long time as with most Lexus Hybrids

are always asking the usual question "How Do I increase the power?

It is indeed subjective... I personally find 300h not fast enough to be enjoyable, but it is practical and cheaper to own, I don't think anyone denies it. Although that said - I found even 200t lacking... so that makes 200t lacking in two places and 300h only on one.

IS200t got much larger IS350 brakes, so they last quite a long time, maybe not as long as IS300h, but not as bad as IS250.

But on second point I think you hit the nail on the head 🙂 indeed it is always the same question. I would add - I was never in the market for 2.0t, and I just got it because Lexus gave me no other choice. I hope it will be enough.. but the rest is history.

GMB · April 14, 2023

Hello Kam

Here's my experience with the 200t. I have had it just under 2 yrs and it has been rock solid reliable. The best mpg I ever got was a momentary 40mpg on a long ( a bit downhill ) stretch of the M6 near Kendal doing about 65mph in 8th gear. Normally 27mpg around town and country, driving carefully. The car is not a traffic lights racer, in fact most sporty cars will leave you for dead up to about 45mph, but take off from 60 plus is indeed rapid and well over 100 is quickly achieved. Not in the UK I might add😚.

Once you get used to the quirky nature of the car I found that it is nice to drive, as long as you let the car do what it wants to do with the engine and gearbox peculiarities. It is fast, quiet and very comfortable and is at its best on long fast roads, not so good around town with the lag and lethargic take-offs.

If I want to go faster I take the IsF, not that you can get away with fast driving and keep your licence for long in this country. But that is being SORNed soon due to the recent excessive tax and Insurance costs. Government - 1: Me - Nil.

I think you will grow to love it if you give it a chance.

BTW it is the only car that I have ever had that has attracted compliments about the way it looks by some passers-by.😕

Linas.P · April 14, 2023

15 minutes ago, GMB said:

dead up to about 45mph, but take off from 60 plus is indeed rapid and well over 100 is quickly achieved.

Weird isn't it? Because that is my experience as well... up-to 45-50MPH it just doesn't want to put the power down. Yet from 60 it takes off and it is just a matter of time when it is doing over 100, miss it and you lose the license.

I think the "unintended acceleration" thing needs to be investigated properly, because as I said up-to 50MPH even IS250 beats it, which shouldn't really happen considering the power figures. As well similar power BMW 430i is much faster and in my experience launches much more harshly... so there must be something with how car is adjusted.

GMB · April 14, 2023

Following Linas' comments I looked up unintended acceleration and found this interesting article:

Toyota is reportedly planning to roll out a new feature to prevent accidents caused by pressing the accelerator instead of the brake pedal, resulting in unintended acceleration. The safety function will suppress engine output if the gas pedal is mistakenly pressed when there is a person in front of the vehicle, thereby preventing the vehicle from accelerating towards the pedestrian. The introduction of the new function comes following a spate of high-profile accidents involving elderly people who made mistakes using the gas and brake pedals. In early July, the country’s land, infrastructure, transport and tourism ministry asked Toyota and seven other major domestic automakers to take urgent action regarding sudden acceleration caused by mistakenly pressing the accelerator.

Sounds like a stupid idea to me. It defeats the object when you want to burn off the git in the mini cooper.

Many years ago I had a sports car with twin SU carbs. The throttle return spring ( attached to the heat shield ) snapped on the M1 at 70 mph and the car was accelerating with no return. The only way to stop was to turn off the ignition and NOT turn the steering wheel. Problem solved with an elastic band and still living to tell the tale.

Kam_Lexus_IS_200t · April 14, 2023

2 hours ago, Mr_Groundhog said:

What's the mileage like (actual real life mileage) in the city, B-roads, motorways... ?

In a lot of city driving and some motorway between 23-27 mpg is a optimistic view. Heavy city driving will for sure bring it below 20-18 mpg.

Kam_Lexus_IS_200t · April 14, 2023

1 hour ago, IS300FSPORT said:

@Kam_Lexus_IS_200t "Whatever case may be with power I still believe it’s enough to be fun and I enjoy it to be fair and far better than a CVT 300h"

That statement is subjective but as an owner of an IS300H let me assure you it has its own advantages. (Maybe I am biased)

The IS300H has far more advantages over the 200T & this is based on facts:

- Better on Fuel MPG

- Road tax is cheaper

- Demand/Resale value (People want Hybrids or EV) trending

- Brakes last a long time as with most Lexus Hybrids

- Naturally aspirated engine long term reliability less to go wrong. I.e No turbo, yes there is the Hybrid system but proven to go on for mega miles.

& to add the in gear acceleration of an IS300H has never let me down in comparison to rivals in sport mode.

Of course the 2.0T may well be a good engine but the power is restricted due to it being paired to an old drivetrain (automatic) gearbox & leaves owners disatisfied due to lack of power. With respect most owners of the IS200T who usually join this forum are always asking the usual question "How Do I increase the power? " have a browse on here its the same theme. With Linas always stepping in & giving his wisdom.

If I was in the market for a 2.0T I'd just go out & buy a Golf R or S3 etc with the added bonus of 4wd. There are far more capable machines out there with turbo charged engines with modern tech yes reliability is questionable but maintenance is key. Even the 330d is a contender when it comes to economy & performance.

Ultimatley from the last decade the GS450H or the RX450H from the Hybrids takes the crown the IS300H is just an average car that ticks alot of boxes.

Shouldn’t have been too harsh on the 300h it is a brilliant car. There is no other hybrid I would consider and in terms of Golf R and S3 I’d prefer a saloon like I have now I’m not that obsessed with power I’d rather have increased reliability and a better sound system which both of does can’t compare to Lexus’ ML sound system and not to mention the ride quality, build quality and reliability. And yes lets not forget the ventilating seats which is a rare sight in a lot of cars even the German ones.

GMB · April 14, 2023

1 minute ago, Kam_Lexus_IS_200t said:

In a lot of city driving and some motorway between 23-27 mpg is a optimistic view. Heavy city driving will for sure bring it below 20-18 mpg.

If you are driving around town in lower gears then 22 mpg is normal. You can get lower if you have a heavy right foot. The worst I saw was 17mpg after the car had been in for a service. I think the mechanic must have been called Evel Knievel.

Whether it is relevant I do not know but the car always has Shell V power or Tesco Momentum 99 octane in it.

Kam_Lexus_IS_200t · April 14, 2023

1 hour ago, Linas.P said:

It is indeed subjective... I personally find 300h not fast enough to be enjoyable, but it is practical and cheaper to own, I don't think anyone denies it. Although that said - I found even 200t lacking... so that makes 200t lacking in two places and 300h only on one.

IS200t got much larger IS350 brakes, so they last quite a long time, maybe not as long as IS300h, but not as bad as IS250.

But on second point I think you hit the nail on the head 🙂 indeed it is always the same question. I would add - I was never in the market for 2.0t, and I just got it because Lexus gave me no other choice. I hope it will be enough.. but the rest is history.

Again I agree with you had I had a choice between an IS350 and IS200t I would go for the 350; however, there was only one options personally I don’t CVTs and hybrids so IS200t was the only choice for me unless I look at other car manufacturers which means compromising on reliability and build quality.

Linas.P · April 14, 2023

8 minutes ago, GMB said:

Following Linas' comments I looked up unintended acceleration and found this interesting article:

Toyota is reportedly planning to roll out a new feature to prevent accidents caused by pressing the accelerator instead of the brake pedal, resulting in unintended acceleration. The safety function will suppress engine output if the gas pedal is mistakenly pressed when there is a person in front of the vehicle, thereby preventing the vehicle from accelerating towards the pedestrian. The introduction of the new function comes following a spate of high-profile accidents involving elderly people who made mistakes using the gas and brake pedals. In early July, the country’s land, infrastructure, transport and tourism ministry asked Toyota and seven other major domestic automakers to take urgent action regarding sudden acceleration caused by mistakenly pressing the accelerator.

Sounds like a stupid idea to me. It defeats the object when you want to burn off the git in the mini cooper.

Many years ago I had a sports car with twin SU carbs. The throttle return spring ( attached to the heat shield ) snapped on the M1 at 70 mph and the car was accelerating with no return. The only way to stop was to turn off the ignition and NOT turn the steering wheel. Problem solved with an elastic band and still living to tell the tale.

Yes this is purely dumb american thing... there must be a way "programme it out".

GMB · April 14, 2023

1 hour ago, IS300FSPORT said:

@Kam_Lexus_IS_200t "Whatever case may be with power I still believe it’s enough to be fun and I enjoy it to be fair and far better than a CVT 300h"

That statement is subjective but as an owner of an IS300H let me assure you it has its own advantages. (Maybe I am biased)

The IS300H has far more advantages over the 200T & this is based on facts:

- Better on Fuel MPG

- Road tax is cheaper

- Demand/Resale value (People want Hybrids or EV) trending

- Brakes last a long time as with most Lexus Hybrids

- Naturally aspirated engine long term reliability less to go wrong. I.e No turbo, yes there is the Hybrid system but proven to go on for mega miles.

& to add the in gear acceleration of an IS300H has never let me down in comparison to rivals in sport mode.

Of course the 2.0T may well be a good engine but the power is restricted due to it being paired to an old drivetrain (automatic) gearbox & leaves owners disatisfied due to lack of power. With respect most owners of the IS200T who usually join this forum are always asking the usual question "How Do I increase the power? " have a browse on here its the same theme. With Linas always stepping in & giving his wisdom.

If I was in the market for a 2.0T I'd just go out & buy a Golf R or S3 etc with the added bonus of 4wd. There are far more capable machines out there with turbo charged engines with modern tech yes reliability is questionable but maintenance is key. Even the 330d is a contender when it comes to economy & performance.

Ultimatley from the last decade the GS450H or the RX450H from the Hybrids takes the crown the IS300H is just an average car that ticks alot of boxes.

I tried a couple of 300h cars and found them boring. Sorry! But the CVT gearing and the way the engine revs highly on brisk acceleration does not float my boat at all. One man's meat etc etc.

I had a brand new VW for a year. Got rid of it after it broke down a couple of times.

If you want performance..... Nissan GtR, 370Z, need I go on. Just avoid the German makes after they started making them in tax subsidised countries instead of Germany. BTW Mercedes are now made of Renault bits I am told?

GMB · April 14, 2023

8 minutes ago, Linas.P said:

Yes this is purely dumb american thing... there must be a way "programme it out".

If you find out Linas please let me know!

Linas.P · April 14, 2023

5 minutes ago, GMB said:

BTW Mercedes are now made of Renault bits I am told?

I believe only MB X-Class is Renault (it is literally Renault with MB stickers) and I believe Renault supplies 2.3L diesel engine for MB, which they mark as 250d.

But I mean Toyota is guilty of that as well... anyone wants Zupra?

2 minutes ago, GMB said:

If you find out Linas please let me know!

As I don't have 200t I am not sure I will be going into this rabbit hole for now, but if I stumble upon some lead by accident then I will be sure to share.

GMB · April 14, 2023

2 minutes ago, Linas.P said:

I believe only MB X-Class is Renault (it is literally Renault with MB stickers) and I believe Renault supplies 2.3L diesel engine for MB, which they mark as 250d.

But I mean Toyota is guilty of that as well... anyone wants Zupra?

Well at least Toyota found a good engine. Renault diesel engines are pretty good but not really in the same league

Been googling again and found this:

The following Mercedes models have a Renault engine:

A-Class – A 160 (d), A 180 (d), A 200, A 220e, and A 250
B-Class – B 160 (d), B 180 (d), B 200, and B 250e
CLA-Class – CLA 180 (d), CLA 200, and CLA 250e
C-Class – C 180 d and C 200 d
GLA-Class – GLA 180 d and GLA 200
GLB-Class – GLB 180 d and GLB 200
Citan – 108 CDI, 109 CDI, 110 (CDI), 111 CDI, 112 CDI, and 113
Vito – 109 CDI and 111 CDI

Linas.P · April 14, 2023

Yes as I said - MB certainly buys some engines from Renault, perhaps more than I thought. But MB X is a joke... "Luxury Pick-up truck"... as if it was not enough it was made by Renault, the Nissan who as well uses same platform for Navara licensed it to china and they made Dongfeng Rich 6, which looks nearly identical.

NemesisUK · April 14, 2023

33 minutes ago, GMB said:

Following Linas' comments I looked up unintended acceleration and found this interesting article:

Toyota is reportedly planning to roll out a new feature to prevent accidents caused by pressing the accelerator instead of the brake pedal, resulting in unintended acceleration. The safety function will suppress engine output if the gas pedal is mistakenly pressed when there is a person in front of the vehicle, thereby preventing the vehicle from accelerating towards the pedestrian. The introduction of the new function comes following a spate of high-profile accidents involving elderly people who made mistakes using the gas and brake pedals. In early July, the country’s land, infrastructure, transport and tourism ministry asked Toyota and seven other major domestic automakers to take urgent action regarding sudden acceleration caused by mistakenly pressing the accelerator.

Sounds like a stupid idea to me. It defeats the object when you want to burn off the git in the mini cooper.

Many years ago I had a sports car with twin SU carbs. The throttle return spring ( attached to the heat shield ) snapped on the M1 at 70 mph and the car was accelerating with no return. The only way to stop was to turn off the ignition and NOT turn the steering wheel. Problem solved with an elastic band and still living to tell the tale.

Seems it is already on cars, at least my 2020 RX has whats called "Intelligent Clearance Sonar System" and the example given to describe it is where the driver selects D instead of R to reverse out of a parking space and accelerates, the system detects the wall in front and reduces torque and applies the brakes. Similarly when pulling into a space the driver hit the accelerator instead of the brake the system takes over, disabling the throttle and applies the brakes.