Attempted Theft of my RX450h 2020

[PDM]

On 6/13/2023 at 9:47 PM, talaipwros said:

That's great news.

 

Which Lexus branch offered it and can we ask our local branch for this as well?

Also any newfound rattling after the plate attachment?

 

Many thanks

You will need to email cr@lexus.co.uk in the first instance.   They will then arrange things with your local dealer for fitment.

No rattling at all.

Paul

[Sybaris]

Thanks for that.  Will do.  Hopefully other owners can put some pressure on them too.

Hmmm was I sold a vehicle with a vulnerability or even a design fault without knowing about it at the time.

Hmmmm did I put at least £100 on my credit card when I bought the car?

Hmmm am I covered under section 75 of the Consumer Credit act or even the Consumer Rights Act (not for CC)?

Anyone here a certified legal expert in these matters?

[Andy B]

17 hours ago, PDM said:

You will need to email cr@lexus.co.uk in the first instance.

I have just sent them an email to enquire as to whether they plan to offer the fitment of the plate to NX owners and, if so, how I can arrange to have it fitted to mine.

I will await their reply and report back.

[Herbie]

The great North/South divide seems to be alive and kicking, even with respect to this plate

I emailed Lexus UK Customer Relations about this plate and this is the reply I received about an hour ago:

9:59 AM (1 hour ago)

 

Dear Mr Hewitt

Thank you for contact to Lexus UK in respect of your RX.

I can advise that we have been testing some prototype protective plates and checking the installation of this plate.  This is necessary before we can introduce it to our Lexus Centre network and our customers. 

We hope to be able to notify our Lexus Centre partners, particularly those in London and the South-East when this deterrent will become available. This will include its cost and fitment instructions. 

I can advise that outside of the areas listed we have seen minimal criminal activity of this nature which is why Lexus Preston, unlike a Lexus Centre in London, would not be aware of this situation.

I appreciate that this is a pressing matter for you and other RX owners, and we will do our best to introduce this deterrent as quickly as we can.

Kind regards

 

Claire Dean
Lexus Customer Relations Case Manager
Toyota (GB) PLC - Lexus Division
Distributor of vehicles, parts and accessories for the UK

[ic2alpha]

@herbie

you beat me to it. Lexus replies to my email with the same template as well.

Today I had an S5 tracker and immobiliser fitted as I wasn’t comfortable with the car being so vulnerable. When the plate becomes available I will have my dealer installed it for extra protection but I am not too worried now.

 

edit:

forgot to mention. The installer of the tracker and immobiliser told me that he has been installing lots of these on Lexus RXs and NXs and he was aware of the canbus hack. 

 

 

[Spock66]

3 hours ago, Herbie said:

This will include its cost and fitment instructions. 

So looks like we will have to pay for a design flaw...

[ic2alpha]

13 minutes ago, Spock66 said:

So looks like we will have to pay for a design flaw...

I thought the exact same thing when I received their email. 

[Sybaris]

I e-mailed them and had the same reply.

Maybe if enough people e-mail them, they might get the message.

I will reply and tell them it is their flaw, they can pay for it.

[Phaeton]

 I had the same initial reply. I responded, expressing disappointment  that the letter implied customers will be treated differently, depending upon their geographical location. They responded stating  that this was not their intention, and they were simply reflecting the fact that these thefts are primarily in London and the South East. Although they couldn't give a timescale they confirmed all dealerships will be notified when available. Let's hope it's sooner rather than later.

[Sybaris]

I am in the middle of a debate with Lexus UK as I feel that there is an inherent vulnerability with the security of the car.

I also came across this.

https://www.moneyhelper.org.uk/en/everyday-money/buying-and-running-a-car/your-rights-if-something-is-wrong-with-your-car

[Fatts]

Just to provide an update to members on this forum from the awful experience of having my beloved car stolen from my driveway. 

• The Police only gave me a crime reference number and today more that a month following the incident no local bobby have thought it fit to drop by. Though i have received the customary text message £soory to learn you have been a victim of Crime"
• Thankfully my insurance company settled my claim in full within 10 days. (not sure if am allowed to name them but they were brilliant
• I have been able to buy a new 23 plate BMW which I have fitted a Ghost 2 Immobiliser and a tracker. (Tessa Certified). My insurance company even kept my policy open for 60 days after the settlement thus I was able to simply notify a change or registration number to get my new car insured
• I have also had to install CCTV on my property to provide added deterrence. (more for my own reassurance rather than insurance requirement)
• I have decided to give the Lexus brand a wide berth for the foreseeable future, sad to say after owing a GS450 h, an NX, and five RX's between 2014 -2023. My dealer from who I have bought my last four RX's tried passionately to persuade me to buy the latest RX but i told him no amount of sweeteners/ dealer contribution would tempt me to stay unless Lexus UK address the the inherent vulnerability of their cars to CAN bus thefts. (They  offered me a whopping £7k discount+dealer contribution  on the new RX450h+ to keep my business but I still declined)
• I have decided to keep my Forum membership going for now but will continue to read the posts that interest me, but am now registered on several BMW forums so would probably keep more active on those.
• Finally I would like to thank all members of this forum who sent me their commiseration & best wishes last month when I reported the incident on the forum, thankfully my story had a happy ending thanks to my brilliant Insurance company.

[VFR]

That sent a clear message to Lexus UK (odds on the dealer feed your disgust back) to deal with this issue ASAP before it becomes ingrained into popular belief that owning a Lexus is  not a good idea. 

[stringbender]

I haven't read the whole thread. Are you allowed to name the insurer who gave you such good service ?

[Phil xxkr]

13 hours ago, Sybaris said:

I am in the middle of a debate with Lexus UK as I feel that there is an inherent vulnerability with the security of the car.

I also came across this.

https://www.moneyhelper.org.uk/en/everyday-money/buying-and-running-a-car/your-rights-if-something-is-wrong-with-your-car

Great article Dan, thanks 

[Herbie]

3 hours ago, stringbender said:

I haven't read the whole thread. Are you allowed to name the insurer who gave you such good service ?

Yes, of course, and I certainly hope he does.

[Sybaris]

Their reply to me:

- We certainly hope that more information on the availability of this protective measure will be available soon and we do appreciate the urgency in seeking to offer a supporting installation.

- must convey that Lexus disagree that there is an inherent vulnerability that is a design flaw, or that we are in some may liable for the thefts that are occurring.

- Very specific and custom made electronic devices, costing thousands of pounds it seems, are being utilised in combination with physical cannibalisation of the vehicle in order to access internal wiring. 

- Prevention of one type of theft does not remove the possibility that a different type of attack may be possible in one way or another. Determined criminals have shown repeatedly that we cannot second guess the limits of the motivation to steal wonderful and desirable vehicles.

- From Lexus Customer Relations, we do hope to be in a position to confirm what level of support can be offered for those that expressed an interest in the protective plate, and wish to assure you that we will be in touch as soon as we have any additional information to share with you.

 

 

[Sybaris]

I am arguing back that:

- This is a vulnerability

- I suspect the cost of the equipment is not thousands of pounds as suggested

- It is a tactic that appears to be repeatedly used

- RXs are within the top 5 stolen cars in the UK according to reports on various websites

- It is forcing insurance prices to to up by thousands of pounds

- It is an inherent design flaw with the car

What I would like to ask the community is for some support and if anyone agrees with my points to convey their feelings to Lexus Customer Relations. 

[VFR]

I am guessing that the highest crime areas have been prioritised for the supplying company to get these to the dealers ?

Graham said ……….. Yes, it was FOC and they washed and vacuumed the car as well. It was done at very short notice so I didn't ask for a courtesy car.

So the precedent has been set IMO

[Sundance]

On 6/13/2023 at 4:06 PM, 08ISF said:

Update on the protection plate:

The protection plate is now in play. I had it fitted to my RX at the local dealer's today. From what I understand they are trialling this on a few customer's cars and then will presumably roll it out. Whether it will be a recall or a service bulletin subject I do not know, or it may be you have to ask, but it does exist.

Whether it will be effective remains to be seen and I don't suppose it will help with this year's insurance renewal, which by the look of it will be 100% up on last year.

Evening Graham, given your dealings with a Dealer do you happen to know if this protection plate is available to all generations of RX?

As you can see mine is an '07 400h which, I gather, may contain even more valuable precious metals in the c-c than later models so I am thinking of getting something done about it.

Also I'm a mere mile or two outside the part of London that is greater so if you would be so kind as to let me know which Dealer fitted your plate (PM if you prefer) I'd very much like to get in touch with them.

Many thanks, Rowley

[08ISF]

31 minutes ago, Sundance said:

Evening Graham, given your dealings with a Dealer do you happen to know if this protection plate is available to all generations of RX?

As you can see mine is an '07 400h which, I gather, may contain even more valuable precious metals in the c-c than later models so I am thinking of getting something done about it.

Also I'm a mere mile or two outside the part of London that is greater so if you would be so kind as to let me know which Dealer fitted your plate (PM if you prefer) I'd very much like to get in touch with them.

Many thanks, Rowley

From what I understand it is the 4th Gen RX which is vulnerable, along with current RAV4's and possibly NX's and ES's. Earlier models such as yours did not apparently use the CAN BUS system of wiring which the plate is to protect. This is nothing to do with the cat converter which your post mentions. Other means are available to try and protect that.

Oh, and by the way my insurance renewal has just come in , about 100% up on last year but a lot less than I was expecting so I'm happy.

[Sundance]

31 minutes ago, 08ISF said:

From what I understand it is the 4th Gen RX which is vulnerable, along with current RAV4's and possibly NX's and ES's. Earlier models such as yours did not apparently use the CAN BUS system of wiring which the plate is to protect. This is nothing to do with the cat converter which your post mentions. Other means are available to try and protect that.

Oh, and by the way my insurance renewal has just come in , about 100% up on last year but a lot less than I was expecting so I'm happy.

Ah, apologies, I hadn't read all seven pages of this thread in their entirety, obviously I should have done as I made an inaccurate assumption.  I'll search elsewhere to get clarification on protecting my c-c.

[Sybaris]

Sorry to hear about your RX.  It is very disappointing that such a design flaw exists IMHO, and that Lexus seem to me to be more worried about admitting liability than protecting their customers.  I guess that is how businesses work.  We are just income to them.

[First_Lexus]

On 6/21/2023 at 9:19 PM, Fatts said:

I have been able to buy a new 23 plate BMW which I have fitted a Ghost 2 Immobiliser and a tracker. (Tessa Certified)

Apart from having the aftermarket immobiliser/tracker fitted, are BMW less vulnerable to these thefts? 

I’m equally disappointed by the Lexus response and, although I’m not looking to change right now, I’d be interested in manufacturers who aren’t vulnerable (assuming there are any!).

As an aside, a few months ago near where I live, two Mercedes and a BMW were taken on the same night although I’m not sure which method was used to steal them. I did hear through the grapevine that Ring doorbells mysteriously went off-line at least at one of the addresses so there was no footage of the theft.

[Toyota Owner]

9 minutes ago, First_Lexus said:

Apart from having the aftermarket immobiliser/tracker fitted, are BMW less vulnerable to these thefts? 

I’m equally disappointed by the Lexus response and, although I’m not looking to change right now, I’d be interested in manufacturers who aren’t vulnerable (assuming there are any!).

As an aside, a few months ago near where I live, two Mercedes and a BMW were taken on the same night although I’m not sure which method was used to steal them. I did hear through the grapevine that Ring doorbells mysteriously went off-line at least at one of the addresses so there was no footage of the theft.

All modernish vehicle can be driven away via OBD port theft as thanks to EU anticompetition laws the port has to be open for any repair garage to connect up to - makes theft easy with the correct equipment, obviously if the vehicle has a proper key it slows the theft down. 

As for Ring doorbells going offline, there normally connected to the internet via the homes WIFI network - you can guess why they went off line during the theft - the thieves came prepared.

I can only think of one hardwired video doorbell that doesn't use WIFI & cloud storage. 

[A-Rod]

I don't understand why peolle with expensive cars won't fit an immobiliser and a tracker? We used to fit these back in 90s on every single car [overseas] - we even had magnet immobilisers where you'd have to put a magnet in a specific place for the car to start.