Lexus or Toyota

[Cotswold Pete]

Visited Lexus Cheltenham on Saturday as the missus says time to let got of my LS400.

Anyway looked at a wide range of new and pre-loved including CT, IS, ES, RC (not that I am ever going to buy an RC) UX etc.

Then in the parking lot she spotted a Toyota Camry (one of the last).

So we tried the ES and the Camry, and my missus was really shocked that the ES was so much nicer to open the doors on, to sit in etc, compared to the cmary which was the same price (more or less£40K)

So made me realise if I was ever to go Toyota I would be epxecting it to be a lot cheaper than a Lexus, now I can see why so many cab drivers like the ES, no contest over top spec Camry.

Now all I need to decide is do I go from LS400 to LS460 knowing it will not be young, but will be more solid than an ES, or maybe a GS450, or possibly IS300h (which the missus quite likes and my neighbour might be selling his)

Also  from talking to the sales man and sales woman  (should that be persons) most people are going SUV, and I want to stick with saloon, which seems to be more choice limiting these days.

One final comment - I hate those plastic arch trims that  even lexus are fixing to their cars, IMHO makes them look a little naff

[The-Acre]

3 hours ago, Cotswold Pete said:

Visited Lexus Cheltenham on Saturday as the missus says time to let got of my LS400.

Anyway looked at a wide range of new and pre-loved including CT, IS, ES, RC (not that I am ever going to buy an RC) UX etc.

Then in the parking lot she spotted a Toyota Camry (one of the last).

So we tried the ES and the Camry, and my missus was really shocked that the ES was so much nicer to open the doors on, to sit in etc, compared to the cmary which was the same price (more or less£40K)

So made me realise if I was ever to go Toyota I would be epxecting it to be a lot cheaper than a Lexus, now I can see why so many cab drivers like the ES, no contest over top spec Camry.

Now all I need to decide is do I go from LS400 to LS460 knowing it will not be young, but will be more solid than an ES, or maybe a GS450, or possibly IS300h (which the missus quite likes and my neighbour might be selling his)

Also  from talking to the sales man and sales woman  (should that be persons) most people are going SUV, and I want to stick with saloon, which seems to be more choice limiting these days.

One final comment - I hate those plastic arch trims that  even lexus are fixing to their cars, IMHO makes them look a little naff

Whatever you decide it will never have the fine quality of an LS400, those days are sadly gone. And I absolutely agree about the plastic wheel arches, really naff, that's something I've noticed lately.

[steve2006]

I have the best of both worlds a Toyota Celsior. 

 

[Spottedlaurel]

In order from that selection, GS450 followed by IS300 (smaller, but at least you get a folding rear seat).

[Mr Vlad]

Oh decisions decisions lol. From a LS400 to an is300h too much of a difference unless you want a smaller car. ES is a bigger is300h. GS450 would be the hybrid which is rather a spiffing car. So a LS460 would be 'old'. Same size car as yours but quieter smoother just pure class in a car. I'd absolutely love one but hey ho.

I think you have to ask yourself just what do I want from a car. Your better half needs to be included in the chat. Is it time to go smaller? Are you comfortable in the size of the LS400?

I hope you and your better half get the car you both love. 

[george72]

go for the es, good compromise between the LS and IS.

[Las Palmas]

Do you mean now or next car?

Now : CT

Next : hydrogen, which very much could be Toyota or Honda - less likely Hyundai or BMW.

[talaipwros]

12 hours ago, Las Palmas said:

Do you mean now or next car?

Now : CT

Next : hydrogen, which very much could be Toyota or Honda - less likely Hyundai or BMW.

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/bmw/x5/359704/new-bmw-ix5-hydrogen-2023-review

 

Looks like BMW is upping the ante

[Spacewagon52]

I am interested to why your wife thinks it is time to let go?

Have you been expressing doubts about your LS400?

I persuaded myself that my Mk3 LS400 had to go after 1 year of ownership. Mainly on practical grounds with two Labradors. I regretted it - especially after buying a BMW estate! I said I would have another one, one day, and I did. However, getting a "good one" now is very hard. If you decide to sell there is limited opportunity (cost excepting) to come back to a 400.

As Phil says, they do not make cars like the LS 400 now. The quality is hard to describe until you actually own one. Newer Lexus cars have lots more tech and drive really well. 

Is an ES that much better than a sound LS400? Only you can decide.

My main concern with my LS 400 is if something goes wrong that is difficult or expensive to fix. Then I will have to say goodbye. Provided your LS400 can be maintained, even if you spent £2000 - £3000 on her, that is peanuts compared with buying an ES.

You will know when the time is right to let go ............ for whatever reason and it could be now.

Just my tghoughts.

 

 

[Malc1]

18 hours ago, Cotswold Pete said:

Now all I need to decide is do I go from LS400 to LS460 knowing it will not be young

I've thought about this time and time again AND decided against .  it would NOT be changing " up " in my opinion AND would be accompanied with silly expensive bills for things that just wouldn't arise on my / an Ls400 ...... take the steering column rake adjustment for instance .  going to cost me a washer to fix on mine or maybe £2k on an Ls460 .......  and it goes on and on and on methinks  .... it's your money so take's your choice .......  the Ls400 ( Mk3 ) is the way to go and to remain if one is fortunate to already own one

Malc

[Malc1]

25 minutes ago, Spacewagon52 said:

My main concern with my LS 400 is if something goes wrong that is difficult or expensive to fix. Then I will have to say goodbye. Provided your LS400 can be maintained, even if you spent £2000 - £3000 on her, that is peanuts compared with buying an ES.

You're absolutely " spot on "  .  you can get an awful lot of Amayama / Rockauto / LexusPartsDirect comfort to repair an old Ls400 .. and it's simple technology to sort out 

Reading earlier here somewhere about a new EV ? Merc driver's screen going blank and taking weeks and weeks and £000s to sort out .....  so WHY would one want to put oneself thru' all that angst 

Simple old fashioned Ls400 technology, supreme comfort, reliability and V8 oomph is all one, well me anyway, can ask for 

Malc

[steve2006]

I kept my 1994 LS400 ( JDM Toyota Celsior) for just under 16 years and had it not been for the opportunity to purchase a newer model I would probably still have it now.

During my ownership I did all the usual fails like the climate control LCD, starter motor and the steering tilt repair, carried out all my own servicing and kept on top of regularly washing and waxing including under washing once a year and wheel arch clean outs.

In all that time it had 2 daft MOT fails, one for corroded rear brake pipes and never an advisory.

Since parting with it the car has changed owners at least twice and is now I believe Sorn with an expired MOT.

If I had the garage space and money to keep both cars I would have done because I know I would never find another in the same condition for reasonable cost.

 

[Las Palmas]

1 hour ago, talaipwros said:

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/bmw/x5/359704/new-bmw-ix5-hydrogen-2023-review

 

Looks like BMW is upping the ante

They need to up the quality too. Had 2 of them.

[Cotswold Pete]

3 hours ago, Spacewagon52 said:

I am interested to why your wife thinks it is time to let go?

Turns out she is not bothered by the sheer size more the 'floatiness' of it, which I do recall when I got my first LS back 15 years ago was a bit of a 'shock', and now I have no prblems chucking the LS around corners knowing it floats like a butterfly stings like a bee.

My own reasons for changing are I realyl do not have the space/time/energy to get it back to the shiny and mechanically sorted car it should be, and when I come into some money later this year it is my chance to try another Lexus.

I do like the ES, though it is not anywhere near as solid (or brick outhouse like) build, though being a frugal chap not sure I am going to lighten my wallet to the tune of £40K when I could get a 460 for a lot less.

So I agree with many sentiments in the replies and it is a little tough mentally letting go of my LS some time soon.  I met a 460 dirver the other day (just got chatting in a supermarket car park) and is 10 years a 460 dirver with 15 years 400 driving before that and he said both brilliant but the 460 was now his true love.

So my wife not averse to trying a 460, but I assume it needs to less floaty than my 400, which should not be difficult given the likely state of the control arm bushes.

 

[talaipwros]

4 hours ago, Las Palmas said:

They need to up the quality too. Had 2 of them.

Had 3 of them - still got one - and zero problems for hundreds of thousands of miles. Guess it's a bit of lucky strike.

[Las Palmas]

7 minutes ago, talaipwros said:

Had 3 of them - still got one - and zero problems for hundreds of thousands of miles. Guess it's a bit of lucky strike.

That's a lot of miles. Guess I must have had bad luck then. 1 I kept half a year and the other less than a month.

But then again, I also had a Supra 3.0L Targa that had orange light on the dashboard when driving faster than 160km/h and going to Toyota in Spain they could not look into it as they had not yet received manuals for the model, so went visit family in Denmark and Toyota there was almost same story, except they tried 2 days before giving up. When we came back home no more Toyota for a few years. Nissan 280ZX and 300ZX were lightyears better. Lexus quality.

[Spacewagon52]

I have pondered what would be a DIRECT replacement for my LS400 - GS450h comes to mind, though the 460 is also tempting. There seems to be more problems with the 460 than the 400, from reading the forum. Provided you get a good one, with a full Lexus service history, it should be fine. 

 

Better value than an ES?

[Malc1]

Wot about a Ls600 ??

Malc

[Spacewagon52]

5 minutes ago, Malc1 said:

Wot about a Ls600 ??

Malc

Yes! But I think you might be able to source a unicorn easier!