Battery Symbol on infotainment screen

[Southern Aston]

Hi all

Having 12v Battery issues in a 2018 RX HL. By any chance is there an indicator on any of the screens or dash that tell you how much it is charged? I suspect not from reading other threads. 
 

There is a Battery symbol on the infotainment screen (top right next to the Bluetooth symbol). Does anyone know what that is for? I cannot find it anywhere in the manual. I don’t think it is my phone as the phone Battery life apparently appears as a different symbol elsewhere according to the manual? 
 

Many thanks 

 

SA 

[Herbie]

Do you mean the symbol on page 109 of the manual ?

EDIT - sorry, just trying to do 3 things at once here and it ain't working 

Just noticed that you said infotainment screen next to the Bluetooth symbol. That's your mobile phone, nothing to do with either of the two car batteries. What's the problem you're having with the 12V Battery?

[Southern Aston]

Thanks Herbie, much appreciated. Sounds like there isn’t anything that visibly monitors the 12v. 
 

I picked up a used approved 450HL last weekend and drove it long distance home (plus a fairly long midweek run too). This morning I started ignition but not the engine, and was installing a child seat for a couple of minutes when a warning noise sounded and it asked to be put into P as hybrid mode not working (something like that). It was already in Park though… long story short I couldn’t get the engine on 

 

AA came out later and diagnosed a flat startup 12v. They’ve recommended I get to a dealer to do a drain test and potential replacement.

 

The theory was combination of cold weather and maybe sitting in a dealership for a few weeks pre sale, but underneath that likely a faulty Battery. 

I understand the petrol engine charges the hybrid Battery which in turn charges the 12v. So I’m a bit worried it’s the hybrid Battery that could be the issue. Hoping it’s just the 12v though. 

 

I’ve read on this forum that others use a standalone charger to keep the 12v alive when they’re not using the car much. But any tips on this and the whole situation would be appreciated.

Many thanks

John

 

[ColinBarber]

Nothing wrong with your hybrid traction Battery.

The 12 v Battery is small and can easily go flat, especially in this cold weather which affects useable capacity. In theory it should have been fine to do what you did but I'd recommend never turning on the ignition without going all the way into Ready mode and let the engine cut in/out as required to keep the hybrid Battery charged.

I imagine that the 12 v Battery was allowed to discharge on the forecourt and this has damaged/lowered its capacity. Whilst it will probably still work fine if you keep it charged up, you won't get the same duration before it goes flat again and therefore get the dealer to replace it.

If you aren't cumulatively using your vehicle for at least an hour a week then you will want to charge up the 12 v Battery (either using a charger (such as Noco or CTEK) or putting the vehicle into Ready mode for 60 minutes).

[Herbie]

Aha, right.

It does indeed sound like the man from the AA is correct and that the 12V Battery has stood around too long. Given that you've only had the car a week, I would be inclined to get it back to the dealer for replacement under warranty. If you want any 'ammo' to back you up, just go to any garage or car accessory shop that sells batteries and ask them to do a load test on it. It'll only take a couple of minutes and is usually done free of charge (ha, see what I did there? Free of charge? I'll get me coat ).

Put your mind at rest about the hybrid Battery. They're almost bulletproof and many cars are doing 250k miles+ still on the original one.

Hybrids don't have a starter motor or an alternator and the way it works is that when you press the Start button, the 12V Battery boots the computers, pressurises the brakes and gets the car into READY mode (hybrid system running). When the petrol engine is needed the hybrid system energises MG1 which spins the engine up to 1,000rpm, at which point it supplies fuel and spark to fire it. Going 'the other way' so to speak, the high voltage traction Battery (288V if I remember correctly) feeds into a DC/DC converter, which then supplies 12V to run the 12V systems such as lights, radio etc., as well as charging the 12V Battery.

One thing to point out is that when you are doing anything like cleaning the car interior and you have doors open and maybe listening to the radio, always put the car into READY mode so that the engine will fire up as and when needed to keep the batteries charged.

[Herbie]

Doh!! I wish I could touch type and then I'd be able to see when someone has beaten me to it 

[Vicmeldrew]

3 hours ago, ColinBarber said:

If you aren't cumulatively using your vehicle for at least an hour a week then you will want to charge up the 12 v battery (either using a charger (such as Noco or CTEK) or putting the vehicle into Ready mode for 60 minutes).

Where should the CTEK/NOKO charger be connected? To the Battery terminals or the jump start points under bonnet in engine compartment?

[Herbie]

1 hour ago, Vicmeldrew said:

Where should the CTEK/NOKO charger be connected? To the battery terminals or the jump start points under bonnet in engine compartment?

It makes not one jot of difference in an electrical sense, 12V at the front is just the same as 12V at the back. There may be logistical reasons for choosing one over the other but that's all.

[Vicmeldrew]

Thanks Herbie. My logic is the same as yours but in handbook for my Volvo it states never connect negative terminal to Battery when charging or jump starting.

[Spock66]

59 minutes ago, Vicmeldrew said:

My logic is the same as yours but in handbook for my Volvo it states never connect negative terminal to battery when charging or jump starting.

I think that may be because the Battery vents hydrogen when charging and there may be a spark as you connect the terminal, but a very remote risk in practice.

[Herbie]

1 hour ago, Spock66 said:

I think that may be because the battery vents hydrogen when charging and there may be a spark as you connect the terminal, but a very remote risk in practice.

That is indeed the exact reason, but in more than 45 years of messing around with cars, neither I, nor any of my friends or relatives have ever seen or even heard of a single case of explosion from a charging Battery, so I never give it a thought.

[ColinBarber]

7 hours ago, Vicmeldrew said:

Thanks Herbie. My logic is the same as yours but in handbook for my Volvo it states never connect negative terminal to battery when charging or jump starting.

More of an issue when jump starting. When you connect a Battery charger, the charger should be switched off and only switched on once you have connected it to the Battery - therefore there is no risk of a spark.

[Barry14UK]

If I correctly recall, the Lexus manual that came with my 2015 RX450h says to connect charger negative to earthing point but I have always connected direct to Battery on this and other cars.

Good idea to get a 'smart charger' giving maximum charge of 5amps (this will stop overcharging that shortens Battery life. You use the mode appropriate to your Battery and this will adjust charge as Battery requires.

[LenT]

3 hours ago, Barry14UK said:

If I correctly recall, the Lexus manual that came with my 2015 RX450h says to connect charger negative to earthing point but I have always connected direct to battery on this and other cars.

Good idea to get a 'smart charger' giving maximum charge of 5amps (this will stop overcharging that shortens battery life. You use the mode appropriate to your battery and this will adjust charge as battery requires.

Better still, avoid the connection problem in the first place.

My CTEK trickle charger came with one lead that has two eyelet connectors that fix permanently to the relevant Battery posts and then via a small plug to the charger.

So the connection is secure and distant from the Battery itself. CTEKs also have systems to prevent overcharging.

[Vicmeldrew]

13 minutes ago, LenT said:

My CTEK trickle charger came with one lead that has two eyelet connectors that fix permanently to the relevant battery posts and then via a small plug to the charger.

So the connection is secure and distant from the battery itself. CTEKs also have systems to prevent overcharging.

The CTEK is exactly what I have and intended to do.

I was looking for confirmation that this would be safe and not damage the cars electrical system.

Thank you all for your replies.

[Zotto]

Another precaution while charging 12V Battery with any charger is to leave all systems OFF if you are charging without disconnecting Battery + or - connector.

 

[Vicmeldrew]

3 hours ago, Zotto said:

Another precaution while charging 12V battery with any charger is to leave all systems OFF if you are charging without disconnecting battery + or - connector.

 

What about locking vehicle , it sets the alarm which I presume is using power and is technically on?

[Herbie]

4 minutes ago, Vicmeldrew said:

What about locking vehicle , it sets the alarm which I presume is using power and is technically on?

It's fine to lock it if you want to. There's always some drain on the Battery keeping the radio presets, the alarm, the clock and so on, alive. It won't cause any problems with charging the Battery in situ. I think Zotto is being cautious regarding the possibility of voltage spikes, but the Battery itself acts as a big smoothing capacitor anyway.

It would be a very different kettle of fish if you were using a 40 year old transformer-based charger, but modern intelligent chargers handle this aspect very well.

[Vicmeldrew]

Thanks Herbie for that reassurance. Tha last thing I would want do is keep Battery topped up but cause other problems by doing so.

[Brad Ched]

Hi All,

Just having a similar conundrum with the 12V Battery -was unable to start my 2009 RX 450h, even though I am convinced I had stopped everything (pressed the Stop button after I parked, but remained in the car for some 30-odd minutes in the recent cold wather).

Had to call AA who came with on of those huge jump-start booster devices, connected it to the terminals under the front (not in the boot) and voila.

Really grateful for all the knowledable responses from @Herbie @ColinBarber and others, but can I ask, please:

- which model CTEK booster is suitable to keep in the car (and possibly charge it at home from time to time) to be able to jump-start my car if a similar flat 12V occurs again for whatever reason? Would it be MXS 10? I don't see anything as a jump-starting in the descriptoin, just charger / maintainer.

- if Ctek are not suitable as a jump-start devices, what do you recommend specifically for this 3.5 litre engine on the 2009 RX 450h?

Thank you all in advance.

Brad

[Vicmeldrew]

if Ctek are not suitable as a jump-start devices, what do you recommend specifically for this 3.5 litre engine on the 2009 RX 450h?

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/NOCO-GB40-UltraSafe-Lithium-Starter/dp/B015TKUPIC/ref=sr_1_21?crid=16NU44357MEUP&keywords=portable+car+jump+starter+battery+booster+with+smart+charging&qid=1671627910&sprefix=Smart+battery+starter%2Caps%2C85&sr=8-21

This is what I purchased to start my rx450h when the need has arisen.. it’s probably over the top for rx450h but I wanted to use it on other vehicles

[Herbie]

1 hour ago, Brad Ched said:

which model CTEK booster is suitable to keep in the car (and possibly charge it at home from time to time) to be able to jump-start my car if a similar flat 12V occurs again

I'm not sure but can say that it wouldn't be the MXS 10, which, if I'm reading it correctly, only seems to be a charger rather than a jump start pack.

I have one of these and it's been superb. I've never needed it for my own car but it has started cars for many other people and works first time, every time. It also holds its charge very well as I've only topped it up once (possibly twice after a few starts) per year.

[Brad Ched]

4 hours ago, Herbie said:

I'm not sure but can say that it wouldn't be the MXS 10, which, if I'm reading it correctly, only seems to be a charger rather than a jump start pack.

I have one of these and it's been superb. I've never needed it for my own car but it has started cars for many other people and works first time, every time. It also holds its charge very well as I've only topped it up once (possibly twice after a few starts) per year.

Thank you @Herbie - I simply ordered it this seco9nd after reading your response!

LOL - the 6th picture in the listing - the one surrounded by all the vehicles / gadgets this can charge - one of them is a cruise ship LOL!!!

 

[Brad Ched]

4 hours ago, Vicmeldrew said:

if Ctek are not suitable as a jump-start devices, what do you recommend specifically for this 3.5 litre engine on the 2009 RX 450h?

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/NOCO-GB40-UltraSafe-Lithium-Starter/dp/B015TKUPIC/ref=sr_1_21?crid=16NU44357MEUP&keywords=portable+car+jump+starter+battery+booster+with+smart+charging&qid=1671627910&sprefix=Smart+battery+starter%2Caps%2C85&sr=8-21

This is what I purchased to start my rx450h when the need has arisen.. it’s probably over the top for rx450h but I wanted to use it on other vehicles

Much obliged for your response @Vicmeldrew.

I Dont Believe It!

I just read it 2 minutes after @Herbie's and have already ordered the one he linked. Your proposition seems somewhat nicer and doesn't purport to jump-start cruise ships LOL!

But Thanks!

[Southern Aston]

On 12/17/2022 at 6:29 PM, ColinBarber said:

Nothing wrong with your hybrid traction battery.

The 12 v battery is small and can easily go flat, especially in this cold weather which affects useable capacity. In theory it should have been fine to do what you did but I'd recommend never turning on the ignition without going all the way into Ready mode and let the engine cut in/out as required to keep the hybrid battery charged.

I imagine that the 12 v battery was allowed to discharge on the forecourt and this has damaged/lowered its capacity. Whilst it will probably still work fine if you keep it charged up, you won't get the same duration before it goes flat again and therefore get the dealer to replace it.

If you aren't cumulatively using your vehicle for at least an hour a week then you will want to charge up the 12 v battery (either using a charger (such as Noco or CTEK) or putting the vehicle into Ready mode for 60 minutes).

Hi @ColinBarber, @Herbie 

 

Just coming back to this. I’m considering getting a ‘maintenance’ charger for the 12v in my RX450HL to keep it topped up. As opposed to a jump starter. Unfortunately I’ve only on street parking so cannot charge from the mains. Just wondered if you’re aware of a trickle charger that I can charge from mains in the house and then attach to the 12V in the car to recharge the 12v. As you can tell I’ve not much know how on the practical stuff! 
 

Many thanks