Not a happy bunny

[george72]

After waiting over 9 months I was finally due to pick up my lovely new es300h tomorrow when I received a phone call to say that there was a problem. 

Essentially the dealer is saying they cant offer the finance deal at 4. 9 percent agreed at the point of sale due to lexus finance changing rates. They argued that other models were protected by an increase in financial contribution to mitigate the increase. Whereas the es300h was not protected and in fact there is now no contribution at all. They said that this left a gaping whole and as they had already discounted the car they had very little liverage. 

They have offered by a courtesy car in the interim whilst they speak to lexus UK. I am not happy at all. 

What a terrible experience after waiting 9.5 months! 

[steve2006]

Another member has suffered the same problem recently, IIRC the finance rate is now 8.9% and the small print allows it!

[ColinBarber]

I doubt Lexus UK will be able to do anything. They, essentially Toyota GB, don't have any control over Toyota Financial Services UK as they go up completely different reporting chains into the TMC organisation and each have their own P&L. I imagine it is the finance company that has pulled the plug.

[Cs150]

I picked up the ES around one week past. Rate of 4.9% was given and the document signed indicated Lexus would still be paying the £2k contribution. I plan to clear finance after the first payment. The right thing here is for the original agreement to be honoured push as hard as you can.

[NemesisUK]

15 minutes ago, Cs150 said:

The right thing here is for the original agreement to be honoured

Even when the T&Cs state the rate can be changed?

[Herbie]

1 hour ago, Cs150 said:

The right thing here is for the original agreement to be honoured push as hard as you can.

Unfortunately, the right thing here is the Ts & Cs, which explicitly allow this.

[Cs150]

Not sure it is right thing morally and to preserve reputation. Depends if they want to do right by the customer or act in a way that will put them off purchasing the brand again. 

[Harrier Man]

I feel for you, devastating and what a let down after such a long wait. I do hope Lexus and your dealer come through for you. Any chance of a car loan from elsewhere? I am definitely no financial guru and have no wish to teach any grannies to suck eggs, but MoneySavingExpert 9 Nov 22  were showing some loans from 4.9% (depending on amount borrowed and duration). Might it be possible to take one of these deals to fund your car? Good luck, hope something comes through for you.

[Guest]

Surely the finance was arranged when you signed the order?  i know both times i ordered a Lexus they proposed the finance and wanted it accepted before they ordered the car.

Is it possible the dealer somehow missed that step out?

Of the many cars ive purchased ive never had the finance offer changed once id placed the order .

Surely the terms  that state the offer can be changed or withdrawn at any time is before the customer has applied for and been accepted for that particular offer?

If Lexus are changing the terms  and interest rates of orders made 9 months or more ago , then other than cash buyers, how could anyone place an order not knowing what you will be paying on finance once the car turns up? 

This has got to be a mistake that hopefully will be sorted out ASAP.

 

 

 

[cadman2k]

Other than let "A Customer Down" The dealer will know that in the current climate they will shift a car if cancelled with finance based on today's rates. 

Good luck in getting this sorted.

Did you let your old car go 9 months ago or was there a px involved in the deal also

[ColinBarber]

15 hours ago, PaulD68 said:

This has got to be a mistake that hopefully will be sorted out ASAP.

Neither the dealer, Lexus UK nor Toyota finance are going to make a loss on the deal and they have T&Cs in place to protection them - but if you don't want to accept their new terms then they need to give you a way to back out of the deal without incurring any costs.

Normally there isn't an issue but with extended lead times, increases in component and shippings costs and exchange rate (which can only be hedged for so long) we aren't in normal times when it comes to purchasing a vehicle.

 

That specific T&C is just related to the offer being available to a new order, once the paperwork has been signed a whole bunch of other T&Cs become relevant.

20 hours ago, steve2006 said:

Another member has suffered the same problem recently, IIRC the finance rate is now 8.9% and the small print allows it!

 

[george72]

Well. I have communicated in no uncertain terms my anger and frustration about this situation,that frankly should have been resolved days ago-they told me about this less then 24hrs before I was due to pick the car up. 

At this point I am expecting the dealer to provide me with a resolution that is acceptable. They have offered to provide me with a loan car until they have to to take this up with lexus UK. 

If others have had their original deal honoured then surely there is a precedent here? Perhaps not a legal one but certainly one based on good practice and customer service-I thought lexus were supposed to be top of the league on this?? 

My previous lexus was bought by same dealer as part of this deal but it was not a part exchange as such as the price agreed was contingent upon me handing it over within days of agreeing this deal. 

I am hurt and upset to say the least and even lost a bit of sleep if I was totally honest. And I know it is only a piece of metal ect......

 

 

[Cs150]

Certainly through dealing with Lexus I have overall been underwhelmed. The car is great but I personally thought dealing with Lexus directly and dealer would be better than what it turned out to be. The expectation was greater than the actual experience that was provided. Originally the finance rate was 3.9% I signed up for and they changed the rate to 4.9%. Was advised it can still be paid off anytime after the first payment with a charge of 56 days interest. Changing the rate to 8.9% is a massive change.

[Guest]

22 minutes ago, Cs150 said:

Certainly through dealing with Lexus I have overall been underwhelmed. The car is great but I personally thought dealing with Lexus directly and dealer would be better than what it turned out to be. The expectation was greater than the actual experience that was provided. Originally the finance rate was 3.9% I signed up for and they changed the rate to 4.9%. Was advised it can still be paid off anytime after the first payment with a charge of 56 days interest. Changing the rate to 8.9% is a massive change.

Its worse than just the increase in APR to 9.9% but also the loss of £2000 deposit allowance.

you would have to really really want a Lexus ES to pay that much of an increase.

[rayaans]

3 hours ago, george72 said:

Well. I have communicated in no uncertain terms my anger and frustration about this situation,that frankly should have been resolved days ago-they told me about this less then 24hrs before I was due to pick the car up. 

At this point I am expecting the dealer to provide me with a resolution that is acceptable. They have offered to provide me with a loan car until they have to to take this up with lexus UK. 

If others have had their original deal honoured then surely there is a precedent here? Perhaps not a legal one but certainly one based on good practice and customer service-I thought lexus were supposed to be top of the league on this?? 

My previous lexus was bought by same dealer as part of this deal but it was not a part exchange as such as the price agreed was contingent upon me handing it over within days of agreeing this deal. 

I am hurt and upset to say the least and even lost a bit of sleep if I was totally honest. And I know it is only a piece of metal ect......

 

 

I understand the disappointment that you may be feeling especially waiting so long for the vehicle.

However - it is explicitly stated in the terms and conditions that the finance deal can change

Lexus UK or the dealer might give you a goodwill gesture and you do have the option of paying the finance off as well if you really want the car. 

Unfortunately I dont think anyone can really guarantee the APR at the current time 

[Harrier Man]

Another thought ... Three weeks before I ordered my NX in February, I ordered a Toyota RAV4 PHEV with a 2.9% finance deal and an expected September delivery date. On the expectation of my Lexus dealer that I could have an NX 450h+ in May (didn't happen of course), I cancelled my RAV4 order and placed an order for the Lexus. However, I didn't take up the Lexus finance because it was 4.9% even though both go through Toyota Finance. That aggravated me so I took a Nationwide loan at 2.9% instead.

One of the reasons we (I) pay more for a Lexus than a Toyota is for the usually more customer focused approach the Lexus brand offers. The experience of the OP leaves me feeling less sure about buying a Lexus in the future. I can only reconcile it to myself to some degree by recognising that the whole car industry is in exceptional times at the moment, Even though I believe some of the contributing factors have been due to bad decisions made by the company, many factors have been outside their control.

Whether one considers Lexus should honour the original deal, or whether it is fair for them to wiggle out using the small print, or whether there should be a half way compromise position, is for each of us to decide. It is also for Lexus to wrestle with, given that how they handle cases like this will have an impact on their reputation and potential future sales.

[ColinBarber]

25 minutes ago, Harrier Man said:

However, I didn't take up the Lexus finance because it was 4.9% even though both go through Toyota Finance.

Pricing is based on the demographic they sell to and a Lexus owner is an affluent golf player will more deposable income compared to a Toyota owner in the eyes of the marketing department. Lexus finance, parts, servicing etc. are all priced higher compared to Toyota.

[Cs150]

Can only comment on the experience of the local dealers Toyota and Lexus which are the same franchise operation. Whilst individual staff can make or break it of course; I find no difference in overall customer service between Lexus and Toyota. Of course this is all subjective but it is hard to tell which is the more premium experience based on direct interaction. If anything the Toyota arm of the franchise was a little more helpful with extended test drives etc

[george72]

Well picked up my courtesy car. Spoke to sales staff who appeared to be genuinely sympathetic to my situation and apologised. However they were clear that this was a lexus finance problem rather then theirs as dealer. And whilst this is technically correct-My deal was with the dealer and they are indeed the front door to lexus. They were keen to absolve themselves but did reiterate that the sales manger would be looking to work with lexus to bring about a solution. 

 

[dutchie01]

All brands will be confronted with this problem i guess. Its about increased interest rates but also cars that increased considerably in price during the long wait until delivery. My experience with Volvo in the Netherlands was that the XC60 i ordered back in November was some 8000 euro more expensive on the day of delivery in August. I am leasing through Leaseplan and all orders through them were honored. Private buyers however were given the choice to fork up the difference or cancel the order.

[rayaans]

6 minutes ago, george72 said:

Well picked up my courtesy car. Spoke to sales staff who appeared to be genuinely sympathetic to my situation and apologised. However they were clear that this was a lexus finance problem rather then theirs as dealer. And whilst this is technically correct-My deal was with the dealer and they are indeed the front door to lexus. They were keen to absolve themselves but did reiterate that the sales manger would be looking to work with lexus to bring about a solution. 

 

You are mistaken

The only deal that you made with the dealer was that they can deliver the specified colour and spec. 

Don't forget that by opting for a financial product from the dealership, you're actual finance deal was with Lexus Financial Services which is a completely different entity. 

The distinction is important because you dont own the car, its actually owned by Lexus Financial Services until you pay for it and therefore are bound to their terms and conditions.

You have a few options if the situation stays the same:

1) swallow the extra cost

2) pay off the finance immediately with savings or get a personal loan

3) Walk away and likely you will get your deposit refunded in full.

[george72]

Thank you all. I am struggling to get my head around all of this. It may all be legally cosher but it just does not sit well with me. I feel like I have been left high and dry. Should have never entertained all of this,i had a lovely es300h 2019 f sport with 5k on the clock, what a **** show! 

[NemesisUK]

Have you not explored option #2 as shown in Rayaan's post above. It would seem the logical next step?

[talaipwros]

Just to let you know that there are still around - but not for long -  a few RX450h's well discounted and at 3.9% rate.

[george72]

Even if I pay the finance immediately, I still lose the 2k contribution.