As many of us thought.......from today`s Daily Telegraph

[First_Lexus]

30 minutes ago, Boxbrownie said:

Maybe they are, are your people business users primarily?

One is, but only one. The rest are normal private motorists - not car enthusiasts of any description - who simply bought EVs because they do mileages where the range isn’t an issue for them. Actually, one bought an iPace and then went back to petrol as the range and charging were pretty hopeless for what he wanted.

As with the EY articles and surveys, ‘driving experience’ simply isn’t mentioned by any of them. All they wanted was cheaper charging than petrol/diesel, no road tax and some environmental concerns thrown in.

As with this forum and Lexus - let’s be honest here - any forum is likely to feature significant confirmation bias. 

[Boxbrownie]

16 minutes ago, Malc1 said:

Utopia is usually being quite satisfied with all one has in life ............. and it's in Kent right now, overlooking the water at Queenborough Town Quay 😇

Malc

I knew you were in Kent, that’s why I asked where your Utopia was 😉

[Rabbers]

Frankly I’m surprised that people are surprised that governments are moving to replace the revenues being lost from diminishing sales of non-electric vehicles.  That the same governments encouraged EV sales merely confirms the fact that governments and the bureaucracies that serve them have no memory, let alone a conscience. 

[Las Palmas]

17 hours ago, Spock66 said:

The current Government policy is to raise taxes, if it was not Vehicle Excise Duty it would be something else going up.

I don't have an electric car, but even if I did I would think at £165 per year that's a fair cop.

All governments policies is to get more money in. Not just in UK. How else can not qualified people get the job as politician, needing no qualifications whatsoever, only need somebody to vote on them? Long vacations, high salary, no responsibility.

[Boxbrownie]

2 minutes ago, Rabbers said:

Frankly I’m surprised that people are surprised that governments are moving to replace the revenues being lost from diminishing sales of non-electric vehicles.  That the same governments encouraged EV sales merely confirms the fact that governments and the bureaucracies that serve them have no memory, let alone a conscience. 

It seems to be only the journalists/press that seems surprised, it makes good headlines.

 

The rest of us just get on with life.

[Las Palmas]

1 hour ago, dutchie01 said:

Nobody with a right brain did believe EVs would be taxless until eternity no? Strange and biased article in my opinion. Also not taking into account the rapid development within the EV industry. Batteries will become cheaper and better, lighter more capacity faster charging,recycling. Cheaper cars are on the way, for example VW just announced an ID2 and ID1, Toyota is on a roll etc.

And still mostly produced in China. We all know what it is like to be dependant on one country to deliver what is needed by many.

[LenT]

23 minutes ago, NemesisUK said:

“happiness is not having what you want, but wanting what you have” (Rabbi Hyman Schachtel (1954))

“But wanting all you have is not the same as having all you want.”  LenT (2022)

[Las Palmas]

56 minutes ago, LenT said:

“But wanting all you have is not the same as having all you want.”  LenT (2022)

No, but extremely much more important.

[Rabbers]

29 minutes ago, NemesisUK said:

👍

“happiness is not having what you want, but wanting what you have” (Rabbi Hyman Schachtel (1954))

I’m wondering if the good rabbi was not denying the value, indeed the very concept, of human ambition.  Extended, his thinking would mean that happiness lies in ignorance of the availability of better things.

[LenT]

16 minutes ago, Rabbers said:

I’m wondering if the good rabbi was not denying the value, indeed the very concept, of human ambition.  Extended, his thinking would mean that happiness lies in ignorance of the availability of better things.

That was my thinking too, Renato.

But you’ve expressed it rather better!

While not wishing to denigrate the worthy Rabbi, could his statement not also be summarised as “happiness is being content with your lot”?

[Mincey]

It was obvious that EVs would be taxed. Anyone remember the same thing happening a few years ago when Diesel was "the way to go"? Once everyone had made the switch, up went the tax and fuel costs. And rightly so if you ask me (which nobody did).

[Mr Vlad]

I always thought happiness was a cigar called Hamlet. I wasn't happy after smoking one some years ago lol.

I'm getting a bit peeved off with EV is better than petrol. Petrol is better than EV. Its getting tiresome. Its creeping into most threads slowly but surely. Yes folk gave strong opinions but that's not a good thing as its like shoving something down someone's throat. 

So what EV cars are going to be taxed. Everything gets taxed so what's with the big hoohah over it? Get over it. YES Ev's have their place. That's a given. Fossil fuel cars have their place too. I favour EV But I doubt I'll be in a position to get one so fir the foreseeable I'll stick with my 2.5l V6 and be happy I enjoy driving it 😁

[Boxbrownie]

15 minutes ago, Mr Vlad said:

I always thought happiness was a cigar called Hamlet. I wasn't happy after smoking one some years ago lol.

I'm getting a bit peeved off with EV is better than petrol. Petrol is better than EV. Its getting tiresome. Its creeping into most threads slowly but surely. Yes folk gave strong opinions but that's not a good thing as its like shoving something down someone's throat. 

So what EV cars are going to be taxed. Everything gets taxed so what's with the big hoohah over it? Get over it. YES Ev's have their place. That's a given. Fossil fuel cars have their place too. I favour EV But I doubt I'll be in a position to get one so fir the foreseeable I'll stick with my 2.5l V6 and be happy I enjoy driving it 😁

Until the majority of Lexus forum members are EV drivers it’ll stay this way I am afraid, or are they afraid? 😄

 

It is a shame Lexus (and Toyota) took so long getting onboard, they really did dig their heels in the sand. Had they jumped sooner Lexus could have been a leader just as the “h” series of vehicles was to hybrids.

[bernieeccles]

Read many posts on the Tesla forums of people getting quotes for insurance in the thousands if at all. I don't know if this is an EV thing in general but it does seem that Tesla cars are having problems getting spares when damaged and are often written off because of it.

[Linas.P]

It was quite obvious where it will end, just can't see how anyone can act surprised about it.

There was short period of time where rich could enjoy novel ideas and pretend they are so "clean and environmentally friendly" by being subsidised from tax payer money. Realistically ordinary person was never in position to by brand new £60k electric car and benefit from subsidies, it was just upper classes. But it was always clear this will be short period of time when it was beneficial to own electric car... it turned out to be ~ 6-8 period.

No surprises it will end at some point! As far as I am concerned the sooners is the better -BEVs needs to find the ways to "stand on their own two legs" without subsidies and without coercion. I am sick and tired of having to pay tax so that it could be spent on making them more viable.

The only thing I am wondering about - how that will work with 2030 band on ICEVs... as clearly without being subsidised BEVs just doesn't make any sense for like ~80% of society. I am guessing transition will not be very smooth! But again - who is surprised about that?!

[GMB]

Well, I have now had a go in three different electric vehicles (fully, hybrid and plug-in) and did not like any of them.

Boring, characterless, no fun to drive, rubbish heaters, I could go on but don't want to sound like a Karen or a Brian. Sorry Karen and Brian!

Believe it or not I think the 200t is quieter (yes really) smoother and drives better, mind you - some of that is due to a proper auto transmission.

Don't tell Linus but I like it, especially since the mapping was sorted to get the engine response/turbo lag improved. 

The noisiest bit is from the tyres and road surface just as in the electric things.

It is more expensive with tax and fuel economy but I think worth the extra penalty over electric boredom.

I suppose it takes all sorts......

[Phil xxkr]

3 hours ago, NemesisUK said:

👍

“happiness is not having what you want, but wanting what you have” (Rabbi Hyman Schachtel (1954))

And remembering why you wanted it in the first place. Phil xxkr 

[Phil xxkr]

48 minutes ago, Mr Vlad said:

I always thought happiness was a cigar called Hamlet. I wasn't happy after smoking one some years ago lol.

I'm getting a bit peeved off with EV is better than petrol. Petrol is better than EV. Its getting tiresome. Its creeping into most threads slowly but surely. Yes folk gave strong opinions but that's not a good thing as its like shoving something down someone's throat. 

So what EV cars are going to be taxed. Everything gets taxed so what's with the big hoohah over it? Get over it. YES Ev's have their place. That's a given. Fossil fuel cars have their place too. I favour EV But I doubt I'll be in a position to get one so fir the foreseeable I'll stick with my 2.5l V6 and be happy I enjoy driving it 😁

Only if you have a comb-over hairstyle 😂

[Rabbers]

3 hours ago, LenT said:

While not wishing to denigrate the worthy Rabbi, could his statement not also be summarised as “happiness is being content with your lot”?

I suspect that the political and economic climate of the times LED Schachtel - and other influential religious thinkers in other faiths - to philosophically lean towards more or less extreme forms of socialism wherein personal ambitions and aspirations needed to be sacrificed for  the collective good, and it is easy to see how definitions of happiness, preferably expressed and summarized in the form of pithy sayings, would have been at the forefront of their efforts to teach and communicate.

[ColinBarber]

4 hours ago, First_Lexus said:

As with the EY articles and surveys, ‘driving experience’ simply isn’t mentioned by any of them.

There have been a couple of member here who moved from a RC F/GS F to Tesla M3 with performance and driving experience being part of the reasons. 

[First_Lexus]

From my perspective, there is a serious point here in terms of Government policy.

If we (in the U.K.) really do want to be seen as an international leader in terms of emissions reduction then surely - regardless of whether an EV would work for us personally at the moment or whether we can afford one - Government should be incentivising the switch.

Accepting the ‘revenue gap’ the country currently has, but from a pure policy perspective the move to road tax for EVs combined with the gradual reduction and removal of purchase price subsidy feels a bit odd at this exact moment. Perhaps in 5-10 years when more EVs are on the roads, but now? I’m not sure the message it sends is positive or useful.

[ColinBarber]

21 hours ago, PaulWhitt20 said:

How will this affect the £10 I currently pay for car tax on my 2.5l petrol engine with a small battery and motor on my “alternative fuel” car?

Zero and low emission cars first registered between 1 March 2001 and 30 March 2017 currently in Band A will move to the Band B rate, currently £20 a year.

 

What band B will actually pay in 2025 will depend on budgets between now and then.

[royoftherovers]

8 minutes ago, First_Lexus said:

From my perspective, there is a serious point here in terms of Government policy.

If we (in the U.K.) really do want to be seen as an international leader in terms of emissions reduction then surely - regardless of whether an EV would work for us personally at the moment or whether we can afford one - Government should be incentivising the switch.

Accepting the ‘revenue gap’ the country currently has, but from a pure policy perspective the move to road tax for EVs combined with the gradual reduction and removal of purchase price subsidy feels a bit odd at this exact moment. Perhaps in 5-10 years when more EVs are on the roads, but now? I’m not sure the message it sends is positive or useful.

I think that you are very sure Ed. Smart cookies and wise old owls spell trouble.

This move towards EV smells of calamity to me and the people best placed to profit/benefit from it are the Chinese who are ready to flood the market with low cost and reliable vehicles. Watch VW hit the buffers if it is not extremely careful. And if it goes,then so does the the Western Economy.

All it takes for evil to triumph is for Politicians to do nowt and for the Americans to retreat to their Bunkers.!

[wharfhouse]

14 minutes ago, ColinBarber said:

Zero and low emission cars first registered between 1 March 2001 and 30 March 2017 currently in Band A will move to the Band B rate, currently £20 a year

Other then the SE all other trims of IS 300h were already in Band B so will stay there. That is currently £20 a year but gets discounted to £10 for hybrid (and alternative powered vehicles). For 2023 it says "rates for Alternative Fuel Vehicles and hybrids will also be equalised" - by that I assume it means the £10 discount will be dropped so will mean a doubling in annual ved to £20...!

[ColinBarber]

14 minutes ago, royoftherovers said:

the people best placed to profit/benefit from it are the Chinese who are ready to flood the market with low cost and reliable vehicles. Watch VW hit the buffers if it is not extremely careful. And if it goes,then so does the the Western Economy.

Wasn't the same view held in the 60/70/80s about Japan, and yet here we are on a Lexus forum.