Gs450h (3rd gen) random powercut while driving, now dead

[zeczec]

3 hours ago, Sami Tilander said:

You still need to find out the culprit... Batteries do not "sent out power too intensely", but there is a short-circuit somewhere. If you don't find that, it will happen again even with standard 12V battery...

If the main fuse is blown, the short-circuit must be in the wires leading from battery to the other fuse boxes. That narrows down the search a bit.

One thing bothers me: if your main fuse is blown, how the interior lights can work?

BR.Sami

 

Hi Sami. This is probably best explained with the image attached to this post. There are 3 other fuses that are still connected separately, so I'm guessing that's where the power to the interior lights goes.

 

 

2 hours ago, KayCee said:

Umar

I am not saying that it is this that as happened, but there is a procedure for removing our batteries

To remove battery you must remove negative first then positive last

this is where it can blow that fuse and if the radio is on can blow that,

Install

Positive first Negative Last

I have doubt that its the wrong battery 12v is 12volt

i may be wrong as i am in my 70s i do get things wrong now and then

Hello KayCee. This all happened while I was driving. The electrics were fine for 6 months up to this point. 6 months ago I changed the Battery as the original reached end of life, and I saw a debate on this forum about different batteries that can be used as the original is quite dear. I learnt that any can be used as long as the specs match... but that the capacity (Ah) can exceed the original spec. The original spec being 70Ah, I found one at 100Ah and went for that. This one: https://www.tayna.co.uk/car-batteries/yuasa/ybx5335/

Now because the Battery is physically larger, I've had to remove the Battery tray and just leave it loose. I've been meaning to modify the tray to make it fit and then put the covers on, but not got round to it. And so that leads me to the picture I've attached (presently showing the terminals disconnected). The bracket is loose... plus I've got tools lying around. Do you reckon while driving, stuff moved around and came into contact with the terminals and caused a short circuit - could that be a possibility? 

[zeczec]

5 minutes ago, royoftherovers said:

ROTFL means what John?

It means rolling on the floor laughing 😁.

I think the mechanic assumed I installed a Battery with a higher than recommended Cold Crank Amperage.

[HensTeeth]

33 minutes ago, zeczec said:

And so that leads me to the picture I've attached (presently showing the terminals disconnected). The bracket is loose... plus I've got tools lying around. Do you reckon while driving, stuff moved around and came into contact with the terminals and caused a short circuit - could that be a possibility? 

 

If the bracket managed to catch the positive terminal, and short to chassis, there's your blown fuse ...

[zeczec]

Just now, HensTeeth said:

If the bracket managed to catch the positive terminal, and short to chassis, there's your blown fuse ...

I'm gonna go with this as the cause. Replacement fuse on its way. And I'm going to sort out the mess that is my Battery compartment 😬.

 

Half thinking to order an extra fuse in case that wasn't the cause and it happens again 😅

[royoftherovers]

45 minutes ago, zeczec said:

It means rolling on the floor laughing 😁.

I think the mechanic assumed I installed a battery with a higher than recommended Cold Crank Amperage.

Thanks Umar. I learn daily.

[johnatg]

Trying to get my head round this. Do you mean that the Battery was just standing loose in the corner of the boot - secured by what? - the cables?

It is absolutely essential that the Battery is secured by solid brackets - original or fabricated - so that it cannot move.

I repeat - absolutely essential!

And loose tools flying around are highly undesirable!

[zeczec]

25 minutes ago, johnatg said:

Trying to get my head round this. Do you mean that the battery was just standing loose in the corner of the boot - secured by what? - the cables?

It is absolutely essential that the battery is secured by solid brackets - original or fabricated - so that it cannot move.

I repeat - absolutely essential!

And loose tools flying around are highly undesirable!

Yes, it is as you described 🫢. My excuse is I'm a millennial 😅.

[KayCee]

One thing bothers me: if your main fuse is blown, how the interior lights can work?

i do believe that fuse protects  the hybrid system hence traction Battery going flat

[zeczec]

11 minutes ago, KayCee said:

One thing bothers me: if your main fuse is blown, how the interior lights can work?

i do believe that fuse protects  the hybrid system hence traction battery going flat

Here's my thinking on that. There's an offshoot cable that goes it's own separate way to it's own mini set of 3 fuses... I think the interior lights likely come from that. I've attached a picture of this.

 

In any case, the main 150A fuse is due here tomorrow or day after so let's see... hmmm.

[Herbie]

22 hours ago, zeczec said:

Hi Sami. This is probably best explained with the image attached to this post. There are 3 other fuses that are still connected separately, so I'm guessing that's where the power to the interior lights goes.

 

 

Hello KayCee. This all happened while I was driving. The electrics were fine for 6 months up to this point. 6 months ago I changed the battery as the original reached end of life, and I saw a debate on this forum about different batteries that can be used as the original is quite dear. I learnt that any can be used as long as the specs match... but that the capacity (Ah) can exceed the original spec. The original spec being 70Ah, I found one at 100Ah and went for that. This one: https://www.tayna.co.uk/car-batteries/yuasa/ybx5335/

Now because the battery is physically larger, I've had to remove the battery tray and just leave it loose. I've been meaning to modify the tray to make it fit and then put the covers on, but not got round to it. And so that leads me to the picture I've attached (presently showing the terminals disconnected). The bracket is loose... plus I've got tools lying around. Do you reckon while driving, stuff moved around and came into contact with the terminals and caused a short circuit - could that be a possibility? 

Oh. My. God.

How can you possibly look at that and not know that it's absolute carnage waiting to happen 

Never, ever, ever, leave the Battery unsecured like that.

As for the electrical properties, the higher the Ah figure, the longer it can stand doing nothing before it goes flat. The CCA (Cold Cranking Amps) rating doesn't matter at all for hybrids because the Battery doesn't crank the engine. It only takes 20A to get the car into READY mode, so you have 810A spare 

Besides which, it's the electrical load that dictates what current is drawn. It wouldn't matter if the Battery was 20,000Ah and a CCA of 20,000A; just because the Battery can supply it, it doesn't mean that the car will draw it. I think I'd be looking for a new mechanic with an answer like he gave you.

[zeczec]

42 minutes ago, Herbie said:

Oh. My. God.

How can you possibly look at that and not know that it's absolute carnage waiting to happen 

Never, ever, ever, leave the battery unsecured like that.

As for the electrical properties, the higher the Ah figure, the longer it can stand doing nothing before it goes flat. The CCA (Cold Cranking Amps) rating doesn't matter at all for hybrids because the battery doesn't crank the engine. It only takes 20A to get the car into READY mode, so you have 810A spare 

Besides which, it's the electrical load that dictates what current is drawn. It wouldn't matter if the battery was 20,000Ah and a CCA of 20,000A; just because the battery can supply it, it doesn't mean that the car will draw it. I think I'd be looking for a new mechanic with an answer like he gave you.

This is for sure a case study for others to learn from!

[ColinBarber]

3 hours ago, zeczec said:

Here's my thinking on that. There's an offshoot cable that goes it's own separate way to it's own mini set of 3 fuses... I think the interior lights likely come from that. I've attached a picture of this.

It's common on Toyota/Lexus vehicles that there isn't just a single main fuse. Those others are possibly supplying power for the alarm, hybrid system, electric power steering etc. and it seems some emergency lighting 😉 

[zeczec]

53 minutes ago, ColinBarber said:

It's common on Toyota/Lexus vehicles that there isn't just a single main fuse. Those others are possibly supplying power for the alarm, hybrid system, electric power steering etc. and it seems some emergency lighting 😉 

Incidentally... Not the hazard lights. Hazard lights are sadly completely dead... Which seems like a safety issue.

[zeczec]

Good news. I've installed the replacement fuse and my car is fully back in working order, thank God.

I've tidied up the Battery compartment, but still more to do before I properly start driving this car again (need to modify my Battery tray to fit this battery). This has been a good thread and I thank everyone for their contributions. And if that fuse blows again, I'll look to update you here 😌. But I think, it will be okay now. Lesson: properly secure Battery with brackets and apply all supplied covers.

[Lwerewolf]

Just saying.

[zeczec]

26 minutes ago, Lwerewolf said:

Just saying.

It's a good thread. I see some have removed their Battery tray, and I may have to do the same as the Battery I have is a bit too long to fit. Width is fine though. Unless I modify the tray.