IS250 Clutch & Flywheel Kit

[karlfullard]

Looking for recommendations on where to find a clutch and flywheel replacement kit as I’m struggling to find one other than an Exedy kit on eBay for £1100. 

[Vintagesixtysix]

Welcome….

You may already be aware that a lot of members are going to be auto so maybe not so many recommendations through experience.

Are you petrol or diesel ?

[karlfullard]

Thanks for your reply.

Yeah the manual cars seem to be quite rare in comparison to the auto’s which is probably why there isn’t many options around for replacing the clutch & flywheel, yes petrol.

[Linas.P]

Yes, this is one of the pitfalls of having manual IS250 - clutch work is expensive and works out around £800-£1200, same goes for OE Lexus/Toyota parts. So I think what you are finding is in ballpark of what it costs. 

[karlfullard]

Yeah that’s what I’ve came to realise, I just thought I would try ask on here to confirm my suspicions before I committed to buying.
 

I’m not sure if the dmf is at fault or not however the clutch is certainly worn and I thought while I was in there it would be best to just replace both the flywheel and the clutch

The kit I’ve found is replacing the dmf with a solid mass flywheel which I’m in two minds about however I cannot find a replacement dmf anywhere has anybody here fitted a single mass and how do you find it? 

thanks for your reply. 

[Mr Vlad]

Changing from a DMF to a Solid Mass flywheel can be Catastrophic. Why? Because of the weight difference. Its been the case where such a swap has been done and a massive vibration because the crank is out of balance and gives up. Its happened to RoverMG cars (I know from my Rover years and the forum). It's probably happened to orher brands of cars too.

[Linas.P]

3 minutes ago, Mr Vlad said:

Changing from a DMF to a Solid Mass flywheel can be Catastrophic. Why? Because of the weight difference. Its been the case where such a swap has been done and a massive vibration because the crank is out of balance and gives up. Its happened to RoverMG cars (I know from my Rover years and the forum). It's probably happened to orher brands of cars too.

I think in case of Exedy kit OP is referring to - it is made for IS250, so it is balanced right etc. Solid flywheel is cheaper, more robust, but probably will result in less smooth gear changes. 

As well, it is likely that only clutch needs changing, but considering overall effort required to replace the clutch it just makes sense to deal with flywheel as well at the same time. 

[karlfullard]

Yeah the kit is specific for an IS250 I will link the listing below, ideally I would replace it with a DMF however I cannot find one and I’m assuming main dealer will want a fortune but I could always call for a quote

it is tempting to just try a clutch kit in the car but it has a slight judder pulling away if you don’t get the revs perfect every time which I’ve managed to get down to a T almost in the year I’ve owned it and I can pull away smooth but if I just try to pull away as you would in any other car it will judder

which could definitely be the DMF but I’m also thinking it’s maybe just a worn cutch because the engagement point is almost at the top of the peddles travel here is the link for the kit.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/372706999471?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=NbW-CGVRRNO&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=KMnEp9liTZK&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

[H3XME]

On 11/2/2022 at 6:04 PM, karlfullard said:

Looking for recommendations on where to find a clutch and flywheel replacement kit as I’m struggling to find one other than an Exedy kit on eBay for £1100. 

Hi Karl,

I had the pleasure of replacing the clutch on my manual IS250 a couple of years ago. It had its first ever clutch change at 140,000 miles. I bought EXEDY OE replacement clutch. I cost me ~£300 then but I see they are over £500 now... (Part number: LEK2001).

A1 Clutches have replaced it for me and charged £220 I think. They replaced the fluids too.. 

I was worried I would need a new flywheel as well, but seeing the OEM flywheel was ~£900+VAT from the main dealer, I was either going to buy a solid flywheel from Fidenza from the states (I wanted a solid one anyway as it would be lighter and better for drifting & spirited driving) for £500-600 delivered.

I ended up going to A1 Clutches with my exedra kit that included cover, disc & bearing and asked them to let me know if the flywheel needs doing too. Majority of the garages will tell you that you should replace the flywheel as well to get more money out of you, but that's only the case if your flywheel has heat spots - which you shouldn't get unless you're particularly bad with riding your clutch or doing burnouts a lot. 

Long story short, my flywheel was fine to reuse, didn't need skimming or anything (not really possible on DMF anyway) and the whole clutch change cost me around £500...

I had a quick look and I would recommend this BluePrint clutch kit for £338... https://www.autodoc.co.uk/blue-print/7981920 I've used many BluePrint parts in the past, they are OE quality with the brand stamp & mark up..  

 

Old clutch for reference.

 

[H3XME]

19 hours ago, Mr Vlad said:

Changing from a DMF to a Solid Mass flywheel can be Catastrophic. Why? Because of the weight difference. Its been the case where such a swap has been done and a massive vibration because the crank is out of balance and gives up. Its happened to RoverMG cars (I know from my Rover years and the forum). It's probably happened to orher brands of cars too.

It's not really the case on these cars. Rovers are infamously 💩, my mate with a 350Z (3.5L V6), went to a Competition Clutch Solid flywheel from the factory DMF and the difference was minimal. It's better for performance purposes but doesn't cause faults otherwise well known aftermarket clutch manufacturers wouldn't offer such products. They are all being tested - I worked for an aftermarket performance parts distributor and we dealt with a lot of brands such Competition Clutch, Exedy, Helix, HKS, Mishimoto, Whiteline, Cusco, Goodridge, HEL, PFC, EBC you name it. I know how these top level manufacturers test & push new products out. 

[Mr Vlad]

Oh dear Lucas. I'm disappointed you think Rover cars are *******. They're actually superb and I've had 12 of them. The problem with the solid flywheel replacing DMF was particularly with the diesel cars. Oh the Rover diesel cars had BMW engines. I'm not knocking your knowledge but what I've stated is Fact. I'm talking historically and about 15 years ago maybe 18.

[H3XME]

1 minute ago, Mr Vlad said:

Oh dear Lucas. I'm disappointed you think Rover cars are *******. They're actually superb and I've had 12 of them. The problem with the solid flywheel replacing DMF was particularly with the diesel cars. Oh the Rover diesel cars had BMW engines. I'm not knocking your knowledge but what I've stated is Fact. I'm talking historically and about 15 years ago maybe 18.

Okay, on a diesel I'm with you on that...  diesel engines vibrate A LOT more than normal petrols. 

[Lex_utor]

On 11/3/2022 at 3:15 PM, karlfullard said:

it is tempting to just try a clutch kit in the car but it has a slight judder pulling away if you don’t get the revs perfect every time which I’ve managed to get down to a T almost in the year I’ve owned it and I can pull away smooth but if I just try to pull away as you would in any other car it will judder

 

Oh boy, I have noticed this with my car as well. I also have a manual IS250. I was hoping it wasn't the clutch going south. So the judder means flywheel is on the way out too? Is this a common problem with these cars?

Never had that and have always had manuals. First time it happened I wondered if it had anything to do with the traction control. With mine, basically if you don't take off like a race driver, it will judder.

But sometimes I find it only really happens when the car is cold. Or at least happens more easily when cold. Actually the whole grear change is night and day different between cold and warm, which is nothing abnormal for manual cars.  Once it warms up it's great. But cold, second gear is a bit annoying. 

But I have been fearing the clutch. It's interesting that this is my first Lexus and is turning to be the car which threw me the most big bills. One of the reasons I bought a Lexus was exactly because I was tired of big bills from an Alfa and my RX8. 😄

[karlfullard]

H3XME thanks for your reply good information there which will definitely help me much appreciated 

Lex_utor

Your issue sounds very similar to mine however mine is not effected by temp as it will judder the same warm or cold I’ve managed to learn to drive around it and can pull away smooth but your right they don’t like to pull away slow you have to get the revs up first and then clutch out quickly and get moving otherwise it’ll judder just feeding in the power slowly bit of a ball ache when driving in traffic or around car parks 

I think it’s made worse by the fact these cars don’t have a great deal of low down torque and like to be revved to get the most out of them 

I’ve had quite a few cars with this issue but they where diesel VAG cars which suffer badly with DMF issues through the 2000s into the 2010’s I’m hoping my issue here is just a worn clutch but it’s very possible it’s the DMF however it doesn’t chatter on idle like a bad DMF usually does so I’m hopeful but I’m ready to replace the DMF if needs be

on your shift quality comment I changed my gearbox oil and put some molyslip gearbox additive in and the gearshifts are lovely now even when the box is cold so might be worth giving that a go it was certainly worth it for me 

turning the traction control fully off strangely does seem help the issue I’ve experimented with that also I find the traction control extremely intrusive on these cars even if the light doesn’t appear on the dash it seems to be always doing something the background

my car goes around corners completely different and way better with it off vs with it on and pulling away is also smoother my guess is you have more control over the throttle with it on by that I mean the car isn’t holding back how much % of throttle it’s giving you vs your input on the peddle but that’s just a guess. 

[Lex_utor]

3 hours ago, karlfullard said:

Lex_utor

Your issue sounds very similar to mine however mine is not effected by temp as it will judder the same warm or cold I’ve managed to learn to drive around it and can pull away smooth but your right they don’t like to pull away slow you have to get the revs up first and then clutch out quickly and get moving otherwise it’ll judder just feeding in the power slowly bit of a ball ache when driving in traffic or around car parks 

I think it’s made worse by the fact these cars don’t have a great deal of low down torque and like to be revved to get the most out of them 

I’ve had quite a few cars with this issue but they where diesel VAG cars which suffer badly with DMF issues through the 2000s into the 2010’s I’m hoping my issue here is just a worn clutch but it’s very possible it’s the DMF however it doesn’t chatter on idle like a bad DMF usually does so I’m hopeful but I’m ready to replace the DMF if needs be

on your shift quality comment I changed my gearbox oil and put some molyslip gearbox additive in and the gearshifts are lovely now even when the box is cold so might be worth giving that a go it was certainly worth it for me 

turning the traction control fully off strangely does seem help the issue I’ve experimented with that also I find the traction control extremely intrusive on these cars even if the light doesn’t appear on the dash it seems to be always doing something the background

my car goes around corners completely different and way better with it off vs with it on and pulling away is also smoother my guess is you have more control over the throttle with it on by that I mean the car isn’t holding back how much % of throttle it’s giving you vs your input on the peddle but that’s just a guess. 

Similar indeed. But it seems yours is a bit worse. Maybe mine is not on that stage yet, but will? Mine is not really an issue when driving in traffic or around car parks. And warm it does get better.

I also tested without the tractio control and also got the impression it was better. But I wasn't sure, thought it could be just wishful thinking. I also like driving with the TC off, but since it turns itself back on when you turn the car off, I always forget to turn it off again every time I turn the car on. 

But I love how my car goes around corners regardless. It sticks to the road like glue. Like it's on rails. 

Good tip about the gearbox oil and the molyslip gearbox additive. How much does that kind of service normally cost?

[karlfullard]

Yeah it won’t get any better anyway that’s for sure, my car was like that when I bought it so it’s possible it was driver error in the past or it’s just wear and tear the car is on 109k and 13yr old clutches and DMF are wear items at the end of the day, yes the handling is very good on the IS for the size and weight of the car it’s well setup and has good mechanical grip, I did the service myself, I paid about a tenner for the additive can’t remember how much the oil was but all in with new crush washers it was less than £50 not sure how much a garage would charge it all depends on their labour costs 

[Lex_utor]

Yeah, mine was also like that when I bought it. I wonder if I should change the clutch right away or wait till it gets worse. I can drive around it, as you say. 

[H3XME]

15 minutes ago, Lex_utor said:

Yeah, mine was also like that when I bought it. I wonder if I should change the clutch right away or wait till it gets worse. I can drive around it, as you say. 

@karlfullard this judder you’re talking about. I had the same on mine basically when the clutch was too worn to grip properly. Don’t stress over changing your flywheel, get the clutch bought, drop it off and tell them check over your DMF - if it’s not got heat spots, it will be fine. Judder could also be a result of a worn release bearing. Dont just assume it’s the DMF aka the worst case scenario. Go to the garage and ask them to check if the flywheel is reusable. Simple as that 

[Lex_utor]

What's this DMF you are all talking about in the V6 petrol?

And if mine is not that bad yet, should I hurry to change the clutch? 

[H3XME]

18 minutes ago, Lex_utor said:

What's this DMF you are all talking about in the V6 petrol?

And if mine is not that bad yet, should I hurry to change the clutch? 

Dual Mass Flywheel

[karlfullard]

@H3XME That’s what I’m going to do is order a clutch and have it fitted and get them to advise on the flywheel and go from there my thoughts where also that it may just be down to a worn clutch not grabbing the flywheel properly 

[AFlex]

Take a look at the US forums - a guy called Jeff Lange is running a pretty sweet clutch setup (SMF) and he has upgraded his IS250 to a 350 engine. Impressive stuff

[H3XME]

1 hour ago, AFlex said:

Take a look at the US forums - a guy called Jeff Lange is running a pretty sweet clutch setup (SMF) and he has upgraded his IS250 to a 350 engine. Impressive stuff

If it’s the guy I’m thinking of he had a bad time doing that swap. Things weren’t as simple as they sound, but a manual is350 would be the dream