What replacement 12V battery to use?

[BossCT200hAdv]

Should I replace my factory-fitted Yuasa 12V Battery with the same OEM one, or would a third-party one be fine?

Cheers.

[ColinBarber]

3rd party are fine but you ideally want an AGM Battery and certainly one that can take a vent hose.

[BossCT200hAdv]

Thanks.  I contacted my Lexus dealership, asking for a quote for a direct replacement, and they’ve tried to fob me off with not knowing what “OEM Yuasa” means.  I assume they’ll fit a non-standard 3rd-party one.

Can most garages do this - Lexus says it’s a 5 mins job - or do electronics need to be reset, etc?  I might stand a better chance getting what I want, elsewhere.

[Herbie]

48 minutes ago, BossCT200hAdv said:

Should I replace my factory-fitted Yuasa 12V battery with the same OEM one, or would a third-party one be fine?

Cheers.

I may be wrong but I thought all factory-fitted batteries were Panasonic, not Yuasa?

[ColinBarber]

11 minutes ago, Herbie said:

I may be wrong but I thought all factory-fitted batteries were Panasonic, not Yuasa?

On the 1.8 hybrid (Prius/Auris/CT) they seem to have always exclusively used Yuasa.

[ColinBarber]

21 minutes ago, BossCT200hAdv said:

Thanks.  I contacted my Lexus dealership, asking for a quote for a direct replacement, and they’ve tried to fob me off with not knowing what “OEM Yuasa” means.  I assume they’ll fit a non-standard 3rd-party one.

Can most garages do this - Lexus says it’s a 5 mins job - or do electronics need to be reset, etc?  I might stand a better chance getting what I want, elsewhere.

No, a Lexus dealer will supply a Toyota branded Battery which is almost certainly a Yuasa.

Yes, 5 minute job. Can't remember what needs resetting on the CT - maybe reinitialise the auto windows and you my lose the radio presents.

[Poundy]

This is what you get from Lexus

It's a Toyota branded yuasa AGM Battery made in korea'

Lexus supply them to owners way below online and Battery outlet prices. Think I paid around £100 fitted by lexus 2 or 3 years ago they did a free nail in tyre repair while I was there 😁

 

 

[Las Palmas]

17 hours ago, BossCT200hAdv said:

Should I replace my factory-fitted Yuasa 12V battery with the same OEM one, or would a third-party one be fine?

Cheers.

Is your Battery causing problems with a 2017 car?

Anybody know how long time the batteries normally would last?

Our 2016 has so far not shown any problems starting, but if all the Battery does is starting the computer then it should last as long as in our laptops. 10+ years.

Did not answer the question = OEM Battery is usually the best, but I think it should last more than 5 years.

On our Dyson sucker the cheap one from China has so far been working fine 4 years, the original Dyson only 2½ (after warranty was gone). Next vacuum cleaner will not be a Dyson.

 

[Duggie B]

1 hour ago, Las Palmas said:

Is your battery causing problems with a 2017 car?

My 2018 GS 300h had issues with its 12v Battery, (after a lay up for a few months) despite the Lexus advice to keep it topped up in ready mode for once or twice a week it wouldn't hold charge for more than a couple of days and gave no end of grief, I did have it on a Battery maintainer which did keep it "alive" but for peace of mind I had it replaced with original Panasonic/Toyota/Lexus Battery (bespoke shape) which occasionally I hook up to the maintainer to prevent a repeat performance.....I have heard of some horror stories regarding the multi media unit going awry when swapping out the 12v Battery leading to some rather expensive remedial work (on the GS).

[BossCT200hAdv]

 

This is what is currently fitted:

I've looked it up and it's a Yuasa HJ-S46B24R JIS B24 12V AGM, just to be precise.

20 hours ago, Poundy said:

Lexus supply them to owners way below online and battery outlet prices. Think I paid around £100 fitted by lexus 2 or 3 years ago

I was quoted £164 (+ free labour), for the Battery they didn't specify, which seems about the consumer retail price. 

5 hours ago, Las Palmas said:

Is your battery causing problems with a 2017 car?

3 hours ago, Duggie B said:

My 2018 GS 300h had issues with its 12v battery, (after a lay up for a few months) despite the Lexus advice to keep it topped up in ready mode for once or twice a week it wouldn't hold charge for more than a couple of days and gave no end of grief, I did have it on a battery maintainer which did keep it "alive" but for peace of mind I had it replaced with original Panasonic/Toyota/Lexus battery (bespoke shape) which occasionally I hook up to the maintainer to prevent a repeat performance....

It was an ex-demo model and may have sat on the forecourt, unused, for far longer than they said and I let the warranty expire, before realising the Battery had deteriorated.

It won't hold a charge for more than a few days and has regularly gone flat, as it isn't driven every day.

 

[WearLexus]

I’m sure I’ve seen videos online about how to connect a 12v supply to the vehicle while changing the Battery so all your media centre settings don’t get lost or return to default. It can take an age especially on Lexus/Toyotas to do things like reset the separate tone controls for each mode...CD, FM, DAB, USB, etc. Then there’s sat nav preferences and more. Might be worth having a look but I hope you’re sorted soon.

[northernstar]

My CT is 10 years old @80k miles, the original factory supplied Battery is still going strong.

Love this car.

[SonnyA85]

On 7/25/2022 at 8:00 PM, BossCT200hAdv said:

Thanks.  I contacted my Lexus dealership, asking for a quote for a direct replacement, and they’ve tried to fob me off with not knowing what “OEM Yuasa” means.  I assume they’ll fit a non-standard 3rd-party one.

Can most garages do this - Lexus says it’s a 5 mins job - or do electronics need to be reset, etc?  I might stand a better chance getting what I want, elsewhere.

I changed mine myself. It's a 20 minute job because of the location and number of bolts you need to unscrew and then tighten.

 

Everything on the car worked fine including clock. I didn't need to reset anything.

 

[SonnyA85]

On 7/26/2022 at 12:17 PM, Las Palmas said:

Is your battery causing problems with a 2017 car?

Anybody know how long time the batteries normally would last?

Our 2016 has so far not shown any problems starting, but if all the battery does is starting the computer then it should last as long as in our laptops. 10+ years.

Did not answer the question = OEM battery is usually the best, but I think it should last more than 5 years.

On our Dyson sucker the cheap one from China has so far been working fine 4 years, the original Dyson only 2½ (after warranty was gone). Next vacuum cleaner will not be a Dyson.

 

Car batteries need to be kept above 12.5v ideally. normal is 13v-14.5v.

 

If your car Battery goes below 12v it depends on a lot of factors. Number of times its depleted, how far below 12v and for how long. Every time it goes below 12v it does permanent damage to the point it will no longer be usable unless you top it back up with distilled water, epsom salts and then put a very high amp rate through it like 40-200A. A normal car charger will only do 2-4A with really good ones maxing out at 12A so you need to use a welding inverter to get to the 40A to 200A levels. If you do that then you can use a Battery forever as the distilled water and salt with the high amps will undo all the damage.

 

A Battery will last until all the water evaporates if used daily for a decent run.

 

[SonnyA85]

On 7/25/2022 at 7:19 PM, BossCT200hAdv said:

Should I replace my factory-fitted Yuasa 12V battery with the same OEM one, or would a third-party one be fine?

Cheers.

I replaced with a larger capacity from the other thread on here. It should theoretically last longer because it can go longer before damage is done to it

[Poundy]

23 hours ago, SonnyA85 said:

Car batteries need to be kept above 12.5v ideally. normal is 13v-14.5v.

 

If your car battery goes below 12v it depends on a lot of factors. Number of times its depleted, how far below 12v and for how long. Every time it goes below 12v it does permanent damage to the point it will no longer be usable unless you top it back up with distilled water, epsom salts and then put a very high amp rate through it like 40-200A. A normal car charger will only do 2-4A with really good ones maxing out at 12A so you need to use a welding inverter to get to the 40A to 200A levels. If you do that then you can use a battery forever as the distilled water and salt with the high amps will undo all the damage.

 

A battery will last until all the water evaporates if used daily for a decent run.

 

No water to top up, or facility to do it if the correct AGM Battery is being used. Also, if using a smart charger don't bother trying to use the Recon mode as that is not applicable to AGM batteries, it is only beneficial to wet batteries.

Wet batteries are nowhere near as efficient or long lasting as AGM and possibly all stop/start cars, are now fitted with AGM as OE equipment.

[SonnyA85]

12 hours ago, Poundy said:

No water to top up, or facility to do it if the correct AGM battery is being used. Also, if using a smart charger don't bother trying to use the Recon mode as that is not applicable to AGM batteries, it is only beneficial to wet batteries.

Wet batteries are nowhere near as efficient or long lasting as AGM and possibly all stop/start cars, are now fitted with AGM as OE equipment.

Interesting about efficiency. How more efficient are they? Also what makes them longer lasting the fact that they don't let the water evaporate?

 

I'd say wet batteries are longer lasting because they can be refurbished and brought back to full capacity quite easily.

 

[ColinBarber]

2 hours ago, SonnyA85 said:

Interesting about efficiency. How more efficient are they? Also what makes them longer lasting the fact that they don't let the water evaporate?

Efficiency is probably the wrong term. They support a higher discharge before being damaged and are suited for the CT with its small Battery that easily gets discharged. They are safer in an accident because the acid cannot run free.

 

15 hours ago, Poundy said:

Wet batteries are nowhere near as efficient or long lasting as AGM and possibly all stop/start cars, are now fitted with AGM as OE equipment.

AGM is normally used for start/stop systems because they can be charged at a higher rate and therefore charge can be maintained even with higher use of the starter motor.

This isn't an issue for Toyota hybrids as the Battery isn't used to turn over the engine and Toyota/Lexus have mainly reverted back to flooded batteries for their latest Hybrids (ES, UX, latest RX etc).

[Barry14UK]

If using a charger for bringing up level in an AGM Battery it should not be capable of charging at more than 5amp according to Lexus manual on my RX450h which also means using an appropriate 'smart charger', in AGM charging mode,  I read some car models with AGM batteries (but I don't know which), should be charged at a maximum 4amp.

AGM batteries are heavier and contain more lead than their free flow lead acid counterparts and as has been said the acid is absorbed within a mat.

[Poundy]

3 hours ago, SonnyA85 said:

Interesting about efficiency. How more efficient are they? Also what makes them longer lasting the fact that they don't let the water evaporate?

 

I'd say wet batteries are longer lasting because they can be refurbished and brought back to full capacity quite easily.

 

 My original comment was to purely point out that you cannot top up OE agm Lexus CT200h batteries as suggested and perhaps not a good idea to try.

On the efficiency comparison Agm will perform at least 3x the number of cycles than a wet, are maintenance free, are not subject to outside temp changes, do not leak, they cope with high discharge better and last much longer. Cons they are expensive, but you get what you pay for lol!

Having to refurbish something to extend its life is hardly a comparison to something that doesn't need refurbing to function longer. It's a bit like saying my Dunlop tyres have a longer life than your Goodyear if I retread them now and again 😁

My Jaguar XF-R sport AGM Battery went close on 8year before replacement and was still working without any issues and is the norm for most AGM batteries. The only reason I changed it was the capacity was reading down to 65%. which is my favoured replacement signal. Never seen a wet cell get close to those numbers and if it did it would be the exception to the rule.

[Poundy]

2 hours ago, ColinBarber said:

This isn't an issue for Toyota hybrids as the battery isn't used to turn over the engine and Toyota/Lexus have mainly reverted back to flooded batteries for their latest Hybrids (ES, UX, latest RX etc).

Step backwards IMHO, it can only be from a cost saving point of view. Lexus were all about a quality step up from Toyota.

The days of sulphuric acid leaking away in the boot should be long gone now 😄

2 hours ago, ColinBarber said:

Efficiency is probably the wrong term.

I beg to differ 😉

On the efficiency comparison Agm will perform at least 3x the number of cycles than a wet, are maintenance free, are not subject to outside temp changes, do not leak, they cope with high discharge better and last much longer. Cons they are expensive, but you get what you pay for lol!

 

[Poundy]

1 hour ago, Barry14UK said:

If using a charger for bringing up level in an AGM battery it should not be capable of charging at more than 5amp according to Lexus manual on my RX450h which also means using an appropriate 'smart charger', in AGM charging mode,  I read some car models with AGM batteries (but I don't know which), should be charged at a maximum 4amp.

AGM batteries are heavier and contain more lead than their free flow lead acid counterparts and as has been said the acid is absorbed within a mat.

If in Doubt use normal mode 14.4v not AGM 14.7 as only certain AGM need 14.7V and will still charge correctly with 14.4v normal setting.

Dear Sir;

There are many different Battery manufacturers and Battery models on the market.
Recommendations regarding charging voltage vary a bit.

Most AGM- batteries are recommended to charge with normal 14.4V voltage.
Some AGM- batteries (and Ca-Ca batteries) require 14.7V (snowflake) for best treatment.

Please check with the Battery manufacturer to get the correct information for your particular Battery.

If no information is possible to acquire, use normal charging option, 14.4V It suits most lead/acid batteries, including GEL, EFB, AGM, etc.
It is better to charge with a bit too low voltage than too high.

Yours, sincerely,
Teresa
CTEK

[ColinBarber]

3 hours ago, Poundy said:

I beg to differ 😉

On the efficiency comparison Agm will perform at least 3x the number of cycles than a wet, are maintenance free, are not subject to outside temp changes, do not leak, they cope with high discharge better and last much longer. Cons they are expensive, but you get what you pay for lol!

Just because it is AGM, it doesn't mean it is better quality. You can get good AGM batteries, and you can get cheap ones - the same for flooded batteries. Cycle count is really only increased if it is a good quality deep-cycle AGM Battery, but for normal use in a daily used vehicle it isn't needed.

 

3 hours ago, Poundy said:

Lexus were all about a quality step up from Toyota.

Not at all from an engineering point of view, only marketing. When Lexus first launched it didn't exist in Japan, with top end Toyotas being of higher quality. Really the difference is in styling and interior finishes - mechanically and electronically they have always been the same.

[Poundy]

1 hour ago, ColinBarber said:

Just because it is AGM, it doesn't mean it is better quality. You can get good AGM batteries, and you can get cheap ones - the same for flooded batteries. Cycle count is really only increased if it is a good quality deep-cycle AGM battery, but for normal use in a daily used vehicle it isn't needed.

 

Not at all from an engineering point of view, only marketing. When Lexus first launched it didn't exist in Japan, with top end Toyotas being of higher quality. Really the difference is in styling and interior finishes - mechanically and electronically they have always been the same.

It depends. if you want to compare a cheap AGM with a cheap wet cell or a quality AGM with a quality wet cell. The scenario is the same the AGM is more efficient in its power storage and distribution. Like sized powered batteries will still have a 3-1 plus starting advantage in its life expectancy in favour of AGM and no sulfation.

It's irrelevant if its needed or not Its progress " Lexus the luxury Vehicle division of Toyota" " In the pursuit of perfection"

" ok guys get those quality batteries of and fit the wets, make sure the caps are tight a don.t spill anything"

" Hmm! do we really need radial tyres or come to that lead free paint, what about using the Duckhams 20/50 engine oil"

You couldn't make it up, even Lada fit AGM whether you need it or not 😅

[Las Palmas]

1 hour ago, Poundy said:

You couldn't make it up, even Lada fit AGM whether you need it or not 😅

If we agree that acid is not good for paint, skin and other things: AGM batteries are the right choice.

First time I remember seeing an AGM Battery was in Toyota Supra 3.0 Targa maybe in 1984 - 1986. I noticed the label: Maintenance Free.