Why are folk selling their is250's

[SeanR]

Been reading posts on here since February and not read of anything catastrophic yet.

No engine out and repair issues, no talk of worn timing chains!, 

So thats good.

I know Linas had a weird problem with his but im assuming this is uncommon ?

Mine has developed a problem, when i put up the side passenger window the trim lifts up about 5mm with it, but i can live with that lol, maybe try some silicone spray on it or something. Perhaps the hot weather recently making the rubber seal grippy.

Will say that the F sport grille has improved the looks from standard. Think the car still looks quite modern apart from the rear exhausts. Modern cars seem to have the exhaust and bottom trim a bit more up to date and integrated, but again just being picky.

 

 

[Mr Vlad]

Well I very nearly found a reason to get rid. My youngest daughter hopefully today will give birth to her 3rd. She got a pram and baby seat. I usually test these for quality and fit before the day but today I test fitted the baby seat which nowadays need to be rear facing. I was horrified on the utter bad fit. Wobbly all over the place. I thought the car rear seat just to bucket seat type. All previous cars I chauffeured my new born grandkids had 'flatter' seats and no issues with baby seat fitting. Anyway woman at Halfords was superb. After a car seat grip mat the baby seat now fits as it should plus I didn't quite have the routing of the seat belt right, had the belt over a bit it should have gone under. 

[LenT]

29 minutes ago, Mr Vlad said:

. I usually test these for quality and fit …

Somehow, I’ve always pictured you as probably being too big to fit in one… 😊

[Mr Vlad]

lol Len. Yes too big to sit in one but possibly a bit old to fit it in especially when one has had a ruddy hard week and ones back isn't as it once was lol.

[Linas.P]

10 hours ago, SeanR said:

Been reading posts on here since February and not read of anything catastrophic yet.

No engine out and repair issues, no talk of worn timing chains!, 

So thats good.

I know Linas had a weird problem with his but im assuming this is uncommon ?

 

I have been on here for like 7 years and there was single occasion of blown head gasket and no other serious issues ever reported, but in that instance there was logical explanation. Basically, car was 60k miles, but 10 years old and water pump gave way, leaked coolant and owner didn't realise that until it was too late, as result engine overheated and blown head gasket. IS is really a cars fault? or a bit of missed maintenance? 

I had weird problem, but that is because I bought "non running" car dirt cheap from auction and it was way way worse than anyone can imagine, horrible service history etc. My suspicion is that somebody jump started the car incorrectly, potentially multiple times, blown some wires, blown immobiliser, then tried to repair it but failed and then flocked the car on copart. It is nothing to do with Lexus or IS250, it was just some imb/ec/iles who previously owned and worked on the car. In the end of day I have fixed immobiliser issue by getting whole replacement ECU kit, but still could not figure out where engine harness is shorting and I am not good enough electrician to do it - "simple" fix would be to replace the harness, but that requires removing the gearbox so I am struggling to do it on the driveway. 

In short - nothing seriously wrong with IS250 whatsoever, there are some "weaknesses", but to really be impacted you have to drive 200-300k miles. All the issues are solved by having port injection like on IS350, but again one has to drive for 100s of thousands of miles to really bother.

[H3XME]

On 7/2/2022 at 7:06 PM, Linas.P said:

In short - nothing seriously wrong with IS250 whatsoever, there are some "weaknesses", but to really be impacted you have to drive 200-300k miles. All the issues are solved by having port injection like on IS350, but again one has to drive for 100s of thousands of miles to really bother.

I don't think there are any major issues with carbon build up in these cars in Europe, are there? Isn't it mainly the US with their poor quality fuel that contributes to this. Speaking of IS350.. I saw a couple for sale on the FB Marketplace over the past few months. Maybe get one of those Linas! I was tempted as £7-8k is reasonable for ~60,000 mile car.. people pay that for IS250s these days, but I think I'd miss the third pedal too much for what I use the car for. Though there are people in Japan that drift 350s...(auto) - it's possible because of the power difference. Auto 250 would have no chance. 

[royoftherovers]

18 minutes ago, H3XME said:

I don't think there are any major issues with carbon build up in these cars in Europe, are there? Isn't it mainly the US with their poor quality fuel that contributes to this. Speaking of IS350.. I saw a couple for sale on the FB Marketplace over the past few months. Maybe get one of those Linas! I was tempted as £7-8k is reasonable for ~60,000 mile car.. people pay that for IS250s these days, but I think I'd miss the third pedal too much for what I use the car for. Though there are people in Japan that drift 350s...(auto) - it's possible because of the power difference. Auto 250 would have no chance. 

There seems to be a nice Gen 3 GS450h in "cars for sale"

[Mr Vlad]

Eh up Lucas. I'm no drifter but I've had mine drift but only after much provocation lol.

I've got another reason why to get rid of an is250. Sunday I picked up new born grandson with its mum and dad. No then the dad is 6"3" and he was too big for the passenger seat and only just fit after lowering it fully. And leather seats are ruddy awful for baby seats. I bought a car seat anti slip mat which is a brilliant idea. 

[H3XME]

1 hour ago, Mr Vlad said:

Eh up Lucas. I'm no drifter but I've had mine drift but only after much provocation lol.

I've got another reason why to get rid of an is250. Sunday I picked up new born grandson with its mum and dad. No then the dad is 6"3" and he was too big for the passenger seat and only just fit after lowering it fully. And leather seats are ruddy awful for baby seats. I bought a car seat anti slip mat which is a brilliant idea. 

Vlad, don't take this the wrong way but just because one loses traction for few seconds doesn't mean it's drifting. Linking a whole track would be impossible without clutch kicking with this power/weight. Especially on dry tarmac.

[H3XME]

1 hour ago, Mr Vlad said:

Eh up Lucas. I'm no drifter but I've had mine drift but only after much provocation lol.

I've got another reason why to get rid of an is250. Sunday I picked up new born grandson with its mum and dad. No then the dad is 6"3" and he was too big for the passenger seat and only just fit after lowering it fully. And leather seats are ruddy awful for baby seats. I bought a car seat anti slip mat which is a brilliant idea. 

I think it's the footwell design. I'm 6'2 and my seats are always fully lowered, but sitting in the passenger seat doesn't feel as comfy/good as sitting behind the wheel. Though it is much better with my IS300h seats as they're not electric so go quite a bit lower than the original seats. 

[eleveneleven]

 Fuel costs definitely are the reason why people are giving up on them, i think a lot of buyers snapped them up post lockdown (just before the used car market and lease prices went nuts), when people had spare cash from lockdown, petrol prices were reasonable and they weren't doin that many miles so could justify the cost.

 6 cylinder BMW's and other big German cars were selling like hot cakes (the smart ones chose Lexus. 😉)

Things eventually returned to "Normal" people found themselves out n about more, doin more miles. combine that with the rising price of...EVERYTHING and the fact that most were pre 08 cars which required E5 and it probably got harder to justify as a runaround.

I'm assuming there's small percentage too that thought they were buying a fast sporty saloon and ended up eventually selling to try and scratch that itch.

£110ish of E5 to fill the tank with a 330 mile range (driving like my grandad) isn't great all things considered but I'm happy to pay the price for now in return for a car that’s comfortable, heavy on toys and ridiculously reliable.

It’s good to know where you stand with a car especially an old used one. There’s not many cars of this vintage you can say that about unfortunately. A service and oil change every year along with consumables, grease slide pins, occasional oil top ups and it'll happily chug along in comfort and silence 🤞

If I was to replace mine with anything right now it’d probably be a Gen 8 accord 2.0 which offers a similar package to the Lexus but with slightly better fuel economy.

[Mr Vlad]

Not took wrong way at all Lucas 👍

[Linas.P]

5 hours ago, H3XME said:

I don't think there are any major issues with carbon build up in these cars in Europe, are there? Isn't it mainly the US with their poor quality fuel that contributes to this. Speaking of IS350.. I saw a couple for sale on the FB Marketplace over the past few months. Maybe get one of those Linas! I was tempted as £7-8k is reasonable for ~60,000 mile car.. people pay that for IS250s these days, but I think I'd miss the third pedal too much for what I use the car for. Though there are people in Japan that drift 350s...(auto) - it's possible because of the power difference. Auto 250 would have no chance. 

The poor quality US fuel is a myth, I mean you could buy worse quality fuel there, but that does not mean equal quality fuel isn't available. 91 MON ~= 97 RON, but they as well do have 93... so they have 99-100 Octane as well. I think it has more to do with some people in US doing insane mileages and it is more of inherent design issue which shows-up with miles. So at least in my mind - any IS250 will have some issues with carbon by 200-300k miles. That isn't unusual and nobody would be surprised, but what was unusual and what created this name for IS250 having carbon issues is that in US within 3 years from launch there were already people who did like 160k miles and already had carbon issues.

IS350 for £7-8k sounds like amazing deal and in current market definitely makes more sense than IS250, my only issue is the insurance on grey import. But on other hand there is no comparison between MT IS250 and IS350, IS350 just all around better and even lower road tax. Besides Lexus AT can be "manualised", there are mods for it where it keeps each gear and properly shifts on paddle shift click.

My only issue is that I could not justify spending £8k on mk2 IS overall, for me the platform is just too old for that sort of money. 

[Linas.P]

2 hours ago, eleveneleven said:

 Fuel costs definitely are the reason why people are giving up on them, i think a lot of buyers snapped them up post lockdown (just before the used car market and lease prices went nuts), when people had spare cash from lockdown, petrol prices were reasonable and they weren't doin that many miles so could justify the cost.

 6 cylinder BMW's and other big German cars were selling like hot cakes (the smart ones chose Lexus. 😉)

Things eventually returned to "Normal" people found themselves out n about more, doin more miles. combine that with the rising price of...EVERYTHING and the fact that most were pre 08 cars which required E5 and it probably got harder to justify as a runaround.

I'm assuming there's small percentage too that thought they were buying a fast sporty saloon and ended up eventually selling to try and scratch that itch.

£110ish of E5 to fill the tank with a 330 mile range (driving like my grandad) isn't great all things considered but I'm happy to pay the price for now in return for a car that’s comfortable, heavy on toys and ridiculously reliable.

It’s good to know where you stand with a car especially an old used one. There’s not many cars of this vintage you can say that about unfortunately. A service and oil change every year along with consumables, grease slide pins, occasional oil top ups and it'll happily chug along in comfort and silence 🤞

If I was to replace mine with anything right now it’d probably be a Gen 8 accord 2.0 which offers a similar package to the Lexus but with slightly better fuel economy.

All the comparable cars have similar fuel consumption, so the argument of fuel cost is unfounded, unless you saying people are overall downsizing or going for diesel cars. Likewise I have no plans using E5 as I believe E10 damage is overblown and not justified. 

Gen 8 accord is FWD, so that is out of question automatically. Besides even thought Hondas are build very well, but are kind of plain and they never feel Luxury inside. They feel like Toyota's - good quality economy car, without any bells and whistles, where Lexus really feels class above.  

[H3XME]

29 minutes ago, Linas.P said:

 

IS350 for £7-8k sounds like amazing deal and in current market definitely makes more sense than IS250, my only issue is the insurance on grey import. But on other hand there is no comparison between MT IS250 and IS350, IS350 just all around better and even lower road tax. Besides Lexus AT can be "manualised", there are mods for it where it keeps each gear and properly shifts on paddle shift click.

My only issue is that I could not justify spending £8k on mk2 IS overall, for me the platform is just too old for that sort of money. 

Insurance is not a problem. Plenty of Import specialists about. Adrian Flux for example. You won't get anything better for £8k though.. 

[J Henderson]

4 hours ago, eleveneleven said:

  £110ish of E5 to fill the tank with a 330 mile range (driving like my grandad).

I must be driving like a great grandad then. My range after filling up is always 400+

[Linas.P]

1 hour ago, H3XME said:

Insurance is not a problem. Plenty of Import specialists about. Adrian Flux for example. You won't get anything better for £8k though.. 

Not a problem for you... Import specialist would charge me £2000+ in London. 

[eleveneleven]

5 hours ago, Linas.P said:

All the comparable cars have similar fuel consumption, so the argument of fuel cost is unfounded, unless you saying people are overall downsizing or going for diesel cars. Likewise I have no plans using E5 as I believe E10 damage is overblown and not justified. 

Gen 8 accord is FWD, so that is out of question automatically. Besides even thought Hondas are build very well, but are kind of plain and they never feel Luxury inside. They feel like Toyota's - good quality economy car, without any bells and whistles, where Lexus really feels class above.  

The E10 thing just sounds like Lexus trying to cover their backs, mines an 08 so I can use E5 but the car does feel much better on premium fuel so I'm happy to continue using it until i'm priced out. 

One could argue that the IS is a bit plain, yes it has plenty of toys but it's not a drivers car at all IMO!

I was in a 10plate Avensis the other day and it felt eerily similar to the IS they even look similar from the side/back (not sure if they use the same platform?)

The IS is just a much nicer Toyota for the most part but there's absolutely nothing wrong with that!  

The Honda is definitely more "premium" than luxury but it's one of the best alternatives you can get for a similar price if you're willing to put up with FWD which most buyers don't really care about. A well specced E90 BMW is a nice place to be it's just a shame they ride harsh and are made with chocolate parts.

[Linas.P]

1 hour ago, eleveneleven said:

The E10 thing just sounds like Lexus trying to cover their backs, mines an 08 so I can use E5 but the car does feel much better on premium fuel so I'm happy to continue using it until i'm priced out. 

One could argue that the IS is a bit plain, yes it has plenty of toys but it's not a drivers car at all IMO!

I was in a 10plate Avensis the other day and it felt eerily similar to the IS they even look similar from the side/back (not sure if they use the same platform?)

The IS is just a much nicer Toyota for the most part but there's absolutely nothing wrong with that!  

The Honda is definitely more "premium" than luxury but it's one of the best alternatives you can get for a similar price if you're willing to put up with FWD which most buyers don't really care about. A well specced E90 BMW is a nice place to be it's just a shame they ride harsh and are made with chocolate parts.

BMW rides fine if you throw away terrible run-flat tyres.

Avensis and IS250 do not share the platform - Lexus of the era was "real Lexus" with it's own platform (it could be argued that it shared platform with JMD Toyota Mark X, but there were more IS250's than Mark, so I would argue it was Mark which used Lexus platform and not the other way around), but they do share many components in suspension, switch gear and buttons design, as well as horrible 2AD-FHV engine. So Accord as I said is similar to Avensis, but IS250 being "much nicer Toyota" is on the other level altogether. Many things things looks similar between Toyota and Lexus indeed, but they are very different feeling for touch (with exception of modern ES which feels exactly like Toyota). For example overall design of dash is similar, but on Lexus is soft touch like rubber/leather and Toyota more like hard textured plastic. Same thing in Honda - it looks kind of similar, but just nowhere as nice to touch (sadly same applies to Acura, which meant to be like Lexus, but is just Honda with different badge).

Is IS250 drivers car - probably not, but being RWD it is way nicer to drive than any FWD econobox. Yes BMWs are better, but less comfortable, whereas I would say Lexus is perfectly balanced between Merc which is comfy but absolute barge and BMW which is nicer to drive but kind of uncomfortable. 

[H3XME]

10 hours ago, Linas.P said:

there were more IS250's than Mark, so I would argue it was Mark which used Lexus platform and not the other way around) 

Is IS250 drivers car - probably not, but being RWD it is way nicer to drive than any FWD econobox. Yes BMWs are better, but less comfortable, whereas I would say Lexus is perfectly balanced between Merc which is comfy but absolute barge and BMW which is nicer to drive but kind of uncomfortable. 

That's only because IS is sold worldwide and Mark X is sold domestically in Japan, as pretty much all other cars of that type, Crowns, Alphard etc. In Japan they actually have the Lexus equivalent from Toyota, such as Toyota Celsior / LS400, Toyota Mark X / IS250 and so on. Lexus was literally just a luxury export brand for them, hence why they keep Toyota equivalents domestically as well. 

BMWs are more sporty, there's no question about it, but the reliability and luxury aspect is far inferior, so not quite comparable?

When I was window shopping for cars, I was looking at imported options.. If I was to get something nice, I'd be heavily leaning towards Mark X GRX133 with the 3.5L 2GR engine.. with only 36,000 miles on the clock, this car is a bargain at £15k delivered + registering and paying tax on top. This is the G's version as well, which was later on renamed to GR Sport as it's got the factory body kit, bigger brakes and such. Definitely one of the best all rounders for the money. 5 seats, over 300hp, good brakes, LSD, nice interior, lighter than an IS250. 

 https://carfromjapan.com/cheap-used-toyota-mark-x-2013-for-sale-60e4e766bbcf391d3e82ba89

 

Or slightly bigger and less sporty Toyota Crown with the same engine at 40,000 miles for only £13k + tax. 

https://carfromjapan.com/cheap-used-toyota-crown-2013-for-sale-62aaf61981eab3d9082b8fae

 

[Mr Vlad]

Mmmmmm is250 a drivers car or not. It most definitely is. It handles every bit as good as a series 3 beemer and that comes from 3 series beemer owner friends. And from memory it handles as good as the UR Quattro I had in the 80's. 

[Linas.P]

4 hours ago, Mr Vlad said:

Mmmmmm is250 a drivers car or not. It most definitely is. It handles every bit as good as a series 3 beemer and that comes from 3 series beemer owner friends. And from memory it handles as good as the UR Quattro I had in the 80's. 

It definitely handles better than UR Quattro - AWD is just never good for handling, but definitely not as good as BMW. Yet it handles good enough to be fun and enjoyable to drive, which cannot be said about any comparable FWD car. 

[Linas.P]

5 hours ago, H3XME said:

That's only because IS is sold worldwide and Mark X is sold domestically in Japan, as pretty much all other cars of that type, Crowns, Alphard etc. In Japan they actually have the Lexus equivalent from Toyota, such as Toyota Celsior / LS400, Toyota Mark X / IS250 and so on. Lexus was literally just a luxury export brand for them, hence why they keep Toyota equivalents domestically as well. 

BMWs are more sporty, there's no question about it, but the reliability and luxury aspect is far inferior, so not quite comparable?

When I was window shopping for cars, I was looking at imported options.. If I was to get something nice, I'd be heavily leaning towards Mark X GRX133 with the 3.5L 2GR engine.. with only 36,000 miles on the clock, this car is a bargain at £15k delivered + registering and paying tax on top. This is the G's version as well, which was later on renamed to GR Sport as it's got the factory body kit, bigger brakes and such. Definitely one of the best all rounders for the money. 5 seats, over 300hp, good brakes, LSD, nice interior, lighter than an IS250. 

 https://carfromjapan.com/cheap-used-toyota-mark-x-2013-for-sale-60e4e766bbcf391d3e82ba89

 

Or slightly bigger and less sporty Toyota Crown with the same engine at 40,000 miles for only £13k + tax. 

https://carfromjapan.com/cheap-used-toyota-crown-2013-for-sale-62aaf61981eab3d9082b8fae

My view about JMD equivalents to Lexus is that Lexus made their platform, because Lexus is semi-autonomous within Toyota and then later it was decided that such platform could be reused for more upmarket Toyotas at home. 

When it comes to car platforms, the key is the volumes - as such Toyota would never make platform for the car which they know they only going to sell in low numbers domestically. I guess it is moot point, because Lexus is owned by Toyota anyway, so any Lexus platform is Toyota's platform as well. But my argument is that platform was made with Lexus in mind first and foremost (i.e. focusing on Luxury and Handling), rather than being rebadged Toyota like modern ES.

[H3XME]

1 minute ago, Linas.P said:

Toyota would never make platform for the car which they know they only going to sell in low numbers domestically. I guess it is moot point, because Lexus is owned by Toyota anyway, so any Lexus platform is Toyota's platform as well. But my argument is that platform was made with Lexus in mind first and foremost (i.e. focusing on Luxury and Handling), rather than being rebadged Toyota like modern ES.

Perhaps.. that being said, there is A LOT of cars that are still being sold only domestically.. I said that only because Mark X was actually sold from 2004, (a year earlier than IS250) developed as a successor of the (JZ)X110 cars, Mark II, Chaser, Verossa and such. While those were still current (up to ~2003), the Altezza or IS200 was already there developed as a direct competition to 3series in the compact saloon category. I think it just made sense to them to continue doing IS and since Mark X was already around as a successor of the Mark II etc. they used that platform. But who knows. We can only go off what's online since we don't work for Toyota lol.

[Mr Vlad]

Have to totally disagree with you Linas. I had the UR Quattro for just over 8 years in the 80's when I was in my 20's and its in that car I learnt to drive expletives fast and hard. No car I've had or had a go in handled like the Quattro, close but not as sure footed. As for the is250 handling as good as a 3 series beemer well that comes from 3 series beemer owners I know who've driven my car and I theirs. Can you do a direct comparison Linas? 

Oh that toyota crown looks real niiiiiiiiice. I'd have one, would probably make an excellent family car.