Lexus RZ revealed

[wivenhoe]

The fact that Lexus in the States provide up to 30 days free use of a petrol car says a lot. To me it confirms they see the car as an ‘urban run around’ rather than a full replacement for a ICE. Having to turn off the HVAC to get anywhere near the quoted range is quite frankly ridiculous on such an expensive car. As every review I read is saying the real world range is small I am becoming more certain I’ll ask for my £ 500 back. 
I know what residual they are basing their PCP quotes on but for us cash buyers I really fear what they will be in say 3 years - trying to sell a car then for say £ 35k with a range of well less than 200 miles will be a hard call. 
I think Lexus understand they have got the range totally wrong so are pushing other aspects - radiant heaters to increase range, low Battery depletion over 9 years, free ICE car for long drives (in the States), revolutionary yoke (in 2025) - anything bar pushing the real life range. 
 

[John Adams]

Spot on. I've wanted an ev for a long time and was patiently waiting for this new Lexus as I assumed it would be good. One of the benefits of an EV to me was no road tax/luxury car tax but that goes from 2025 which has made me rethink my plans. I've no doubt that the RZ will be a well built reliable car but the range is now the potential issue for me. There are many cars you can buy with a better range for 72k so I think Lexus have messed up here. I am waiting for a test drive to make my mind up. If I like it, I will have to get an exceptional deal to buy it. I will not pay 72k and although I will buy on PCP I certainly don't want to pay 10% plus interest rate.

 

I really think I will be staying with the plug in NX which is the best of both worlds. Local driving on electric and petrol for the long journeys. Like you, I think I will be asking for my £500 back. Incidentally, my car is built and on a boat yet my dealer still hasn't got a demo car for me to try and not expecting one until next month.

[wivenhoe]

John - my car must be on the same ship and I suspect the demos are as well so an ‘interesting’ situation where my actual car will be parked alongside the demo I will probably reject !

I have a plug in Range Rover Velar which is just as good as ‘an urban runabout’ EV wise.  

The EV world hasn’t addressed the fact that with electricity at a home charger is 35p / kw there is little benefit of an EV over ICE. With petrol at say £ 1.50 / litre that at say 40 mpg equates to 16p / mile and say 65kw x 35p = £ 22.75 / say 175 miles = 13p. However, if you use a fast charger it’s nearer 60p / kw = 22p / mile !

[Kevin Williams]

15 hours ago, talaipwros said:

Read More: https://www.slashgear.com/1266522/2023-lexus-rz-450e-review/

 

Blimey... And the RZ has a Lexus badge...

[Hillie]

12 hours ago, wivenhoe said:

I think Lexus understand they have got the range totally wrong so are pushing other aspects - radiant heaters to increase range, low battery depletion over 9 years, free ICE car for long drives (in the States), revolutionary yoke (in 2025) - anything bar pushing the real life range. 
 

I have been browsing some articles on the top of the range Fisker Ocean Extreme, at £61K plus options, coming with a 'Fisker claimed' WLTP of 440miles from the Hyper range Battery.  Even at half this number for a real world usable range, this vehicle is cheaper, larger and 2x the range of the RZ.

https://www.fiskerinc.com/en-gb/ocean-extreme

For me this is the first BEV that is starting to peak my interest from a potential real world range, aesthetics, and looks. 

[wivenhoe]

I’ve looked at the Fisker before. My reservation with it a lack of info regards servicing and warranty work. Genesis get over this by promising a service where they collect / deliver the car and provide a curtesy car - can’t see anything on Fiskers site. 

[Hillie]

2 hours ago, wivenhoe said:

I’ve looked at the Fisker before. My reservation with it a lack of info regards servicing and warranty work. Genesis get over this by promising a service where they collect / deliver the car and provide a curtesy car - can’t see anything on Fiskers site. 

Agreed,  Fisker is entirely focused on the vehicle build, up selling and specmanship and not really discussing after market aspects at this stage.   Even the show rooms today seem to be more like pop-up booths in shopping centres, conference areas and airport concourses.  No doubt the questions of post sales sales support will bubble up to the top of the critical list as soon as they start shipping orders.

[wivenhoe]

The website says delivery summer 2023 so they need to start informing what they are going to provide.

I did wonder if Fisker is one of the reasons Tesla dramatically reduced their prices and there is talk of a further price cut. 

[wivenhoe]

I have a test drive this Thursday and my car is in Portbury, no doubt with plenty of others. 
This is the first test drive I have ever had where I am pretty sure I won’t buy !

[talaipwros]

12 hours ago, wivenhoe said:

I have a test drive this Thursday and my car is in Portbury, no doubt with plenty of others. 
This is the first test drive I have ever had where I am pretty sure I won’t buy !

Good luck, let us know how things went

[RadicalCoupe-Fuji]

Just noticed that the fancy pano roof electric frosting thing is an option, so unless you pay for it you don't get it & you don't get a manual shade either, so pay up or have no way to block the light from the panoramic roof. 

[Whoever]

17 hours ago, wivenhoe said:

I have a test drive this Thursday and my car is in Portbury, no doubt with plenty of others. 
This is the first test drive I have ever had where I am pretty sure I won’t buy !

And I have a test drive on Friday!

[John Adams]

25 minutes ago, Whoever said:

And I have a test drive on Friday!

Wish I could have one. Nothing until at least the end of May according to my dealer

[wivenhoe]

6 hours ago, John Adams said:

Wish I could have one. Nothing until at least the end of May according to my dealer

Mine is at the dealers. Arrived the same time as the demo - or they are using mine as the demo !

Spoke to NFU and they said the insurance would be the same as my Range Rover Velar P400e. They provide a new car for a total write off/ theft for the first 2 years from new. 

[John Adams]

11 hours ago, wivenhoe said:

Mine is at the dealers. Arrived the same time as the demo - or they are using mine as the demo !

Spoke to NFU and they said the insurance would be the same as my Range Rover Velar P400e. They provide a new car for a total write off/ theft for the first 2 years from new. 

Any more thoughts on whether you will buy or not?  Although I am looking forward to eventually getting a test drive I'm pretty sure I will cancel unless I can get a really good deal.

[talaipwros]

On 5/1/2023 at 8:47 PM, wivenhoe said:

I have a test drive this Thursday and my car is in Portbury, no doubt with plenty of others. 
This is the first test drive I have ever had where I am pretty sure I won’t buy !

How did it go?

[wivenhoe]

Bit the bullet and confirmed I will buy the car. It’s at the dealers, still with the protective tape on it. Collecting it next Wednesday. 
Had a lengthy test drive and my concerns were overcome - after the Range Rover I thought the seat height would be more like a saloon but it isn’t. It’s not quite as high as the RR but fine to step into. I’m 6’ 2” and there is enough headroom for me to raise the seat and still have plenty of clear headroom.
The fit and finish is classic Lexus. I was concerned what the Orage Ultra Suede would be like on my Copper / Black car - having had leather for 20+ years. It really felt prestige and is a good & practical colour. It goes ok with the copper / black externals. 
My major concern was the range. Having done some research it all made more sense now. Lexus appear to calculate the range shown more realistically than some other manufacturers - they keep some back so even if the range is showing 0 you still have range to get to a charger. Lexus are the only manufacturer warranting that the Battery will be no less than 90% capacity after 10 years. 

When I got in the car (fairly warm day) it was about 80% charged showing 195 miles.
Putting the aircon on full blast shrank the range to 160. I have since found out that studies confirm that all EV’s loose between 11% - 17% when the heating or a/c is used. BUT if you precondition the car before driving and use the seat ventilation to cool it doesn’t affect the range. Similarly in the winter if you use the heated seats and radiant heaters after pre-heating then you don’t eat into the real range. Not very helpful if you regularly carry rear seat passengers !

Having learnt you can turn off the speeding bong and others the only snag I found was that the instrument cluster was a bit dark despite the illumination being on max. I found that my ‘reactor lite’ glasses were dark which hasn’t happened in previous cars with tinted windscreen. When I took them off the display was ok. I’ll have a pair of normal specs in the car for just driving. 

The dealer has been great and matched a very good price for my Range Rover Velar and of course held last years price which is £ 3k below current list. 
I took the dive to buy the RZ as not least it was available now - I am convinced that the used car / residuals are going to normalise over the next 6 to 9 months and if that happens I would lose a fortune. My px on a 2 year old car is 89% of what I paid, if the residuals normalise the car would probably draw no more than 50% at 3 years old so it would lose me £ 27k over the next 12 months - worth taking a risk with RZ then as I can’t see it losing 40% in the next year. 

I hope I haven’t bored everyone with this long post. I thought it may be useful to all those waiting for a test drive. 
 

[Moleman]

9 hours ago, wivenhoe said:

 the only snag I found was that the instrument cluster was a bit dark despite the illumination being on max. I found that my ‘reactor lite’ glasses were dark which hasn’t happened in previous cars with tinted windscreen. When I took them off the display was ok. I’ll have a pair of normal specs in the car for just driving. 

 

Does that mean that the car does not have an anti UV coating on the windows?

A surprise at that price level. 

[wivenhoe]

I’m not sure but my glasses definitely darkened and yet the interior wasn’t overly bright. I am ploughing through the manual now - all 700+ pages 

[ColinBarber]

5 hours ago, Moleman said:

Does that mean that the car does not have an anti UV coating on the windows?

No, because reactive lenses reactive to visible light as well as UV.

[Moleman]

18 minutes ago, ColinBarber said:

No, because reactive lenses reactive to visible light as well as UV.

Well for 20 years I have had reactive glasses and they do not darken inside of my cars, I have polarised sun glasses for that reason.

Modern car glass normally has both UVA and UVB protection, more on the windscreen than the side windows.

Reactive lens are made to react to UV radiation, when exposed they go dark and lighten when not exposed to UV radiation.

Hence the question, based upon experience.

[talaipwros]

Quote

Running in Normal mode, our 75-mph highway range test of an RZ450e Premium (conducted at an ambient temperature just above freezing) yielded a disappointing result: just 120 miles.

https://worldcarblog.com/en/car-models/lexus/99-cars/lexus/1427-tested-2023-lexus-rz450e-is-a-good-lexus-but-a-just-okay-ev#gsc.tab=0

[wivenhoe]

Interestingly, the UK article in the same blog is far more encouraging than the American one. 

https://worldcarblog.com/en/car-models/lexus/99-cars/lexus/1353-new-lexus-rz-450e-2023-review#gsc.tab=0

[talaipwros]

 

This guy liked the car but range was at best 165miles on eco mode at low speed  ( 150 miles with some rain and motorway driving at 55 miles an hour).

 

I can only imagine range when AC is on and it is cold outside

 

 

[John Adams]

25 minutes ago, talaipwros said:

 

This guy liked the car but range was at best 165miles on eco mode at low speed  ( 150 miles with some rain and motorway driving at 55 miles an hour).

 

I can only imagine range when AC is on and it is cold outside

 

 

I've just picked one up on a 3 day extended test. Just putting the fan on to demist the window lost 25 miles, a/c on went down another 20 miles. Driven about 80 miles so far in poring rain and I've averaged 2.8 m/kwh at an average speed of 28 mph. Car drives beautifully but not impressed with the range. One thing it didn't have -or at least I can't find it- is a gauge showing how much charge is in the car. All it does is tell you estimated range which goes up and down like crazy when you switch something on or off. knowing the percent state of charge would be useful.

 

Early days but lets see how it goes