Auto gearbox oil change yet again BUT

[Mr Vlad]

Well my car now has new bushes in the rear hub, the ones pressed into it at the bottom. Whilst I was waiting to pick up my car I noticed something oh so very interesting. A flush and refill machine for auto boxes. I asked the garage owner about it and he almost raved about it. Only had time for a minute chat as he's a busy man. 

The company is Launch. Never heard of them but they do some really good looking garage test equipment etc. The machine is the Cat 501s. Attached is a photo of the advert card. I've seen a couple YouTube videos of this kit doing it's thing and I for one will get mine done in the near future. 

I phoned Launch and spoke with customer services who in turn gave me the number of the sales guy who could answer any questions. I spoke with him and asked if the kit would work on the Lexus is250. He said that the kit would connect to the pipes that go to the gearbox oil cooler. Now then. I actually don't know if our cars have an oil cooler for the gearbox. 

Price wise the garage couldn't quote but to do a BM or Merc you're talking around £400 all in. 

I'm wondering about the thoughts of fellow is250 owners on this.

 

[Texas]

Can it refill with the correct Toyota WS atf or does it just use a generic ( bulk bought by the drum ) atf?

[Mr Vlad]

It refills with what ever oil the operator puts in. That also dictates the price of the job. 

[steve2006]

20 minutes ago, Mr Vlad said:

It refills with what ever oil the operator puts in. That also dictates the price of the job. 

So if you request Toyota Type IV or WS that’s what you get guaranteed?

I must admit the picture of the machine looks like my Mig welder though 😀

 

[Spock66]

Normally you would want to replace the filter as well which would require taking the sump off (or whatever it's called on a gearbox).

[Mr Vlad]

I suggest a look on YouTube. Search Cat 501s. 1st video should be 2 guys with an Audi Q series car. They're foreign but are speaking English. If I remember rightly the 2nd video is with a beemer. On both the filter is changed. 

[Amerikan Toyota]

dont flush, drain and fill only

[Mr Vlad]

Why do you say don't flush? The CAT 501S machine first Injects a cleaning/flushing agent it then circulates new oil for old until a window in the machine shows clean oil. After that the gearbox sump is dropped, new filter installed, sump replaced and system topped up. An auto gearbox specialist with Lexus knowledge gave me a quote of, are you sat down? £500 all in. Ruddy good value I'd say. Oh this auto box place does all the top cars  rollers porschs (can't spell that lol) jags astons etc etc.

[Amerikan Toyota]

"Why do you say don't flush?" Flushing machine uses pressure, pressure unclogs ****, **** goes into wrong place.

[Mr Vlad]

There's been a number of members here say just that, there's also a number of members who disagree. If that pressure system unclogs debris then it definitely gets flushed out. If not then the specialist auto box garages would be sued to the moon and back and be out of business. 

Have you yourself had experience of this then? Then all I can say it was done wrong.

[Malc]

Gentlemen .......  my 1995 car with 238k miles has only once ever had a partial drain and top-up / refill ............... maybe some 5/6 years ago and at maybe 180k miles ..  all seems well and the gearbox doesn't seem to miss a beat methinks ......  am I doing summat wrong here  ? 

or is it simply that the Ls400 gearbox is made of sterner stuff and not so " fragile " as more modern boxes perhaps

Malc

[wharfhouse]

49 minutes ago, Malc said:

Gentlemen .......  my 1995 car with 238k miles has only once ever had a partial drain and top-up / refill ............... maybe some 5/6 years ago and at maybe 180k miles ..  all seems well and the gearbox doesn't seem to miss a beat methinks ......  am I doing summat wrong here  ? 

or is it simply that the Ls400 gearbox is made of sterner stuff and not so " fragile " as more modern boxes perhaps

Malc

I had a 1997 BMW 528i automatic and did 210K miles from new in about 10 years and it never had the gearbox oil changed as BMW claimed sealed for life. The car was always serviced by BMW as per the schedule and the gearbox never missed a beat and was working as well when I traded it in as when it was new. In fact only had a few items replaced in my ownership - other than normal maintenence I had radiator and header tank and catalytic converters replaced and I think that was it. It was still on all original suspension parts too...! 

[Mr Vlad]

Well there you go, two fine examples of very high mileage cars with auto gearboxes never missing a beat and never having the boxes oil changed. There will be countless thousands more similar experiences. However there will also be countless thousands of folk whose auto gearboxes failed because the oil packed in. Also a major contribution to gearboxes failing is how they're used, too short journeys and too long journeys etc etc. Also batches of oil that was put in from new not all being the same standard. There are many variables. 

Personally I will be getting the gearbox on my is250 fully serviced via the cat 501s machine. Why? For peace of mind. I don't believe there is an oil to last the lifetime of a gearbox.

Example. The most excellent Ford Mondeo Titanium X Sport 2.0 ecoboost. That car is an auto box car and Ford state an oil change every 37.5k miles or 5 years which ever comes first. I witnessed the oil change and was surprised how much the oil had deteriorated compared to new oil. 

[Spock66]

9 minutes ago, Mr Vlad said:

I witnessed the oil change and was surprised how much the oil had deteriorated compared to new oil. 

It may look like crap but that does not mean it's still not performing correctly, unless you actually test its performance properties, but certainly a placebo effect to have nice clean fluids.

[Mr Vlad]

There were issues with cars which covered 100k miles without the gearbox oil change. Gearbox was goosed and a good few grand to replace. Much more than a placebo effect. You could tell by the feel of the oil used compared to new. And yes I've had 3x titanium x sport mondeos. By far best car in class.

[wharfhouse]

37 minutes ago, Mr Vlad said:

Well there you go, two fine examples of very high mileage cars with auto gearboxes never missing a beat and never having the boxes oil changed. There will be countless thousands more similar experiences. However there will also be countless thousands of folk whose auto gearboxes failed because the oil packed in. Also a major contribution to gearboxes failing is how they're used, too short journeys and too long journeys etc etc. Also batches of oil that was put in from new not all being the same standard. There are many variables. 

Personally I will be getting the gearbox on my is250 fully serviced via the cat 501s machine. Why? For peace of mind. I don't believe there is an oil to last the lifetime of a gearbox.

Example. The most excellent Ford Mondeo Titanium X Sport 2.0 ecoboost. That car is an auto box car and Ford state an oil change every 37.5k miles or 5 years which ever comes first. I witnessed the oil change and was surprised how much the oil had deteriorated compared to new oil. 

Yes it may be how the cars are either designed or driven and treated that impacts whether the auto box oil really is for a lifetime. In my case those 210K miles were primarily long distance motorway driving including quite a lot of cross Europe journeys at high speeds (3 digits in mph). I've always believed that cars used regularly as designed for long distances are significantly more reliable than those kept for weekend only outings in nice weather. I have always treated my cars as work tools but sympathetically - I'm a mechanical engineer so understand how products are designed and tested - and have had the cars serviced by main dealers to the service schedules laid down by the manufacturers and in general haven't experienced major issues in all the cars I've owned and many have racked up decent mileages.

My current IS 300h is now at 115k miles and again I'm simply servicing according to Lexus at a Lexus dealer every 10K miles (which in my case means more than one service a year). As no transmission oil change is scheduled for regular use I don't plan on changing it off my own bat so we will see whether I suffer any issues over the coming years I guess...!

Of course my experience and use may not match others and so I have no problem if others want to change their oil.

[Duggie B]

30 minutes ago, Mr Vlad said:

And yes I've had 3x titanium x sport mondeos. By far best car in class.

I'll second that 👍....loved every minute of mine

[VFR]

I wonder what will do more harm ?

Changing the oil / fluid.

or 

Not changing the oil / fluid.      😉

[Alfalfa]

On 2/28/2022 at 12:41 PM, Mr Vlad said:

Why do you say don't flush? The CAT 501S machine first Injects a cleaning/flushing agent it then circulates new oil for old until a window in the machine shows clean oil. After that the gearbox sump is dropped, new filter installed, sump replaced and system topped up. An auto gearbox specialist with Lexus knowledge gave me a quote of, are you sat down? £500 all in. Ruddy good value I'd say. Oh this auto box place does all the top cars  rollers porschs (can't spell that lol) jags astons etc etc.

Dont use the cleaning/Flushing agent, only use the oil, the cleaning agent can make smal parts to slip and make problems.

have done a Flushing on my 250, recomended.

[Alfalfa]

On 3/1/2022 at 2:37 PM, Mr Vlad said:

There's been a number of members here say just that, there's also a number of members who disagree. If that pressure system unclogs debris then it definitely gets flushed out. If not then the specialist auto box garages would be sued to the moon and back and be out of business. 

Have you yourself had experience of this then? Then all I can say it was done wrong.

I flushed my 250 vitout the cleaning agent, this was advised by the leader of the Lexus workshop that did the job, the reason for the advise was tha since the car had wery high milage 250000km, he was afraid that there could come parts from the cleaning that vould be Stock in a solenoid.

i folowed the advise and the gearbox respond better and no problem so far.