Bathtime for Betsy!

[peniole]

The softness you mention is a byproduct of the so called self healing paint, and yes heating it up accelerates the self healing.

[Mincey]

10 hours ago, Eldavo said:

(I also wouldn’t use a waterless wash but then again I wouldn’t name my car either 🤷🏻‍♂️) 😂

Each to their own and all that, as I was only saying to Ralph the Dishwasher yesterday.

[Mincey]

Quick update. Betsy was looking rather less than her previously shiny self after a trip to Stamford along the back roads, so I treated to her to a wash. I got halfway round spraying the stuff on and the squirter broke. I was not happy. Not very happy at all. Luckily I managed to find a spare spray (I think my wife uses it for spraying water onto her flowers) so that was pressed into action. Had I not done this, my neighbours would  have pointed and laughed at me.

[First_Lexus]

20 minutes ago, Mincey said:

Quick update. Betsy was looking rather less than her previously shiny self after a trip to Stamford along the back roads, so I treated to her to a wash. I got halfway round spraying the stuff on and the squirter broke. I was not happy. Not very happy at all. Luckily I managed to find a spare spray (I think my wife uses it for spraying water onto her flowers) so that was pressed into action. Had I not done this, my neighbours would  have pointed and laughed at me.

I can’t believe Walter the Sprayer let you down…

[Mincey]

6 minutes ago, First_Lexus said:

I can’t believe Walter the Sprayer let you down…

I'm going to be writing to the lead singer of Echo and the Bunnymen about this, make no mistake.

[Mincey]

Meant to add earlier - I'll be wearing those gloves which doctors wear next time I wash Betsy as my hands are feeling a little tingly at the moment. This has been a Public Heath Announcement.

[SH20]

Waterless wash products will leave fine micro scratches which are not visible in normal daylight.  Sorry but it's a fact.   Even a light  film of dirt is made up from fine particles which is what waterless products were aimed at. Heavy soiled vehicles would just make micro scratches more inevitable due to the there being more dirt to shift.   I've used waterless polishes myself but on very old cars were the aim was to achieve shine.   The premise that the liquid waterless polish "lifts" the dirt off the panel  is  marketing speak.   Where is the dirt going? straight into the fibres of the micro pad or cloth it's being applied with.   As it is moved around lifting more dirt the cloth becomes loaded with particles.  Turning the cloth or pad regularly won't really help.

The thing that will truly highlight micro scratching is direct bright sunlight on the panel when you alter the angle you view the panel or with a good quality LED work light/torch which unfortunately cost anything between £50 to £250.   These hand held lights are so bright they will show swirls and micro scratches instantly.   

When a car is cleaned and there is no sun shining all cars look great because the eye can't see the fine detail of scratches and the car always looks it's best  when it's dull.  Shine an LED light on the panels and there will be micro scratches.  Doesn't matter if the top coat of lacquer is hard or soft, all lacquers will suffer.  So will ceramic coatings, they are not bullet proof, don't let anyone tell you otherwise.     

My brand new ES has covered 54 miles after I drove it back from the dealers.  I was initially impressed with how the car was prepped but while I was transferring my ES mud flaps and bumper protection strip today the very bright sunlight caught the driver side upper rear quarter panel and I could see the fine micro scratches in the lacquer.  I made a shadow with my hand and the paint reverted back to looking flawless.  Most of the car's paint is fine, just the odd area is not.  I'll be machine polishing the whole car in due course and give the lacquer an initial cut before waxing it.           

[LenT]

4 hours ago, SH20 said:

   I'll be machine polishing the whole car in due course and give the lacquer an initial cut before waxing it.           

Steve, you don’t mention it, so I wonder if you’ve considered going the snow foam and ceramic coating route?

I use Modesta coatings and of course they have a much longer lasting effect than waxes.  They are also much more resistant to surface scratches - although, as the guy who did my car detailing emphasised, I had to avoid those mechanical, swirl-making car washes from now on!

[Brian R]

On 12/30/2021 at 12:09 AM, Eldavo said:

This seems an appropriate place to post this; I’ve found that the paint on my car is significantly softer than that of my other car or the wife’s car. So much so, that bird splats will “etch” into the paint regularly.

Despite what people think, this “etching” isn’t the acids in the shizzle but is caused by the clearcoat heating up in the sun but not under the splat. I use the wife’s old hairdryer to reflow the clearcoat where the bird splat has been and after 30-45 seconds on pretty concentrated heat it completely disappears. 
 

(I also wouldn’t use a waterless wash but then again I wouldn’t name my car either 🤷🏻‍♂️) 😂

I've seen this warming technique being suggested occasionally, does it really work that well?

[SH20]

Hi Len,  my working life was based around the world of body shops and the repair of accident damage cars, paintwork was a major part of those repairs.   Your right in suggesting snow foam and the use of ceramic coatings are part and parcel of sound paint correction.   No matter what size the panels or car and no matter what type of paint finish,  basic cellulous, 2 pack solid paint, base coat (solid or metallic finish) and clear lacquer top coat or even 3 stage pearl  the preparation is the same. 

Power wash to loosen the heavy contaminates, snow foam with a neutral ph formula to assist the breakdown of dirt,  the use of Iron fallout solutions if necessary, not always,  clay bar of the paint, drying the car,  machine polishing with a dual action or rotary machine choosing the correct pad and cutting power of the polish,  Rotary polishers should only be used by experienced detailers due to the extra heat they produce but are twice as quick as a duel action machines,  finishing polishes applied by hand or by machine with soft pads or hand application pads before complete degreasing of the polished areas. This removes all traces of the polishes used.   Then either wax or if preferred a ceramic coating which requires someone who knows how to apply them.  

I used G Tech Crystal Serum Light  ceramic coating on my previous ES which was velvet black.  I'm choosing not to use a ceramic coating on this Premium Edition in Messa Red apart from the front bumper which can suffer more from grit bouncing up off the road surface.  Ceramic coatings are hard work to correct defects whereas cutting lacquer and waxing is easier but can only be done so many times. Paint is measured in microns and as it's only  the top lacquer coat that is ever cut, (Base coat and clear Paint) multiple cutting operations need to be limited.

Owners have the right to clean their cars as they see best and it's not my intention to influence how members  should clean their cars  but when you suffer from OCD as I do it has to be said I am a lost cause.   

[LenT]

30 minutes ago, SH20 said:

Hi Len,  my working life was based around the world of body shops and the repair of accident damage cars, paintwork was a major part of those repairs.   Your right in suggesting snow foam and the use of ceramic coatings are part and parcel of sound paint correction.   No matter what size the panels or car and no matter what type of paint finish,  basic cellulous, 2 pack solid paint, base coat (solid or metallic finish) and clear lacquer top coat or even 3 stage pearl  the preparation is the same. 

Power wash to loosen the heavy contaminates, snow foam with a neutral ph formula to assist the breakdown of dirt,  the use of Iron fallout solutions if necessary, not always,  clay bar of the paint, drying the car,  machine polishing with a dual action or rotary machine choosing the correct pad and cutting power of the polish,  Rotary polishers should only be used by experienced detailers due to the extra heat they produce but are twice as quick as a duel action machines,  finishing polishes applied by hand or by machine with soft pads or hand application pads before complete degreasing of the polished areas. This removes all traces of the polishes used.   Then either wax or if preferred a ceramic coating which requires someone who knows how to apply them.  

I used G Tech Crystal Serum Light  ceramic coating on my previous ES which was velvet black.  I'm choosing not to use a ceramic coating on this Premium Edition in Messa Red apart from the front bumper which can suffer more from grit bouncing up off the road surface.  Ceramic coatings are hard work to correct defects whereas cutting lacquer and waxing is easier but can only be done so many times. Paint is measured in microns and as it's only  the top lacquer coat that is ever cut, (Base coat and clear Paint) multiple cutting operations need to be limited.

Owners have the right to clean their cars as they see best and it's not my intention to influence how members  should clean their cars  but when you suffer from OCD as I do it has to be said I am a lost cause.   

Very interesting, Steve.  I did, momentarily, consider getting a D/A Polisher - but decided that if it need that much attention, at my age I’d prefer to take the car back to the professional who did such an excellent job first time round!

I notice you mention applying a ceramic to the front bumper.  I did consider having mine wrapped, which would provide more effect protection than the ceramic finish.  But in the end decided that the very low mileage I’ve been doing would probably reduce the type of damage you describe- and I could always have it added later.

So far that’s worked out fine!

[Eldavo]

12 hours ago, Brian R said:

I've seen this warming technique being suggested occasionally, does it really work that well?

On the Lexus paintwork yes. On my wife’s Audi paintwork it still works but to a lesser degree so the clearcoat must be “harder”. 

[NemesisUK]

13 hours ago, Brian R said:

I've seen this warming technique being suggested occasionally, does it really work that well?

 

48 minutes ago, Eldavo said:

On the Lexus paintwork yes. On my wife’s Audi paintwork it still works but to a lesser degree so the clearcoat must be “harder”. 

In the owner's handbook (for my RC) it does mention a 'self restoring' top coat? How does this change how one would prepare and care for the paintwork?

■Self-restoring coat
The vehicle body has a self-restoring coating
that is resistant to small surface
scratches caused in a car wash etc.
●The coating lasts for 5 to 8 years from
when the vehicle is delivered from the
plant.
●The restoration time differs depending on
the depth of the scratch and outside temperature.
The restoration time may become shorter
when the coating is warmed by applying
warm water.
●Deep scratches caused by keys, coins,
etc. cannot be restored.
●Do not use wax that contains abrasives

[LenT]

19 minutes ago, NemesisUK said:

 

In the owner's handbook (for my RC) it does mention a 'self restoring' top coat? How does this change how one would prepare and care for the paintwork?

■Self-restoring coat
The vehicle body has a self-restoring coating
that is resistant to small surface
scratches caused in a car wash etc.
●The coating lasts for 5 to 8 years from
when the vehicle is delivered from the
plant.
●The restoration time differs depending on
the depth of the scratch and outside temperature.
The restoration time may become shorter
when the coating is warmed by applying
warm water.
●Deep scratches caused by keys, coins,
etc. cannot be restored.
●Do not use wax that contains abrasives

Sounds like some form of ceramic coating.  It would certainly be a sensible factory-applied finish to provide added protection to cars at the more expensive end of the market.

[Mincey]

39 minutes ago, LenT said:

Sounds like some form of ceramic coating.  It would certainly be a sensible factory-applied finish to provide added protection to cars at the more expensive end of the market.

For £920, I'd hope that it had something special in it!

[LenT]

8 minutes ago, Mincey said:

For £920, I'd hope that it had something special in it!

£920!  
I agree.  In fact if I was going to spend that much on a superior factory finish on a new car, then I’d be inclined to spend a little more and take it straight to a professional Car Detailer - as indeed many such buyers do.

[SH20]

I assume the £920 was the option price of the paint when it was ordered.