IS250 with 112000 burning oil - Help!

[JavierHG]

Hi everyone

I've noticed the Low Oil warning 1360 miles after doing the oil/filter change. The car has 112805 miles and it has taken about 2 liters of oil.

Checking the manual it claims that 1.1qt/600 miles is acceptable yet it's a bit concerning.

No obvious leaks have been observed, the car runs perfectly fine.

I've spoken with a garage and they've said if the car is running fine it could be reasonable that is using such an amount of oil, they've suggested using STP Synthetic Oil Treatment as a solution to reduce the amount of oil consumed.

After watching this video from Scotty Kilmer he advises against using this products on car with Variable Valve Timing which i believe our Lexus has therefore i am unsure what would you guys suggest or do?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Linas.P]

If my car would consume 2L of oil in 1360 miles I would be concerned as well, that doesn't sound reasonable at all. Do you have any history with the car, how it was maintained etc? As well, have you done oil change yourself, do you know what oil it was, do you know if right amount was put in?

Because the most likely cause is either wrong oil was there or the oil was missing from the beginning, because I can't see how 2L of oil could be burnt in such a short period. Especially without noticeable blue smoke etc. 

Now for reference - my old IS250 was 192k miles and it used to burn ~0.6L over 10k miles (Castrol Magnatec 5W30 or Toyota/Lexus dealership special). Meaning that I can go from one oil change pretty much without adding any oil, or maybe adding small bottle of 0.5L after 5k miles. I did have another issue - which was sticking valve lifters and solution for it was more frequent oil changes and engine flush - so I was doing oil change every 6k miles anyway, so oil burn was non issue.

What you need to consider as well is that 10k miles isn't really ideal mileage for service - it is designed for fleet managers and to artificially reducing servicing costs, by making long servicing intervals. Actually, it is considered "extended service" interval and there are certain conditions you need to meet to do it e.g. car should not be doing any type of driving which is considered "high load". What is considered high load? Driving on motorway for extended periods of time (in excess of 60MPH), driving in traffic for extended periods of time, idling for extended periods of time i.e. exactly what we doing all day long every day. So our cars actually don't qualify for "extended service intervals" and 10k miles service is not normal. Actually, people who car about longevity of the cars do oil change every 6k or even every 3k miles. In miles it looks weird, but in kilometres it is every 10k/5k kilometres and that is most of Europeans are doing.

Anyway, that out of the way - your oil burn does not seem normal, as it is already burning too much oil I would not recommend flush either. One thing I have noticed myself in single instance where I have used 0w40 Mobil One Long-Life oil (I have specific use case) was that car didn't burn any oil in 10k miles and oil was still relatively clean, whereas Magnatec would be very dirty (it is kind of bad and good at the same time). Anyway- so one potential solution for oil burn is using thicker oil, at least in it is "warm" rating i.e. Xw40. This will reduce engine efficiency a little bit and there were other factors to consider - so you could only proceed at your own risk and I do not recommend it. It worked great for me and for what I needed, but this is not suitable for everyone as solution.

[JavierHG]

1 hour ago, Linas.P said:

If my car would consume 2L of oil in 1360 miles I would be concerned as well, that doesn't sound reasonable at all. Do you have any history with the car, how it was maintained etc? As well, have you done oil change yourself, do you know what oil it was, do you know if right amount was put in?

Because the most likely cause is either wrong oil was there or the oil was missing from the beginning, because I can't see how 2L of oil could be burnt in such a short period. Especially without noticeable blue smoke etc. 

Now for reference - my old IS250 was 192k miles and it used to burn ~0.6L over 10k miles (Castrol Magnatec 5W30 or Toyota/Lexus dealership special). Meaning that I can go from one oil change pretty much without adding any oil, or maybe adding small bottle of 0.5L after 5k miles. I did have another issue - which was sticking valve lifters and solution for it was more frequent oil changes and engine flush - so I was doing oil change every 6k miles anyway, so oil burn was non issue.

What you need to consider as well is that 10k miles isn't really ideal mileage for service - it is designed for fleet managers and to artificially reducing servicing costs, by making long servicing intervals. Actually, it is considered "extended service" interval and there are certain conditions you need to meet to do it e.g. car should not be doing any type of driving which is considered "high load". What is considered high load? Driving on motorway for extended periods of time (in excess of 60MPH), driving in traffic for extended periods of time, idling for extended periods of time i.e. exactly what we doing all day long every day. So our cars actually don't qualify for "extended service intervals" and 10k miles service is not normal. Actually, people who car about longevity of the cars do oil change every 6k or even every 3k miles. In miles it looks weird, but in kilometres it is every 10k/5k kilometres and that is most of Europeans are doing.

Anyway, that out of the way - your oil burn does not seem normal, as it is already burning too much oil I would not recommend flush either. One thing I have noticed myself in single instance where I have used 0w40 Mobil One Long-Life oil (I have specific use case) was that car didn't burn any oil in 10k miles and oil was still relatively clean, whereas Magnatec would be very dirty (it is kind of bad and good at the same time). Anyway- so one potential solution for oil burn is using thicker oil, at least in it is "warm" rating i.e. Xw40. This will reduce engine efficiency a little bit and there were other factors to consider - so you could only proceed at your own risk and I do not recommend it. It worked great for me and for what I needed, but this is not suitable for everyone as solution.

Thanks for the detailed explanation Linas.

Unfortunately it didn't come with any service history, yes I know not an ideal decision and it had 1 owner.

The oil/filter change was done by Halfords as part of an interim check, again probably not an smart idea but at the time I didn't know any local garage.

The paperwork they gave me claims they added 6.3 liters of Xtech synthetic oil and they did not find any issues in the car, the suggested replacing spark plugs and cabin filter following Lexus maintenance schedule, I replaced the filter but haven't replaced the spark plug as it was a bit too complex for me.

My plan is doing oil/filter change at 3000 miles or 6 months as I drive mainly in London and probably you know how the traffic is in here.

I have it booked to be checked on the 4th of Jan to see if I am missing anything as I've now found a what seems to be good independent garage, will see if they suggest adding thicker oil.

[Linas.P]

You welcome,

My experience with Halfords is basically that they are fraud and they have no clue what they are doing. Now granted not every centre is the same and I can't speak for all, but I have used 4 different ones in London and always had appalling experience. How much was their interim service there? Are you aware that you can get Lexus Essential care Minor (interim) service for £185? Maybe little bit more expensive than Halfords but definitely worth it.

So they said they put "right amount" of some non-brand oil of unknown spec... from my experience that doesn't mean they did it. I would not be surprised if they haven't even changed the filter and didn't let the old oil to properly drain. In my experience again - they tend to overfill oil more often, than they do underfill, because they simply don't know how to properly measure the level (that is the level of mechanics we talking about).

I know maintaining the service history on 12 years old car with 100k miles adds no value, but I just found Lexus service in itself best value for money. The only thing I would not recommend with them is changing any major parts, outside of the service package their hourly rate is astronomical and parts themselves are often expensive. So what I tend to do is to take my car to Lexus mid-year for standard service (filters, oils that sort of stuff), they give me full list of items which needs to be addressed and I just say "thank you" and don't pay any of that. Then before MOT, I order the parts myself and what I can change myself I do it, what I can't or could not be bothered to do, I take it to local garage and literally point the finger and tell them what they need to change + standard oil change. This way I don't pay Lexus labour rate and I have full confidence that my car is fully serviced and always passes mot without advisories.

Doing oil change every 3k miles may be overkill, you kind of need to monitor the situation and see if it is actually required. I would rather put good oil every 6k miles, than cheap oil every 3k miles, but it all depends on the circumstances. Note as well that 3k/6k mile services would aid in protecting the car from wear... but once your car engine is already worn, you can do oil service every 100 miles it still won't matter. Now I don't know if that is the case, but if your car burns so much oil then the only way of addressing it would be changing piston rings (major engine work in general) and more frequent oil change won't help it.

So what I would do - I would do the oil change properly now, I would make sure personally that right amount of oil was in the engine after service, that filter was changed and that oil looks clear, and then I monitor that oil after every other fuel refill. By the way - on Lexus the proper process to check the oil is rather strange, on most cars you need to check oil level when cold, but on Lexus you need to check the oil level when engine is at working temperature. This presents an issue - when engine is running, it will always show oil level as low, because oil is scattered across the engine. So to check the level properly you need to get engine up to temperature, then switch it off for like 15-20 min for oil to drain down to the sump and then check the level.

[scudney]

Doesn't the IS250 if l am not mistaken require roughly 7.1 litres of oil during a complete oil change?,in that case you are already almost a litre short 🤔

[JavierHG]

44 minutes ago, Linas.P said:

You welcome,

My experience with Halfords is basically that they are fraud and they have no clue what they are doing. Now granted not every centre is the same and I can't speak for all, but I have used 4 different ones in London and always had appalling experience. How much was their interim service there? Are you aware that you can get Lexus Essential care Minor (interim) service for £185? Maybe little bit more expensive than Halfords but definitely worth it.

So they said they put "right amount" of some non-brand oil of unknown spec... from my experience that doesn't mean they did it. I would not be surprised if they haven't even changed the filter and didn't let the old oil to properly drain. In my experience again - they tend to overfill oil more often, than they do underfill, because they simply don't know how to properly measure the level (that is the level of mechanics we talking about).

I know maintaining the service history on 12 years old car with 100k miles adds no value, but I just found Lexus service in itself best value for money. The only thing I would not recommend with them is changing any major parts, outside of the service package their hourly rate is astronomical and parts themselves are often expensive. So what I tend to do is to take my car to Lexus mid-year for standard service (filters, oils that sort of stuff), they give me full list of items which needs to be addressed and I just say "thank you" and don't pay any of that. Then before MOT, I order the parts myself and what I can change myself I do it, what I can't or could not be bothered to do, I take it to local garage and literally point the finger and tell them what they need to change + standard oil change. This way I don't pay Lexus labour rate and I have full confidence that my car is fully serviced and always passes mot without advisories.

Doing oil change every 3k miles may be overkill, you kind of need to monitor the situation and see if it is actually required. I would rather put good oil every 6k miles, than cheap oil every 3k miles, but it all depends on the circumstances. Note as well that 3k/6k mile services would aid in protecting the car from wear... but once your car engine is already worn, you can do oil service every 100 miles it still won't matter. Now I don't know if that is the case, but if your car burns so much oil then the only way of addressing it would be changing piston rings (major engine work in general) and more frequent oil change won't help it.

So what I would do - I would do the oil change properly now, I would make sure personally that right amount of oil was in the engine after service, that filter was changed and that oil looks clear, and then I monitor that oil after every other fuel refill. By the way - on Lexus the proper process to check the oil is rather strange, on most cars you need to check oil level when cold, but on Lexus you need to check the oil level when engine is at working temperature. This presents an issue - when engine is running, it will always show oil level as low, because oil is scattered across the engine. So to check the level properly you need to get engine up to temperature, then switch it off for like 15-20 min for oil to drain down to the sump and then check the level.

Bringing the car to Halfords Woolwich was a mistake, and not a cheap one as it was £175. The fact that you have to leave the car all day and you cannot see them working on it is worrying, i should also have asked them to show me the replaced parts.

Wasn't aware Lexus cost £185, will definitely consider them as an option in the near future.

Sure i will monitor the situation for now and only use Castrol MAGNATEC Stop-Start 5W-30 A5 or similar.

Paperwork they gave me shows 6.3 not sure if liters or qt and i believe the IS250 2WD without filter takes 6.2qt or 5.9 L

 

 

[Linas.P]

1 hour ago, JavierHG said:

Bringing the car to Halfords Woolwich was a mistake, and not a cheap one as it was £175. The fact that you have to leave the car all day and you cannot see them working on it is worrying, i should also have asked them to show me the replaced parts.

Wasn't aware Lexus cost £185, will definitely consider them as an option in the near future.

Sure i will monitor the situation for now and only use Castrol MAGNATEC Stop-Start 5W-30 A5 or similar.

Paperwork they gave me shows 6.3 not sure if liters or qt and i believe the IS250 2WD without filter takes 6.2qt or 5.9 L

You can't see them working on car in Lexus either, although some dealers provide video of car inspection. That said I guess Lexus is trustworthy enough not to worry about any dodgy business.

Regarding Lexus Essential care - it is technically been discontinued, but I was able to book it for my IS250 yesterday, so you can still get it done at dealers discretion, just need to ask politely 🙂

5W30 A5, is the right oil for your car and indeed car hold 6.3L total and 5.9 without filter. 

[is200 Newbie]

It takes 6.2/6.3 litres to fill after an oil change. You should take some confidence from the fact that the oil, when viewed on the dip stick should be a transparent light brown colour - if dark then i would question if its been changed or question the reliability of the cars engine ... more likely its not been changed !! Maybe just me but i am suspicious if changes are done effectively basically due to the amount of specific tools required in order to do the services, in particular in changing the oil filters, this car needs a specific tool to remove the filter, would Halfords have one of these in order to change it, and countless others to do other models? Thats a big expense and space required to enable them to effectively do a service on each model of car they do?

It really is an easy job to do, one of the easiest on the car. If you have the space and time to do it then i would recommend you do it yourself if not only for the fact that it gives you confidence its done properly with the correct grades of oil and filters etc ...