was considering an RX but now inclined to ES but some questions if you don't mind

[mikesands]

Can I fit a towbar?  It's the only sensible way of carrying my e-bike 

Reviews complain about a lack of oomph, some even saying they are nervous about joining a major road.  Is this a legitimate criticism (I find my daughter's 2016 Prius amply powered)

One review I read says that some spec models have special hollow alloy wheels to reduce road noise - presumably the Takugami? And connected with this - hopefully the tyres are not special tyres, as I need to fit all-weather or winter tyres to get up my drive

Thanks

Mike

[Moleman]

I have never driven the ES 300h but if you find the Prius okay and amply powered then you will have no problems. Are you really that worried? Car reviewers appear to (in fact they all appear to say the same thing makes you wonder if they actually drive the car they are testing) hate the Lexus CVT system and do not understand how to drive it correctly.

[e-yes]

54 minutes ago, mikesands said:

Can I fit a towbar?  It's the only sensible way of carrying my e-bike 

Reviews complain about a lack of oomph, some even saying they are nervous about joining a major road.  Is this a legitimate criticism (I find my daughter's 2016 Prius amply powered)

One review I read says that some spec models have special hollow alloy wheels to reduce road noise - presumably the Takugami? And connected with this - hopefully the tyres are not special tyres, as I need to fit all-weather or winter tyres to get up my drive

Thanks

Mike

I don't think on the ES you can fit a tow bar. Maybe on a Camry and definitely on a RAV4 but the ES structure is so significantly different from the Avalon/Camry that towing is "not permitted". Even the roof has extra structural reinforcement (on the hybrid which is the only choice in UK) to keep the body extra rigid.

Reviewers be damned. It makes at least 300Nm of total system torque. Put it in ECO mode though and feel all the panic there is to be felt. The good thing is that even in Normal non-ECO mode, doing higher two digit speeds, it still manages 55mpg !

Takumi 18" wheels are the hollow circumference wheels which reduce noise. But, and this is subjective, Takumi spec is too much money for what it is.

But I think in the current 2022 line up, going F-Sport + Takumi Pack is probably the best value for money. Base ES + Premium Pack still takes it into 40k+ territory and you don't get the Mark Levinson, Head-Up display or kick-sensor operated boot lid.

With F-Sport + Takumi Pack you pretty much get all the goodies and leave out the ones which can be lived without eg real leather, ventilated seats. However you have to decide if you want 19" deep black "murder" wheels or not as there is no other option on F-Sport.

HTH

Cheers,

--E

[-Error-]

Hi Mike,

Yes, you can fit a towbar to an ES, there is even an official accessory for bikes, go check it out. 
No you can't, unfortunately no official tow bar available and although people have managed to achieve it it's normally a custom DIY job.

The acceleration will be more than satisfactory if the Prius hasn't left you longing for more power. The 2.5L unit is nearly as twice as powerful as the one found in the Prius so although the weight of the car is slightly bigger you will feel an increase in performance I'm sure.

Did you mean Takumi? I remember reading up about the hollow chamber muffling effects on the LS, wasn't aware that it's trickled down to the ES as well. How much of an effect will that have? I'm not so certain we'd notice on our british roads. The majority of the road noise comes from the road surface and not our vehicles; take a trip to France/Belgium and you'll see what I mean.

There are various technologies besides what Lexus has come up with, Foam Layered tyres such as the ContiSilent tyres from Continental being one example.

[mikesands]

I think the lack of towbar is going to be a killer.  I might have got away with a boot rack for the ebike, but another thread says it distorted the boot lid and Halfords gave a full refund.  The beauty of a towbar is that the bike rack can be clipped on in seconds as can the bikes themselves.  Anything else is a faff, and for older people like me lifting a 20 odd kilo bike on to a roof rack is probably not a good idea (incidentally Lexus don;t even list a roof rack accessory.

Mike

[Mincey]

I have no complaints or worries about ooomph so far. Pulling out onto busy roundabouts does not require a drop into S for assurance as it did on my 3IS. I think my wife saying "oooh, this doesn't hang around, does it?" as I gave the accelerator pedal it's inaugural (for me) meeting with the floor mat as we entered the dual c/w section of the A47 near Peterborough earlier this week says it all (and I can only imagine what it feel like to do the same in a bigger engined Lexus).

[Mincey]

1 hour ago, e-yes said:

However you have to decide if you want 19" deep black "murder" wheels or not as there is no other option on F-Sport

(why are they called "murder" wheels?)

[Las Palmas]

If all you want a tow bar for is carrying a bike there are plenty of possibilities.

Specialists in Japanese cars:

https://yakima.com/

 

So far, I have not seen a car this could not fit on and carry a bike:

https://www.mekster.se/thule-thule-raceway-2-659565.html?msclkid=12cf771dfbb015d48489166f7fd186e4

 

I had one of these on a MR2 Spyder, never hurt the car; easy on – easy off:

https://www.saris.com/product/bones2

[e-yes]

5 minutes ago, Mincey said:

(why are they called "murder" wheels?)

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=murdered out

 

 

Cheers,

--E

 

[Mincey]

2 minutes ago, e-yes said:

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=murdered out

Thank you!

[mikesands]

50 minutes ago, Las Palmas said:

If all you want a tow bar for is carrying a bike there are plenty of possibilities.

 

 

Specialists in Japanese cars:

 

https://yakima.com/

 

 

 

So far, I have not seen a car this could not fit on and carry a bike:

 

https://www.mekster.se/thule-thule-raceway-2-659565.html?msclkid=12cf771dfbb015d48489166f7fd186e4

 

 

 

I had one of these on a MR2 Spyder, never hurt the car; easy on – easy off:

 

https://www.saris.com/product/bones2

 

But were you trying to hang a 25kg e-bike off it.  The other thread comments on this type of rack distorting (and perhaps damaging the boot lid).  Am I right in thinking that the es300 has a very similar boot arrangement to the GS300.  If so and people on the GSforum are using them without problems I might take a chance.

Mike

[Las Palmas]

 

1 hour ago, mikesands said:

But were you trying to hang a 25kg e-bike off it.  The other thread comments on this type of rack distorting (and perhaps damaging the boot lid).  Am I right in thinking that the es300 has a very similar boot arrangement to the GS300.  If so and people on the GSforum are using them without problems I might take a chance.

Mike

No. Never had an electric bike. 2 all-terrain / downhill capable bikes and believe they were 25 - 30 kg. Together.

 

 

 

[peniole]

No tow bar possible.

Acceleration doesn't feel dramatic, but watch that speedo. Will put most cars to shame on an on ramp. Does not hang about at all as you have the instant electric torque. I've mostly driven normal mode, ECO feels a bit anemic and haven't seen more than 1-2MPG improvement. Have hit a high of 61+ MPG on longer trips. Everyday use, expect lower 50's without trying too hard and in normal mode.

Mine is the premium edition. You get almost all the bells and whistles +12.3 inch larger screen but keeping it well below the 40k mark (minus ML, hollow wheels but it's already quiet without them, 360 cameras this one I miss, real leather, ventilated seats, reclining rear seats and rear shades). If not mistaken, can still be ordered, to me it was the sweet spot. F sport has the 19s, no thank you. AVS in this type of vehicle in unnecessary, the American 350 sure, but not the 300h.

Finally, I have michelin cross climate + on mine, so you're covered there.

Be aware, rear seats do not fold down. Boot sizable but a bit shallow.

[PRT68]

Think outside the box. Buy the ES, and an old Berlingo. Chuck the bike and muddy kit in that, and keep the ES sparkling clean...

[First_Lexus]

9 hours ago, mikesands said:

Reviews complain about a lack of oomph, some even saying they are nervous about joining a major road.  Is this a legitimate criticism (I find my daughter's 2016 Prius amply powered)

^^ Sweeping generalisation coming…but motoring journalists in the UK are obsessed with German brands at the expense of everything else. They make similar complaints about the NX but - in my experience having owned two - it’s just nonsense! 

Take a good long test drive and make up your own mind. If it works for you, damn the reviews. 

Should add I’ve just ordered a new RX. Definitely no lack of oomph with that!

[Phil xxkr]

1 hour ago, First_Lexus said:

^^ Sweeping generalisation coming…but motoring journalists in the UK are obsessed with German brands at the expense of everything else. They make similar complaints about the NX but - in my experience having owned two - it’s just nonsense! 

Take a good long test drive and make up your own mind. If it works for you, damn the reviews. 

Should add I’ve just ordered a new RX. Definitely no lack of oomph with that!

Is it me but why give any review from anyone such credence? I was taught a long time ago rules are for the guidance of wise men and observance of fools, now substitute rules for reviews 😎

[Mincey]

14 hours ago, First_Lexus said:

^^ Sweeping generalisation coming…but motoring journalists in the UK are obsessed with German brands at the expense of everything else.

Wise words. If you stuck an Audi badge on a Daewoo Matiz and let them test it, they'd write that it was the best thing since sliced bread.

[First_Lexus]

5 minutes ago, Mincey said:

they'd write that it was the best thing since sliced bread.

^^ …and much like the Audi, sliced bread is over rated!!

[Mike246]

Couldn't agree more. Don't know whether the reviewers have a down on Lexus generally or the ES in particular but it only gets a 3 out of 5 rating.

It seems that most ES owners including me would disagree with that.

[Phil xxkr]

9 minutes ago, First_Lexus said:

^^ …and much like the Audi, sliced bread is over rated!!

For the Avoidance of doubt Ed does this mean you eat your loaf whole? 🤣🤣🤣

[First_Lexus]

19 minutes ago, Phil xxkr said:

For the Avoidance of doubt Ed does this mean you eat your loaf whole? 🤣🤣🤣

I’m often told I’m half a loaf short of a picnic…

[Phil xxkr]

23 minutes ago, First_Lexus said:

I’m often told I’m half a loaf short of a picnic…

Agree with them Ed, as the old saying goes, half a loaf is better than none (even an unsliced one) 😂

[First_Lexus]

56 minutes ago, Mike246 said:

Couldn't agree more. Don't know whether the reviewers have a down on Lexus generally or the ES in particular but it only gets a 3 out of 5 rating.

It seems that most ES owners including me would disagree with that.

^^ I think review sites, where owners rate the cars they actually own, are far more revealing. Those take practical considerations into account - expectations, reliability, dealer service, comfort - rather than power delivery, handling etc.

As an example, a friend of mine needed a reasonably priced SUV as a second car. They looked at a Ssangyong Korando and liked it, especially at the price, but we’re put off by the relentlessly negative media reviews. They then looked at Reevoo, and noted actual owners were satisfied, and noted some of the shortcomings. They bought the car - that was in 2012 and they still have it. It’s hardly put a foot wrong and they’re very happy. 

Over the years I’ve bought cars that the media said would be excellent - the VW Tiguan springs to mind - and which were utterly hopeless. I replaced that Tiguan (after the gearbox exploded at 40k miles) with a Honda Accord that the press said was outdated, noisy, poor handling and riding - I could go on. That was a brilliant car and it was the first of my three Hondas. 

As I said earlier, damn the reviews!!

[beyond the blue]

3 hours ago, First_Lexus said:

^^ …and much like the Audi, sliced bread is over rated!!

I'm trading in an Audi A3 for my new ES and can't wait to get rid of it if I'm being honest.

[wharfhouse]

4 hours ago, Mike246 said:

Couldn't agree more. Don't know whether the reviewers have a down on Lexus generally or the ES in particular but it only gets a 3 out of 5 rating.

It seems that most ES owners including me would disagree with that.

Same with the IS - reviewers always put it down rating it around 3/5 stars - I wanted something different to a line of previous BMWs and based on reviews was very 50/50 about whether to go to the IS but had a day test drive and liked it so much I bought one the following day - what I experienced and what reviewers said seemed like night and day! Five years on still very happy driving that same car. It's such a shame that Lexus stopped the IS in the EU and UK - I would have bought another without hesitation - now I'm just keeping my current IS for the foreseeable future as really don't know what to change to. To a large extent I think the constant and largely unfounded negative reviews comparing the IS to BMW 3, Merc C and Audi A4 was one of the nails in it's coffin. The reviewers have a lot to answer for. I hope they don't bad mouth the ES to the same fate. 

Strangely I saw a recent article in same media that criticised the IS so much now saying how good a used car buy it was!