A nudge too far?

[Phil xxkr]

From today's papers

"Charging points for electric cars will be preset to turn off for nine hours a day amid fears they could cause blackouts with the government pushing the switch from diesel and petrol.

From May, every new charger will automatically not function at 'peak times' to ease the pressure on the national grid. There is also set to be a 'randomised delay' of up to 30 minutes if there is high demand from motorists".  

All designed to nudge you into charging at off-peak hours 😱. I wonder about all those company car drivers who chose EV because of lower BiK rates and actually need a car to perform their job? 

 

[Mincey]

Whoops.

[Phil xxkr]

1 minute ago, Mincey said:

Whoops.

Assuming of course James it's true 😎

[wharfhouse]

32 minutes ago, Phil xxkr said:

From today's papers

"Charging points for electric cars will be preset to turn off for nine hours a day amid fears they could cause blackouts with the government pushing the switch from diesel and petrol.

From May, every new charger will automatically not function at 'peak times' to ease the pressure on the national grid. There is also set to be a 'randomised delay' of up to 30 minutes if there is high demand from motorists".  

All designed to nudge you into charging at off-peak hours 😱. I wonder about all those company car drivers who chose EV because of lower BiK rates and actually need a car to perform their job? 

 

It does say that "Owners will be able to override the preset times, to take account of night workers and people who have different schedules." although I'm not keen on someone else controlling when or if I might be able to charge if / when I ever go BEV...

[Boxbrownie]

It be bloomin’ hard to do that to mine……plugged into a normal 13amp socket 😁

[Phil xxkr]

18 minutes ago, wharfhouse said:

It does say that "Owners will be able to override the preset times, to take account of night workers and people who have different schedules." although I'm not keen on someone else controlling when or if I might be able to charge if / when I ever go BEV...

Absolutely Phil, same with smart meters and a cashless society 😎

[wharfhouse]

2 minutes ago, Phil xxkr said:

Absolutely Phil, same with smart meters and a cashless society 😎

Yes - been putting off a smart meter too... will probably have to give in to that one day but really don't see any benefit - certainly won't help me use any less gas/electricity...

[Arnett]

Hate the idea of electric cars anyway. Just another reason to hate them more

[Mincey]

1 hour ago, Phil xxkr said:

Assuming of course James it's true 😎

A good point, well made!

[Mincey]

49 minutes ago, wharfhouse said:

Yes - been putting off a smart meter too... will probably have to give in to that one day but really don't see any benefit - certainly won't help me use any less gas/electricity...

Same here. British Gas keep emailing me saying that it is critical that I have to have one. I think otherwise.

[Phil xxkr]

14 minutes ago, Mincey said:

Same here. British Gas keep emailing me saying that it is critical that I have to have one. I think otherwise.

Good man 

[Boxbrownie]

Since we moved to Cornwall every few months we get emails saying the power company “needs” to fit a smart meter and can they make an appointment, well no…..p155 off, I don’t want one, I don’t trust one (for what it’s really going to be used for, higher rates at peak times) and their inference is it is a legal necessity,well it ain’t yet and until that day they can stuff their dumb smart meter up the chairman’s chuff!

 

Rant over…and calm….

[Duggie B]

1 hour ago, Mincey said:

Same here. British Gas keep emailing me saying that it is critical that I have to have one. I think otherwise.

Me too.....it'll be my choice as and when .....

[Phil xxkr]

50 minutes ago, Duggie B said:

Me too.....it'll be my choice as and when .....

The "criticality" is when they have a critical mass of users so they can control as and when you use it 😱

[Herbie]

4 hours ago, wharfhouse said:

although I'm not keen on someone else controlling when or if I might be able to charge if / when I ever go BEV...

Get used to it Phil because that's the whole reason for Smart Meters to exist.

They know the existing infrastructure won't be able to cope and we also have a couple of nuclear stations reaching end of life with no viable new ones to replace them, so generating capacity is going to be well down anyway.

At the moment, smart meters 'phone home' a couple of times a day at most but will soon be altered to every 30 minutes or even less. This is so they can micro-manage demand by charging more per unit at peak times and 'incentivising' people to balance their loads across the day more efficiently. They also have the ability to cut you off completely for periods of time if demand gets too high at any given time.

[Spacewagon52]

1 minute ago, Herbie said:

Get used to it Phil because that's the whole reason for Smart Meters to exist.

They know the existing infrastructure won't be able to cope and we also have a couple of nuclear stations reaching end of life with no viable new ones to replace them, so generating capacity is going to be well down anyway.

At the moment, smart meters 'phone home' a couple of times a day at most but will soon be altered to every 30 minutes or even less. This is so they can micro-manage demand by charging more per unit at peak times and 'incentivising' people to balance their loads across the day more efficiently. They also have the ability to cut you off completely for periods of time if demand gets too high at any given time.

Very interesting information, thanks.

[royoftherovers]

1 hour ago, Herbie said:

Get used to it Phil because that's the whole reason for Smart Meters to exist.

They know the existing infrastructure won't be able to cope and we also have a couple of nuclear stations reaching end of life with no viable new ones to replace them, so generating capacity is going to be well down anyway.

At the moment, smart meters 'phone home' a couple of times a day at most but will soon be altered to every 30 minutes or even less. This is so they can micro-manage demand by charging more per unit at peak times and 'incentivising' people to balance their loads across the day more efficiently. They also have the ability to cut you off completely for periods of time if demand gets too high at any given time.

HERBIE, YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT.

In Spain here I have recently been given the following in relation to cost of electricity. Smart meters were introduced without my knowledge about 3 years ago.

Mon-Friday peak hours are 10.00-14.00 and 18.00-22.00

Off Peak 08.00-10.00, 14.00-18.00, 22.00-00.00

Super off Peak 00.00-08.00

Super off Peak rates apply all day SAT AND SUN and Public Holidays.

I got up at 03.00 this morning to put the Dishwasher on (and to charge my imaginary EV !)

[Mincey]

I think I'll be investing in one of these. Will they run on E10....? 😉

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Böhmer-AG-6500W-Petrol-Generator-3-4kVA/dp/B084VPBKCV/ref=sr_1_4?dchild=1&keywords=petrol+generator&qid=1631545155&sr=8-4

[Thackeray]

I don't see the point in getting a so-called "smart meter" while its only value seems to be to tell you that using an electric kettle consumes a lot of electricity. Like many people, I already know that.

But what is more interesting is that there is a wholesale market in electricity. Here are some quotes for Nordic prices tomorrow, hour by hour. By using this information, I would have thought that an electric car designer could set up software in the car that could control when the car was charged and at what price.

So for example, if you drive home at 5pm in your electric car and plug it in to start charging immediately, the wholesale price in the chart shown at the above link, would be 107 euros per MWh. But if instead you could programme the car to tell it that you would need a range of 50 miles by 8am the next day, the car could then download the forecast prices and charge from midnight when the price would be 66 euros per MWh. I have no idea how long you would need it to charge. But the car could calculate how long it would need to be charged to achieve a range of 50 miles (plus some leeway, perhaps) and then time the charging to be done at the times when the price was best.

In that way, it wouldn't be the supplier controlling when or whether the customer could have the electricity. Instead, the customer would be buying when the price was best.

 

[First_Lexus]

2 hours ago, Herbie said:

Get used to it Phil because that's the whole reason for Smart Meters to exist.

They know the existing infrastructure won't be able to cope and we also have a couple of nuclear stations reaching end of life with no viable new ones to replace them, so generating capacity is going to be well down anyway.

At the moment, smart meters 'phone home' a couple of times a day at most but will soon be altered to every 30 minutes or even less. This is so they can micro-manage demand by charging more per unit at peak times and 'incentivising' people to balance their loads across the day more efficiently. They also have the ability to cut you off completely for periods of time if demand gets too high at any given time.

^^ I’ve just moved back from Wiltshire to Berkshire, and my new property is newly built - I’m the first owner. 

- Smart meter is pre-installed, there is no option;

- EV charging point also pre-installed, which may come in handy one day;

- There are no landline telephone points as “…nobody uses those any more.” Well I did, but mobile only seems fine so that’s actually saving me money;

- Equally, most rooms have an Ethernet port built in. The wireless is very good, but the Sky engineer was very excited and has plugged by new Sky Q boxes straight into them as he says it’s “…much better that way…”;

- Have to say, super fast fibre to the door has made a big difference compared with what I was used to. I never thought I’d find myself saying that!

Progress I guess. However, with so many new houses being built a lot of this stuff comes by stealth for those who buy those properties. I wasn’t looking for a new build but location was perfect and development small (only 16 houses in total) so decided to go for it.

As an aside, and given the above, my previous house had a heat source pump heating system which was a) cheap to run, because b) it was usually broken! My new house, built just a couple of years before gas central heating on new homes is outlawed has…well, gas central heating, obviously! Go figure…

 

[Herbie]

7 minutes ago, First_Lexus said:

- There are no landline telephone points as “…nobody uses those any more.” Well I did, but mobile only seems fine so that’s actually saving me money;

 

8 minutes ago, First_Lexus said:

- Have to say, super fast fibre to the door has made a big difference compared with what I was used to. I never thought I’d find myself saying that!

The PSTN (Public Switched Telephone Network) is due to be switched off by the end of 2025. All telephone exchanges will close and everybody will be on VoIP (Voice over Internet Protocol) for voice calls. You'll probably see a port on the back of your router that you can plug your landline phone into and it'll work OK now, as long as you have VoIP activated on the fibre.

[Thackeray]

18 minutes ago, First_Lexus said:

- There are no landline telephone points as “…nobody uses those any more.” Well I did, but mobile only seems fine so that’s actually saving me money;

If you've got a fibre terminal box on the wall, this generally has a phone socket as well as an internet socket for the router. There's a plan to phase out the 100-year-old copper wires in the next couple of years, so landline phones will use this connection instead.

Edit: Herbie beat me to it. As he says, you could also use the phone socket on the router. If you're lucky you may have a wall-box with a rechargeable Battery so that the phone will continue to work during the power cut caused by everyone trying to recharge their electric cars. This Battery takes the place of the roomful of 12v batteries at the telephone exchange. (Cue Herbie's fascinating picture of the roomful of batteries which he included in a thread a year or two ago.)

Or if you have a newer terminal box, there will be no Battery and you'll have to use your mobile to call 999 if there's a power cut.

[Boxbrownie]

16 minutes ago, First_Lexus said:

^^ I’ve just moved back from Wiltshire to Berkshire, and my new property is newly built - I’m the first owner.

- EV charging point also pre-installed, which may come in handy one day;-

 

Is it a genuine EVSE charger or just an outside insulated 13 amp socket, as our Son bought a new house in the past two years and it specified there was an EV charge port included, apparently dues to local council planning there had to be a proportion of the new houses on site that have them installed.

I was happy as it meant we could charge when we visit, unfortunately all it was is a 13 amp by the garage door albeit a specially insulated and earthed spur from the box, so no quick charging just the normal overnight stuff.

[First_Lexus]

26 minutes ago, Boxbrownie said:

Is it a genuine EVSE charger or just an outside insulated 13 amp socket, as our Son bought a new house in the past two years and it specified there was an EV charge port included, apparently dues to local council planning there had to be a proportion of the new houses on site that have them installed.

I was happy as it meant we could charge when we visit, unfortunately all it was is a 13 amp by the garage door albeit a specially insulated and earthed spur from the box, so no quick charging just the normal overnight stuff.

It’s a Pod Point - as far as I know (and have been told) it’s a proper EV charger.

https://pod-point.com/solutions/driver/home-charging

35 minutes ago, Herbie said:

 

The PSTN (Public Switched Telephone Network) is due to be switched off by the end of 2025. All telephone exchanges will close and everybody will be on VoIP (Voice over Internet Protocol) for voice calls. You'll probably see a port on the back of your router that you can plug your landline phone into and it'll work OK now, as long as you have VoIP activated on the fibre.

^^ The router does indeed have a UK telephone socket on it! It might have been helpful to tell me that rather than SKY and the developer simply saying “…you don’t need a landline.” Mind you, based on two weeks without one they may have a point…

[Malc]

55 minutes ago, First_Lexus said:

There are no landline telephone points as “…nobody uses those any more.

well me too, I call my buddies in Australia on their landline phones ..  would I want to call it from MY mobile I wonder .....  might that break my bank .....  2 x 45 min calls a week on average .........  my internet provider, via my landline, actually gives me a freebie International Calling landline programme too .......... I won't be moving to a brand new house then ...  my house is actually about 400 years old but full of mod cons etc BUT not everyone else in the world has our First World functionality methinks, especially " Old Buggers " in Oz

Malc

My mobile is NOT provided by my landline / internet provider