Lexus vip event

[george72]

Eve all. 

I confess I am not yet a bono fide lexus owner yet but want to purchase a used es 300h at the right price. I am struggling to get either an f sport or premium at the right price at the moment. I have been invited to a vip event at Leicester lexus which I have accepted and wondering what this actually means in practice? Any pearls of wisdom would be welcome? 

[cadman2k]

They were marketed generally as ``your chance to drive away with a Brand New or Approved Used Lexus with not just a dealer level discount but with an additional manufacturer authorised VIP Bonus``

 However like any sales event it may or may not be the best time to strike a deal. 

It's likely a few members on here have had experiences that do not gel with above.  I have never been to one so can not pass personal comments.

I know dealers in the past have been known to offer an additional loyalty trade in value to make you feel as though you've got a good deal when trading hybrid for hybrid

The car market at the moment is very buoyant so it may not be the best time but certainly worth a try if you are looking for a specific model. 

Nothing ventured...... 

 

[Diesel Do Nicely Brian]

I bought my current car just over a week before a VIP event with every discount available/special finance etc. The price I paid for my car brand new, not yet delivered to the dealer, is less than I can pick up a pre registered one or even an 18 month old one just now.   

They were then REALLY busy over the VIP time so have no real need to make you a decent deal. 

Best time to buy a car is always when they have stock, not enough footfall and near the end of a month. 

[george72]

Well that was a waste of my time. After waiting for the sales person a little while I was told that it was an event for new car sales only. 

I emailed them 2 days ago to check this but had no response! 

I saw a car that I liked but needed to be 1k less then the advertised price. They said no discount on used cars! 

[Linas.P]

16 hours ago, george72 said:

Eve all. 

I confess I am not yet a bono fide lexus owner yet but want to purchase a used es 300h at the right price. I am struggling to get either an f sport or premium at the right price at the moment. I have been invited to a vip event at Leicester lexus which I have accepted and wondering what this actually means in practice? Any pearls of wisdom would be welcome? 

I have been on couple of those and it is frankly a joke. So last time I got invitation I filled in the form and receive the call from Lexus GB, lady on the phone took my details and asked what cars I am interested in etc. I said RC-F and LC, she then set the time for me for Saturday 2PM and said she will make sure both cars will be available for test drive... so far so good. 

What I was expecting - glass of Champagne, maybe some snacks and dozen or so cars (not LC obviously, but in total) which they want to get rid of and which they willing to agreed good deals for. Came Saturday, I got to my Lexus dealer and there is nothing special about the day... sat in 7 people queue until receptionist came to me and I explained here why I am there. It took literally an hour before salesperson came to me saying "what car you are interested in?" He had no clue FFS! So I had to explain him again why I am there. He looked like he is literally hearing this for the first time in his life and then explained that they do not have either of the cars available. Thanks for wasting my time I guess.

In the end we gone through few option they have available in franchise and all of them were exceptionally bad deals. Eventually, dealership MD came around and he had LC500, so I was offered a test drive, so I guess that was the only positive, by complete accident. In the end they sort of took note of what I want - in nutshell higher miles car where mileage is represented in price (I am just cheapskate like that) and it has to be black/white with red interior...They said they will call me when they have something in stock... this was January 2020 and I haven't had the call since. I assume no care came to match mi criteria 😄

In short - what are "Lexus VIP events"... just fancy name for semi-warm calling people they have on record as Lexus owners and trying them into dealership. There are no special deals or anything like that, they just want you in the dealership, because higher "footfall" means statistically more purchases. Now I am sure that if I wanted IS300h, or CT200h, or NX/UX they would have had something more to offer. Secondly, it was start of Covid conditions, not yet full lockdown but maybe that is what made it unusual.

As for ES... I am very critical about that car as frankly it isn't even Lexus and it is very obvious. Cheap hard plastics inside, overall build quality not bad (it is Toyota after all), but it does not feel luxurious at all. Ride as well is are one would expect 300h to drive, but both IS300h and GS300h are far better cars form driving perspective and more luxurious. If you really interested I have recently seen ES300h Takumi (I guess that is what you mean by Premier) in Lexus Reading. Not sure regarding the price as it is new car on their dealership floor, 200 miles on the clock.

[Diesel Do Nicely Brian]

Dear me - that sounds like a poor experience of VIP. 

As for your summary of the ES, you are wrong. I went into my ES after 5 years in a GS450h and in most respects the ES is a better car. I have also owned several Lexus models and over my years of Lexus ownership driven almost all the range, sometimes for weeks at a time as courtesy cars, if not ones I owned for years.  The ES is every bit a Lexus and is not full of “cheap hard plastics” - my GS and IS’s had far more, and my Avensis has plenty. 
 

The Camry, which I have also test driven and spent time in, is nowhere near the quality, spec or car of the ES.  It is much blander inside, lower spec and cheaper plastics.  

[Linas.P]

2 hours ago, Diesel Do Nicely Brian said:

The ES is every bit a Lexus and is not full of “cheap hard plastics” - my GS and IS’s had far more, and my Avensis has plenty. 

The Camry, which I have also test driven and spent time in, is nowhere near the quality, spec or car of the ES.  It is much blander inside, lower spec and cheaper plastics.  

It is... for example all the windows switches are surrounded by hard textured plastic which is extra cheap, as well the area around gear shifter. Neither IS, nor GS has this. I think overall, it is better in areas where one would expect 8 years newer, new generation car to be better. Tech is better etc. but quality is not, the sound proofing is not as good and the materials themselves are not as solid. It does not feel Lexus at all, same like UX... again driven both Lexus UX and Toyota CH-R and they are carbon copies just with different badges.

The Camry is step below ES, because ES is based on Avalon and Avalon is carbon copy of ES. I guess what makes ES less offensive is that we don't have Toyota Avalon in UK, so now way to compare like for like and see that it is just badge engineering. 

In either case that is my experience and opinion, whoever wants to buy it I suggest to test drive GS/IS and ES back to back and decide themselves. Obviously, don't compare 2013 poverty-line IS300h Exec/Luxury with 150k miles against brand new ES300h Takumi, take 2019 IS300h F-Sport or Premier at least. 

[Diesel Do Nicely Brian]

The 2019 model ES is not the same as the 2021 model - all the plastics around the switches and centre are nicely textured in the 21 MY, some with chrome trims, and the 2022 moves it up again.   All switches in literally every car are surround by plastic or cheap veneered wood made to look expensive. It’s all plastic. 
 

I owned the GS450h for 5 years - I am aware of the qualities, more so than a quick look in the door at a showroom.  The ES is quieter on the road, even with my GS having been Dynamat installed and the ES untouched.  The plastics in my GS, IS, NX etc were no better than the ES, which is well beyond any of my Toyotas. 

[Linas.P]

I have looked in F-Sport Takumi when it was launched, so I assume 2019 model and I have looked into Takumi which is on dealership floor now so I assume 2021 model and both of them have exactly same quality which was very disappointing in my opinion. As well I note that you owned GS mk3 in low trim (SE) and my comparison was with mk4 in high trim. I have never tested low trims on any Lexus so I really don't know how bad they get, for IS300h I only ever tried F-Sport (probably 5 different ones) and GS only Premier and F-sport.

I appreciate that owning car for extended period of time can help you with - 1) finding less apparent issues with it and 2) just learning to live with it as it is, but if the car has unsatisfactory martials and build quality whilst sitting on the dealership floor I just can't see how that could improve after X years of owning it. 

The previous gen Lexus (GS mk4 2012 and IS mk3 2013) were already step down in quality of the cars they have replaced and ES is step below them, to the level where I don't even see the point of having Lexus badge on it. I am sure there always been some hard plastics in Lexus if you go looking for them, but at least around the driver and in obvious places it was all soft-touch material and padded corners everywhere. ES has hard and rattily plastics right in your face and it took no more than 1 second for me to pick-up on them. I mean sure - people can selectively ignore it and pretend they are not there, so that is certainly your choice... 

[Diesel Do Nicely Brian]

Fine - you clearly know everything and I am done adding to this discussion. 

The GS450h I had was a launch SE Sunroof - the only piece of spec missing from the SE-L was adaptive cruise control and no difference whatsoever in any other way to the SE-L like the later models which lost spec/poorer leather on lower spec cars, but I am sure you already know that too. 
 

 

[Kissu]

1 hour ago, Linas.P said:

It is... for example all the windows switches are surrounded by hard textured plastic which is extra cheap, as well the area around gear shifter. Neither IS, nor GS has this. I think overall, it is better in areas where one would expect 8 years newer, new generation car to be better. Tech is better etc. but quality is not, the sound proofing is not as good and the materials themselves are not as solid. It does not feel Lexus at all, same like UX... again driven both Lexus UX and Toyota CH-R and they are carbon copies just with different badges.

The Camry is step below ES, because ES is based on Avalon and Avalon is carbon copy of ES. I guess what makes ES less offensive is that we don't have Toyota Avalon in UK, so now way to compare like for like and see that it is just badge engineering. 

In either case that is my experience and opinion, whoever wants to buy it I suggest to test drive GS/IS and ES back to back and decide themselves. Obviously, don't compare 2013 poverty-line IS300h Exec/Luxury with 150k miles against brand new ES300h Takumi, take 2019 IS300h F-Sport or Premier at least. 

You sir are talking a load off rubbish,we have a 3 year old Toyota CHR and a 1 year old Lexus UX,and they are like chalk and cheese.Forums are a dangerous place when you have so much misinformation.

 

 

[Spacewagon52]

Oh dear, I have the feeling this is going to be a long thread!

[Linas.P]

41 minutes ago, Kissu said:

You sir are talking a load off rubbish,we have a 3 year old Toyota CHR and a 1 year old Lexus UX,and they are like chalk and cheese.Forums are a dangerous place when you have so much misinformation.

I think you comparing apples and oranges... Your Lexus US is Takumi (top of the range model) and what was the trim level your CH-R? Secondly, it may seem like 2 years difference is not that much, but I know for a fact that CH-R had small facelift together with introduction of GR trim. So before you say that I am talking loads of rubbish please check if your are at least comparing similar spec cars.

1 hour ago, Diesel Do Nicely Brian said:

Fine - you clearly know everything and I am done adding to this discussion. 

The GS450h I had was a launch SE Sunroof - the only piece of spec missing from the SE-L was adaptive cruise control and no difference whatsoever in any other way to the SE-L like the later models which lost spec/poorer leather on lower spec cars, but I am sure you already know that too. 

I can know only as much information as you have provided. your signature says it was SE trim, which is de-facto lowest trim available. Obviously, I cannot know it is some limited "launch edition" model which basically is SE-L... That said you still comparing 2006 car with 2021 car and that isn't right. The standards and expectations of quality have generally increased in 15 years, so comparison can be difficult. That is why I am careful with what I say.

To to remind you I said that if you compare ES300h with comparable IS/GS then it is step below in quality. Quite specifically that comparable car would be 2020/2021 IS300h Fsport/Takumi is we are comparing against 2020/2021 ES300h F-sport/Takumi.... you can't take 10 years older car of lower trim and compare it with brand new ES with higher trim and then say ES is just as good!

...but this is what I can see people do continuously. They get into the brand starting from used lower spec. car, overtime they build appreciation for the brand and buy newer higher spec car and say... "ohhh my car is so much better than my old one". Yes, because it is 10 years newer and 2-trim levels higher spec. + placebo and confirmation bias effects associated with spending large amount of money on the object you like.

As I said - if somebody are really into ES and they really like it, that is great... your money, your car... more power to you. But if you compare it like for like with IS/GS it replaces and the time scales for new model year, then it is not only isn't improvement, but arguably worse quality than car it replaces. So my only advise, test drive these cars back to back before you make decision and don't go by advise from people who moved into ES from 15 years older car as their experience arguably isn't very objective.

[Kissu]

9 minutes ago, Linas.P said:

I think you comparing apples and oranges... Your Lexus US is Takumi (top of the range model) and what was the trim level your CH-R? Secondly, it may seem like 2 years difference is not that much, but I know for a fact that CH-R had small facelift together with introduction of GR trim. So before you say that I am talking loads of rubbish please check if your are at least comparing similar spec cars.

I can know only as much information as you have provided. your signature says it was SE trim, which is de-facto lowest trim available. Obviously, I cannot know it is some limited "launch edition" model which basically is SE-L... That said you still comparing 2006 car with 2021 car and that isn't right. The standards and expectations of quality have generally increased in 15 years, so comparison can be difficult. That is why I am careful with what I say.

To to remind you I said that if you compare ES300h with comparable IS/GS then it is step below in quality. Quite specifically that comparable car would be 2020/2021 IS300h Fsport/Takumi is we are comparing against 2020/2021 ES300h F-sport/Takumi.... you can't take 10 years older car of lower trim and compare it with brand new ES with higher trim and then say ES is just as good!

...but this is what I can see people do continuously. They get into the brand starting from used lower spec. car, overtime they build appreciation for the brand and buy newer higher spec car and say... "ohhh my car is so much better than my old one". Yes, because it is 10 years newer and 2-trim levels higher spec. + placebo and confirmation bias effects associated with spending large amount of money on the object you like.

As I said - if somebody are really into ES and they really like it, that is great... your money, your car... more power to you. But if you compare it like for like with IS/GS it replaces and the time scales for new model year, then it is not only isn't improvement, but arguably worse quality than car it replaces. So my only advise, test drive these cars back to back before you make decision and don't go by advise from people who moved into ES from 15 years older car as their experience arguably isn't very objective.

Our CHR top of the range Dynamic.We will have to agree to disagree.

 

 

[Linas.P]

It was indeed to of the range... I agree with that. The CH-R I was talking about from my experience was Blue-Edition, basically Dynamic with black roof. I know it just been replaced with new 2021 CH-R GR edition, despite my advise to at least go with Lexus UX, or better with 2-3 years old Lexus NX.

In either case we may need to agree to disagree, but there are far more in common between these two cars in areas where it matters than differences. I probably don't even need to say it is just my opinion.

[george72]

Interesting digression.... Many thanks for the inputs. I am a complete novice to lexus but I had shortlisted 2 cars: the nx300h and es300h and I found the drive on the es300h to be superior in every regard which is why I have narrowed my choice. I have no experience of the Is300 or Gs300h. 

[Linas.P]

It is kind of sad, because both IS300h and GS300h have been discontinued, but if you looking after used car then I guess it is only better.

I don't like NX just because I basically don't like any SUVs, not sure of the reason why you didn't like it, but maybe it is why as well? From driving perspective I found ES300h same as any other Lexus 300h and I could not even complain much about it being FWD, because realistically 300h is just powerful enough to really take advantage of RWD. Still both GS/IS would be more more "dynamic" when driving and would have better balance. IS is smaller car, more sporty, GS is bigger car and more luxurious, but in my opinion both are better built - more "Lexus like".

[serbarry]

OT

I find Linas' contributions informative and useful.