2002 LS430

[The-Acre]

On 4/8/2021 at 10:19 AM, BigBoomer said:

If all you want is to waft along a motorway, then coil springs/struts are good enough.

If you want better cornering, flatter riding, and better tracking (keeping the tyre in contact with the road) then the air-suspension system is superior in just about every way. The only downside to the air suspension is it's complexity and by extension it's reliability.
I agree with Lexus that the air suspension is superior in almost every way over the coil spring, at least for that era.
More modern systems can be better but in my experience they tend to be harsher riding.

Before buying my LS, I test drove a couple of late model coil sprung 400s, an early 430 (air), 2 facelift 430s (both air) and a 460 (air) and the best handling was without doubt the facelift air suspended 430s. The 460 was nice but felt vague and remote.

Personally I've found my cornering and general handling has improved with coils.

[BigBoomer]

3 hours ago, The-Acre said:

Personally I've found my cornering and general handling has improved with coils.

Undoubtedly those brand new coil springs and dampers are better than 18 year old worn out air suspension. 😁
Not really a fair comparison.

I was comparing 98/00 coil sprung LS400s vs 2001/2004 air sprung LS430s, all on original factory supplied springs & shocks and all under 100k miles.

[Tulpen]

I'm afraid there's a Brexit/Remain, Vax/Antivax mindset on here when it come to coils or air. Whatever suits you is good for me.  🙂

[The-Acre]

3 hours ago, BigBoomer said:

Undoubtedly those brand new coil springs and dampers are better than 18 year old worn out air suspension. 😁
Not really a fair comparison.

I was comparing 98/00 coil sprung LS400s vs 2001/2004 air sprung LS430s, all on original factory supplied springs & shocks and all under 100k miles.

A good point.  The problem with air it the often complete failure. Not just Lexus of course, Mercedes are plagued with it when the years go by. My coils do create a slight "rattle" at low speed over some small road imperfections, not that we have many bad roads in this country!  I guess we should never expect a complex expensive system to be trouble free after 16 years or so. I had two failures on my Celsior at 63k, not air leaking but oil from the strut. I was lucky really because it happened just after a European road trip, I wouldn't have wanted that in Germany!

[Brik]

I've just had a closer look at the rear distribution valve and it is leaking very slightly, from where the plastic is in contact with the (corroding) metal bracket.

They have the part on fleabay but I don't really want to spend almost £300 just to then uncover another issue with the suspension...

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/New-Lexus-LS430-Air-Suspension-Rear-Valve-Block-Height-Control-No-2-4809650040/203335283824?epid=1713774933&hash=item2f57ba3470:g:0yMAAOSwXXpgaL3O

[The-Acre]

On 4/10/2021 at 6:14 PM, Brik said:

I've just had a closer look at the rear distribution valve and it is leaking very slightly, from where the plastic is in contact with the (corroding) metal bracket.

They have the part on fleabay but I don't really want to spend almost £300 just to then uncover another issue with the suspension...

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/New-Lexus-LS430-Air-Suspension-Rear-Valve-Block-Height-Control-No-2-4809650040/203335283824?epid=1713774933&hash=item2f57ba3470:g:0yMAAOSwXXpgaL3O

This will always be the problem with ageing limos, an arm and a leg to put the smallest problem right. 

[Brik]

I managed to track down the business selling the part on eBay and yesterday, around 3 pm, paid cash straight into his bank. Fairplay to the bloke the parcel was waiting for me when I finished work today at 2 pm.

I've fitted it and, so far, the car hasn't lost any height.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1WxABAbPancsblOZrJBmnHt75kjxFhLgv/view?usp=drivesdk

 

 

[Brik]

Still all good on the suspension front, I may as well move on to the next issue, there is quite a list.

Steering wheel doesn't move.

Sat nav dvd player.

Rear shelf sub woofer.

Exterior lock button on the drivers door.

Front parking sensor.

O/S headlight squirtie.

A/C leak.

Maybe a very slight leak from one of the exhaust manifolds, only noticeable from outside the car.

 

I'll probably look at the steering wheel first, if it were your car what order would you tackle the jobs in?

[BigBoomer]

Whichever in that list most irritates you.

If the steering wheel position is comfy for you it doesn't matter.

The built in SatNav ain't great, even with the most recent DVD. I use a TomTom.

I replaced my Sub with the DaytonAudio and it sounds great. Cost £50 and about 3 hrs total.

Parking Sensors only a problem if you use them.

Headlight squirty is convenient, but 10 secs with a cloth does a better job.

AC Leak is polluting and will lead to AC issues but AC is less of an issue in the UK.

The exhaust leak is probably a crack in the Y-pipe where it joins the primary CATs.
I had mine fixed by a local exhaust place. £150 for a mostly rebuilt Y-pipe.

[PhiL_P]

Came across this thread having just purchased an almost identical car, 2003 LS 430 with 140K on the clock. Interesting comparing to-do lists, here's mine so far (mostly what I've identified's not working) -

- Steering wheel telescopic adjustment

- Most of the hifi speakers don't seem to be working properly with very low audio output (in addition to the usual sub issue)

- A front parking sensor occasionally going haywire

- Sunroof frame badly rusted

- Rear o/s seat not adjusting (but can hear motor trying)

- Parking brake doesn't hold the car (suspect shoes need replacing)

- Front lower suspension arm rear bushes need replacing (advisory on last couple of MOTs)

- Alloy wheels badly corroded (debating forking out for full refurb)

- Rear door windows laminate / glazing failure (the white clouding at the base of both)

As to what irritates me most of my list, definitely the hifi speakers as I was looking forward to hearing how good it was!

[Brik]

20 hours ago, PhiL_P said:

 

- Sunroof frame badly rusted

- Front lower wishbone rear bushes need replacing (advisory on last couple of MOTs)

- Alloy wheels badly corroded (debating forking out for full refurb)

- Rear door windows laminate / glazing failure (the white clouding at the base of both)

 

Sunroof frame is rusted on mine too, and o/s rear window cloudy.

Luckily the w/bone bushes have been replaced and the wheels look suspiciously clean so I'd say they have already been refurbished too.

[BigBoomer]

Chances are your speakers need a re-foam. I did both of my front door speakers and it now sounds excellent.
I used these foams
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07DDLBY96
and this glue
https://www.amazon.co.uk/TECHNICAL-ADHESIVE-SUPER-GLUE-RINGS/dp/B006E8PR3C

If your Sub cone still moves when playing music, then it just needs an 8" refoam kit.
If it doesn't move at all then it needs replacing.
I used the DaytonAudio replacement and it works and sounds great. Just requires a bit of modification to the plastic brackets that hold the Sub.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Dayton-Audio-SD215A-88-DVC-Subwoofer/dp/B0045UY7M8
 

[cruisermark]

31 minutes ago, BigBoomer said:

Chances are your speakers need a re-foam. I did both of my front door speakers and it now sounds excellent.
I used these foams
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07DDLBY96
and this glue
https://www.amazon.co.uk/TECHNICAL-ADHESIVE-SUPER-GLUE-RINGS/dp/B006E8PR3C

If your Sub cone still moves when playing music, then it just needs an 8" refoam kit.
If it doesn't move at all then it needs replacing.
I used the DaytonAudio replacement and it works and sounds great. Just requires a bit of modification to the plastic brackets that hold the Sub.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Dayton-Audio-SD215A-88-DVC-Subwoofer/dp/B0045UY7M8
 

HI George can your subwoofer be replaced from the top or is it seats out job?

[ciao_chao]

On 4/6/2021 at 9:11 AM, messi said:

If the air struts are okay, then it could be the rear height sensors at fault

Just about to mention this. Also a new LS430 owner here, and when doing my research on these, I did read or watch about there being some way to readjust the height/recalibrate the height. Its about 13 minutes into the clip.

 

[PhiL_P]

1 hour ago, cruisermark said:

HI George can your subwoofer be replaced from the top or is it seats out job?

I've researched this one and found you can do it from the top but only if you cut into the shelf section around the speaker opening, however it's the section hidden by the speaker grill so a personal decision if you'd prefer to avoid and remove the seats.

[Mikaelse]

On 4/9/2021 at 3:31 PM, BigBoomer said:

Undoubtedly those brand new coil springs and dampers are better than 18 year old worn out air suspension. 😁
Not really a fair comparison.

I was comparing 98/00 coil sprung LS400s vs 2001/2004 air sprung LS430s, all on original factory supplied springs & shocks and all under 100k miles.

I think that my 1998 LS400 air suspension works just fine. I have 17" inch wheels. Used to have 235/50 tires but now have 225/55 on and that feels fine. 
Leans very little when cornering and damping is still good after 124 kmiles . Feel no need to change them as long as they stay leak free.   

[BigBoomer]

20 hours ago, cruisermark said:

HI George can your subwoofer be replaced from the top or is it seats out job?

I did mine by cutting the parcel shelf under the cover and pulling it out that way.
Took me an afternoon but I was taking my time.
You'll need a Dremel type tool to cut away some of the U shaped bits on the plastic bracket to get the Dayton to fit.
I added a lot of draught excluder to replace the crumbling foam that stops the bracket from hitting the metal.
The longest part of the job was cleaning off the old remnants of foam from the bracket.

Test it before you bolt it in as a couple of people have had problems with one of the coils not being marked correctly, so they ended up with very little output as one coil was fighting the other coil, rather than working with it. The fix for that is easy, just reverse the wiring on one side.

At first mine gave a little too much bass so I had to drop the bass adjuster on the screen by one mark.
Now that it's had time to mellow, I run the bass back at the middle marker (same for mid & high) and it sounds OEM.

A friend commented the other day, when listening to some early Genesis (CD) in a car park, that it sounded better than his home HiFi. 
Apart from the poor speaker foam issue, I like the ML system.

These are the only pics I took. They show the finished article just prior to bolting it back into the car.

[cruisermark]

Thanks george - mine is fine so far but atleast I know what to do should the need arise

[PhiL_P]

All four door speakers now removed, and as suspected all four foams were shot. Fronts repaired and ready to go back in but for the rear having trouble identifying the correct replacement speaker foam size.

Has anyone successfully repaired their rear door speakers?

Also to update on my other to-do tasks, new (used) motor ordered for rear o/s seat, new brake shoes purchased (yet to fit), new front lower suspension arm rear bushes purchased (yet to fit), and new (used) rear door window glass ordered (not going to try this one myself having researched, debating best place to take it)

Also to add, discovered one front and one rear map reading light bulb out. Upon trying to buy replacements discovered they only seem to be available from Toyota/Lexus strangely (BA9S 8w, could only find 4w on general sale)

[BigBoomer]

There are dimensions on the images on this US speaker foam kit.
https://www.simplyspeakers.com/2001-2004-lexus-ls430-speaker-foam-edge-repair-kit-fsk-ls430.html
Looks like 4" or 4.25" may do the trick if you have the ML system and the rear speakers are the 4" speaker with the separate tweeter in a 6" mount.

[PhiL_P]

On 5/5/2021 at 10:09 AM, BigBoomer said:

There are dimensions on the images on this US speaker foam kit.
https://www.simplyspeakers.com/2001-2004-lexus-ls430-speaker-foam-edge-repair-kit-fsk-ls430.html
Looks like 4" or 4.25" may do the trick if you have the ML system and the rear speakers are the 4" speaker with the separate tweeter in a 6" mount.

Thanks BigBoomer. I did purchase 4" but discovered they're too small. Seems sizes between the round numbers are not widely available frustratingly.

Disappointed to report I refitted my repaired front speakers to find little improvement despite the fact they were clearly blown. I'm baffled by the issue, but now wondering whether it could be a problem with the amp or possibly due to the aftermarket Bluetooth system which is fitted (IO Play) which apparently actually includes its own amp and also seems to be wired to the speakers independently of the head unit (when streaming music via BT it overrides the head unit output, but only seems to output from some of the speakers). I'm going to try locating the hidden gubbins to try disconnecting to see if that makes any difference.

[BigBoomer]

On 5/6/2021 at 10:22 AM, PhiL_P said:

Thanks BigBoomer. I did purchase 4" but discovered they're too small. Seems sizes between the round numbers are not widely available frustratingly.

Disappointed to report I refitted my repaired front speakers to find little improvement despite the fact they were clearly blown. I'm baffled by the issue, but now wondering whether it could be a problem with the amp or possibly due to the aftermarket bluetooth system which is fitted (IO Play) which apparently actually includes its own amp and also seems to be wired to the speakers independently of the head unit (when streaming music via BT it overrides the head unit output, but only seems to output from some of the speakers). I'm going to try locating the hidden gubbins to try disconnecting to see if that makes any difference.

If there is a 2nd amp wired in parallel to the speakers, that will lead to clipping which will sound like distortion, even if the 2nd amp is switched off.
Effectively the ML amp will have been seeing an 8ohm speaker in parallel with an 8 ohm output stage so it will have been driving into 4 ohms which will cause the output stage in the ML amp to overdrive and clip the audio signal. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clipping_(audio)
You will need to disconnect the wires that connect from that 2nd amp to the speakers.

Having said that, I'm pretty certain that the IO Play wires into the ML system as an input, unless someone used it to drive a separate amp.