Electronic Bullying

[Steve Oliver]

There is no setting to enable auto locking when leaving the vehicle. Period.

[Grumps]

There could be a simple explanation here. If you walk away with the key in your pocket and by some chance the lock button on the key catches something, then if the car is in range the car will lock.

[Las Palmas]

If the key is taken out of the while engine is still running it beeps.

If engine is stopped and key is away from the car (different detection range for keys, maybe depending on state of Battery in the key) and outside the detection range the car lock and alarm is on. Suppose the interior surveillance is possible to disable, but for us it is not interesting as we have no pets and would definitely never let our little one inside the car while not being there.

In my eyes it is good that door locks and alarm is engaged when key is outside detection range, so considering that as a positive for Lexus.

May be different to other than the CT200H Luxury 2016 bought in Spain, but have never been in other cars from Lexus. Have had a Supra 3.0 1986, MR2 1988, MR2 Roadster 2003 and none of these had factory alarm. Had to have one installed as a car without alarm is more expensive insured.

Lexus is a premium brand in my eyes.

[ColinBarber]

5 hours ago, Las Palmas said:

In my eyes it is good that door locks and alarm is engaged when key is outside detection range, so considering that as a positive for Lexus.

UK vehicles don't do this. Certainly no 200h.

[Las Palmas]

First day with the car I went into a shop, key in my pocket. My wife was in the car. Of course, I did not lock. After a while the alarm started.

Expecting that an alarm will only be activated with doors locked, so that is what I thought and still think.

[royoftherovers]

46 minutes ago, Las Palmas said:

First day with the car I went into a shop, key in my pocket. My wife was in the car. Of course, I did not lock. After a while the alarm started.

 

Expecting that an alarm will only be activated with doors locked, so that is what I thought and still think.

 

John, what does your Handbook say about setting the alarm please ?

[Las Palmas]

10 hours ago, royoftherovers said:

John, what does your Handbook say about setting the alarm please ?

Nothing useful.

First car I have ever bothered reading in the handbook. And as expected found nothing in there.

Have seen somewhere in this forum that the ultrasonic part can be switched off, but cannot find that in the handbook. Many handbooks are written by people that either know nothing of what they write, and more are written by people that believe the readers of handbooks know what they need to know before reading the handbooks.

 

[Steve Oliver]

1 hour ago, Las Palmas said:

Nothing useful.

First car I have ever bothered reading in the handbook. And as expected found nothing in there.

Have seen somewhere in this forum that the ultrasonic part can be switched off, but cannot find that in the handbook. Many handbooks are written by people that either know nothing of what they write, and more are written by people that believe the readers of handbooks know what they need to know before reading the handbooks.

 

Page 92 of the manual I've got... 

[Las Palmas]

The handbook is spreading info over so many places that it is not easy to search for one thing and get complete answer to anything.

Searching for alarm there is no mentioning of any ultrasonic cabin surveillance.

When searching for ultrasonic I get this:

Do not get the keys wet or wash them in an ultrasonic washer etc.

People who made this manual seems to mention things randomly and when being told they have forgot something they do not place it where it should have been using logic. Or maybe the handbook is translated to English using Google.

And info about US is more complete than EU versions (except Nato Germany? Whatever that is) Is there a Germany outside Nato?

For vehicles sold in the U.S.A., Hawaii, Guam, Puerto Rico and NATO Germany

*: For U.S. mainland and NATO Germany only

The handbook is as bad as the car is good.

Luckily it is not necessary to read the handbook to drive the car and like it.

[ColinBarber]

Not sure what manual you have but the UK one has all parts related to the Theft Deterrent System all in one place including the section on the Intrusion movement sensor.

There would be no reason for 'ultrasonic' to be mentioned. This is an owners manual, the owner doesn't need to know if the sensor uses microwaves or ultrasonic or any other form of detection - just that it detects movement within the vehicle and you have the ability to override it if you have something leave in the vehicle that moves or you want to keep the windows down.

[stephschad]

45 minutes ago, Las Palmas said:

And info about US is more complete than EU versions (except Nato Germany? Whatever that is) Is there a Germany outside Nato?

 

For vehicles sold in the U.S.A., Hawaii, Guam, Puerto Rico and NATO Germany

 

*: For U.S. mainland and NATO Germany only

 

Just for clarification: NATO Germany refers to cars, sold to US military personnel stationed in Germany.

[ColinBarber]

14 minutes ago, stephschad said:

Just for clarification: NATO Germany refers to cars, sold to US military personnel stationed in Germany.

and of US specification, not European.

[Las Palmas]

12 hours ago, stephschad said:

Just for clarification: NATO Germany refers to cars, sold to US military personnel stationed in Germany.

That kind of choice of words is one reason I think they have used Google or another slightly inaccurate electronic translator from Japanese to English.

[Las Palmas]

16 hours ago, ColinBarber said:

Not sure what manual you have but the UK one has all parts related to the Theft Deterrent System all in one place including the section on the Intrusion movement sensor.

There would be no reason for 'ultrasonic' to be mentioned. This is an owners manual, the owner doesn't need to know if the sensor uses microwaves or ultrasonic or any other form of detection - just that it detects movement within the vehicle and you have the ability to override it if you have something leave in the vehicle that moves or you want to keep the windows down.

Downloaded this from UK Lexus web site: CT200h_OM_OM76216E_(EE).

Never bothered to read the Spanish.

English is my 3^rd. language and Spanish is my 7^th. So English is what I prefer as I have found no Danish, and I believe I understand most of what is written in English. If we live long enough, we can learn and work with many things, even if we are not geniuses.

With regard to the idea of “a user does not need to understand if a cabin is looked over by a microwave or ultrasonic system”, I find that correct, but I think that all matters concerning how to use the alarm should be in one place and not spread around in the manual. Just like many other single items are in the manual.

Another thing is that I never knew that microwave would be used detecting movements in a car cabin; have been working with car electronics more than 10 years. Microwaves can be dangerous and should be used for heating things and not human brains. I believe (but do not know) that the radar system in our cars use microwave detection, but that is outside the car and outside cars are many other dangerous things.

I do not know if this is a good or bad kit: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Car-Blind-Spot-Monitoring-BSM-Radar-Detection-System-Ultrasonic-Sensor-Assistant-/264365482820 but I know that ultrasonic systems are able to do many things and I believe ultrasonic waves are far less dangerous than microwave rays.

 

 

[ColinBarber]

1 hour ago, Las Palmas said:

Another thing is that I never knew that microwave would be used detecting movements in a car cabin; have been working with car electronics more than 10 years. Microwaves can be dangerous and should be used for heating things and not human brains. I believe (but do not know) that the radar system in our cars use microwave detection, but that is outside the car and outside cars are many other dangerous things.

Most interior sensors in Lexus vehicles are microwave. Ultrasonic needs line of sight and therefore the sensors are visible which isn't desirable and therefore microwave sensors are normally used. Given that they detect movement, they wouldn't normally be on when a living thing is inside the vehicle but the power level isn't high enough to be a problem anyway.

I guess it depends on your definition of microwave. I take it as being 1 GHz or above, until you reach the infrared spectrum. Within that you have the S band where you have a microwave oven operating at 2.4 GHz which is dangerous but WiFi and Bluetooth also operate at the same frequency but at power levels that aren't dangerous.

 

Parking sensors on the bumpers are ultrasonic (visible), but the side/rear traffic sensors are microwave (behind the rear bumper/wing).

[NemesisUK]

My understanding has always been that interior motion sensors are ultrasonic in the 100+kHz and the radar cruise sensor was in the 20+GHz range

Microwaves are line of sight, ultrasonics diffract round obstacles  

[ColinBarber]

Microwaves bounce, that is how your food heats up inside a microwave oven. WiFi uses multiple Tx/Rx (MIMO) to make use of reflections to help improve signal to noise ratio.

 

This info is from the RX450h but similar to other models:

Intrusion Sensor (Models with Intrusion Sensor)

1. An intrusion sensor is provided in the map light assembly.

2. The intrusion sensor detects any intrusion into the vehicle interior and transmits a warning signal to the main body ECU (multiplex network body ECU).

3. This sensor transmits radiowaves at 24.5 GHz in the vehicle interior. When an intruding object moves, in disrupts the reflection of the radiowaves, and the senor detects the resulting changes in the phase of the radiowaves.