Proud owner of CT200H 2013

Mr.Ahmed · August 30, 2020

Hi all,

New member here, I'm now a proud owner of a Lexus CT200H 2013. My first ever Lexus and first ever Hybrid, had it for about a week now and it drives absolutely amazing.

I was wondering if it's worth getting the 7 year service done by Lexus and the Hybrid health check. My closest dealership is the Hayes branch in Greater London followed by the Edgware Road branch in Central London.

Any thoughts or previous experiences with the above two branches would be much appreciated.

Thanks

steve2006 · August 30, 2020

Hi Zakaria and welcome to the LOC.

Good to hear you are happy with your first Lexus, sorry can’t help with the dealers you mention but if you are planning on keeping the car a FLSH isn’t a necessity, have the yearly hybrid check done at Lexus and find a good local independent garage for servicing. You will save both in travel and money.

Herbie · August 30, 2020

8 hours ago, Mr.Ahmed said:

New member here, I'm now a proud owner of a Lexus CT200H 2013. My first ever Lexus and first ever Hybrid, had it for about a week now and it drives absolutely amazing

Hi Zakaria and welcome to the club.

I hate to 'blow my own trumpet' as it were but given that this is your first hybrid, you may find the fourth post in the following topic helpful because they are certainly different to a conventional car:

Mr.Ahmed · August 31, 2020

22 hours ago, steve2006 said:

Hi Zakaria and welcome to the LOC.

Good to hear you are happy with your first Lexus, sorry can’t help with the dealers you mention but if you are planning on keeping the car a FLSH isn’t a necessity, have the yearly hybrid check done at Lexus and find a good local independent garage for servicing. You will save both in travel and money.

Hi Steve,

Thanks for the advice, that's what I was thinking tbh. The car already has FLSH so was in two minds about continuing that. Plus when you take it for servicing at places you don't trust they could try ramping up the works and prices so would prefer going to my local garage.

14 hours ago, Herbie said:

Hi Zakaria and welcome to the club.

I hate to 'blow my own trumpet' as it were but given that this is your first hybrid, you may find the fourth post in the following topic helpful because they are certainly different to a conventional car:

Hi Herbie,

Thanks for the advice, I read your post as well, brilliant advice. I used to have a Honda Accord before the Lexus and there was a short circuit somewhere where I had to keep jump starting it if I left it on the driveway for 2 days or more. Fortunately I bought a jump starter pack 2 years ago and still carry it in my boot just in case, fingers crossed, I won't have to use it on the Lexus.

A friend of mine also has a Lexus CT200H and he told me all about the regen braking and how to drive the car correctly to get optimum use out of the traction Battery.

Quick question, how come you can jump start a hybrid with a conventional car but not the other way round?

steve2006 · August 31, 2020

Hybrids use the traction Battery for starting the petrol engine not the 12 volt Battery so the Battery is just for powering up the computers and not sufficient to jump start a conventional car.

Mr.Ahmed · August 31, 2020

1 hour ago, steve2006 said:

Hybrids use the traction battery for starting the petrol engine not the 12 volt battery so the battery is just for powering up the computers and not sufficient to jump start a conventional car.

Oh right, I see, thanks for clarifying.

Herbie · August 31, 2020

Not to say that Steve is wrong, but he's not quite correct 🙂

The 12V Battery in a hybrid is of a low capacity but even so, it's quite capable of jump starting a conventional car on its own.

A conventional car's starter motor can draw more than 300A when cranking the engine, whereas my RX450h takes less than 20A to achieve READY mode, which is our equivalent of the engine running. Toy/Lex thought that it was an opportunity to save a bit of money - why put a big, beefy Battery in there if all we need is less than 20A? Decent reasoning I suppose, but the downside is that it goes flat quicker.

Even being of a low capacity it's still more than capable of supplying the 300A or more for a conventional starter motor - the problem comes when it can't supply enough.

The 12V Battery of a conventional car is used only for cranking the engine. Once the engine fires and the alternator is producing electricity, the alternator takes over the duty of supplying the electrical needs of the car. If the flat Battery wants to draw, say, 400A but the donor car Battery can't supply that much, the alternator will 'top it up' to provide the extra current, which is all fine and dandy because alternators can output hundreds of Amps - but our hybrids don't have alternators!

The 12V Battery in our hybrids is charged up by a DC/DC converter. This is a box of electronic wizardry that takes the approx. 300V from the hybrid (traction) Battery and drops it to about 14.5V. This DC/DC converter isn't capable of providing hundreds of Amps; it was never designed to do that.

So, if the 12V Battery in the hybrid car isn't up to scratch and can't provide enough power to the flat Battery, it will try to draw the extra power from the DC/DC converter. Hopefully, some current-limiting circuitry will prevent that from happening but if it doesn't then there's likely to be a big bang and an escape of the magic smoke that makes the converter work, followed by lots of tears and an empty wallet :wacko:

royoftherovers · August 31, 2020

31 minutes ago, Herbie said:

Not to say that Steve is wrong, but he's not quite correct 🙂

The 12V battery in a hybrid is of a low capacity but even so, it's quite capable of jump starting a conventional car on its own.

A conventional car's starter motor can draw more than 300A when cranking the engine, whereas my RX450h takes less than 20A to achieve READY mode, which is our equivalent of the engine running. Toy/Lex thought that it was an opportunity to save a bit of money - why put a big, beefy battery in there if all we need is less than 20A? Decent reasoning I suppose, but the downside is that it goes flat quicker.

Even being of a low capacity it's still more than capable of supplying the 300A or more for a conventional starter motor - the problem comes when it can't supply enough.

The 12V battery of a conventional car is used only for cranking the engine. Once the engine fires and the alternator is producing electricity, the alternator takes over the duty of supplying the electrical needs of the car. If the flat battery wants to draw, say, 400A but the donor car battery can't supply that much, the alternator will 'top it up' to provide the extra current, which is all fine and dandy because alternators can output hundreds of Amps - but our hybrids don't have alternators!

The 12V battery in our hybrids is charged up by a DC/DC converter. This is a box of electronic wizardry that takes the approx. 300V from the hybrid (traction) battery and drops it to about 14.5V. This DC/DC converter isn't capable of providing hundreds of Amps; it was never designed to do that.

So, if the 12V battery in the hybrid car isn't up to scratch and can't provide enough power to the flat battery, it will try to draw the extra power from the DC/DC converter. Hopefully, some current-limiting circuitry will prevent that from happening but if it doesn't then there's likely to be a big bang and an escape of the magic smoke that makes the converter work, followed by lots of tears and an empty wallet

So Herbie, the essence of your seven paragraphs is.......do NOT attempt it as it`s not worth the risk?

Herbie · August 31, 2020

24 minutes ago, royoftherovers said:

So Herbie, the essence of your seven paragraphs is.......do NOT attempt it as it`s not worth the risk?

Haha, why use one paragraph when seven is better :laughing:

Seriously though John, no, I would never risk it.

Some people have tried it and got away with it and I suppose every case could be different depending on how flat the recipient Battery is.

It really could be a very expensive risk though, so I would definitely not take it.

Mr.Ahmed · August 31, 2020

1 hour ago, Herbie said:

Haha, why use one paragraph when seven is better

Seriously though John, no, I would never risk it.

Some people have tried it and got away with it and I suppose every case could be different depending on how flat the recipient battery is.

It really could be a very expensive risk though, so I would definitely not take it.

Thanks for the detailed explanation Herbie.

I remember quite a few years back, my brother and I were at the petrol station and we needed a jump start. It was like 1am and the only other car around was a Toyota Prius, my brother asked the driver and he said he shouldn't jump start but as there were no other cars around he reluctantly did the jump start for us. Our car started up fine and the Prius seemed fine there and then.

Thackeray · August 31, 2020

2 hours ago, Herbie said:

Toy/Lex thought that it was an opportunity to save a bit of money - why put a big, beefy battery in there if all we need is less than 20A?

As always, Herbie's wide knowledge helps clarify these complicated areas. (Not sure that his explanation could have been much more succinct.)

Nonetheless, stand by for my quibble. I've puzzled over this money saving hypothesis before. So now's the time to raise my question. How do Toyota save money by installing an expensive AGM Battery, when they could have put in a cheap conventional flooded lead acid unit?

Maybe there was another reason. The design group might have said, "We don't need a big Battery just to provide 20 amps. So maybe we can get away with a less heavy Battery. Any saving in weight will improve fuel consumption. A smaller Battery might just push the car into a lower CO2 level and a correspondingly lower tax band."

Thackeray · August 31, 2020

49 minutes ago, Mr.Ahmed said:

I remember quite a few years back, my brother and I were at the petrol station and we needed a jump start. It was like 1am and the only other car around was a Toyota Prius, my brother asked the driver and he said he shouldn't jump start but as there were no other cars around he reluctantly did the jump start for us. Our car started up fine and the Prius seemed fine there and then.

All the more reason to always carry one of the portable jump starters. Not so much in case your Lexus doesn't start but in case you get asked to jump start someone else's conventional car at 1am with no-one else around. Then you can decline to risk your own car but the jump starter will get the other people started.

Incidentally, here's another follow on question for Herbie. Is it ok to jump start another Toyota/Lexus hybrid from your own Toyota/Lexus hybrid car? I'd guess that would be ok. Any thoughts?

Edit: I've clarified that this is a question about Toyota/Lexus hybrids. I think there are other makes of hybrids where there is a conventional starter motor starting the engine. These should obviously be treated as conventional cars and not jump started from a Toyota/Lexus hybrid.

Edited August 31, 2020 by Thackeray
Clarifying that the question is only about Toyota/Lexus hybrid cars.

Herbie · August 31, 2020

25 minutes ago, Thackeray said:

As always, Herbie's wide knowledge helps clarify these complicated areas. (Not sure that his explanation could have been much more succinct.)

Nonetheless, stand by for my quibble. I've puzzled over this money saving hypothesis before. So now's the time to raise my question. How do Toyota save money by installing an expensive AGM battery, when they could have put in a cheap conventional flooded lead acid unit?

Maybe there was another reason. The design group might have said, "We don't need a big battery just to provide 20 amps. So maybe we can get away with a less heavy battery. Any saving in weight will improve fuel consumption. A smaller battery might just push the car into a lower CO2 level and a correspondingly lower tax band."

Cheers William.

I have to confess that the money angle is just a guess on my part and you may well be correct.

24 minutes ago, Thackeray said:

Incidentally, here's another follow on question for Herbie. Is it ok to jump start another hybrid from your own hybrid car? I'd guess that would be ok. Any thoughts?

I'm not 100% sure but logic would say that yes, it's safe to jump start a hybrid from a hybrid because the recipient car will only need 20A or so to achieve READY mode. The donor car Battery should be more than capable of providing this on its own without having to rely on extra power from its DC/DC converter.

Mr.Ahmed · September 2, 2020

On 8/31/2020 at 5:41 PM, Thackeray said:

All the more reason to always carry one of the portable jump starters. Not so much in case your Lexus doesn't start but in case you get asked to jump start someone else's conventional car at 1am with no-one else around. Then you can decline to risk your own car but the jump starter will get the other people started.

Incidentally, here's another follow on question for Herbie. Is it ok to jump start another Toyota/Lexus hybrid from your own Toyota/Lexus hybrid car? I'd guess that would be ok. Any thoughts?

Edit: I've clarified that this is a question about Toyota/Lexus hybrids. I think there are other makes of hybrids where there is a conventional starter motor starting the engine. These should obviously be treated as conventional cars and not jump started from a Toyota/Lexus hybrid.

Agreed, that's why I always carry my jump starter pack in my boot and check it every month or so to make sure it's charged.

ThomasLexus94 · September 3, 2020

On 8/30/2020 at 9:18 AM, Mr.Ahmed said:

Hi all,

New member here, I'm now a proud owner of a Lexus CT200H 2013. My first ever Lexus and first ever Hybrid, had it for about a week now and it drives absolutely amazing.

I was wondering if it's worth getting the 7 year service done by Lexus and the Hybrid health check. My closest dealership is the Hayes branch in Greater London followed by the Edgware Road branch in Central London.

Any thoughts or previous experiences with the above two branches would be much appreciated.

Thanks

Congrats on your CT, its a great car! My dad got a '19 last year and is loving it (frequently getting over 50mpg)

Mr.Ahmed · September 7, 2020

On 9/3/2020 at 6:15 PM, ThomasLexus94 said:

Congrats on your CT, its a great car! My dad got a '19 last year and is loving it (frequently getting over 50mpg)

Thanks Thomas, 19 plate nice 👍

How much was it if you don't mind me asking?

Mpg is fantastic, I'm averaging around 56mpg

ThomasLexus94 · September 14, 2020

On 9/7/2020 at 11:56 AM, Mr.Ahmed said:

Thanks Thomas, 19 plate nice 👍

How much was it if you don't mind me asking?

Mpg is fantastic, I'm averaging around 56mpg

just over £27,000 he paid for it 🙂

ThomasLexus94 · September 14, 2020

On 9/7/2020 at 11:56 AM, Mr.Ahmed said:

Thanks Thomas, 19 plate nice 👍

How much was it if you don't mind me asking?

Mpg is fantastic, I'm averaging around 56mpg

Here is a video I made of his car last year if you wish to see his exact model?