2007 Lexus GS450H thoughts after 2 months of ownership

Rameez · March 7, 2020

Hi guys

Background

I bought my 2007 lexus gs450h in January.

For some context, I have been daily driving a honda s2000 for 5 years, and wanted something comfortable now.

The car has 48000 miles and is immaculate. It is silver on cream, I would have preferred black on cream or light grey but low mileage ones are few and far between or over priced.

Tech/options

It is the se-l as I wanted all the options, specifically radar cruise and the ml sound system. The sound system is fantastic. The lack of aux input is very frustrating, and there is no cheap or easy way of adding Bluetooth audio, I have Bluetooth for calls though. The radar cruise control only works from 29mph onwards. There is no option for it to help you crawl in stop start traffic. I also like the electric memory seats. The seats and leather are super soft and comfy. The climate control works fine. I have the screen off mostly as I don't like the outdated graphics, but the screen resolution is really good so it's a bit of a shame. The reversing camera is massively superior to parking sensors alone in my experience. The front parking sensors are woeful. They don't detect low objects that would destroy the lower bumper eg high kerbs even up to a foot high which is shocking considering how large and awful looking the parking sensors are. I love the keyless entry and start.

Fuel economy

I've averaged 30mpg on the motorway and less than 20 local. I don't think it will improve.

Hybrid system

I find that the hybrid system is more like a glorified stop start system, I love that when stationary or parking there is no engine noise etc and I like the torque fill at low speeds.

Performance

Official 0-60 is just under 6 seconds. The car doesn't feel very fast to me, although it is fast enough. This may be due to how well insulated the car is. The performance feels right for the size, and you can feel that you are hauling 2 tonnes at all times. The steering feels fine and is not too light. The brakes are quite different to conventional brakes because the first portion of brake pedal travel is regenerative and the more you press the more regen you get, after which the conventional brakes kick in. I do not notice the change but you can see the changes on the power dial. I love this feature as the cushiony regen braking makes for a more relaxing drive. Suspension is fine for the handling and size, the car doesn't roll too much and corners ok

Comfort

The car is nice and quiet, especially when the engine is off. The engine sounds rattly to start and quickly quietens down, but is never super quiet and not as refined as I expected from a petrol lexus engine. The 2.5 V6 in an is250 of the same vintage is much quieter in my experience. The seats are the softest I've ever experienced in a car and the leather is nice and soft. The armrest is reasonably soft and a good size. The steering wheel is nice to hold, it's a shame heated steering wheels weren't common back then, as its the only thing I can think that this car misses. The suspension is not as comfortable as I expected. I think this is purely down to the relatively low profile tyres on the 18 inch wheels (245/40/18). I will get 245/45/18 tyres next to remedy this and hopefully will correct the mpg and speed inaccuracy of 10%. Since my ownership I've done around 1000 miles and have developed 2 annoying interior rattles, probably due to the horrible road surfaces, 1 in the centre console which may well be rectifiable, but one in the rear passenger area that i can't find the source of as I am normally alone.

Overall impressions

Overall the car is fantastic and good value with plenty bells and whistles and all that I needed /wanted.

Britprius · March 8, 2020

I also had a rattle on the rear passengers side of the car when I bought mine. One day when filling with petrol I noticed the filler tube move, and make a metallic noise. To cure the movement I stretched an "O" ring over the fill tube, and this took up the play. On driving the car the rattle in the rear had gone.

Your MPG does seem a little on the low side. I find 35 MPG easy, but get more like 40/41 mpg on a regular 50 mile run on rural roads. I never use motorways as there are non in the area I live

John.

Rameez · March 8, 2020

Thanks for that, I will have a look at the filler tube. In all the cars I have I always get the lowest mpg of the range, so I'm not too surprised.

Lwerewolf · March 8, 2020

245/45/18 will rub according to reports, I think I've read that 235/45/18 are fine. Alternatively - the GS300/GS350 OEM 17'' wheels clear the 450h brakes (same as the 350/430/360 non-f-sport, stoptech bbk = 18''), and I have them as my winter set with 225/50/17 alpin 6. If a set of 17x8.5 volk ce28n shows up, I might jump and ditch the OEM rims... even though they look great 😞

The engine "idles" at 1000rpm, and the "higher pitch whine/noise" thing seems to be coming from the CVT - both the gs450h and ls600h have it, yet the is350/gs350/is-f/ls460/gs460 don't. FWD hybrids seem to lack it as well.

Steering wheel retrofits are possible.

The car is slower than the US version and has a higher max speed (270/275kph tested, not by me). Difference - different rear diff, 3.266 ratio EU vs 3.769 US/Japan. The EU gs430 diff is 3.6 or so, which should improve take-off performance noticeably. The 3.769 will have to be imported. If you're willing to modify the axles at the knuckle-ends, big flange diffs (with the axles) from supras/sc300/etc will fit. Look it up 🙂

MPG - I'm doing 28 during the winter, combined city/highway, rapid takeoffs but sticking to limits... mostly 😄

In case you hear a bang while entering a steep driveway or something: https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2012/SB-10060742-2280.pdf

...same symptoms on ours (and lots of other cars), I was looking for the source for so long... can't gear it on the outside at all but on the inside it sounds scary. In my case I loosened up the bolts holding the sunroof rails to the roof - spec is 5nm and there were signs of work on the car by... questionably qualified individuals, given the soldered wiring harness repairs that I noticed (rear window stoplight). The nuts that hold it to the studs coming from the roof are still tight, no leaks, etc.

Check out the front LCA big bushings mod - you can replace them with polyurethane ones or with the IS-F (hard rubber) or RC-F/GS-F (harder rubber) ones. The chassis are pretty similar - 2nd gen IS->3rd gen GS. The 4th gen GS/3rd gen IS haven't changed a lot at the front either.

https://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/track-tests/2011-lexus-is-f-suspension-walkaround.html

https://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/track-tests/2013-lexus-gs-350-f-sport-suspension-walkaround.html

I have a 2009 (1st facelift, actually manufactured 07/2008, MY2009 bs) and there is an aux port in the storage compartment under the armrest. A retrofit may be possible. Alternatively, and potentially better - bluetooth/aux adapters posing as CD changers. There's also the grom vline, but I'd read the threads here and elsewhere about it.

As always - https://www.toyodiy.com/ https://lexus-europe.epc-data.com/

Some 450h track footage: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCT7bVjsJ5Q13iWkJr13-c8g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QfK15NqkVVo

Have fun 😉

Rameez · March 10, 2020

Thanks for the detailed reply lwerewolf.

I'm glad re your confirmation that the 17s fit. But the ones available second hand on eBay cheaply are in shocking condition. I have read that on 245/45/18s the front left the rubs on full lock to the left, I think I can live with this.

I got used to the rat grey dash board instantly, plus have no intentions to modify, just service and enjoy.

Same with the acceleration or the way it drives , I have no intention of modifying, as I feel its totally fine as is, but thanks for the interesting info re gsf supra etc.

I started a thread re the Bluetooth and aux connectivity. There is a fairly cheap Bluetooth fix but I use the CD changer so wouldn't want to get rid, also have got used to it now and just getting by.

I do really like the car and it is comfy even with a child seat in the front which is what I needed.

LexIS200Sport · March 10, 2020

Nicely written review. Sometimes I wonder if the 3.5 V6 feels less refined than the 2.5 V6 because of the direct injection system (tappety-like noise).

On 3/7/2020 at 4:41 PM, Rameez said:

Fuel economy

I've averaged 30mpg on the motorway and less than 20 local. I don't think it will improve.

Hybrid system

I find that the hybrid system is more like a glorified stop start system, I love that when stationary or parking there is no engine noise etc and I like the torque fill at low speeds.

If you're achieving 20mpg town / 30mpg motorway, then the hybrid system would certainly feel like glorified stop-start 😛

Either that or HV batt is nearing EoL, but doubtful at such low miles.

Mossypossy · March 10, 2020

Couple of drives in on my new 450h.

Battery charge level moves from blue bars to yellow nearly full. It seems that car will drive at 30mph+ on electric only when bars are yellow.

Levels quickly sap when using electric, but then gets back up fairly quickly.

No idea of hybrid health. Got 32mpg on a trip into town and back.

Seem normal?

Britprius · March 10, 2020

1 hour ago, Mossypossy said:

Couple of drives in on my new 450h.

Battery charge level moves from blue bars to yellow nearly full. It seems that car will drive at 30mph+ on electric only when bars are yellow.

Levels quickly sap when using electric, but then gets back up fairly quickly.

No idea of hybrid health. Got 32mpg on a trip into town and back.

Seem normal?

It would be a good idea to get a hybrid health check from your nearest Lexus dealer. This is free with any service or cost about £60 as a stand alone item. It gives you a one year or 10,000 miles extension on the hybrid Battery guarantee. You can do this as many times a year as is required if you do a lot of miles, and can be carried on till the cars 15 th birthday.
You do not have to have the car serviced by Lexus, and you do not need a Lexus service history.

John.

Mossypossy · March 10, 2020

Will do.

Rameez · March 10, 2020

Mines had a Battery check very recently and it was all clear. It's probably just the way I drive.

Odysseus · March 10, 2020

Good on you for sharing your thoughts Rameez. I did something similar with my own GS450H.

Hope this link works.

Two years with a GS450
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/topic?share_fid=80750&share_tid=120121&share_pid=1095548&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Elexusownersclub%2Eco%2Euk%2F&share_type=t&link_source=app

In terms of the streaming from a phone, I just use a FM Bluetooth thing which is plugged in under the armrest so I don’t see it. Not perfect but works well, plus has USB charging for my phone.

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F264407118770

Your MPG is very similar to mine. I struggle to get more than late 20s mpg unless I’m on a motorway run and my typical mpg at the moment is mid 20s. I have a relatively heavy foot as it’s usually just me in the car so there’s no point dilly dallying, plus who buys a 340 bhp, two tonne saloon to be economical? [emoji846]

I respectfully disagree with you about the graphics on the display. They are fairly high res you’re right, and I find them neater and clearer than the fussy animations I’ve seen in the current Lexus cars I’ve driven.

I’m coming up on three years with my car, and I still really enjoy driving it and don’t have any regrets as such. That said the longer I have it the less I rate the CVT gearbox and while the car is fast you have to really mash the throttle to extract the power, and the handling doesn’t encourage you to press on. It’s a lovely car, but not a drivers’ car in the same way a BMW 5 Series is known to be.

Thanks again for sharing your views and please do keep us updated how you get on with the car.

Sent from my Iphone using Tapatalk

subman · March 10, 2020

The car is so quiet at times any small rattle annoy the hell out of me....the crazy insulation has its good and bad I suppose.

Another pointless benefit of the Battery is that you don't pay ULEZ in London which is quite a lot, you get all the performance but yet exempted

You MPG seems a bit off but if you drive it like you stole it (honey mood period) then thats not bad at all.

I finds the suspension a bit "floaty"...at times it feels like a boat

My 450h going in for my first ownership yearly servicing, loved the first year so far but my requirment really suited a BMW 330e plug in instead of 450h

In context my car history include Toyota Supra MK4 TT, E46 M3, BMW 4.4 x5, Range Rover with LPG, RX8 .........

Lwerewolf · March 10, 2020

There's almost no good service and reliability information on the other comparable hybrids out there - it's one of the reasons why I went with the lexus, other than it being something other than an x-speed auto with an electric motor in there somewhere. An atkinson v6 would've been nice for the economy, I guess.

Rameez · March 11, 2020

Thanks for the reply odysseus. I read your review before buying and it was very useful. I always research cars a lot if I'm buying them or not lol. There isn't that much about these cars as they aren't that common and are not typical petrol head cars, so I thought I'd add my opinions.

Fair enough re the screen, I was comparing it to slightly more modern German cars which I feel do it better, but might be a bit of an unfair comparison.

I don't really push the car through the corners etc, I respect that it is a huge barge, and for that I feel it does OK. Also I prefer cars that don't compromise eg between comfort and driving pleasure, so like cars like this where its excellent at one thing and useless at another over being mediocre at everything

I love the cvt, thought I would hate it, but it's seemless and to me feels like it suits the car. Maybe that will change with time like it has done for you.

Subman, you're probably right, the quietness of the car exacerbates the annoying noises, it's a no win situation. I sometimes drive it like I've stolen it lol. Really cool car history btw.

Lwerewolf, for me it was between a gs300 and this, so felt like a no brainer at the time.

Rameez · March 11, 2020

15 hours ago, LexIS200Sport said:

Nicely written review. Sometimes I wonder if the 3.5 V6 feels less refined than the 2.5 V6 because of the direct injection system (tappety-like noise).

If you're achieving 20mpg town / 30mpg motorway, then the hybrid system would certainly feel like glorified stop-start 😛

Either that or HV batt is nearing EoL, but doubtful at such low miles.

Thanks

Yeah it's that tappety noise.

Mossypossy · March 11, 2020

Has anyone successfully used the Dr Prius app to analyse hybrid Battery health on a 450h?

Or hooked up an obd reader to display on info screen?

Farqui · March 11, 2020

I've run the Hybrid Assistant a few times and although the information is very detailed it doesn't seem to easily show the health of the traction Battery. Or maybe I'm missing something?

The app has a specific traction Battery test but I haven't bothered as I have Lexus perform their annual health check (since it was extended to 15 years).

kim_gs · March 11, 2020

I've used it a couple of times, but haven't tested the hybrid Battery health yet.
But I did notice something interresting (worrying?) When I brake the Battery voltage easely increases to 380V (max). And if I do a hard acceleration, the voltage will drop well below 288V (250V if I remember correctly).
The Dr. Prius app display the voltages in red if this happens - I think it believes that something is wrong. I'm not sure that it is right, because I got a brand new Battery fitted from Lexus last year (May).
I think that it's just the characteristics of the larger Battery compared to fx. the Prius.
Can anybody comment on this?

Thx, Kim

Lwerewolf · March 11, 2020

dr. prius also shows a huge difference in voltage between modules during heavy current flow (full throttle or heavy regen). Not necessarily true or synchronized the way techstream is (if it is... but it has a separate data point called "difference highest->lowest" which I'm inclined to trust).

Battery health is measured by capacity anyways, so I'd look at how the voltage difference rises while the car is in neutral, with AC and all power-drawing accessories on. It will at least give you an indication of a potential impending failure of a module pair (voltage is measured at every two 6-cell modules combined). Overall pack voltage doesn't mean much.

Priuschat has plenty of discussion and info on this.