Future of the IS ??

[ghost_killer]

Ok, I know there been rumours and questions over the future of the IS, if there be a next gen or not,

What are your thoughts ? What with the influx of SUV's and sales of the IS gotten less and less in the USA, if you scroll to 4:43 on the youtube link, be a shame if it doesn't get replaced. Sounds like they are seeing how it goes in the USA - I remember when the first gen IS came out in 1998/99, wasn't that designed with Europe in mind specifically for Europeans ? Even though the first gen IS was sold in America and was not till 2001 when the car arrived in America ! So possibility there only be a ES and LS saloon left, GS is pretty much a goner just matter of time for anywhere else that is still for sale in my opinion. 

[Spottedlaurel]

Maybe the new NX will have enough of a price/specification spread to cater for IS buyers?

[Shada]

33 minutes ago, Spottedlaurel said:

Maybe the new NX will have enough of a price/specification spread to cater for IS buyers?

Certainly not! If you want a 4 door saloon to outshine the audi A4 with better style better comfort better reliability build quality and better performance then it's gona take an is to do it

[Spottedlaurel]

2 hours ago, Shada said:

Certainly not! If you want a 4 door saloon to outshine the audi A4 with better style better comfort better reliability build quality and better performance then it's gona take an is to do it

Lexus/Toyota, and indeed many other makers, don't seem willing to offer an alternative to the many options offered by Audi/BMW/Mercedes (and even Volvo, to an extent).

I'd love a big, practical, luxurious estate. The closest I could get was the RX I now have, but that's not as big as my previous Avensis in the back. I'd love to see them do an ES (or Camry) estate.

[MattK9797]

I hope not. I really do want to be able to consider a new model IS in around 3.5 years. Nothing wrong with SUVs if that's what you want. But I just don't.

[Shada]

32 minutes ago, MattK9797 said:

I hope not. I really do want to be able to consider a new model IS in around 3.5 years. Nothing wrong with SUVs if that's what you want. But I just don't.

Same as that. I like a car and have no need or want for  a suv. Wishful thinking would be to see a 4th gen is in the next year so I can buy a 2 two year old one in 3 years time! 

I don't have the need for new to justify the expense. 

[DanD]

It would be good to see a new IS as a viable alternative to Tesla's Model 3.

Sent from my Galaxy Note 10 Plus using Tapatalk

[ganzoom]

 

4 hours ago, DanD said:

It would be good to see a new IS as a viable alternative to Tesla's Model 3.

Sent from my Galaxy Note 10 Plus using Tapatalk
 

 

Quite shocking to see Lexus IS sales US is now sub 15K for the whole year, Tesla sold 158K Model 3s in the US this year following on from 139K year before. Given Lexus/Toyota's conservative approach to tech there is zero chance the IS can catch Model 3 sales in the US any time soon - if ever. 

Electrifying the next NX to compete with the Model Y is the best thing Lexus can do right now, but they better get a move on because all the signs are Tesla is on the verge of laughing the Y in the US for mass production before summer of this year. The NX/RX is what's keeping Lexus going at the moment, the Model Y will be a direct competitor in that market for both price, utility, and target consumers. 

Infact if Tesla call really pull of 7 seats in the Y and keep the price under control (ie not $100K+ like for the X) its going to cause carnage in the US premium SUV segment! 

 

 

[i-s]

But, as I posted in another thread on here... this is what toyota said in November. 

Jack Hollis, group vice-president and general manager of Toyota North America, laid it on the line: “We are continuously working on EV entries,” he said. “But right now, there’s no demand.”

No demand. If Toyota really believe this then the next IS, if there is one, will be another ICE hybrid and release into a drastically shrinking market. 

In 2020 I think there's a very good chance that Tesla, with their 3 models on sale, will sell more cars in Europe than Lexus with their 8 models. Certainly in the UK for 2020 the Model 3 alone will outsell all Lexus models combined.  And then the model Y...

 

[ghost_killer]

20 hours ago, Spottedlaurel said:

Lexus/Toyota, and indeed many other makers, don't seem willing to offer an alternative to the many options offered by Audi/BMW/Mercedes (and even Volvo, to an extent).

I'd love a big, practical, luxurious estate. The closest I could get was the RX I now have, but that's not as big as my previous Avensis in the back. I'd love to see them do an ES (or Camry) estate.

I agree, just gotta see the choices offered by the german 3 and even engine options say on a IS, only 1 engine choice in UK now, same with the ES and ever since the diesel scandal I've noticed more petrol engined BMW's / Audi's and Mercs, not just talking about the hybrid ones, so would of thought even more of a reason for Lexus to continue with the non hybrid models instead of discontinuing them, it is kind of shame if the IS does get discontinued, I guess there are no Lexus station wagons as no one wants this type of car in the US anymore unlike back in the day.

 

7 hours ago, i-s said:

But, as I posted in another thread on here... this is what toyota said in November. 
 

 

No demand. If Toyota really believe this then the next IS, if there is one, will be another ICE hybrid and release into a drastically shrinking market. 

In 2020 I think there's a very good chance that Tesla, with their 3 models on sale, will sell more cars in Europe than Lexus with their 8 models. Certainly in the UK for 2020 the Model 3 alone will outsell all Lexus models combined.  And then the model Y...

 

While I think Tesla's are good looking cars - I didn't say I buy one !! lol I don't like the Model X even with the gull wing doors doesn't do it for me !! Well you heard about the quality issues on Tesla's ? Shocking is not the word !!

[i-s]

1 minute ago, ghost_killer said:

you heard about the quality issues on Tesla's ? Shocking is not the word !!

I drive one daily. It's absolutely fine and better than my previous Honda, Nissan and Volvo cars. 

[Macscrooge]

On 1/12/2020 at 10:03 PM, Spottedlaurel said:

Lexus/Toyota, and indeed many other makers, don't seem willing to offer an alternative to the many options offered by Audi/BMW/Mercedes (and even Volvo, to an extent).

I'd love a big, practical, luxurious estate. The closest I could get was the RX I now have, but that's not as big as my previous Avensis in the back. I'd love to see them do an ES (or Camry) estate.

I quite agree!  My RX was bought for much the same reasons. 

[ganzoom]

Lexus needs to get a move on with what ever they ate planning.....Time is ticking, the Model 3 has destroyed US saloon sales for everyone else (BMW shifted only 66k 3/4 series less than last year, despite it been a brand new model).

Lexus may not care about the IS, but the NX/RX makes up most of Lexus sales. At around £45k starting price the Y is pitched directly at the NX/RX. Add in 7 seater despite been smaller than a RX, bigger boot than a RX, 0-60 times NX/RXs can only dream off, 3p per mile fuel costs, the Y is likely to do the same in the SUV sector as the 3 to the saloon sector........

And its nearly here!!! The Y has already got California certification for sales to start, so I expect first US delivers are only weeks away. RHD deliveries will be 12-18 months behind, but I expect by Easter 2021 we'll be seeing the Y on UK roads, our IS would be 6 years by than, but compared to a Y its going to fell like its 60 years old!!

https://electrek.co/2020/01/13/tesla-model-y-carb-range-deliveries/

[Blisteringblue]

Been quoted 12 weeks lead time on a Model 3 Tesla from Lex Autolease.  If I can swing it as it's pretty expensive I will but I will most likely be moving to a PHEV this time (I swap in July) this is my 2nd IS300h but I won't be back again.   Infotainment aside (it's shocking) the Self Charging Hybrid is no longer a viable company car option as the CO2 BIK rates are through the roof now.   My first 300h was 12% we are approaching the mid 20%s now.   

[ganzoom]

And the Y is nearly here...You have to hope Lexus has a plan to counter it in the US this year!

https://electrek.co/2020/01/15/tesla-model-y-vins-appear-in-nhtsa-database-ahead-of-deliveries/

[rayaans]

The UX300e is also available to order 

[200h]

i had an email from lexus liverpool today asking if i wanted to buy another car

they included the new road tax banding from1st April based on the WLTP

testing and its quiet shocking look how much the road tax has gone up by for the NX & RX

where is the IS range has it now been dropped from the lexus line up.

Here's how the CO2 value change could affect you:

 

[rich1068]

That's astonishing. The RX I can sort of understand because it's a big petrol with a hybrid system to take the edge off. But the NX? Not too up on the newfangled models but isn't that just the vanilla 4 cylinder petrol hybrid?

[wharfhouse]

3 hours ago, rich1068 said:

That's astonishing. The RX I can sort of understand because it's a big petrol with a hybrid system to take the edge off. But the NX? Not too up on the newfangled models but isn't that just the vanilla 4 cylinder petrol hybrid?

Doesn't surprise me - the WLTP really shows how relatively poor SUV fuel consumption is - the old system could hide this due to the way the test was conducted but the WLTP really shows up the overall cars efficiency for the basically the same power train as a saloon. However this first year tax is buried in the initial purchase price so no-one will really notice paying it since subsequent years is the same flat rate for all cars regardless of emissions (other than the +£40k list price uplift). There was a recent report that said despite all the work on cleaner engines emissions are still rising due to the massive shift to less efficient SUVs. 

[rich1068]

Ah, so they're first year rates rather than ongoing rates. See? Told you I don't get these newfangled models 

[wharfhouse]

20 minutes ago, rich1068 said:

Ah, so they're first year rates rather than ongoing rates. See? Told you I don't get these newfangled models 

Yep - all petrol/diesel cars registered after April 2017 pay £145 per year regardless of emissions after the first year. Alternative fuel vehicles including hybrids, bioethanol and liquid petroleum gas cars registered after April 2017 pay £135 per year regardless of emissions after the first year. Zero emission (full BEV) cars pay nothing. However, you have to pay an extra £320 a year on these figures if you have a car (and accessories) with a ‘list price’ (the published price before any discounts) of more than £40,000. So even full BEV cars like Tesla have to pay £320 per year if their list price is over £40,000. For a Lexus with a list price over £40,000 you would therefore have to pay £455 per year - worth being very careful checking the list price including any additional packs/accessories if you are close to the £40,000 threshold... The additional £320 applies for 5 years from new and then reverts to the standard amount after that (benefiting buyers of older second hand cars).

[i-s]

35 minutes ago, wharfhouse said:

 So even full BEV cars like Tesla have to pay £320 per year if their list price is over £40,000. For a Lexus with a list price over £40,000 you would therefore have to pay £455 per year - worth being very careful checking the list price including any additional packs/accessories if you are close to the £40,000 threshold... The additional £320 applies for 5 years from new and then reverts to the standard amount after that (benefiting buyers of older second hand cars).

Slight clarification... the £320 per year applies for 5 years, but it's years 2-6 of the car's life. 

First year: Showroom tax/first year tax/etc

2-6: LCT (luxury car tax) + VED

So, my Model 3 has so far cost me zero VED because its first year rate is 0 as a ZEV. But later this year I'll have to pay its first LCT when it reaches 1  year old. 

Another entertaining wrinkle with this is that the second owner of a car must pay LCT immediately. In other words, if you buy a model 3 from a speculator who bought it to immediately resell at a profit then you'll have to pay LCT when you register the car in your name. 

[rich1068]

Cars registered before March 2001. They're the future 

I'll be honest, I was oblivious to all that. That's where years of leasing and then buying bangers gets you.

[JamesIS220]

I also like estates and so bought a Toyota Auris hybrid estate. As it's a 2015 model its RFL is £0. Who knows if it will rise, but a big draw and hopefully 60mpg. It certainly isn't luxurious like a top spec Lexus, but hope it serves me well.

I have driven old cars since passing my test. All old Volvo estates 1986 740GLE for 5 years. 1989 240 for 10 years. current 1996 940 for 3 years. All daily drivers and reliable.

James

[dutchie01]

Interesting article in Carbuzz.com today with the header  - Teslas biggest threat could be Toyota -.

last year sales of toyotas hybrid vehicles increased by 28.7% in the US while lexus hybrid sales rose by 43.1%. Toyota sold a grand total of 274,550 hybrids in the US in 2019. To compare, Tesla sold about 200,000 vehicles in the US last year. Toyota offers non hybrid versions of its most powerful cars but customers are opting for the hybrids in droves.

makes you think... 

Another bombshell in the EV world made public today. In Holland the Ionity company ( high speed chargers in highway petrolstations) announced an increase in price valid as from today. The average price to charge your batteries to full was about 8 euro to full. This is going to forty seven ( 47 ) euro .....