Isf 08/09 vs 2010+ differences.

Ste.Daley · January 8, 2020

So I'm looking at purchasing an isf as for me it seems the best of the type of v8 saloon especially at the price.

However there's a large difference between the prices of the 08/09 cars vs the 2010+ cars.

I've found various differences but I can't seem to find a comprehensive list of the changes between the two to accommodate the vast difference in price.

Can anyone help?

Thanks

Cactus · January 8, 2020

I think the main change from 2010+ is the addition of LSD, which may or may not be something you want depending on what you use the car for.

after that the other thing of note is suspension, with the most significant change in 2012/13 as lexus used different shocks altogether. again, everyone has different standard and expectation of ride quality in a performance car, you should test drive if possible/available to get a feeling. Or alternatively, you can always upgrade the suspension/coilovers in the earlier model. (I have the 2010 model, its fine in my opinion... for now anyway).

Bear in mind 2011+ models are increasingly rare. Someone will probs come out and correct me with the exact figures. i think there are less than 30 of them about whereas there are more 2008-2010 models abt.

Barry

Charliecloud · January 8, 2020

If you look at the taxed & sorn listings for the IS F then there are a little over 200 ( 214 Q3 2019 ) cars showing up.

Of these around 90 are registered as 2010 + cars.

However a lot of MY2009 are on 2010 plates which skew the figures of MY2010 + model) .

Easiest visual checks are blue section to bottom of steering wheel on a 2010 MY car. 2011+ MY cars have LED daytime lights built into headlight.

All UK Ultra Sonic Blue cars are MY2010 built cars.

The attached lists the changes by MY

Don't get too hung up on the year of the car. Condition and a file of Invoices for servicing is likely to be a better proposition.

IS-F v1.pdf

Womble72 · January 8, 2020

8 hours ago, Charliecloud said:

If you look at the taxed & sorn listings for the IS F then there are a little over 200 ( 214 Q3 2019 ) cars showing up.

Of these around 90 are registered as 2010 + cars.

However a lot of MY2009 are on 2010 plates which skew the figures of MY2010 + model) .

Easiest visual checks are blue section to bottom of steering wheel on a 2010 MY car. 2011+ MY cars have led daytime lights built into headlight.

All UK Ultra Sonic Blue cars are MY2010 built cars.

The attached lists the changes by MY

Don't get too hung up on the year of the car. Condition and a file of Invoices for servicing is likely to be a better proposition.

IS-F v1.pdf 140.06 kB · 6 downloads

The later ones are also euro V engines as the emissions were tweaked (not enough to change the taxation brackets) the 2008/09 are the faster 0-60 of a huge 0.2 secs 😂.....I’ve always said red Is the fastest colour 😂😂.......on a serious note I can’t compare, I’m LED to believe unless u plan to track the car and to a decent standard then the difference is irrelevant as far as LSD goes, the main point I’m LED to believe is the suspension revision which was needed due to our poor road conditions 😂.......I’ve a 2008 and the suspension isn’t an issue tbh BUT I’ve also not been in a later one to compare

gb1600e · January 8, 2020

I test drove a red 2011 ISF and can confirm it was fast so @Womble72 must be right. 🤣 It was in shabby condition so I kept looking and in the end i bought a white 2009 ISF because despite higher mileage it was a much better car. Do I miss all the things it doesn't have? No. And now I know its 0.2s quicker AND the best colour... WHITE whats not to like.😉

Ste.Daley · January 9, 2020

Thanks Guys,

a big help tbh as i can't really see why the price varies so much pre and post 2010.

Ill be using the car as a daily driver, so history will be key, and mileage is never an issue if its been looked after. Most likely a 08/09 with around 70-100k miles will sort me out really, don't want to ruin a low miler! Invoices always are worth their weight i gold!

the LSD change wont make a huge difference to me, but the suspension could probably do with updating if its very hard. What upgrade options do people normally go for?

In terms of upgrading the Infotainment system, is there a common route to go? Id love some sort of tablet/android auto integration but if not i can just integrate a tablet separately.

Womble72 · January 9, 2020

5 hours ago, Ste.Daley said:

Thanks Guys,

a big help tbh as i can't really see why the price varies so much pre and post 2010.

Ill be using the car as a daily driver, so history will be key, and mileage is never an issue if its been looked after. Most likely a 08/09 with around 70-100k miles will sort me out really, don't want to ruin a low miler! Invoices always are worth their weight i gold!

the LSD change wont make a huge difference to me, but the suspension could probably do with updating if its very hard. What upgrade options do people normally go for?

In terms of upgrading the Infotainment system, is there a common route to go? Id love some sort of tablet/android auto integration but if not i can just integrate a tablet separately.

I don’t think there is a software update for the early ones, there is a map update BUT that won’t give full postal codes on the system, the early ones won’t even allow a contacts install from an Iphone 🙄.......can only input manually, I normally use my phone or garmin as navigation unless I’ve the full postcode.......obviously the in-house system doesn’t provide live updates either 😔

MNMJ · January 9, 2020

Watch out; there are a few MY2009 cars on 10 plates. Its not a problem if you know what to look for, but even some dealers get confused.

My view is that you'd have to be seriously tuned into the car to notice the difference in LSDs

Ste.Daley · January 10, 2020

18 hours ago, MNMJ said:

Watch out; there are a few MY2009 cars on 10 plates. Its not a problem if you know what to look for, but even some dealers get confused.

My view is that you'd have to be seriously tuned into the car to notice the difference in LSDs

I agree, which means i don't need it as much so 08/09 are more my range.

Ill keep an eye out.

Ste.Daley · January 10, 2020

19 hours ago, Womble72 said:

I don’t think there is a software update for the early ones, there is a map update BUT that won’t give full postal codes on the system, the early ones won’t even allow a contacts install from an iPhone 🙄.......can only input manually, I normally use my phone or garmin as navigation unless I’ve the full postcode.......obviously the in-house system doesn’t provide live updates either 😔

That doesn't bode well. Is there a system replacement? A few of the 130i that i looked at a while ago had a android system that could replace the idrive. Was hoping for something the same for lexus!

If not ill just buy a small android tablet and make my own version and mount it on the dash somewhere.

Womble72 · January 10, 2020

4 hours ago, Ste.Daley said:

That doesn't bode well. Is there a system replacement? A few of the 130i that i looked at a while ago had a android system that could replace the idrive. Was hoping for something the same for lexus!

If not ill just buy a small android tablet and make my own version and mount it on the dash somewhere.

As far as I’m aware that’s a no BUT if u find out anything different I’d be interested, I’m LED to believe the loom is different for the later system so it would require a complete new loom (not cheap) and not done to my knowledge.

good luck with your search n any update would be appreciated

Arqum · January 10, 2020

You can go down the GROM V-Line route and that will give you full android on the factory system

F.A. · January 10, 2020

I think someone on here has fitted a similar system to this to his ISF.

https://www.phoenixautomotiveinc.com/products/10-4-tesla-style-android-navigation-radio-for-lexus-is-250-is-300-is-350-2005-2012

There are some YouTube videos of this in action. From what I remember, there were a few bugs but lots of functionality.

Irish ISF · January 26, 2021

I'm looking at getting a set of springs and dampers from a low milage 2011 car for my 2008. They are only costing me €280. Worthwhile upgrade? My own are on 58,000 miles now.

Womble72 · January 26, 2021

I’ve bought a set for my 08 from a low miler 2011, not fitted yet BUT told it does make a difference.....€280 is very good, I paid £350 for mine

Irish ISF · January 26, 2021

6 minutes ago, Womble72 said:

I’ve bought a set for my 08 from a low miler 2011, not fitted yet BUT told it does make a difference.....€280 is very good, I paid £350 for mine

I can't really go wrong at that price I suppose. I'll always have a spare set (originals) anyway if I keep the car long term.

Womble72 · January 26, 2021

I think the newer set up is cheaper than the original, like for like.....Labour costs to replace would probably work out dearer than replacing a faulty latter one......I’ve had mine coming up six years n still can’t see me parting.

Irish ISF · January 27, 2021

I was looking at also getting an LSD for this. I fitted a LSD to my old Alfa 156 v6 and it was the best upgrade I ever made. Totally changed the handling and power delivery of the car.

I see the official Drexler one is about £1500 + VAT. Are there other options out there?

scott-o · January 27, 2021

I watched an ISF review on Youtube the other day and it said to outright ignore the cars without the lsd in them, followed by some very mediocre driving 😂 Its infuriating that people are told such nonsense.

You can light the back end up, you can go sideways and the inside wheel doesnt just spin up like a typical open differential car, so the electronics are doing their bit on the none lsd cars fine. You can watch the 08 ISF in the video below leaving 11's at the end and happily going sideways spinning both the inside and outside tyres, not that anyone should be driving like that on the road or track anyway 😂

Also worth mentioning the LSD in the later cars is basically a soft LSD, its not a plate type but a helical gear one, basically works like an open differential until theres a slip difference then the helical gears oppose and allows more power to the wheel with more grip, they do work, i've fitted one to a car previously but its not like a proper plate type LSD. For a fast road car i cant see most being able to tell the difference, even on track the ISF is only tenths of a second behind the m3 and that has a better chassis and a plate lsd.

The only thing i wish my '58' plate had that the later models do is DAB. Some of the rest are 'nice to haves' but not worth the money for me. I bought on condition and history and happily saved myself a few K.

C.B · January 27, 2021

I made a similar choice. I was comparing an 80k mile 10 plate with a 35k mile 59 plate. The 10 plate was more expensive and in poorer condition. Driving back to back I really couldnt tell much difference in the suspension, it was very firm in both. Not that I wouldnt do suspenion the upgrade given the chance at a good price.

I will rarely if ever track the car and I dont think my driving skill is at the level to need the LSD so I opted for the 59 plate. Similar mileage, price etc I would 100% go for the later car but just to let people know I am in no way disappointed with the earlier model.

My decision was vindicated later when a fellow member told me he wouldnt feel safe pulling out of a junction into a gap full throttle in the wet in my non LSD car 🤔

4969_LXS · January 27, 2021

I don't see any major disadvantage with the 08-09 years compared to the 2010 onwards. Just some nice to haves, such as the LED running lights, black DAB radio with chrome surround. 2014 models had the F logo embossed on the headrest which is a nice touch but they're hen's teeth.

I think a few members have said on here before, if you buy an early car in good condition compared to a later car, the money saved can go towards aftermarket parts, more modern coil-over suspension, lower control arm bushes etc. I bought my 08 IS-F as it was the nicest example for sale at the time. As with Japanese philosophy, the later cars are more refined, early cars a more raw. The team behind the car only had a limited budget and couldn't do everything they wanted at once.

The LSD would really only be noticed on a track, I've had minor wheel slip issues on the road under full throttle in the wet with my 08 ISF, running Michelin PS4 all round, when they do slightly slip under full throttle, the car sorts itself out. I'm not lusting for an LSD.

As an example, the McLaren P1 has an open diff, utilising a more sophisticated E-Diff.

The IS-F has 20mm less tyre width on the front and back compared to the E92 M3 stock Vs stock, probably why it lost out slightly in the bends on the early models. Given equal tyres, I'd put money on the IS-F to be quicker.

Irish ISF · January 27, 2021

Interesting. The 156 had a 3.0 with 240bhp going through the front wheels and no traction control of any sort. You couldn't even put down a little bit of power in the wet without spinning the inside wheel up. I fitted a Quaife differential and it was like a different car. That said, I agree that I haven't noticed the back wheels spinning hugely but if I could get a reasonably priced differential like the Quaife unit I would. That only cost €700 I think. Its funny how different some peoples opinions on this are. A lot of people seem to totally ignore the IS Fs without the LSD. I'd like to hear from someone who has owned both or driven both extensively.