Twin turbo V8 engine on its way?

B1RMA · December 16, 2019

Rumours/press releases out at the moment about it, will the RCF/GSF go down this route too as well as the upcoming LC F.

Flytvr · December 16, 2019

Part of me wishes that they do. Only the other day I found myself on Autotrader looking at LC500 prices - yummy! However, I just couldn't go back to the shortfalls of the Lexus V8 - mainly lack of low down torque. So, a twin turbo V8 would get my attention.

On the other hand, I still believe that the actual engine / induction noise (not exhaust) from the NA Lexus V8 is blimin sublime.

noby76 · December 16, 2019

Sounds like BMW N63 engine might be making its way under a Lexus Bonnet..

Flytvr · December 16, 2019

Sounds like BMW N63 engine might be making its way under a Lexus Bonnet..

Shame they didn't go AMG. Good enough for me (and Aston Martin) 😁

Whatever they do, lets hope they don't use stupid augmentation like they do in the RC-F and GS-F!!

noby76 · December 16, 2019

Shame they didn't go AMG. Good enough for me (and Aston Martin) 😁

Whatever they do, lets hope they don't use stupid augmentation like they do in the RC-F and GS-F!!

is V8 even necessary? Nissans VR38DETT V6 engine still wipes its bum with with pretty much any V8 engines from the Germans. and even though i have never been lucky to drive a Nissan GTR, their V6 sounds awesome when they fly by you..

Flytvr · December 16, 2019

is V8 even necessary? Nissans VR38DETT V6 engine still wipes its bum with with pretty much any V8 engines from the Germans. and even though i have never been lucky to drive a Nissan GTR, their V6 sounds awesome when they fly by you..

See your point there Jeff.

Talking about V8 noise, an old school landrover drove past me the other day. RV8. Sounded absolutely epic. Following it was an E63. The Merc sounded tame in comparison! Sign of the times

MNMJ · December 16, 2019

6 hours ago, noby76 said:

Sounds like BMW N63 engine might be making its way under a Lexus Bonnet..

I can't see that being as reliable as a Lexus engine. If they go that way; I'm out

hockeyedwards · December 16, 2019

12 minutes ago, MNMJ said:

I can't see that being as reliable as a Lexus engine. If they go that way; I'm out

Amen.

B1RMA · December 16, 2019

7 minutes ago, MNMJ said:

I can't see that being as reliable as a Lexus engine. If they go that way; I'm out

I agree look at all the negative comments the new Supra has got, Lexus build some damn fine engines why they would bother shortcutting and going down the BMW route would be beyond me, I would definitely rule the LC F out if they did.

I like revving the N/A V8 in our cars, it and I can do it all day without the worry of premature engine failure something BMW can not proclaim. I had one of the first BMW M5's to come into the UK it cost as much as a house and I loved it but have never bothered with M cars since although I tried and loved a special order M3 V8 a while ago.

V8ORBUST · December 16, 2019

Lexus sticking a BMW unit under the bonnet....?

Defeats the point of buying a Lexus in the first place for me.

doog442 · December 16, 2019

4 hours ago, B1RMA said:

I agree look at all the negative comments the new Supra has got

What are the comments based on ? The B58 is a damned fine straight six that's been out for nearly five years without any issues of note and I understand Toyota have perfected it for the Supra. Trust me the BMW community are trying their hardest to break the thing without much success.

I'm currently driving one and if you could stick it in an IS or RC with a bit of Toyota Intervention I'd be all over it like a shot. :wink3: Its the sort of side step that might keep things ticking over for the few petrol heads clinging on to Lexus this side of the Atlantic.

Flytvr · December 16, 2019

https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/future-cars/a30243845/lexus-twin-turbo-v8-lc-f-nurburgring/

The-Acre · December 16, 2019

10 hours ago, noby76 said:

is V8 even necessary? Nissans VR38DETT V6 engine still wipes its bum with with pretty much any V8 engines from the Germans. and even though i have never been lucky to drive a Nissan GTR, their V6 sounds awesome when they fly by you..

Having driven a Nissan GTR, I have to say if I was into cars that required a neck brace when accelerating I wouldn't consider anything else, it was simply stunning!

B1RMA · December 16, 2019

17 minutes ago, doog442 said:

What are the comments based on ? The B58 is a damned fine straight six that's been out for nearly five years without any issues of note and I understand Toyota have perfected it for the Supra. Trust me the BMW community are trying their hardest to break the thing without much success.

I'm currently driving one and if you could stick it in an IS or RC with a bit of Toyota Intervention I'd be all over it like a shot. Its the sort of side step that might keep things ticking over for the few petrol heads clinging on to Lexus this side of the Atlantic.

Most of the comments I have read and watched, the latest 5th Gear team tested one and it seems most people think it's not got enough Supra stuff in it. I also read somewhere that there was a recall in the USA for the Supra I admit I don't know the true facts. I think a lot of the negative comments came from the fact that the initial car in concept was fabulous looking. Then when it arrived in the flesh a general mood of disappointment was noted.

Malc · December 17, 2019

21 hours ago, Flytvr said:

Talking about V8 noise,

absolutely just about zero noise from the V8 tried and tested Ls400 however, like hearing sheep munching grass at 50 mtrs ☺️

Malc

noby76 · December 17, 2019

12 hours ago, B1RMA said:

Most of the comments I have read and watched, the latest 5th Gear team tested one and it seems most people think it's not got enough Supra stuff in it. I also read somewhere that there was a recall in the USA for the Supra I admit I don't know the true facts. I think a lot of the negative comments came from the fact that the initial car in concept was fabulous looking. Then when it arrived in the flesh a general mood of disappointment was noted.

deep down i think they may have regretted the decision of using BMW engine in the new Supra even though it was a co development by both manufactures to keep development costs down. now that's not me saying Germans cannot build engines but i think most hard core Japanese sports car enthusiasts got a bit heart broken when they found out it was a BMW engine.. and i can somewhat understand where they coming from.. if they buy a Japanese car, they want to see made in Japan written all over it..

if Toyota are not interested in developing a new in house Twin Turbo V8 and intending to borrow from another manufacturer, Nissan or Honda should be where they must be looking that's if i was their chief engineer. i think most hardcore Japanese car enthusiast might be ok with that rather than if it came from BMW. Most were saying things like "If i wanted a BMW, i would by a BMW"

B1RMA · December 17, 2019

12 minutes ago, noby76 said:

deep down i think they may have regretted the decision of using BMW engine in the new Supra even though it was a co development by both manufactures to keep development costs down. now that's not me saying Germans cannot build engines but i think most hard core Japanese sports car enthusiasts got a bit heart broken when they found out it was a BMW engine.. and i can somewhat understand where they coming from.. if they buy a Japanese car, they want to see made in Japan written all over it..

if Toyota are not interested in developing a new in house Twin Turbo V8 and intending to borrow from another manufacturer, Nissan or Honda should be where they must be looking that's if i was their chief engineer. i think most hardcore Japanese car enthusiast might be ok with that rather than if it came from BMW. Most were saying things like "If i wanted a BMW, i would by a BMW"

I agree, surely it is not beyond Toyota/Lexus to develop a hot V V8 along the lines of what AMG and others have done already done.

hockeyedwards · December 17, 2019

I would say this is a must watch and well worth 16mins of your time, the Japanese are just something else!

noby76 · December 18, 2019

Toyota might as well use the V8 engine in the LS600h? its powerful enough unless it will not meet emissions standards...

https://blog.lexus.co.uk/tmg-sports-650-takes-a-bow/

B1RMA · December 18, 2019

1 hour ago, noby76 said:

Toyota might as well use the V8 engine in the LS600h? its powerful enough unless it will not meet emissions standards...

https://blog.lexus.co.uk/tmg-sports-650-takes-a-bow/

Interesting, the modern approach is to have the hot V V8 turbo which is what they should do. I had reservations about the the hot V design but it looks like it has stood the test of time and I can't see anyone making a turbo V8 without this innovative clever bit of design. I thought there would be all sorts of heat soak issues but clever engineers have designed it not to have.

Lwerewolf · December 18, 2019

I'll be surprised if it isn't a larger "dynamic force" implementation.

v35a: https://toyota-club.net/files/faq/19-09-10_faq_df_v6_eng.htm - no "hot V" there... same general concepts like the a25a.

Not sure how much leeway the F-badge can get. Still hoping for a next gen NA offering...

B1RMA · December 18, 2019

The other thing that struck me was the fact that Lotus have been sticking superchargers on top of Toyota engines for ages. But I guess there is a higher centre of gravity plus height issues with that. Having said that why couldn't they dry sump the engine. I for one await developments with interest.

I hope they still produce a good old old school N/A V8 for the RCF/GSF range just for the fact I love engines that like to be worked in an old fashioned sort of way.

I've had a few turbo charged cars including a twin turbo V12 but ultimately I like the N/A V8 in my RCF more, although I also like superchargers like many owners in the USA have done to their RCF's waste of money though.

Lwerewolf · December 18, 2019

The 2GR in the Lotus cars doesn't look bad with regards to oil pressure... or at least the stock 2GR doesn't:

https://wilhelmraceworks.com/2gr-oil-pressure (this is on a mk2 MR2 with a 2GR conversion - love these things)

...assuming that Lotus uses the same pan & pickup. This is for transvere mounted engines. The 2UR-GSE has a scavenging system to get oil back to the pan from the heads, and I haven't heard of any oil pressure issues on them either, not that I've looked much... the catch can for the crankcase ventilation is the only thing that's often mentioned.

Toyota has put superchargers on the 2GR before - including on the FSE. Check this beauty: https://www.tomsracing.co.jp/sv/products/parts/detailseng.php?mprID=279

I remember seeing a topic about this particular kit here - somebody'd imported an IS350 (not sold in the EU along with the GS350 for whatever stupid reason...) and put it on...

Incidentally, a Mark X model was officially sold with this exact supercharger setup (JDM-only, of course) - only the engine cover logo differed. Actually, most Toyota engines have had supercharger offerings from TRD/TTE/etc...

Superchargers are not necessarily "bad" for fuel economy - plenty of examples around.