Back on Lexus bandwagon GS 450h vs 300h vs 250

[aviator888]

Hi all 

Been a while since i sold my super high mileage SC430.. truth to be told i still miss the old bugger with all it's oil leaks and saddle brown leather interior 😮 

Few Focuses, BMWs and a Volvo later looks like i am back to Lexus again. 

So far i have narrowed the search down to GS model. Spent the whole weekend going trough Lexus dealerships in Midlands area and test driving. I will keep you posted as the search goes on, but at moment it's really though between the 450h and 250. Both have their pros and cons.. 

[i-s]

Like you, we settled on the GS before settling on a particular model. 

The 300h is the lowest running cost, and with the way things are headed around diesels, electrification, etc it will probably maintain residual value better. 

The 250 is a solid car, although I found it hesitant (but I suspect that auto hold might have been on). Highest running costs in terms of fuel, not sure if servicing is a bit cheaper. However, they are by far cheapest to buy, with even quite modest mileage examples just barely into 5 figures. 

The 450h isn't a car that you NEED. However, it is so accomplished, so capable, so effortless that it is the one you WANT. For blasting down a motorway its ability to gear down to 1000rpm at any legal (and many illegal) speed is fantastic, combined with the cabin refinement and very well judged ride. Is it worth the extra thousands to buy? It was for us. We wanted a Premier spec, so that put the 250 out of the running, and then we found the right 450

 

 

[aviator888]

14 hours ago, i-s said:

Like you, we settled on the GS before settling on a particular model. 

The 300h is the lowest running cost, and with the way things are headed around diesels, electrification, etc it will probably maintain residual value better. 

The 250 is a solid car, although I found it hesitant (but I suspect that auto hold might have been on). Highest running costs in terms of fuel, not sure if servicing is a bit cheaper. However, they are by far cheapest to buy, with even quite modest mileage examples just barely into 5 figures. 

The 450h isn't a car that you NEED. However, it is so accomplished, so capable, so effortless that it is the one you WANT. For blasting down a motorway its ability to gear down to 1000rpm at any legal (and many illegal) speed is fantastic, combined with the cabin refinement and very well judged ride. Is it worth the extra thousands to buy? It was for us. We wanted a Premier spec, so that put the 250 out of the running, and then we found the right 450

 

 

Thank You kindly for feedback. Much appreciated. 

300h: would probably be the most sensible buy indeed, but i consider myself to be an oldschool petrolhead and straight four will be out of the equasion. I do around 4000 miles per year and paying a premium to save little bit on fuel just doesn't work out for me.. No offence to anyone 300h is awesome, just aimed at the different market.. 

450h: is a whole different story. I have already owned 2006 model in the past and i was very impressed with it. The car was noticeably heavier than GS300 of the same era, but it was damn quick in the sport mode :) The one and only downside was the reason i ended up getting rid of it: CVT gearbox. Other than that the 450h is pretty close being the ultimate sports saloon :p 

250: good old 4GR V6 coupled with 6 speed auto.. i actually test drove one in Lexus Nottingham and it wasn't nowhere near as bad as i thought it will be lol. Hope it's not a fake sound coming from speakers like some German models do, but the V6 sounds just gorgeous.. If we had 350 in UK this baby GS would be overlooked, but atm remains decent alternative.. 

On a side note whichever model i will go for, this will be my 11th Lexus since 2008 

True love never dies 😊

 

[i-s]

Probably much of what I'm saying you already know, but hopefully discussion of ideas is useful in clarifying what you want. 

If the CVT put you off that much before it is unlikely that you'd take well to it again?

I certainly find the weight of the GS450h noticeable - similar to the weight of our previous V70 D5 Geartronic, and whilst its fine along a motorway you do feel it on a twisty road, and especially when commuting, turning through mini roundabouts, etc. I find that the weight is really rather annoying when doing day-in-day-out commuting drives. My Tesla is quite a bit lighter than the GS and far more alert for that kind of thing. 

You used the word sport twice... I'd say that if you are looking for a car that you want to enjoy driving through the twisties and giving the car a bit of stick then the 250 might be the better choice - it's over 200kg lighter than the 450h. Whilst not earth-shatteringly fast, the benefit of that is you can actually enjoy extending the car a bit (get the pedal to the floor and enjoy a second or two of full throttle (and a gearchange perhaps), while the 450h will a) arrive at the next corner too quickly and b) not be quite as tuneful. Like you said, if the 350 had been available here it would be an interesting alternative from this point of view. 

As for you, our GS doesn't do a huge mileage - when we bought it my Leaf was my daily commuter car and now that's been superceded by the Tesla. We'll certainly not make up the purchase price difference on running costs with the GS, but we got it as a luxury. 

Soooo.... If driving the car a bit harder, enjoying engagement with the road and through twisties is more your priority, then perhaps the GS250 F-Sport would be an interesting option, with rear-wheel steering, adaptive damping, etc missing from the luxury, as well as the lighter weight. If comfort and cossett are the priorities then a 450h Luxury or Premier. 

 

[aviator888]

Thank You again for sound advice and help :) 

One thing i'm struggling with, is to get my head around different trim levels. On the MK3 GS up to 2009 i think it's pretty straightforward.. but i have yet to find a comprehensive list of all the different specs on MK4 GS.. 

So far i have noticed GS450h for sale are either Luxury, Premier or F- Sport

300h also available in SE and Executive? 

250 seem to come in Luxury or F- Sport trim levels.  

I am aware the F-Sport features different grille and slightly different suspension setup.. everything else leaves me confused atm.. 

[i-s]

SE and Executive are lower specs that achieved certain price points to be more attractive to business users. SE even has cloth seats (yet still heated and electric!).

https://media.lexus.co.uk/wp-content/files_mf/1517227553180125GSEquipmentList.pdf

 

[bagpus]

Get a 450h and stop "tarting" around and listening to the other "boring" farts! They are wonderful motors and incredibly capable. As regards being a tad heavy......yes but an F-sport model will still handle very well indeed. They are not built for driving around like you are at Silverstone. They are built to be able to travel in shear luxury.

[Nico72]

I agree, go for the 450h. It is a simple as this: this engine and model car is so good to drive and to be honest don’t be put off with the cvt as it truly works well with the v6 3.5 L. It is an absolute gem for this model and I have it as luxury and it works wonders to me. The drive is so smooth and you will for sure be pleased to have the extra power whenever you need it. It sounds great too! 

[i-s]

Given that the OP has already had a 450h with the eCVT and found it objectionable enough to get rid of the car then it would seem foolish to make the same mistake twice?

[Zotto]

I had a 2008 GS 450h and a 2014 GS 300h, and with newer model I found a better handling and fuel consumption, but I missed the 450h V6, at the point that I bought a RX 450h to have a 6 banger again. Why not another GS? Just to try something different to my previous one, too similar excepts for engine.

[aviator888]

Ok i just picked up my new car ☺️

 

 

[aviator888]

No not the LC 😂 i am still saving for one.. 

Here's what i actually bought: 

 

 

After nearly 3 weeks of searching, it was a close call between this one and the blue 450h for sale in Lexus Nottingham.. 

250 won me over with with surprisingly good driving dynamics, conventional 6 speed gearbox as opposed to CVT and i could not overlook the fact, that it was £6k cheaper than the 450.. All in all i am well aware what i bought is inferior to the GS450h, But the 250 has it's own perks and it will serve me until the prices of the LC will come down a bit 😊

 

GS 250 Luxury spec with ML and cream leather interior. 12 plate, 64k on the clock. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[royoftherovers]

What is it and why 3 screens above the fascia?

[rich1068]

41 minutes ago, aviator888 said:

Here's what i actually bought:...

From the above comments the 450h sounds great but I think I'd go for the 250 like you 

[hondansxr]

I WAS GOING TO BUT ANOTHER SC430 BUT THE 3 I VIEWED WERE AWFUL FOR SUCH an luxury car .. in the end i went for a 450h seeries 1 (the faster one ) and a gs300 gen 2 to play with soooooo glad i did the 450h is just amazing , to see the faces of people who you leave behind is brill  (sorry bout caps there always on )

[aviator888]

2 day, 500 mile round trip across south coast this weekend. Impressions: 

L10 is definitely an improvement over the 3rd generation GS which was already a very good car in it's class. I'm running Falken tyres all round and they are very quiet and no issues with grip even when pushed. Same as with all other Lexus models, i find the seats generally comfy, but it took me a while to find the right settings. Computer shows 45+ mpg on motorway and drops below 30 around town. Performance is adequate both from standstill or for overtaking at speed. Having barely over 200bhp does not make it quick by any means.. but the gearbox and engine work so well together, that it feels quicker than it actually is ☺️ 

As for extras, anyone looking to buy fourth gen GS don't go anything less than Premier/F-Sport specs respectively. My car is the poor man's "Luxury" version,  lucky to have 12" screen and the ML sound system, but i am really missing rear audio/climate controls, 18 way driver seat adjustments, radar cruise and other gadgets..  

Overall i am very happy with purchase, looking to upgrade the Satnav and perhaps treat the car with these 😂 

Any thoughts? 

 

[rich1068]

A friend of mine has something similar in his RC and I have to say they do look rather swish.

[Vlady]

17 hours ago, aviator888 said:

2 day, 500 mile round trip across south coast this weekend. Impressions: 

L10 is definitely an improvement over the 3rd generation GS which was already a very good car in it's class. I'm running Falken tyres all round and they are very quiet and no issues with grip even when pushed. Same as with all other Lexus models, i find the seats generally comfy, but it took me a while to find the right settings. Computer shows 45+ mpg on motorway and drops below 30 around town. Performance is adequate both from standstill or for overtaking at speed. Having barely over 200bhp does not make it quick by any means.. but the gearbox and engine work so well together, that it feels quicker than it actually is ☺️ 

As for extras, anyone looking to buy fourth gen GS don't go anything less than Premier/F-Sport specs respectively. My car is the poor man's "Luxury" version,  lucky to have 12" screen and the ML sound system, but i am really missing rear audio/climate controls, 18 way driver seat adjustments, radar cruise and other gadgets..  

Overall i am very happy with purchase, looking to upgrade the Satnav and perhaps treat the car with these 😂 

Any thoughts? 

 

 

Mel do you have a link for these carpets?! They look really good!

Also, having 45mpg on a run is very good result!

I have a Premier spec and I do not have a radar cruise, it would be great to have though!

Edited October 1, 2019 by Vlady

[i-s]

We have Radar cruise on our 4GS.... it is a very very very rare option, even on the Premier spec. 

It's not bad, when you get used to it. One limitation that we didn't realise at first was that if the wipers are going at max speed (either set manually or by auto wipers) radar cruise will disable itself. 

For the most part it works well, just occasionally on a bend it will pick up a vehicle in an adjacent lane as being in front and slow down. I think that the ACC in a VW hire car I had recently was better - it didn't have that kind of false reaction, and it had an interesting logic to it (you could treat the ACC as a virtual bumper - once at minimum follow distance you could put foot to the floor and it would not move closer to the car in front - the Lexus will override ACC and accelerate). 

[Vlady]

10 minutes ago, i-s said:

We have Radar cruise on our 4GS.... it is a very very very rare option, even on the Premier spec. 

 

Until you said that your GS has a radar cruise I didn't know Lexus was fitting anything like that.

Friend of mine has a Superb and it ACC works perfect and easy to apply, saying that I never tested it under heavy rain. :) 

[Texas]

On 26 September 2019 at 3:32 PM, royoftherovers said:

What is it and why 3 screens above the fascia?

Haaaa I had to do a double take and realised its the garage door Windows outside!

Paul m.

[i-s]

55 minutes ago, Vlady said:

Until you said that your GS has a radar cruise I didn't know Lexus was fitting anything like that.

Friend of mine has a Superb and it ACC works perfect and easy to apply, saying that I never tested it under heavy rain. 🙂 

That's why I described our 4GS as a unicorn - it's a 2015 pre-facelift premier WITH HUD and all possible options (which on premier means ACC+LKA+PCS, All-LED headlamps and the sunroof): 
 

 

[aviator888]

Please accept my apologies if not allowed to advertise, but the mats were ordered today from well known chinese marketplace. 

Cost was 63 US dollars for the set plus additional 8 dollars to put the logos on as on the set pictured above 😀 This includes the shipping to UK

I am happy to share the link if its ok with site rules.. 

[cruisermark]

16 minutes ago, i-s said:

That's why I described our 4GS as a unicorn - it's a 2015 pre-facelift premier WITH HUD and all possible options (which on premier means ACC+LKA+PCS, All-LED headlamps and the sunroof): 
 

 

You sure have a rare car there  - I've had a LS430 for many years and still have not got bored of it! - Now that we have 2 BMWs in tha family with the HUD, I think your sort of car would be the perfect upgrade for me . . . . . . . . . one day !

[superatticman]

On 10/1/2019 at 4:46 PM, aviator888 said:

Please accept my apologies if not allowed to advertise, but the mats were ordered today from well known chinese marketplace. 

Cost was 63 US dollars for the set plus additional 8 dollars to put the logos on as on the set pictured above 😀 This includes the shipping to UK

I am happy to share the link if its ok with site rules.. 

Aviator.

Great choice. I'm glad I went for the GS250. Main factors were initial cost and wanting relative simplicity. The 2.5 V6 sounds good for its size, gives the car brisk performance and should prove to be indestructible. I do believe economy isn't a million miles away from the GS450h. The dealers reckoned they were both similar. Obviously you get the extra performance from the GS450h. 

I think there's also another reason that I enjoy the GS250. And that its likely to be the last standard 6 cylinder car I'm likely to own. Seriously, years of taking this for granted as my standard engine configuration is going to be no more. This assuming that I buy a newer model of course. 

Unless I do something daft like buy a late F10 530i (isn't even this a 4cyl turbo?) and re enter the financial shock of German car ownership then its going to be CVT and probably 4 cylinders in the future. 

Enjoy the GS250 though. Its a mighty fine car that should be 100% reliable. I'm sure you 'get' Lexus ownership too. They aren't the fastest in their class, aren't the most fun to drive, aren't the most 'trendy', but they really are the best engineered mass produced car out there. 

Adam