ohhh... last again?

noby76 · May 27, 2019

49 minutes ago, Linas.P said:

Does it even makes sense.... at least to yourself?

How much money I have, makes no difference in hypothetical discussion of how good or bad certain car is, or of how much or how little choice there is. Importing such mediocre nearly new car from Japan is total non-sense and you know it... why do you even suggest that?! RC350 in Japan costs ~ £32,000, but with all costs inclusive you can add 50% of that value in taxes and shipping - never-mind the problems once it is here, more expensive insurance, road tax, depreciation, Sat-nav in Japanese, Japanese speed limiter non-sense etc. Why would anyone in their right mind spend £48,000 to get some mid-range car from japan, when RC-F can be bought for £24,000 in UK (that is half price)?

And when it comes to Lexus I have provided them feedback (disappointment with RC300h). Their answer was very simple - get RC-F. And they are right - no matter how I do it is always going to be cheaper to get UK spec. RC-F than get RC350 from Japan... and with such small market like UK there are certainly not many people interested in RC350. That doesn't make RC300h better car however...

And money is obviously and object... What do you even mean? So if I have say £70,000 in my bank account does that mean I should waste £48,000 on importing RC350 from Japan? I hope you not working as financial adviser....

And what is this weird relation between... me having money, used or imported cars and how good ES300h is? Don't you think that is irrelevant? If I go and buy RC-F tomorrow or import RC350 from Japan, woudl that make me "eligible" to say ES300h is outclassed in UK? What it is all about.. I long lost hope to understand if you are taking **** or you really that detached from reality.

blah, blah, blah, blah Yawn....

GET THE RC-F THEN!!!!

oh let me guess... its too expensive for you to run...oh and RC350 is too expensive for you to import from Japan..

as i said before guys this is a 'disorder' .. as its no longer making any sense..

Linas.P · May 27, 2019

Why you have this obsession with suggesting me cars to buy? Did I asked you for advise what to buy?.. So keep it to yourself! I will buy what I need and when I need it...

I don't need to get a car to have an opinion about ES300h or any car for that matter...

noby76 · May 27, 2019

so end the pointless and needless attack on IS300h, RC300h and ES300h models if you are NOT intending on buying one anyway... others on here have found them more than adequate for their needs in an automobile...

Linas.P · May 27, 2019

This is not a shop... yes surely I am not intending to buy cars which I consider not good (nobody should). Where does it say that "only people intending to buy a car can post". It seems you are stuck with some rules of your own invention of why people could post here.

Maybe I am killing time, or maybe I think that different opinions and view-points can help perspective buyers (not) to buy ES300h. This thread specifically was intended as criticism of new ES300h which I consider to be inferiour car compared to what it replaces and I hope it was clear for everyone what the intention was... it seems you have missed that point.

rich1068 · May 27, 2019

I honestly can't believe this discussion is still going.

Linas, love you to bits but you are our friendly troll. Any time you need a hug get yourself to Sheffield.

Guys, why do you bite?

To the matter in hand. I'm no Lexus fan boy. I don't even own one at the moment. But I'd choose the Lexus every day of the week next to those other three. 2 litre diesel? Forgive me while I yawn for about an hour. Oh! And your taxi's here!! No it's not, it's your German rep-mobile. Sorry, I'm yawning again.

Linas.P · May 27, 2019

.... but would you rather get ES or GS, 300h or 350?

P.S. I would not get diesel car either.. but I don't have to.

Thackeray · May 27, 2019

On 5/26/2019 at 2:09 AM, Linas.P said:

in the cold morning even new BMW diesel sounds like a tractor

That old cliché again? Tractors sound great! Modern diesel cars come nowhere close!

Here's one...

Linas.P · May 27, 2019

2 minutes ago, Thackeray said:

That old cliché again? Tractors sound great! Modern diesel cars come nowhere close!

Here's one...

I like starter the most - could not help myself thinking what would happen if he could not pull metal bar in time when the engine suddenly starts.

doog442 · May 27, 2019

Linas me old mucker.

The new Supra sounds right up your street with that B58. Imagine that in an RC ?

Linas.P · May 27, 2019

35 minutes ago, doog442 said:

Linas me old mucker.

The new Supra sounds right up your street with that B58. Imagine that in an RC ?

Another salesman? 😄

At least advise is bit better. NO - Supra not right for me - I need rear seats (more GT than small sports coupe) and if going BMW anyway why not M235, because lets face it is Z4 and that is good - BMW infotainment systems is massive plus. Further, it is not like there is an issue picking up BMW430i. Even from Toyota I would rather go for GT86 if I would be looking for small coupe. I guess the only + on Supra is L6 engine which I would expect to be lovely ans easily capable of 400hp like in good old 2JZ days...

doog442 · May 27, 2019

So lets get this correct.

For years you have lamented the decision of Lexus not to introduce the RC 350 here. Some accuse you of trolling the place as a result. You refuse to go RCF.

Toyota offer up a straight six 3 litre turbo charged engine that meets their exacting standards and would ***** all over the 350.........

I suggest they stick it in the RC...and you still aren't happy.

There is no hope for you..... none. There is no hope for anyone on here either who chooses to debate with you.

Habu · May 27, 2019

3 hours ago, Linas.P said:

I like starter the most - could not help myself thinking what would happen if he could not pull metal bar in time when the engine suddenly starts.

Now that's funny. 🙂

Linas.P · May 27, 2019

@doog442 That is because you comparing GT car with 2 seat sports car - as you can imagine there is little difference in between. If they stick same engine in RC and sell it in UK I would be quite happy with that choice, although I prefer V6 over L6 and NA over FI - when it comes to B58 I still think it is great engine and with a lot of potential in any platform. In fact little bit "toooo much potential" - BMW limits the power in EU to 325, but elsewhere it is tuned for 385.. (on conservative factory tune) as such I tend to believe it could run like 500hp on all stock internals and that is uncomfortably RC-F territory - so Lexus won't allow it unless it is in RC-F mk2.

Going back to RC300h, I don't have an issue with the engine per say (well it is little bit trashy under hard acceleration and it is L4 - fundamentally flawed configuration) - I only have an issue with how slow the car is. I reckon the easiest way to solve the problem would be for Lexus to strap much more powerful electric motor to bump combined "comparable" power from 220hp, to something more like 280hp... As long as RC300h can hit 60 in under 6s that is enough for me.

spacenase · May 27, 2019

3 hours ago, Linas.P said:

.... but would you rather get ES or GS, 300h or 350?

P.S. I would not get diesel car either.. but I don't have to.

GS300h, so much so that I bought one!

noby76 · May 28, 2019

16 hours ago, Linas.P said:

As long as RC300h can hit 60 in under 6s that is enough for me.

There is already an RC available which does that..

Hi class, can anyone else name it for me since someone is not paying attention.. and will get marked down again!

fetchez la vache · May 28, 2019

21 hours ago, Linas.P said:

.... but would you rather get ES or GS, 300h or 350?

P.S. I would not get diesel car either.. but I don't have to.

ES300h please, just like this one...

First_Lexus · May 28, 2019

@fetchez la vache

That looks very nice indeed in white with the dark grey wheels. 😃

Linas.P · May 28, 2019

5 hours ago, noby76 said:

There is already an RC available which does that..

Hi class, can anyone else name it for me since someone is not paying attention.. and will get marked down again!

In your opinion - on which step of this pyramid you are at the moment?

dutchie01 · May 28, 2019

Im afraid there is no longer the luxury of what engine in what car choice as there used to be in the past. Skunkworks delivered beautifully crazy machines, salesdepartments asked for specific engines that were developed and built, marketing asked for halo machines and got them without any problem. All gone. 2021 and WLTP is now driving product development with 95 grams as the benchmark. Electrification is the holy grail and very soon the UX will arrive as full EV. In case of the ES it simply was the ES300H engine or nothing. The only reason why Toyota used the BMW engine in the Supra is cost as developing an inline 6 would cost them over 1 billion, money that would not come back to them. Btw the ES is now the ONLY lexus saloon with a healthy salesrecord( +19%). The IS is well past its sell by date and hoping on a replacement ( 25% down), the LS is turning into a flop with sales half of last year, the LC is wel down... It is the SUV sales that keep the brand going, the UX, NX, RX, RXL and soon a model above that. I think the future competition for Lexus ( so not toyota) will come from China. Chinese manufacturers are already leading in EV development and on the last Chinese motorshow some truly beautiful cars were on display. One day these will hit our markets.

opinions?

Linas.P · May 28, 2019

I agree to most of what you said. Sadly, that is current trend - "carpet SUVs" with little substance for enthusiast driver. On the receiving end cars no longer symbolises freedom, but rather "outdated taste". It is like saying you are hunter - nowadays most people would look at you with surprise and maybe some even with disgust.

The only place where I would disagree - that chinese EVs going to have serious impact on our market. It will impact many manufacturers and their global sales (chinese domestic market is one of the biggest anyway), but I don't think chinese vehicles going to be very popular in EU/NA/JP/AU/NZ markets. Look to what happened to Huawei - there is massive political lobbying. Sometimes justified - chinese companies blindly copies established car brands, sometimes not - I do believe chinese are truly innovating in EV sector and most of patents are open source anyway... Even if some company going to truly make it to western markets soon they going to be accused (without any proof) of spying.

The only other way I can see - chinese already own companies like Volvo, so they can sell Volvo or other established brand EVs. Unless that is what you mean...

Connoisseur · May 29, 2019

The latest model BMW 1 series is a front wheel drive with fake plastic intakes in the bumper and the dynamics of a wet sponge. Other BMW models will follow...BMW design is following its core customers into middle/old age. Audi/VW are the same, and Volvo have occupied that market segment for what seems like forever lol

Once again it seems like Lexus are in trouble only for getting in first 🙂

There is too much on the record evidence of how VW etc use their PR spend with mags to 'force' good coverage, for any objective observer to continue in denial. The unreliability and maintenance costs of German autos, even within warranty, is legendary.

Lexus has a market, which is far from VW etc, and thank goodness for that imho:)

Thackeray · May 29, 2019

3 hours ago, Connoisseur said:

There is too much on the record evidence of how VW etc use their PR spend with mags to 'force' good coverage

That sounds interesting. Could you give some links to this evidence?

rich1068 · May 29, 2019

13 hours ago, dutchie01 said:

Im afraid there is no longer the luxury of what engine in what car choice as there used to be in the past.

Yes there is!! Fill yer boots!

4 hours ago, Connoisseur said:

The latest model BMW 1 series is a front wheel drive with fake plastic intakes in the bumper and the dynamics of a wet sponge. Other BMW models will follow...BMW design is following its core customers into middle/old age. Audi/VW are the same, and Volvo have occupied that market segment for what seems like forever lol

Not sure about the core market. The way I see it it's younger drivers getting cars on lease/PCP that don't really care much about driving dynamics but do car about touchscreen fripperies and big wheels. The manufacturers are businesses, they're giving the market what it wants.

noby76 · May 29, 2019

15 hours ago, Linas.P said:

In your opinion - on which step of this pyramid you are at the moment?

Clearly someone hasn't looked in the mirror yet.. 😂

DanD · May 29, 2019

SUV comfort, touchscreens, etc... Yes, absolutely.

Does it really matter whether a car is FWD or RWD these days, or whether it has 200bhp or 300bhp, when speed limits, traffic and state of the roads prevent all restrict the speed you can travel at? Does it really matter whether a car is FWD or RWD when the electronic trickery governs how a car drives anyway?

The area I live in has 20mph speed limits and speed bumps everywhere. The M3 is always congested. Country roads are full of potholes and you spend your time stuck behind tractors or dodging wild life (and cyclists - not a criticism, just a fact!).

So I want a car that will take me and my family from A to B safely. I want comfortable seats. I don't want to do my back in when I get in and out of the car or when I unload the boot. I want to be able to take three passengers in the back and for them to be comfortable. I want my dog to travel up front in the passenger footwell if need be. I want a car that won't break down. I want a car that is reasonable economical and quiet. I want toys to play with when I'm stuck in traffic, with a good sound system and a clear radio. I want plenty of space because I don't want to compromise on what I want to take with me when I travel, and given the british weather I want to be able to take coats, wellies and umbrellas as well as sun hats, t-shirts and flip flops. I want my kids to be able to use their laptops in the cars or to watch a film, or to charge their phones. I want a SUV because it ticks all the boxes that matter... to me at least.

And I am not the only one. At the end of the day, SUVs meet most of today's requirements for most of people, and Lexus SUVs meet mine (although I do fancy an ES!), and they are no longer as uneconomical to live with as they used to be.

BTW, just read that MB are going to release yet another SUV... the GLB...